Compound vs isolation begginers

[NihilistBrownie]

I've read around here that for a beginner who is bulking, a compound routine works better. I've already started bulking for the last 3 weeks, and I like my isolated routines. Should I change my routine?

It looks like this:

Mondays Chest/triceps
Tuesday Shoulders
Wednesdays Arms
Thursdays abs
Fridays back
Sat: Rest
Sunday: Short hike

Each one of these days, I spend an hour exercising, hitting everything heavy, slow but intense.

[matjusm]

Who says you have to do one or the other? Do a routine focused on compounds with a few isolations thrown in.

[NihilistBrownie]

Who says you have to do one or the other? Do a routine focused on compounds with a few isolations thrown in.

Would that mean making a new schedule from scratch?

Or perhaps I do the same routine, for example Mondays I'll do chest isolations, and just throw in some compound exercises like a pulldown?

I just want to maximize the potential of my workouts.

[MattyG]

OP - do you actually know what compound and isolation exercises are?

[theproctologist]

deadlift, squat, bench. throw those in on their proper days

[NihilistBrownie]

@MattyG

Compound exercises target multiple muscle groups. Isolation tends to target single ones. If I mix in compound exercises, would I need to change my rest days?

I know a few folks who bulked up well, they say they used isolation exercises.

[wwarrior2469]

how are things going with doing shoulders after chest day? seems like you'd wanna move that around a little bit.

OP - compound exercise = more than one joint often targeting multiple muscle groups. isolation = only one joint.

what exercises are you doing on each of the given days?

[NihilistBrownie]

how are things going with doing shoulders after chest day? seems like you'd wanna move that around a little bit.

OP - compound exercise = more than one joint often targeting multiple muscle groups. isolation = only one joint.

what exercises are you doing on each of the given days?

Some weeks I switch shoulders and arms, or abs and back. Either way, if I'm hitting these muscles hard, should I switch to compound? I figure if I isolate muscles like this, each muscle group gets more rest per week to grow. Also I focus on the muscles individually and don't overcompensate somewhere. Is there something wrong with that logic?

For Mondays I do the chest press, I do 5 reps per set for an hour, and take minute breaks between. I crank it the highest I can do for the day, progressively lower weight it a little, then bring it back up.
For shoulder days, I think I use the shoulder press. For arms I switch between two different machines. For abs I do crunches on the floor and use this ab crunch machine. For back I use one lower ab machine, and mid row.

[wwarrior2469]

Some weeks I switch shoulders and arms, or abs and back. Either way, if I'm hitting these muscles hard, should I switch to compound? I figure if I isolate muscles like this, each muscle group gets more rest per week to grow. Also I focus on the muscles individually and don't overcompensate somewhere. Is there something wrong with that logic?

first off - stick to a routine. what's your lifting experience?

there is a problem with that logic....it never yields the results you think it will.

[krazyangel]

Where's leg day?

[NihilistBrownie]

first off - stick to a routine. what's your lifting experience?

there is a problem with that logic....it never yields the results you think it will.

For the last 5 months I mixed all different kinds of strength training exercises (mostly compound) into a 5 days a week cardio routine.

[wwarrior2469]

For the last 5 months I mixed all different kinds of strength training exercises (mostly compound) into a 5 days a week cardio routine.

what are some of the lifts you have been doing?

[NihilistBrownie]

^

I crank it the highest I can do for the day, progressively lower weight it a little, then bring it back up.

For Mondays I do the chest press, I do 5 reps per set for an hour, and take minute breaks between.
For shoulder days, I think I use the shoulder press. For arms I switch between two different machines. For abs I do crunches on the floor and use this ab crunch machine. For back I use one lower ab machine, and mid row.

I don't recall most of the names.

[wwarrior2469]

^

I don't recall most of the names.

my advice - find a beginner's routine and stick to it for a couple of months, eat a lot, train hard.

this will yield better results than going to the gym doing "stuff"

[Saintsqc]

Isolation program works well for some people...such as ronnie coleman.

Beginners, like you or me, need to build a decent amount of muscles first. Compound exercices (squat, dead lift, bench, dips, pull up or chin up, barbel row, over head press) will help you achieve that. They will make your body work as a unit and give you some fonctionnal strength. Isolation will give you nothing.

Do SS or allpro's...not isolation.

[NihilistBrownie]

Isolation program works well for some people...such as ronnie coleman.

Beginners, like you or me, need to build a decent amount of muscles first. Compound exercices (squat, dead lift, bench, dips, pull up or chin up, barbel row, over head press) will help you achieve that. They will make your body work as a unit and give you some fonctionnal strength. Isolation will give you nothing.

Do SS or allpro's...not isolation.

Alright, but then how should I adapt my schedule to compound exercises? I have 5 days a week to exercise. I prefer not to put any rest days in between, and strength train or cardio on the days in between.

Btw, my schedule is pretty consistent, I use the same machines every week, or at least that was the plan.

[StrengthGeek25]

Alright, but then how should I adapt my schedule to compound exercises? I have 5 days a week to exercise. I prefer not to put any rest days in between, and strength train or cardio on the days in between.

Btw, my schedule is pretty consistent, I use the same machines every week, or at least that was the plan.

There's no adapting required. Read what others are posting. FIND A ROUTINE AND DO WHAT IT SAYS.

[Saintsqc]

Why don't you want to take any rest in 5 days?? You are getting stronger from recovery.

I did the same mistake when I started. Training 5 times a week, 1h30 to 2h every work out. I did have some improvements in my lift. Then, I read some articles on that web site and change up my routine. I did the same improvement in 12 weeks with a better routine and proper diet than I did in several months without any informations.

Read the stickys in "work out program" section. Read Starting Strength book.

If you absolutly want to hit the gym 5 times a week. Maybe you could weight lift 3 days and the 2 others days...idk, do some reading? Brain training is pretty important too

Seriously, getting a solid program(allpros, Starting Strength) and doing it right will help you achieve the best results! If I knew it before, I would be a lot stronger than I'm now(im not saying that im strong...).

[NihilistBrownie]

Why don't you want to take any rest in 5 days?? You are getting stronger from recovery.

You see I use my college's gym. I have no other gym membership. And I commute (it's a thirty minute drive), this means that 5 days a week I have access to a gym, no other days. I want to use that time as efficiently as possible, and I love working out. That's why I was using a isolated schedule, this way I can have plenty of rest but still work out 5 days a week. I wasn't doing two hours a day, only one hour a day.

So if I'm using a 3 day schedule, how about this. I already do 15 minutes of low intensity cardio immediately after lifting. Why not just do two cardio days instead, where I do ellyptical or track for 35 minutes ?

[germanbassist87]

Less is more? Growth occurs outside of the gym. 45-60 mins 3 or 4 days a week using compounds is good.

[PerpetualMotion]

Total body workout or upper/lower split. The former is three days a week while the latter is 4 days a week. The reason that the exercise is minimal is due to the CNS. Muscles recovery quicker than most think but the CNS recovers slower. You can make great gains on a 3 to 4 days a week workout plan.

My recommendations for workouts:
5/3/1 by Jim Wendler
Westside for Skinny Bastards by Joe Defranco
Starting Strength by Mark Rippetoe
Maximum Strength by Eric Cressey

The first two you can literally be on forever and never have to change your program ever again since the program is built on constant progression. I've seen people on Starting Strength for more than a year and make awesome gains. Maximum Strength is a 16 weeks (I think).

[Saintsqc]

You see I use my college's gym. I have no other gym membership. And I commute (it's a thirty minute drive), this means that 5 days a week I have access to a gym, no other days. I want to use that time as efficiently as possible, and I love working out. That's why I was using a isolated schedule, this way I can have plenty of rest but still work out 5 days a week. I wasn't doing two hours a day, only one hour a day.

So if I'm using a 3 day schedule, how about this. I already do 15 minutes of low intensity cardio immediately after lifting. Why not just do two cardio days instead, where I do ellyptical or track for 35 minutes ?

Yeah, I understand. I'd rather be at the gym than sit in front of my TV.

IMO, 3 days of weightlifting with compounds exercices while following a good program and doing 2 days of cardio is way better than 5 days of isolation.

[NihilistBrownie]

Yeah, I understand. I'd rather be at the gym than sit in front of my TV.

IMO, 3 days of weightlifting with compounds exercices while following a good program and doing 2 days of cardio is way better than 5 days of isolation.

That's perfectly fine with me I rather being doing cardio on different days. There's something wrong with doing cardio right after strength training.

Is there anything wrong with sticking exclusively to machines? There seem to be plenty of compound machines at my gym, and the machines and other equipment are totally separated by floors.

[Saintsqc]

I strongly suggest you to read the book on SS or following the Allpros simple beginners routine.

You should stay away from machine as much as you can. Free weights are a lot better. The movement is more natural (your joints dont like machine). You need to use your stabilizer and your whole core need to contract to keep you moving.

[Mr-Tripster]

"Stuff" tends to get you platoed as you never know how much to push your self and how much you've improved for your next "stuff". Nothing wrong with isolation if you have a good schedule/routine and viceversa.
Here is mine that tends to allow the muscles to heal up.
Mon Chest
Tue back/bis
Wed Shoulders/triceps
Thur Legs/traps
Fri Arms/abs
Sat: Rest

[NihilistBrownie]

*frustration*
I'm so confused!
Everyone I've talked to is giving me a different opinion, but they all look built. Some are telling to lift 5 days a week, some 3 days, some tell me to target multiple muscles, some tell me to isolate, some tell me to work one part of the body once a week, some tell me target the same muscles multiple times a week.

And yet they all have some success (seriously good success too).

[wwarrior2469]

*frustration*
I'm so confused!
Everyone I've talked to is giving me a different opinion, but they all look built. Some are telling to lift 5 days a week, some 3 days, some tell me to target multiple muscles, some tell me to isolate, some tell me to work one part of the body once a week, some tell me target the same muscles multiple times a week.

And yet they all have some success (seriously good success too).

ok my man you gotta realize that in fitness there are literally infinite ways to skin the proverbial cat.

for me I have been doing a 5 day split that I really enjoy. if you like to work out 5 days a week then work out 5 days a week but you still need STRUCTURE and in that sense you are seriously lacking.

my split is like this:

mon: chest
tue: back
wed: legs
thu: shoulders
fri: arms

you need to find a balanced routine that allows you to properly train your body equally and effectively.

[NihilistBrownie]

ok my man you gotta realize that in fitness there are literally infinite ways to skin the proverbial cat.

for me I have been doing a 5 day split that I really enjoy. if you like to work out 5 days a week then work out 5 days a week but you still need STRUCTURE and in that sense you are seriously lacking.

my split is like this:

mon: chest
tue: back
wed: legs
thu: shoulders
fri: arms

you need to find a balanced routine that allows you to properly train your body equally and effectively.

So let's say I do routine like yours. So I would be doing compound exercises focused on that specific part of my body?

[Saintsqc]

Chest = bench, dips
Back = pull up, chin up, barbel bar row, deadlift
Legs = squat and dead lift (some deadlift on back day, some on legs day)
Shoulders = over head press
Arms = chin up, dips

[wwarrior2469]

So let's say I do routine like yours. So I would be doing compound exercises focused on that specific part of my body?

focus on compounds and se isolations as necessary. they all have their place but as a beginner you need to focus on the compounds.