Realistic Goals and Competing

[juliacheh]

Oh they most certainly ARE different.

Bikini girls can have a goodly amount of fat if they are otherwise genetically gifted. The first woman has nice even fat distribution, legs that go on forever and actually doesn't have much fat to start. She could actually do the bikini thing okay. She MAY even be able to do some novice figure shows with a decent showing... but it would hurt her rather than help her as she will need to build at some point if she wants to be serious and going very low in bf% with such a small base is not really a good idea ever. She has such a nice start that she should either commit to bikini to get the stage experience or start building muscle to kick-ass in figure in a year or two. Personally, I'd go for bodybuilding if I had that to start with but I like it big and bulky.

BTW: Notice what Layne Norton tells her.

My opinion is that bikini is a total joke, but who are we to decide.
Karla, even at 140lbs you don't look bulky at all, that's the goodness of having muscle mass.
I could probably do figure (maybe not right now, but in a year or two), but I hate hate hate to diet.

[msulisa99]

Fabulous post, thank you very much!!!!!

[Christine_Zadel]

What an awesome article ... bodybuilding shows are supposed to be for people who have worked hard to build muscle (which takes years ... not simply 'a year'), they are not Beauty Pageants!!! I've been weight training for 20 years and bodybuilding for 9 of those & still feel I can improve. BTW, I am 5'0, compete at 50kilograms in bodybuilding (in Australia).

[sonti]

What's with the surge of young men coming in here (or into female threads in general) and telling women that YES they are ready for figure/bikini/whatever when they clearly are not? And of course despite numerous women telling them otherwise.

[Metcalfe13]

this was all quite interesting to say the least. A lot of opinions out there...

[DrivenAgain]

Thank you for this sticky!! It really put some of my goals in perspective. I tend to create goals that are unrealistic, then get myself depressed when I don't come close to achieving them, so I've been forcing myself to set smaller realistic goals. This post has significantly slowed down my interest in getting on stage. I promised myself that I will get up there at least ONCE in my lifetime... but it looks like it will be a few more years ahead of me. Once I get my bodyfat down, I will post pics and see what the veteran ladies here have to say before I even consider getting on stage. I have been lifting on and off since my teens, but I have no idea how much muscle mass will be left, once I take off these layers of chub.

Thanks for saving me from setting myself up for failure.

[kfisherx]

Thank you for this sticky!! It really put some of my goals in perspective. I tend to create goals that are unrealistic, then get myself depressed when I don't come close to achieving them, so I've been forcing myself to set smaller realistic goals. This post has significantly slowed down my interest in getting on stage. I promised myself that I will get up there at least ONCE in my lifetime... but it looks like it will be a few more years ahead of me. Once I get my bodyfat down, I will post pics and see what the veteran ladies here have to say before I even consider getting on stage. I have been lifting on and off since my teens, but I have no idea how much muscle mass will be left, once I take off these layers of chub.

Thanks for saving me from setting myself up for failure.

You just made my day and made the hours I put into this all worth it. Thank you!

[LaVida]

That first woman could get away with bikini actually. She should build up her butt a bit though. Otherwise is pretty genetically gifted for bikini. Second one has too much fat to do either in any near term.

I don't even venture outside of this folder too much for this reason. There has to be a place for girls to go who will not listen to reason and still want to go on stage.

Hi, I know this is an old post, but what a greattttt thread!! thank-you, thank-you, thank-youuu!

If you don't mind, I would really value you're opinion on my physique for competition please??
I thought that I would aim for a competition that is now 13 weeks out and assess myself 2 weeks before to see if I should do it or not, or just aim for one 2 months later, or even perhaps 5 months later...just not sure and could use your help.

I am currently at 19 to 20%bf and weigh 137lbs. The last pictures in my progress pics was when I started cutting and was at 22% then.

My pics dated Sept. 2010 were at 17-18%bf and I feel I am headed there again shortly, however; my concern after reading this is that with more fat loss, I will not hold enough muscle, hence; perhaps wait till the other competition 5 months away and start bulking/gaining more muscle now??

Appreciate anyone's advice/comments.

[rockangel]

Hi, I know this is an old post, but what a greattttt thread!! thank-you, thank-you, thank-youuu!

If you don't mind, I would really value you're opinion on my physique for competition please??
I thought that I would aim for a competition that is now 13 weeks out and assess myself 2 weeks before to see if I should do it or not, or just aim for one 2 months later, or even perhaps 5 months later...just not sure and could use your help.

I am currently at 19 to 20%bf and weigh 137lbs. The last pictures in my progress pics was when I started cutting and was at 22% then.

My pics dated Sept. 2010 were at 17-18%bf and I feel I am headed there again shortly, however; my concern after reading this is that with more fat loss, I will not hold enough muscle, hence; perhaps wait till the other competition 5 months away and start bulking/gaining more muscle now??

Appreciate anyone's advice/comments.

I am sorry but you are not at the body fat level you think you are. You are carrying more fat than you think you are. It looks like you have a good base of muscle, but you are not at 19 or 20% and the Sept 2010 pics are not at 17 - 18%.

You have quite a bit of fat loss that needs to happen before you step on stage and 13 weeks is not going to be enough time.

This is exactly why this thread was made, people (and i am guilty of this as well) severly underestimate their body fat.

http://www.leighpeele.com/body-fat-percent.pdf
Go to this site, look at page 18. Those girls are 5'2 and are in the body fat range you are claiming. This is what we mean.

I honestly would suggest you continue to either build muscle or recomp and look at another year of doing so. You have come a long way, but you still have a way to go. Its not something that you can do in a year or two, this is a very long term comittment.

[LaVida]

I am sorry but you are not at the body fat level you think you are. You are carrying more fat than you think you are. It looks like you have a good base of muscle, but you are not at 19 or 20% and the Sept 2010 pics are not at 17 - 18%.

You have quite a bit of fat loss that needs to happen before you step on stage and 13 weeks is not going to be enough time.

This is exactly why this thread was made, people (and i am guilty of this as well) severly underestimate their body fat.

http://www.leighpeele.com/body-fat-percent.pdf
Go to this site, look at page 18. Those girls are 5'2 and are in the body fat range you are claiming. This is what we mean.

I honestly would suggest you continue to either build muscle or recomp and look at another year of doing so. You have come a long way, but you still have a way to go. Its not something that you can do in a year or two, this is a very long term comittment.

Thank-you for sharing. I had already read leigh's bodyfat article a long while ago, and I have been measuring with calipers, although would like to have dexa done one day.

I just posted my most recent pics where I am now 19-20%bf, and I appreciate your opinion however; I have to say that I do think I am in fact at about 19-20%bf, especially when I compare my pics to YOURS, where u say you are at the same ????
We just hold our body fat differently.
I could be wrong, but I would appreciate anyone correcting me at this too.

I am not trying to be vengeful here but just honest, as I ask all of you to be with me.
When I look at the condition you were in when you entered your first contest, I have to be honest and say that I would never have done so looking like that (you had no muscle??), and that is my biggest fear and what my main question was....

In order for me to lose the fat on my bottom half I'll have to go very low in bf% and I fear that I have not built up my top half enough to support that loss, because I don't want to look skinny/weak.

I'll appreciate other opinions please???

[rcswent]

Thank-you for sharing. I had already read leigh's bodyfat article a long while ago, and I have been measuring with calipers, although would like to have dexa done one day.

I just posted my most recent pics where I am now 19-20%bf, and I appreciate your opinion however; I have to say that I do think I am in fact at about 19-20%bf, especially when I compare my pics to YOURS, where u say you are at the same ????
We just hold our body fat differently.
I could be wrong, but I would appreciate anyone correcting me at this too.

I am not trying to be vengeful here but just honest, as I ask all of you to be with me.
When I look at the condition you were in when you entered your first contest, I have to be honest and say that I would never have done so looking like that (you had no muscle??), and that is my biggest fear and what my main question was....

In order for me to lose the fat on my bottom half I'll have to go very low in bf% and I fear that I have not built up my top half enough to support that loss, because I don't want to look skinny/weak.

I'll appreciate other opinions please???

Forget the measurements Whether you are in fact 20% now or not doesn't matter. What matters is how your body physically looks. During my contest prep, I rarely took body fat measurements (didn't weigh myself much either) because: 1) calipers are not accurate enough 2) the mirror and my coach were all I needed to determine that I was ready.

Is this your first competition? It might be beneficial for you to work with someone who can give you objective feedback throughout your transformation process. I would hope that a good coach would be honest with you as to whether or not you would be ready for the stage.

[LaVida]

Forget the measurements Whether you are in fact 20% now or not doesn't matter. What matters is how your body physically looks. During my contest prep, I rarely took body fat measurements (didn't weigh myself much either) because: 1) calipers are not accurate enough 2) the mirror and my coach were all I needed to determine that I was ready.

Is this your first competition? It might be beneficial for you to work with someone who can give you objective feedback throughout your transformation process. I would hope that a good coach would be honest with you as to whether or not you would be ready for the stage.

Yes, good point. Thank-you for that. Yes, it's my first competition. I am currently doing things on my own, because I'm still high in fat and know I can do it until the 17% mark where I get stuck and so plan on hiring someone then, but right now I stopped myself because I fear losing upper body size. I supposed I SHOULD get a coach or trainer's opinion NOW.

Thanks!

[whatevergirl]

I'm following a great new diet and workout plan now, but still relatively 'new' to weight lifting. This thread really was an eye opener for me...helped in many ways. Thank you! I'm hovering around 136 lbs now, and I'm 5'4''...looks like 128 might be a goal I should shoot for (120 was what I was aiming for, no real ''reason'') looking at my height peer group.

I'm tossing the idea around in my mind, about competing next year. We'll see. But, the more I learn here, and elsewhere about this, the less tentative I'll become. What you don't know, can sometimes hurt you. lol So, knowledge is important if you want to compete, and compete well.

Thank u again for posting this!!

[whatevergirl]

Forget the measurements Whether you are in fact 20% now or not doesn't matter. What matters is how your body physically looks. During my contest prep, I rarely took body fat measurements (didn't weigh myself much either) because: 1) calipers are not accurate enough 2) the mirror and my coach were all I needed to determine that I was ready.

Is this your first competition? It might be beneficial for you to work with someone who can give you objective feedback throughout your transformation process. I would hope that a good coach would be honest with you as to whether or not you would be ready for the stage.

''Simpy'' said something similar when I asked her about weight, etc.
This is really good to know...

[rockangel]

Thank-you for sharing. I had already read leigh's bodyfat article a long while ago, and I have been measuring with calipers, although would like to have dexa done one day.

I just posted my most recent pics where I am now 19-20%bf, and I appreciate your opinion however; I have to say that I do think I am in fact at about 19-20%bf, especially when I compare my pics to YOURS, where u say you are at the same ????
We just hold our body fat differently.
I could be wrong, but I would appreciate anyone correcting me at this too.

I am not trying to be vengeful here but just honest, as I ask all of you to be with me.
When I look at the condition you were in when you entered your first contest, I have to be honest and say that I would never have done so looking like that (you had no muscle??), and that is my biggest fear and what my main question was....

In order for me to lose the fat on my bottom half I'll have to go very low in bf% and I fear that I have not built up my top half enough to support that loss, because I don't want to look skinny/weak.

I'll appreciate other opinions please???

First, you obviously have not read the post that i posted about my first show. It was in the link in the VERY first post in this thread. Perhaps you should go take a look at it.
I KNOW in my first contest i was not where i wanted to be. I readily admit that i had no business being up there. So your nasty little comments bear no weight on me. And yes, you are trying to be vengeful. Call it what it is honey.

You have the exact problem i have and that is you carry all the fat in the lower region. Yes you will have to go very low in body fat in order to lose all the cellulite you have. As will I.
And yes, i said that my bf levels were what they were and I was WAY WAY off. Please at one point calipers were giving me 17% and i was more like 27%. I left them in my pics like that becaus i want to remind myself that it is easy to misjudge body fat on oneself, and it reminds me of how dumb i was to think i was at 17% at one time. I can laugh at myself, something you need to learn.

And this is why i have said you either need to recomp or build more muscle, you are not ready to show, you are not were you think you are. I tried to give you some good advice, and just becaus eyou dont like what you hear and wont listen to others who have been there and done that you are going to get pissy. Good luck, you are going to need it with your attitude.

[LaVida]

First, you obviously have not read the post that i posted about my first show. It was in the link in the VERY first post in this thread. Perhaps you should go take a look at it.
I KNOW in my first contest i was not where i wanted to be. I readily admit that i had no business being up there. So your nasty little comments bear no weight on me. And yes, you are trying to be vengeful. Call it what it is honey.

You have the exact problem i have and that is you carry all the fat in the lower region. Yes you will have to go very low in body fat in order to lose all the cellulite you have. As will I.
And yes, i said that my bf levels were what they were and I was WAY WAY off. Please at one point calipers were giving me 17% and i was more like 27%. I left them in my pics like that becaus i want to remind myself that it is easy to misjudge body fat on oneself, and it reminds me of how dumb i was to think i was at 17% at one time. I can laugh at myself, something you need to learn.

And this is why i have said you either need to recomp or build more muscle, you are not ready to show, you are not were you think you are. I tried to give you some good advice, and just becaus eyou dont like what you hear and wont listen to others who have been there and done that you are going to get pissy. Good luck, you are going to need it with your attitude.

LOL NOOO hon, I DID read your 1st post, I just didn't understand why you were telling me I wasn't at 19-20%bf, when clearly you weren't either.
Anyways, good to know that you just left them up there as a reminder.

Note taken, and NO I am not getting pissy at all. I just want other opinions because obviously everybody sees things and people differently. I just want to keep objective.

No worries. Luv ya.

Cheers!

[rockangel]

LOL NOOO hon, I DID read your 1st post, I just didn't understand why you were telling me I wasn't at 19-20%bf, when clearly you weren't either.
Anyways, good to know that you just left them up there as a reminder.

Note taken, and NO I am not getting pissy at all. I just want other opinions because obviously everybody sees things and people differently. I just want to keep objective.

No worries. Luv ya.

Cheers!

Im a lot better at judging bf levels now then i was then. I have seen and learned a lot more and having three female competitors and 2 male bber competitors working with me, helps a lot. If you want me to tell you my bf levels are: My first pic was prob around 33%, didnt take any caliper readings so cant ever say for certain, but i am over 30 for sure. My comp pics i was more around 27 - 28% and my most recent pics i am more around 23 - 25%. That is non calipered, visual only.
Just because i was wrong in the past about myself (which i admitted in my first post to you), doesnt mean that I do not know what i am talking about.

I am telling you you were not 17% in september because you have no visible striations in your glutes/quads. You may be 17% on top, but overall you are not 17% as you still have a lot of fat in the saddlebag and inner thigh area, something that you should NOT have at all at 17% and ready for a show. You have very little visible definition in your legs in your most recent pictures. So i am saying no, 13 weeks is not enough time for you to lose enough fat to be competitve. I would not go on stage looking as you do now, and i am not going on stage looking as i do now.

I would say overall body fat is probable more like 22- 25%. While you are leaner on top, your bottom half is going to be the deciding factor for you and is where you need to work on leaning out more. That is going to take more than 13 weeks.

And yes, being shorter and holding fat in your legs, you are going to have to go lower than most girls (same goes for me) and this will take more then 13 weeks.

Like i said, you look like you have a good base but you still have a way to go. You are not ready to show, and neither am i, but i didnt come on here asking if i could be ready to show in 13 weeks, i know i am not.

[kimm4]

''Simpy'' said something similar when I asked her about weight, etc.
This is really good to know...

I don't care about body fat numbers, progress pics tell me everything. But I will be totally honest, a scale is absolutely needed as a tool during contest prep. If the scale is not moving and steadily going down during your prep, then this is a problem.

[TraceyDW]

Thank you for this sticky!! It really put some of my goals in perspective. I tend to create goals that are unrealistic, then get myself depressed when I don't come close to achieving them, so I've been forcing myself to set smaller realistic goals. This post has significantly slowed down my interest in getting on stage. I promised myself that I will get up there at least ONCE in my lifetime... but it looks like it will be a few more years ahead of me. Once I get my bodyfat down, I will post pics and see what the veteran ladies here have to say before I even consider getting on stage. I have been lifting on and off since my teens, but I have no idea how much muscle mass will be left, once I take off these layers of chub.

Thanks for saving me from setting myself up for failure.

I have to agree with Driven Again.....Thanks for helping me get a grip on time frames as I would have also been setting myself up for failure. I thought with working on a base for 1 year and building for 1 year I could do it.....Now I know that I need to be patient and enjoy the journey!! I would still like to be ready for 2013, but time, dedication and a professional trainer will be the deciding factor.

[juliacheh]

LaVida, no offense to you, but look at my pictures from bodyspace
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/ph...-photo/5547492
and
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/ph...-photo/5317121
Some people guesstimated me here as being 16-18 body fat. (i never did any tests, since I only believe in Dexa Scan, and it's expensive)
I was pretty lean everywhere, but still held some fat in my glutes and hamstrings (this is the area where I hold most fat genetically).
Do you see how much leaner I'm in these pictures than you are? (no bragging, just being objective here). I still wasn't in contest condition and probably needed to drop 5 pounds more(estimating) to come into stage leanness.
Rockangel is spot on and deserves eternal reps and major props for sharing her story and her brutal honesty.

[LaVida]

LaVida, no offense to you, but look at my pictures from bodyspace
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/ph...-photo/5547492
and
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/ph...-photo/5317121
Some people guesstimated me here as being 16-18 body fat. (i never did any tests, since I only believe in Dexa Scan, and it's expensive)
I was pretty lean everywhere, but still held some fat in my glutes and hamstrings (this is the area where I hold most fat genetically).
Do you see how much leaner I'm in these pictures than you are? (no bragging, just being objective here). I still wasn't in contest condition and probably needed to drop 5 pounds more(estimating) to come into stage leanness.
Rockangel is spot on and deserves eternal reps and major props for sharing her story and her brutal honesty.

OKAY Julia and Rockangel....those are the answers I needed to hear! Thank-You sooooooo much!
So, should I just forget about the 13 week deadline and keep losing fat and whenever I get there, I get there? OR
should I start bulking and gain more muscle on my top half??

Truly Appreciate your answers!

[Emma-Leigh]

LaVida, no offense to you, but look at my pictures from bodyspace
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/ph...-photo/5547492
and
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/ph...-photo/5317121
Some people guesstimated me here as being 16-18 body fat. (i never did any tests, since I only believe in Dexa Scan, and it's expensive)
I was pretty lean everywhere, but still held some fat in my glutes and hamstrings (this is the area where I hold most fat genetically).
Do you see how much leaner I'm in these pictures than you are? (no bragging, just being objective here). I still wasn't in contest condition and probably needed to drop 5 pounds more(estimating) to come into stage leanness.
Rockangel is spot on and deserves eternal reps and major props for sharing her story and her brutal honesty.

^^ This.

Also - check out this thread for BF stuff: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=123726731

Also -->

I don't care about body fat numbers, progress pics tell me everything. But I will be totally honest, a scale is absolutely needed as a tool during contest prep. If the scale is not moving and steadily going down during your prep, then this is a problem.

^ this is the truth. Regardless of what 'number' you think you are / what you are measured to be.... <-- if you don't LOOK the part, what does it matter?

[LaVida]

^^ This.

Also - check out this thread for BF stuff: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=123726731

Also -->

^ this is the truth. Regardless of what 'number' you think you are / what you are measured to be.... <-- if you don't LOOK the part, what does it matter?

Thanks Emma-Leigh, yes I read that forum a while back....had to refer to it again for a reality check! lol

Any thoughts on my question above about what I should do next? I don't know if I will lose a lot of upper body muscle if I keep cutting, which is why I'm thinking I should gain more mass on top, or what??

[kfisherx]

I am in football season (hell-weeks) drudgery right now and heading into the gaming season so forgive me for being so occasional on the boards.

The good news is that I am up 20lbs and strong and fast as hell right now!

LaVida, you have received the best advice. You are most likely NOT going to hit it in 10-13 weeks but you can build this year and do even better next year. Personally, I would spend the next year building (not getting fat but really building esp in the upper area) You should also try to figure out a "coach" situation for your first show as they make a big difference to the big picture.

I have looked at your pics and your abs are gonna be awesome once you are able to get down low enough in bf%. Your problem area will be your upper legs and that is the toughest area of all to lose bf% from so again a coach and a LOT of time to diet down will be best for you.

[LaVida]

I am in football season (hell-weeks) drudgery right now and heading into the gaming season so forgive me for being so occasional on the boards.

The good news is that I am up 20lbs and strong and fast as hell right now!

LaVida, you have received the best advice. You are most likely NOT going to hit it in 10-13 weeks but you can build this year and do even better next year. Personally, I would spend the next year building (not getting fat but really building esp in the upper area) You should also try to figure out a "coach" situation for your first show as they make a big difference to the big picture.

I have looked at your pics and your abs are gonna be awesome once you are able to get down low enough in bf%. Your problem area will be your upper legs and that is the toughest area of all to lose bf% from so again a coach and a LOT of time to diet down will be best for you.

Great Advice! Thank-youuuu!!

[bubblegumkitty]

You just made my day and made the hours I put into this all worth it. Thank you!

I have to agree that I was very overly ambitious thinking that if I put in a couple of years of hard work and good supplements and hardcore diet that I would be able to possibly attempt some amateur competitions. I dont know if its more motivating to know its going to be more work or more intimidating! Now I REALLY feel like I have no idea what to do or where to begin :Z And I definetely dont want to be one of these girls listening to these men who clearly just wanna get them some and really dont have the female's career in their best interests.

[djz227]

Hi, thanks for the great thread.
Please tell me what I need to do to be competition ready. Also what category do I best fit into? Thank you.

[kfisherx]

I have to agree that I was very overly ambitious thinking that if I put in a couple of years of hard work and good supplements and hardcore diet that I would be able to possibly attempt some amateur competitions. I dont know if its more motivating to know its going to be more work or more intimidating! Now I REALLY feel like I have no idea what to do or where to begin :Z And I definetely dont want to be one of these girls listening to these men who clearly just wanna get them some and really dont have the female's career in their best interests.

It could be possible in a couple of years especially if you chose the show correctly. BEST to do serious bulk/gain plan somewhere before doing a show though.

Hi, thanks for the great thread.
Please tell me what I need to do to be competition ready. Also what category do I best fit into? Thank you.

You need to read this sticky. It has ALL the information you need within.

[whatevergirl]

Reread through this whole thread again...and really have come away learning a lot. I know nada about competitions, and this was a great thread to start in...thanks to all who shared!

[djz227]

You need to read this sticky. It has ALL the information you need within.

I did read the sticky. I just can't evaluate myself and was hoping for an objective pair of experienced eyes. Thanks anyway.