Well of course they will! But the full question is will deadlifts/squats make me stronger than my friend who neglects those and legs all together? He is currently pretty much stronger than me in everything when it comes to upper body. He benches a little more than 2x what I can. His tri's are a little stronger but not by a lot. His bi's are probably about 2x stronger than mine also. Thing is we have about the same build.. I'm 5'10 134 at the moment and he is about 5'7 138. He looks bigger but not by a huge amount.
ANYWAY, we've both been doing the same routines for a little while now and he really has no interest in training legs or lower body but I am because I know how important it can be. I also don't want to have chicken legs. So my question is if I begin to put legs and squats/deadlifts into my regular routine, will I eventually pass him in strength? If what I researched is right, I will be releasing more testosterone and be able to push harder than him in the long run. What do you guys think?
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12-10-2010, 08:28 PM #1
Will squats/deadlifts make me stronger
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12-10-2010, 08:32 PM #2
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Warning : Bodybuilding results may cause slight narcissism and turn you into a cheeky kunt, please train responsibily .
"-You can have results or you can have excuses . You can't have both !"
"In the gym, you are nothing but the embodiment of your own will."- BrettT
Current Lifts 18/10/2016
OHP: 225 x 1
Bench : 340 x 1
Squat : 500 x 2
Deadlift : 600 x 1
Bench/Squat/Deadlift total , natty , raw : 1440
Next milestones : 365 bench , and current lifts or higher under 12% bodyfat
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12-15-2010, 12:54 PM #3
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DEFINITELY!
Your legs are a HUGE muscle group with a large growth potential. Training your legs will spark a greater growth hormone release by your body - this should assist in growth elsewhere.
Also, your legs are the most functional of all muscles to make stronger. After all, in real life, when does bicep curling 50kg help? On the other hand, the ability to deadlift (pick things off of the floor) comes in handy every day.
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12-15-2010, 12:57 PM #4
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12-15-2010, 12:59 PM #5
The temporary, acute hormonal response that may or may not occur during training (depends on various parameters) will have a negligible impact upon other body parts.
What is of more importance is that it can likely be deduced that since you are committed and willing to train legs, that you are more serious about training overall than your friend, and thus may in time surpass him.Who was this love of yours?
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12-15-2010, 01:27 PM #6
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unless his friend has great genetics...
why are you so worried about being stronger than your friend? Also, you could stand to put on a good chunk of muscle. Start a clean mass diet. if he's 5'7" 138, then you would look comparable at 5'10" and about 145-150.
If strength is your goal, look into a workout program focused on strength instead of mass.oh and gecko that link did not contain answers only the search page - swiftness_02
The foods that trigger ketosis are high in carbs, not sugars - michaeldude
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12-15-2010, 02:58 PM #7
Lol I'm not "so worried about being stronger than my friend". All I was wondering is if my strength would surpass his if I started training legs and he continued to neglect them. Mainly out of curiosity because I am definitely going to begin leg training. Strength is my goal but also would like to be bigger. I know everything I need to do though. Eating and lifting heavy ;-)
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12-15-2010, 03:00 PM #8
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12-17-2010, 04:38 AM #9
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'The large burst of anabolic hormones resulting from squats and deadlifts, allows most of your muscles to benefit from this release simultaneously. Squats and deadlifts work many muscles simultaneously in the body and will allow most of your body to get some stimulation from the release of the hormones during the workout. The testosterone and GH released, is very crucial for being a catalyst for your muscle growth. It won’t be released as much in the smaller compound excercises, such as bench press. Therefore doing smaller compound excercises, would not be able to makeup for the benefit of having leg workouts in your routine.'
*ww.bodybuildingweb.net/blog/squats-deadlifts-and-release-of-testosterone-and-growth-hormone/
The above speaks for itself...
'Remember, since your legs are such a large muscle group, training them has a MUCH larger effect on anabolic (muscle-building) hormones.
In fact, the Barbell Squat, while being one of the “hardest” and most excruciating exercises, is actually the best overall exercise for skyrocketing testosterone levels in the body.'
Read more: *ww.180mma.com/strength-and-conditioning/muscle-building/242-bodybuilding-training-tip-for-more-growth-hormone-release#ixzz18N8ZLQQF
Free martial arts tips and workouts 180° MMA Training and Combat Fitness
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12-17-2010, 04:42 AM #10
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12-17-2010, 04:46 AM #11
Your body responds to working out muscle groups by producing more testosterone. By lifting legs, the largest of muscle groups, you'll produce even more testosterone (according to bb.com anyway). My personal experience, my upper body gains increased quite a bit when I added squats and deads. Do what's right for you. You'll pass your friend soon enough.
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12-17-2010, 04:57 AM #12
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12-17-2010, 04:57 AM #13
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I wouldn't say the debate is put to bed on exercise-induced GH release. Here is an excerpt from one of many articles on this very website.
"Exercise is probably the largest contributor to growth hormone release. Exercise appears as though it effects the growth hormone release through numerous different mechanisms such as:
Neural Input
Direct stimulation by catecholamines
Lactic & nitric oxide
Changes in acid-base balance (Godfrey, R, et al, 2003)
Different types of exercises impact the HGH in different ways however.
Resistance Training:
Resistance training offers one of the most influential environments for exercise induced growth hormone release (EIGR). The major factors that determine how much an increase is produced are load and frequency.
When we lift heavier loads at a greater frequency (less rest time) we cause our bodies to release greater amounts of growth hormone.
It should be noted however that in regards to protein synthesis, insulin-like growth factor-1 plays a larger role than growth hormone does.
Resistance training programs that utilize many large muscle groups at once tend to elicit the greatest growth hormone release as more total muscle fibers are called into play. Also, growth hormone release tends to depend upon how much of a demand on anaerobic glycolysis there is during an exercise training bout."
Whether squats and deads will release GH aiding in overall mass and strength increases, or whether or not it is negligible in terms of its effect on the upper body... I believe you are on the right track in terms of your desire to keep the body in balance strength and mass-wise.
I agree with the other guys - your apparent desire and discipline is what is going to make you out-perform your friend in the long run.
On a personal note - it's good to have a little healthy rivalry with your training partner, but don't worry about it too much. My training partner in college could always out-bench me too, but being shorter has certain advantages biomechanically. Leverage is improved. I'd rather be able to out-squat somebody than out-curl them anyway. That's where the BIG weight is. Your friend may out-curl you by 10 pounds, but you'll out-deadlift him by 200.~Forgiven~
My Training Log and Record of Adventures:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?p=441433851
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12-17-2010, 06:08 AM #14
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12-17-2010, 06:17 AM #15
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12-17-2010, 08:49 AM #16
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JFC!!
Yes, squats and deadlifts have a relatively decent release. You know what else does? Every exercise does. Yes, squats and deads have the highest amount, yet it is negligible compared to bench press, military press, rows, pull ups, etc. Compounds aren’t the only ones, isolations do too. Hell, getting aroused releases testosterone. Healthy fats do too. As does sleeping, and so does fasting.
When It comes to working out, studies have shown that rest periods had a larger effect on any release than the exercise selection itself. Keep rest periods shorter had larger releases than longer rest periods. What sort of rest periods do most people use with squats and deads? Let me guess.....2+ minutes? yeah...so you are negating the benefit there.
One more thing, studies shown that after about 10 weeks of steady training, any benefit you received, from trying to tailor your rest periods for maximum release, was undone as your body adapted.
Moral of the story? Train body parts so that those particular body parts grow. Do not train your calf to have your traps grow. Use the rest period that best fits your routine. Don't give two ****s to the test or GH release. Talking about that, helps CSCS's sell their training books to newbies, who will then go on about how compound only workouts are the best for everything. I know, I was one of those lemmings for awhile.
Squats & Deadlifts and release of testosterone
Originally Posted by Excerpt
Then iSkinny had his curiosity piqued after I referenced rest periods effecting hormones and did more digging:[/QUOTE]
Go do some reading beyond the asinine articles located the supersite of this page. The articles in the forum are generally far more useful and less idiotic.-
Alchemist of Alcohol
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Journal: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=126418493
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12-17-2010, 09:57 AM #17
Yes. Yes it does.
From the link you provided:
There is however, no significant studies that show that resistance excercise, directly leads to higher hormone levels long term. In fact, for a day or 2 post-excercise, many studies show LH and testosterone decline, while cortisol increases.
Read more: http://www.180mma.com/strength-and-c...#ixzz18N8ZLQQF
Free martial arts tips and workouts 180° MMA Training and Combat FitnessNo brain, no gain.
"The fitness and nutrition world is a breeding ground for obsessive-compulsive behavior. The irony is that many of the things people worry about have no impact on results either way, and therefore aren't worth an ounce of concern."--Alan Aragon
Where the mind goes, the body follows.
Ironwill Gym:
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Ironwill2008 Journal:
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12-17-2010, 10:03 AM #18
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12-17-2010, 10:12 AM #19
I've seen that same article linked in here in defense of the "Squats will make your arms grow (or whatever unrelated bodypart)" a hundred times, even though it states the opposite.
Back in before other bro's post links to posts by other bro's on other bodybuilding sites that tout 'teh hyooge test release.'
Here's the peer-reviewed, clinically-studied results: Squat and Deadlift for their own benefits. If you want big arms, work your arms in balance with the rest of your body by doing some direct arm work. If you want a big chest, or a big Bench Press number, train that bodypart and/or that lift directly.No brain, no gain.
"The fitness and nutrition world is a breeding ground for obsessive-compulsive behavior. The irony is that many of the things people worry about have no impact on results either way, and therefore aren't worth an ounce of concern."--Alan Aragon
Where the mind goes, the body follows.
Ironwill Gym:
https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showpost.php?p=629719403&postcount=3388
Ironwill2008 Journal:
https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=157459343&p=1145168733
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12-17-2010, 10:17 AM #20
Lol you guys can stop telling me to "eat". I started off at 125 and I was 125 for my whole late teenage/early adult life so 135 is making progress for me. Don't worry about that my weight is going up =]
Btw thanks for the input guys. My purpose for wanting to begin legs is to make my legs bigger and stronger it was never to increase my bench or whatever I was just wondering if these "rumors" were true.
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12-17-2010, 10:28 AM #21
Exactly...
OP when it comes to this type of thing, expect 5-10lbs of Bw with every inch of height. So if your friend is 5'7 138lbs, you should probably be at least 165-170lbs minimum if you expect the same level of muscularity/strength, assuming you two have been training a similar mount of time and have similar body compositions...
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12-17-2010, 10:34 AM #22
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12-17-2010, 11:36 AM #23
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12-17-2010, 11:37 AM #24
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12-17-2010, 11:43 AM #25
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12-17-2010, 11:47 AM #26
^^^^I'll go with this.
I'll work my legs to make my legs bigger, and work my arms to make my arms bigger. Same with every other bodypart; work them in balance with everything else.
I don't make the rules of physiology; I just have to center my training around them if I expect to make progress.No brain, no gain.
"The fitness and nutrition world is a breeding ground for obsessive-compulsive behavior. The irony is that many of the things people worry about have no impact on results either way, and therefore aren't worth an ounce of concern."--Alan Aragon
Where the mind goes, the body follows.
Ironwill Gym:
https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showpost.php?p=629719403&postcount=3388
Ironwill2008 Journal:
https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=157459343&p=1145168733
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12-20-2010, 04:43 AM #27
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That's just crazy talk.
What's wrong with you people? You're taking all the mystical magic out of this whole thing and trying to reduce things to common sense and hard science. Next you're going to tell me the tooth fairy doesn't exist?~Forgiven~
My Training Log and Record of Adventures:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?p=441433851
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12-20-2010, 06:55 AM #28
Not to pick on you, but this type of post represents a lot of what is going wrong on this site:
1. The uninformed giving "advice" to the general public.
2. Quotation of BS from "studies" that nobody bothered to read in depth before interpreting the results, and that often runs contrary to practical experience and real world results.
3. The buzzword of "functional" in relation to bodybuilding, which is not a functional sport.
To the OP: If you want to be stronger in a particular lift then train that lift, and similar lifts that work the muscle(s) you're directly trying to target. If you want to be the master barbell curling champion, then a schedule of heavy curls is going to be your friend.
However, if you want to be stronger overall, then squats, deadlifts, bench press, overhead pressing, and other compound work is your ally. Lift heavy, eat a lot, and you'll become bigger and stronger. This will likely carry over to other lifts such as curls indirectly, and allow you to train those more intensely as well, leading to further strength gains, ultimately surpassing your upper body-only partner in most things.
And forget about GH release, fancy supps, etc. The only true path to gains is lifting heavy, lifting consistently, and eating.☠ By reading this post, you have agreed to my negative reputation terms of service.
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12-20-2010, 07:07 AM #29
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As far as looking massive... Compare guys who do deads and squats with guys who don't... I always see dudes with big arms chest and traps but turn to a stick figure from the bottom of the chest to the waist(Im not even bothering talking about leg development)... Squats and deads work all those muscles that require you to stabilize your upper body.. The result is this thick plate that sits under your ribs and makes your upper body look alot more powerful, esp from the side.
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12-22-2010, 01:59 AM #30
I am just having a hard time wrapping my mind around 5'10" and 134lbs. OP please eat more and try to get bigger. Definitely keep the weight training up, and Squats and Deadlifts are the two best exercises you can do. Whatever you do for your upper body, just be balanced about it. Don't do just Bench Press and Bicep Curls. But read the stickies in the Exercise and Workout Program forums, and I'd even recommend you read through them in the Nutrition forums. Good luck!
--- Nick ---
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