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  1. #1
    Registered User kratos01510's Avatar
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    How long would it take to cut from 13-15% body fat to 10-11% bodyfat?

    question is as stated. Im at around 13-15% body fat according to the numerous scales ive used to calculate it(I know they arnt dead on but its been consistantly inbetween those numbers for the past week so it must be somewhat correct). I was just wondering if my diet was spot on maybe 1 cheat meal every 2 weeks. How long would it take me to lower my body fat % from 13-15% to 10-11%(im really aiming for 10% i kinda wanna see my abs)? I weigh 158 pounds im 5 foot 10 inches. I workout consistenly 4 days a week and im running(High intensity) For atleast 4-5 days as well. I know it depends on genetics and it differes for everyone but i was wondering if someone had atleast a rough estimate to give me.
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    Registered User Total Body Rebuild's Avatar
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    Nutritional info? At this stage, I think nutrition is going to be the main factor in your success.

    What is your daily cal intake? Daily expenditure?

    That will allow us to make a general estimate.

    The reason I say this is that a "spot on" diet can mean many things to many different people...the deficit is what will matter in the long run...
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    Registered User kratos01510's Avatar
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    14% journey to 10%

    Originally Posted by Total Body Rebuild View Post
    Nutritional info? At this stage, I think nutrition is going to be the main factor in your success.

    What is your daily cal intake? Daily expenditure?

    That will allow us to make a general estimate.

    The reason I say this is that a "spot on" diet can mean many things to many different people...the deficit is what will matter in the long run...
    Right now my daily cal intake is 500-700 below a recommended 2000 a day. Iv'e heard over and over again going to low below 2000 is not only dangerous but could lead to stores in fat because the body tries to save it instead of burn it. So yea right now i try to eat about 1500 cal's a day.. Some day's just a tiny bit under. I'm trying to take it slow and steady seeing this as the best way to do so. I know burning 3000 calories a week results in 1 lb of fat loss a week roughly. And i also know that the less body fat% you have the harder and longer it takes to burn that extra % of body fat off. Im already pretty lean so i dont know if that has anything to do with it. Based off of this is there any rough estimate of how long it'd take to go from 14% to 10%? Im guessing somewhere between 8-12 weeks maybe longer?
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  4. #4
    Registered User Total Body Rebuild's Avatar
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    From a mathematical prospective...(There are many real life/physiological aspects that can effect this)

    Current stats : 158lbs, 15% bodyfat (I know you may be lower, but lets just err on the high side for the sake of the equation)

    Lean body mass: 134.3lbs
    Fat mass: 23.7lbs

    Let's assume that for every pound you lose, 65% is fat and the other 35% is other lean body mass. (This may vary for many, but I think it is somewhat realistic. You may lose a higher fat percentage, which is good, but that just means you reach your goal earlier. Also, this is not all muscle mass, its other stuff too.)

    So...

    Based on the above figures, you would be 10% at around 145lbs. That would put you at around 130.5 lbs of lean body mass and 14.5lbs of fat mass. You would lose 13lbs total, with 4.3lbs being lean mass and 8.7lbs being fat mass.

    So, around 145lbs is the target, 13lbs down.

    13x3500 cals = 45500 total cal deficit needed.

    500cal daily deficit: ~91 days (13 weeks)
    600cal daily deficit: ~76 days (~11 weeks)
    700cal daily deficit: ~65 days (~9 weeks)

    In conclusion,

    Yes, about 8-12 weeks. Your mileage may vary...
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  5. #5
    Registered User kratos01510's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Total Body Rebuild View Post
    From a mathematical prospective...(There are many real life/physiological aspects that can effect this)

    Current stats : 158lbs, 15% bodyfat (I know you may be lower, but lets just err on the high side for the sake of the equation)

    Lean body mass: 134.3lbs
    Fat mass: 23.7lbs

    Let's assume that for every pound you lose, 65% is fat and the other 35% is other lean body mass. (This may vary for many, but I think it is somewhat realistic. You may lose a higher fat percentage, which is good, but that just means you reach your goal earlier. Also, this is not all muscle mass, its other stuff too.)

    So...

    Based on the above figures, you would be 10% at around 145lbs. That would put you at around 130.5 lbs of lean body mass and 14.5lbs of fat mass. You would lose 13lbs total, with 4.3lbs being lean mass and 8.7lbs being fat mass.

    So, around 145lbs is the target, 13lbs down.

    13x3500 cals = 45500 total cal deficit needed.

    500cal daily deficit: ~91 days (13 weeks)
    600cal daily deficit: ~76 days (~11 weeks)
    700cal daily deficit: ~65 days (~9 weeks)

    In conclusion,

    Yes, about 8-12 weeks. Your mileage may vary...

    Appreciate the comments they seem spot on. Now i rememeber trying to reach a body fat that low before and i seemed to reach a stalemate at about 155 pounds. No matter what my diet i couldnt break 155. This however was when i was eating 3 meals a day at about 300 cals each avergining 900 cals a day and also running about 4 miles(Fast pace) and working out which means i was prob averging no calories a day... Or close to that... Yes yes i know that was stupid as hell but will i hit that stalemate again or since i up'd my calories but still go under 2000 will i be able to break it? I heard eating low cals like that just makes fat store instead of burning it? Anyways Ill continue to do this at a steady pace and see where i go from there =). Thanks again!
    Last edited by kratos01510; 11-20-2010 at 07:20 AM.
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  6. #6
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    Originally Posted by Total Body Rebuild View Post
    From a mathematical prospective...(There are many real life/physiological aspects that can effect this)

    Current stats : 158lbs, 15% bodyfat (I know you may be lower, but lets just err on the high side for the sake of the equation)

    Lean body mass: 134.3lbs
    Fat mass: 23.7lbs

    Let's assume that for every pound you lose, 65% is fat and the other 35% is other lean body mass. (This may vary for many, but I think it is somewhat realistic. You may lose a higher fat percentage, which is good, but that just means you reach your goal earlier. Also, this is not all muscle mass, its other stuff too.)

    So...

    Based on the above figures, you would be 10% at around 145lbs. That would put you at around 130.5 lbs of lean body mass and 14.5lbs of fat mass. You would lose 13lbs total, with 4.3lbs being lean mass and 8.7lbs being fat mass.

    So, around 145lbs is the target, 13lbs down.

    13x3500 cals = 45500 total cal deficit needed.

    500cal daily deficit: ~91 days (13 weeks)
    600cal daily deficit: ~76 days (~11 weeks)
    700cal daily deficit: ~65 days (~9 weeks)

    In conclusion,

    Yes, about 8-12 weeks. Your mileage may vary...
    if he does it properly he shouldn't be losing 1/3 pound of LBM with every pound he loses
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  7. #7
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    Exclamation Hoping to drop from 13-14% range to single digit BF% in 10 wks

    I have a similar question...I am currently 161 lbs, at 13-13.5% body fat and have 10 weeks to lose as much body fat as possible for a "biggest loser" competition at work. I am currently eating five balanced meals every three hours daily, totaling with approximately 161 grams of protein, 161 grams of carbs, and 20 grams in fat. The amount of calories will fluctuate depending on the days workout, but I always maintain a 500 cal deficit.

    I am a single parent, and have my son every other week...so the weeks that I don't have him consist of 3 days of 60-90 min intense HIT cardio sessions, and four days of weight training and moderate cardio (5k-10k run).

    The weeks that I do have my son consist of "prison PT" and circuit training in the house, which last approximately 60 min per session (after 8 years in the Army, this kind of PT is very old, and its hard for me to conjure the motivation to go any longer than an hour).

    I would like to drop to 8-9%; but I am unsure as to whether this is feasible in the time frame given...primarily due to the fact that I am not willing to sacrifice lean mass.

    ....Also, I am drinking a little over a gallon of water a day, which I have learned during my time in the Army really assists with fat loss.

    My game plan is to continue what I am doing until 30 day out, at which time I may consider using a thermogenic burner.

    Any additional advice you guys may have would be appreciated. I'm also curious as to whether anyone here has attempted fat loss while in the same BF% range as me, and what their experience was.
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    Originally Posted by barnes188 View Post
    I have a similar question...I am currently 161 lbs, at 13-13.5% body fat and have 10 weeks to lose as much body fat as possible for a "biggest loser" competition at work. I am currently eating five balanced meals every three hours daily, totaling with approximately 161 grams of protein, 161 grams of carbs, and 20 grams in fat. The amount of calories will fluctuate depending on the days workout, but I always maintain a 500 cal deficit.

    I am a single parent, and have my son every other week...so the weeks that I don't have him consist of 3 days of 60-90 min intense HIT cardio sessions, and four days of weight training and moderate cardio (5k-10k run).

    The weeks that I do have my son consist of "prison PT" and circuit training in the house, which last approximately 60 min per session (after 8 years in the Army, this kind of PT is very old, and its hard for me to conjure the motivation to go any longer than an hour).

    I would like to drop to 8-9%; but I am unsure as to whether this is feasible in the time frame given...primarily due to the fact that I am not willing to sacrifice lean mass.

    ....Also, I am drinking a little over a gallon of water a day, which I have learned during my time in the Army really assists with fat loss.

    My game plan is to continue what I am doing until 30 day out, at which time I may consider using a thermogenic burner.

    Any additional advice you guys may have would be appreciated. I'm also curious as to whether anyone here has attempted fat loss while in the same BF% range as me, and what their experience was.
    When attempting to get in the single digits body fat you shouldn't obsess over a consistent deficit. Too much emphasis from old school diets is just around the consistent deficit daily. If you stick with the same 160g of carbs/protein and 20g of fat per day you will eventually hit a wall with the diet once your body catches up to what you're putting it through. It will be so predictable to your body since the diet never changes, and calories/carbs/fat are never cycled up or down. Hormones like Leptin, neuropeptide Y, anandamide will be working against you the entire diet. It's important to "re-feed" with most diets in the case of carb cycling you would "carb up" doing this helps keep the body confused to keep progress going.
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    as long as it has to...everyone is different, i lost 45 plus in 8 months but others have lost 60 to 100 in some cases, each person is difrent so dont get discouraged if u dont loose it fast. it may take few months to a few yrs but if ur into it for life it wont matter how long it takes.
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  10. #10
    Registered User Gatoxx's Avatar
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    I"m in a totally different situation, I came from a weight 247 pounds on september, I currently weight 210 my bf % is around 16 I have lost a lot of weight but the bf did not drop a lot. How close I'm I to get to a single digit, or closer?
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    Originally Posted by Gatoxx View Post
    I"m in a totally different situation, I came from a weight 247 pounds on september, I currently weight 210 my bf % is around 16 I have lost a lot of weight but the bf did not drop a lot. How close I'm I to get to a single digit, or closer?
    first off,

    congrats for losing the weight!!


    but at this stage as stated before it depends ALOT on nutrition and PROPER carbs/fats... yes STILL, it makes SUCH a big difference esp at this stage when you're hovering around the mid teens(15-18%)... also, WATER intake, make sure you flush your body

    idk your workout regimen or your goals or school/work/social life too b/c those ALL play factors...

    also maybe changing/switching up your cardio routine too, as i've heard that that helps, not just WHAT you're doing but WHEN.. .adn then nutrition, nutrition, nutrition... EVERYthing must be clean
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    ALSO always remember that muscle weighs more than fat, thus lifting weights/resistance training prob burns more fat than anything if you go heavy and intense
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    Originally Posted by kevans74 View Post
    ALSO always remember that muscle weighs more than fat, thus lifting weights/resistance training prob burns more fat than anything if you go heavy and intense
    Firstly:
    Muscle DOESN'T 'weight more than fat'.
    1 pound of muscle = 1 pound.
    1 pound of fat = 1 pound.
    1 pound = 1 pound.

    Muscle is, however, DENSER than fat. So - similar to how 1 pound of gold will take up less room than 1 pound of feathers, you can weight the same and LOOK different depending on your body composition.


    Secondly - how does the 'weight' of muscle / fat have relate to: "lifting weights/resistance training prob burns more fat than anything if you go heavy and intense
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    Originally Posted by Emma-Leigh View Post
    Firstly:
    Muscle DOESN'T 'weight more than fat'.
    1 pound of muscle = 1 pound.
    1 pound of fat = 1 pound.
    1 pound = 1 pound.

    Muscle is, however, DENSER than fat. So - similar to how 1 pound of gold will take up less room than 1 pound of feathers, you can weight the same and LOOK different depending on your body composition.


    Secondly - how does the 'weight' of muscle / fat have relate to: "lifting weights/resistance training prob burns more fat than anything if you go heavy and intense
    First, yes I meant to say more dense

    Second, i was in a hurry at the time and getting out of class, so i admit i worded this wrong I meant to say that weight/resistance aids most in burning muscle fat as it spikes the metabolism more than anything, thus making cardio sessions more effective/efficient when lowering body fat levels
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    Originally Posted by Total Body Rebuild View Post

    So, around 145lbs is the target, 13lbs down.

    13x3500 cals = 45500 total cal deficit needed.

    500cal daily deficit: ~91 days (13 weeks)
    600cal daily deficit: ~76 days (~11 weeks)
    700cal daily deficit: ~65 days (~9 weeks)

    In conclusion,

    Yes, about 8-12 weeks. Your mileage may vary...
    Extremely sorry to semi-hijacking this thread. But i got a question about the deficit calculations.

    Had one of those stupd " Oh i want to give up phases" that i just battled through and started again, managed to lose about 4-5kg since then. I was alittle vary about it cause it didnt really seem real. So i picked up a neutriant guide program to make sure i actually hit the marks on everything.

    Is it -normal- To start gaining weight again? I mean less then a week ago i was 76~ now i am up in 81 again. I though it was the new scale that was acting up but it wasnt. Sure i was kinda full at the moment of the weight in but it just got me so paranoid. Did messurment check and it hasnt move anything at all.

    The second question was somewhat related, On training days i feel the biggest hunger that the 1500kcals cant really tame. is it viable to eat 1900-2000kcals if i am burning 600-700kcals ( according to fitday ) at the gym?

    Gosh i feel stupid for asking this, Sorry once again for hijacking it.
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    Originally Posted by Total Body Rebuild View Post
    From a mathematical prospective...(There are many real life/physiological aspects that can effect this)

    Current stats : 158lbs, 15% bodyfat (I know you may be lower, but lets just err on the high side for the sake of the equation)

    Lean body mass: 134.3lbs
    Fat mass: 23.7lbs

    Let's assume that for every pound you lose, 65% is fat and the other 35% is other lean body mass. (This may vary for many, but I think it is somewhat realistic. You may lose a higher fat percentage, which is good, but that just means you reach your goal earlier. Also, this is not all muscle mass, its other stuff too.)

    So...

    Based on the above figures, you would be 10% at around 145lbs. That would put you at around 130.5 lbs of lean body mass and 14.5lbs of fat mass. You would lose 13lbs total, with 4.3lbs being lean mass and 8.7lbs being fat mass.

    So, around 145lbs is the target, 13lbs down.

    13x3500 cals = 45500 total cal deficit needed.

    500cal daily deficit: ~91 days (13 weeks)
    600cal daily deficit: ~76 days (~11 weeks)
    700cal daily deficit: ~65 days (~9 weeks)

    In conclusion,

    Yes, about 8-12 weeks. Your mileage may vary...
    As has been said before on here, this would vary from person to person.

    Here is a passage from Lyle Mcdonald, regarding fat loss slowing down as you get leaner, along with less of a deficit. I guess diet and patience is the key

    So, the basic assertion of the paper is that, so long as the net daily deficit does not exceed what your fat stores can provide, you should spare lean body mass. And based on the small amount of research that they found, this seemed to be generally true (many studies find an initial rapid LBM loss but this is most likely glycogen and water and stuff, not muscle mass). By extension, if your daily caloric deficit exceeds the above, your body will have to mobilize LBM to cover the difference. So let?s look at an example.

    Say we have a 180 lb male at 15% bodyfat. He has 27 lbs. of fat, and his maintenance calorie intake is 15 cal/lb or 2700 calories. With 27 lbs. of fat, he should be able to sustain a caloric deficit, from diet alone, of 27 lbs. fat * 31 cal/lb = 837 calories/day. So he could reduce his calories to 1863 (ha! 10 cal/lb) and shouldn?t lose any LBM at that level of intake. He should get a weekly fat loss of just over 1.5 lbs./week.

    If the same 180 lb guy was at 10% bodyfat, only 18 lbs. of fat, he could only sustain a 558 calorie/day deficit (2150 cal/day or 12 cal/lb), he?s down to 1 pound per week. By the time he?s at 8%, he?s down to 14.5 lbs. of fat and a total deficit of 446 calories/day and about 2/3 a pound of fat loss/week. Oh yeah, if he were a fat **** at 30% bodyfat, that?s 54 lbs. of fat, he could sustain a deficit of over 1500 cal/day and lose over 3 pounds per week of pure lard; of course he?d only be eating 1300 cal/day. Again, the above all seem to roughly pass the reality check in terms of what we see in human dieters.

    Now, one implication of the above is that, as a diet proceeds and your fat stores shrink, your net deficit has to decrease. Ok, step back, take a breath and read that again. More importantly, note my use of the word ?net? in the first sentence of that paragraph.

    Now it?s going to get confusing.

    At first glance, the above seems to be indicating that, as you get leaner, you?ll need to raise calories to compensate, so that the deficit isn?t as extreme. But that?s incorrect; it is saying that fat loss will need to slow (because the net deficit you can sustain will be smaller). By ?net? deficit, I mean the difference between your current maintenance requirements and your intake. This is important because, as you diet, your maintenance requirements go down due to the loss of bodymass along with the adaptive component of metabolic rate (due to insulin, leptin, ghrelin, peptide YY, etc). Let?s simplify this by looking at the math.

    Our 180 lb man at 15% starts his diet. He has 27 lbs. of fat and can sustain a maximum deficit of 27 lbs. * 31 cal/lb = 837 calories. Assuming a maintenance of 15 cal/lb (2700), his starting calorie level will be 2700 cal - 837 calories = 1863 calories/day. He?ll be losing around 1.5 lb fat/week.

    So now we check in 8 weeks later, he?s down 12 lbs., almost purely of fat (we?ll ignore any small LBM losses). His new numbers are 168 lbs. with 15 lbs. of fat = 9% bodyfat. Maximal sustainable deficit = 15 * 31 = 465 cal

    Assuming his maintenance is still 15 cal/lb (not automatically a safe assumption), his maintenance requirements should now be 2520 calories. But the adaptive part of metabolic rate reduction has probably dropped him a good 10% below that. So let?s say his maintenance is 2250 cal/day or so. 2250 cal/day - 465 calories = 1785 calories. So, not much of a reduction from his previous 1863 calorie/day diet. Basically, the drop in his maintenance levels over the course of 8 weeks offsets the fact that he can?t sustain as much of a deficit and is now leaner. Of course, his fat loss has also slowed to just under a pound/week.

    Now four weeks later, he?s dropped about 4 more pounds of fat. His new numbers are
    164 lbs. with 11 lb of fat = 6.7% bodyfat. Maximal sustainable deficit = 11 * 31 = 341 cal

    His maintenance will have dropped further, let?s say 14 cal/lb (people?s daily activity tends to go down due to the hormonal changes from extreme dieting) and a 15% adaptive reduction which brings him to 1951 calories/day. Reduce by 341 to get 1610 calories/day. He will need to reduce daily calories by a couple of hundred (from 1785/day to 1610/day) to achieve the maximum deficit but his fat loss will be down to 2/3rds pound per week.

    Ok, step back for a second: the above calculations aren?t meant to be the holy word of god, there are a lot of estimates upon estimates being made, especially my guesses as to the changes in maintenance level and how big of an impact the adaptive component is having. The adaptive component is a big question mark with not enough data for my liking. Tracking morning body temperature gives a rough guideline: for every 1 degree drop in morning temperature below 97.8 degrees, your metabolism is suppressed by about 10%. This was more to illustrate what I meant by ?net deficit? with changes in both fat mass and maintenance requirements.

    But, again, the above seems to scale roughly with reality. As people get leaner and leaner, fat loss slows drastically. To keep it moving, they have to either cut calories further or increase activity, both can cause muscle loss. Every bodybuilder who has had to move to 2 hours/day of aerobics to keep the fat coming off knows what I?m talking about. Drugs become more and more attractive as the myriad other systems start to fight back against you as well (on which note: will someone please get the folks working on intranasal leptin to hurry it up).
    Weight loss comp (02/03/11 to 01/06/11)
    01/01/11 - 183lbs
    March
    02/03/11 - 173lbs @ 20%bf
    09/03/11 - 171.2lbs
    16/03/11 - 171lbs
    23/03/11 - 169.2lbs
    30/03/11 - 170.2lbs
    April
    06/04/11 -
    13/04/11 - Holiday
    20/04/11 - Holiday
    27/04/11 - 177.4lbs
    May
    04/05/11 - 177lbs
    11/05/11 - 173.6lbs
    18/05/11 -
    25/05/11 - 174lbs
    June
    01/06/11 - Target visible abs (relaxed) followed by slow bulk! :o)
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  17. #17
    Registered User irngirl's Avatar
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    Hi guys, I was wondering if you could help me figure out my numbers/macros. I'm 5'1 and 125.5lbs/18% according to my Tanita scale. I'm doing a comp in June and want to get those numbers down significantly.

    Right now I do a 3 day split in the gym and cardio 4 x week with 2 HIIT 30 min sessions and 2 longer steady state sessions. I was also curious if you have carb cycling/water cut advice.

    Thanks
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  18. #18
    Not Swimming. Emma-Leigh's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by irngirl View Post
    Hi guys, I was wondering if you could help me figure out my numbers/macros. I'm 5'1 and 125.5lbs/18% according to my Tanita scale. I'm doing a comp in June and want to get those numbers down significantly.

    Right now I do a 3 day split in the gym and cardio 4 x week with 2 HIIT 30 min sessions and 2 longer steady state sessions. I was also curious if you have carb cycling/water cut advice.

    Thanks
    Try this thread - http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=121703981
    The first post goes through things in detail.
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  19. #19
    Registered User kilog55's Avatar
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    how is a 3-4% bf loss advanced fat loss?
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  20. #20
    Registered User SKINS32's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Emma-Leigh View Post
    Try this thread - http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=121703981
    The first post goes through things in detail.
    If I use that thread it calls for 125p/135f/400c? Why do all other sources call for 250p/100f/200c? The information in that thread does not work for me. if I follow the BMR+activity i would be obese on a bulk.

    T
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