In which order does protein/fat really get burned

[MikaK65]

So... I've read that on first burns carbs, then fat, then protein...

It seems most are of the opinion that one can't gain muscle and lose fat simultaneously which would be some contradictory to the above if all fat would be burned before protein is touched.

I mean the body has fat storages (in cells which we really want to get rid of) that would get consumed to cover calorie deficit before the protein gets transferred into energy instead of getting into it's aimed purpose to building your muscles.

So... In other words does the above order regard only fat that has still not gotten into fat cells ie. the actual burning order would be
1) Carbs still in digestion
2) Fat still in digestion
3) Protein still in digestion
4) Fat from fat cells
5) Eventually muscle tissue

Now the above looks some contraditory to the fact that we know there are cases where people have gained some muscle while on calorie deficit diets albeit it's slower than gaining muscle mass by bulking.

Further... what about glycogen tied in muscles is that a part of 5) above or does it burn at som other point?

Thank you for any insight regarding the correct order.

[JustinPSherman]

In for the answer to this, been wonderin&# 103; for a long ass time.

[WonderPug]

I think you might be taking a tad bit too simplistic view of how nutrition works and I fear I don't have the energy right now to explain in detail.

Thus, here's the two second version: macronutrients are used for different purposes, such as repair, cellular energy, etc. The body can run mostly on ketones, for example, when dietary carbs are dramatically reduced, but protein will then preferentially be converted to maintain blood sugar, etc. When there's an abundance of carbs but insufficient dietary protein, then muscle wasting occurs.

In other words, you really have to have at least a basic understanding of how energy requires are satisfied and how nutritions are partitioned to maintain bodily functions.

[kusok]

at the same time.

[ErickStevens]

ITT: Over-complication.

[MikaK65]

I think you might be taking a tad bit too simplistic view of how nutrition works and I fear I don't have the energy right now to explain in detail.

Thus, here's the two second version: macronutrients are used for different purposes, such as repair, cellular energy, etc. The body can run mostly on ketones, for example, when dietary carbs are dramatically reduced, but protein will then preferentially be converted to maintain blood sugar, etc. When there's an abundance of carbs but insufficient dietary protein, then muscle wasting occurs.

In other words, you really have to have at least a basic understanding of how energy requires are satisfied and how nutritions are partitioned to maintain bodily functions.

Yes, I agree my thinking probably is too straight forward and thank's for your comment. I actually read an article where it was stated that to avoid your above mentioned too dramatic carb reduction one should eat approx. 150 g of carbs daily to prevent protein getting used as an energy source. Unfortyunately I don't have a link to the source. Any further comment about this?

[WonderPug]

Any further comment about this?

That's an oversimplification.

On low carb diets (LCD) and especially very low carb diets (VLCD), one has to balance macronutrients correctly, just like on any diet where macronutrient partitioning is relevant.

Generally speaking, on a VLCD one will try to consume 65% of calories from fat, 30% from protein and 5% from carbs. Assuming adequate caloric intake, there is sufficient exogenous protein to support body repair while also stabilizing blood suger without cannibalism.

[Oliver1987]

That's an oversimplification.

On low carb diets (LCD) and especially very low carb diets (VLCD), one has to balance macronutrients correctly, just like on any diet where macronutrient partitioning is relevant.

Generally speaking, on a VLCD one will try to consume 65% of calories from fat, 30% from protein and 5% from carbs. Assuming adequate caloric intake, there is sufficient exogenous protein to support body repair while also stabilizing blood suger without cannibalism.

Catabolism

[WonderPug]

Catabolism

No. Cannibalism. Without sufficient protein, one starts eating his friends and family ;-)

What do you want from me? I'm just a stupid pug, after all.

[MikeK46]

Thank you for any insight regarding the correct order.

First and foremost, your user name is freaking me out...is that supposed to be a sick joke?

Second of all, you're missing the underlying concept of energy balance. Dietary carbs, protein, and fat all provide food energy. The body expends energy. An energy surplus is needed for anabolic activity (i.e. building muscle, storing fat), while an energy deficit is needed for catabolic activity (i.e. breaking fown muscle, breaking down fat).

Start here and work your way through all the articles:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat...-equation.html

[MikaK65]

That's an oversimplification.

On low carb diets (LCD) and especially very low carb diets (VLCD), one has to balance macronutrients correctly, just like on any diet where macronutrient partitioning is relevant.

Generally speaking, on a VLCD one will try to consume 65% of calories from fat, 30% from protein and 5% from carbs. Assuming adequate caloric intake, there is sufficient exogenous protein to support body repair while also stabilizing blood suger without cannibalism.

5% sounds really low, but who am I to say 7 Yet about adequate caloric intake. How much? For example if my BMR+workout is approx 2600 calories daily would 1800 calories be all too little to dream of any muscle mass gains in combination with fat loss?

Note: I am practically a beginner My fat is relatively high (24%). I am trying to get enough of protein - approx 150 grams daily

[WonderPug]

First and foremost, your user name is freaking me out...is that supposed to be a sick joke?

At first, I thought you lost the posing trunks and bought a hat...

Note: I am practically a beginner My fat is relatively high (24%).

If I were you, I'd cut first and thereafter bulk.

[MikaK65]

First and foremost, your user name is freaking me out...is that supposed to be a sick joke?

Start here and work your way through all the articles:

Lol! Muy bad Mike Not a joke. Thank's for the link.

[MikaK65]

If I were you, I'd cut first and thereafter bulk.

Ok. Point taken and understood. I guess this gets already off topic, but how does the following look like for cutting

Daily long term averages
Protein 148 g / 590 cal (33%)
Carbs 200 g / 800 cal (45%)
Fat 44 g / 400 cal (22%)

against above mentioned average
2600 burnt by BMR+workouts

[jake1224]

Ok. Point taken and understood. I guess this gets already off topic, but how does the following look like for cutting

Daily long term averages
Protein 148 g / 590 cal (33%)
Carbs 200 g / 800 cal (45%)
Fat 44 g / 400 cal (22%)

against above mentioned average
2600 burnt by BMR+workouts

You could do well to eat some more than that. More fat, more protein.

[arkmuscle]

So... I've read that on first burns carbs, then fat, then protein...

It seems most are of the opinion that one can't gain muscle and lose fat simultaneously which would be some contradictory to the above if all fat would be burned before protein is touched.

I mean the body has fat storages (in cells which we really want to get rid of) that would get consumed to cover calorie deficit before the protein gets transferred into energy instead of getting into it's aimed purpose to building your muscles.

So... In other words does the above order regard only fat that has still not gotten into fat cells ie. the actual burning order would be
1) Carbs still in digestion
2) Fat still in digestion
3) Protein still in digestion
4) Fat from fat cells
5) Eventually muscle tissue

Now the above looks some contraditory to the fact that we know there are cases where people have gained some muscle while on calorie deficit diets albeit it's slower than gaining muscle mass by bulking.

Further... what about glycogen tied in muscles is that a part of 5) above or does it burn at som other point?

Thank you for any insight regarding the correct order.

Glucose is your body's main source of fuel. Excess glucose is stored in the liver and other cells as glycogen. Glycogen is used as a quick energy source by being converted to Glucose when your body needs it. Your body burns carbs, fats, or proteins based on your body composition and BMR so their isnt always a set order. Also remember proteins can be converted to glucose by gluconeogenesis in the liver explaining why calorie deficit diets can cause some people to gain muscle. Your body's main goal in breaking down all the food you eat is to make ATP(energy) for the cells in your body.

[paulgnc24]

human body is a very complex thing. everything works in favor of each other to function well. so i think it denpends how your body adapts an reacts to the situation its given in,.