Your 5/3/1 questions (and many others) answered

[musclehead09]

wouldn't it be a good idea to add in 5x10 lateral raises on overhead press days? I'm starting my first day today and the press is the first workout. I was wondering on BBB after supersetting 5x10 presses and chins wouldn't it be a good idea if i did 5x10 on lateral raises to work the medial deltoid? And even add in at least a few sets of 10 on rear delt flies to even out the shoulder? Or would this be too much volume to start out on the program? I'm just thinking it'd cause shoulder imbalances not to do lateral raises and rear flies

[Lucharilla0311]

wouldn't it be a good idea to add in 5x10 lateral raises on overhead press days? I'm starting my first day today and the press is the first workout. I was wondering on BBB after supersetting 5x10 presses and chins wouldn't it be a good idea if i did 5x10 on lateral raises to work the medial deltoid? And even add in at least a few sets of 10 on rear delt flies to even out the shoulder? Or would this be too much volume to start out on the program? I'm just thinking it'd cause shoulder imbalances not to do lateral raises and rear flies

You're majoring in the minor here. In your case, focus on getting stronger every session because strength training IS hypertrophy training for you.. Being 17 @ 155 lbs I'd rather see you focus on hitting your main 5/3/1, hammer the holy hell out of two supplemental exercises, and split. I wouldn't worry about high volume isolation whatchamacallits when the priority should be on training efficiency and getting stronger. Don't worry about muscle imbalances when you need to focus on LBM at this point.

[musclehead09]

You're majoring in the minor here. In your case, focus on getting stronger every session because strength training IS hypertrophy training for you.. Being 17 @ 155 lbs I'd rather see you focus on hitting your main 5/3/1, hammer the holy hell out of two supplemental exercises, and split. I wouldn't worry about high volume isolation whatchamacallits when the priority should be on training efficiency and getting stronger.

I'm actually solely focused on STRENGTH AND POWER but i was thinking wouldn't it lead to injury eventually not to work the other parts. I wasn't thinking of these additional exercises for bodybuilding purposes. i was thinking of them for injury prevention in the long run

[Lucharilla0311]

I'm actually solely focused on STRENGTH AND POWER but i was thinking wouldn't it lead to injury eventually not to work the other parts. I wasn't thinking of these additional exercises for bodybuilding purposes. i was thinking of them for injury prevention in the long run

You're basing your assumption on the presses and pulls not hammering your deltoids, which they do. I got by for months with the bench, two supplemental exercises (supersetted over 5 sets), and hill sprints when I hit a PR 410 x 1 bench. If it works for me with what I was slinging, you can rest assured..

That said, doing some small measure of injury prevention and/or a few isolations is completely fine (obviously). Not in the context you were describing though. My deltoids grew and more importantly are healthier than ever doing speed roping preworkout. If you're worried about injuries, I HIGHLY recommend doing that. I have all my trainees doing circuit style warm-ups before every workout - All of which involved the rope.

EDIT: Check out all the beginners that are doing full body routines here.. I don't hear one swinging dick complaining about injuries from doing 3 compound lifts per day. Just stating the obvious.

[musclehead09]

You're basing your assumption on the presses and pulls not hammering your deltoids, which they do. I got by for months with the bench, two supplemental exercises (supersetted over 5 sets), and hill sprints when I hit a PR 410 x 1 bench. If it works for me with what I was slinging, you can rest assured..

That said, doing some small measure of injury prevention and/or a few isolations is completely fine (obviously). Not in the context you were describing though. My deltoids grew and more importantly are healthier than ever doing speed roping preworkout. If you're worried about injuries, I HIGHLY recommend doing that. I have all my trainees doing circuit style warm-ups before every workout - All of which involved the rope.

EDIT: Check out all the beginners that are doing full body routines here.. I don't hear one swinging dick complaining about injuries from doing 3 compound lifts per day. Just stating the obvious.

Lol okay true makes sense. how many times a week did you START out doing hill sprints? I'm thinking of only doing 2x a week to make sure I'm not destroying my legs because i know Wendler says not to do em day before squats or deadlifts. So i was thinking of doing them on 2 off days to start out being the day after a deadlift session and then a day after a squat session.

[Lucharilla0311]

Lower days at first. I still do them years later.

[musclehead09]

Lower days at first. I still do them years later.

okay cool. I'm gonna start out doing 5 sprints 2x a week adding 1 every week. Then once i finish a few cycles i'll bump it up to
3x a week. I didn't know if this was okay but when i supersetted my 5x10 overhead press and 5x5 chins the last set up chin ups 5 was nearly failure for me. the first 4 sets were real easy though which was funny. I'm thinking since it's chins and it was the last set it doesn't matter. and dude you are one swole beast 5'9 240 lbs lol.

[Bumpus]

wouldn't it be a good idea to add in 5x10 lateral raises on overhead press days? I'm starting my first day today and the press is the first workout. I was wondering on BBB after supersetting 5x10 presses and chins wouldn't it be a good idea if i did 5x10 on lateral raises to work the medial deltoid? And even add in at least a few sets of 10 on rear delt flies to even out the shoulder? Or would this be too much volume to start out on the program? I'm just thinking it'd cause shoulder imbalances not to do lateral raises and rear flies

I largely agree with lucharilla that at your size focusing on the main compounds is perfectly fine, but you don't necessarily have to do BBB for all 4 lifts. If you are worried about developing an imbalance you can do something like the triumvariate on OHP day. I think lateral raises and face-pulls on OHP day would round it out nicely.

[musclehead09]

I largely agree with lucharilla that at your size focusing on the main compounds is perfectly fine, but you don't necessarily have to do BBB for all 4 lifts. If you are worried about developing an imbalance you can do something like the triumvariate on OHP day. I think lateral raises and face-pulls on OHP day would round it out nicely.

okay thanks for the idea. i was thinking of doing something like that for press and bench day. I think I'll just BBB for all 4 lifts for a few cycles since I'm not that strong yet then switch it up for those 2 lifts.

[musclehead09]

I don't think this question has ever been asked. Is it okay to do hill sprints up a back street CEMENT hill? The best hill around me is a huge hill that is a back street. It'd give me the best workout. I have running shoes so that'd be alright. If not the grass hills around me aren't that good they're either not steep enough or they're way too short.

[Bumpus]

I don't think this question has ever been asked. Is it okay to do hill sprints up a back street CEMENT hill? The best hill around me is a huge hill that is a back street. It'd give me the best workout. I have running shoes so that'd be alright. If not the grass hills around me aren't that good they're either not steep enough or they're way too short.

I believe the avid runners say concrete is the hardest on the joints. But if its all you have give it a go. I would certainly look into quality shoes though. You may find those not steep hills are adequate.

[Lucharilla0311]

I don't think this question has ever been asked. Is it okay to do hill sprints up a back street CEMENT hill? The best hill around me is a huge hill that is a back street. It'd give me the best workout. I have running shoes so that'd be alright. If not the grass hills around me aren't that good they're either not steep enough or they're way too short.

Don't sweat it at your age and BW. Hell, I've been running a few miles a week around my neighborhood at 235 lbs so it's not a big deal.. Here's mine: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YtJgpXVqAE

[Kielbaso]

5/3/1 is actually VERY similar to HIT training in the sense that you're basically doing one, all-out effort set per exercise. It's not rocket science here - it's just working hard on one set and carefully monitoring progression. Great concept.

[InnerVenom]

After the first week I have to change Boring But Big to Triumvirate or something else.

5x10 Deadlift & Squat are killing me after the Main Sets.

That much Deadlift is too much of a transition for me after doing other programs like Madcow & SS where I only do really 1 heavy set a week.

At least Jim says assistance doesn't matter that much and to mainly focus on the Main Sets.

[musclehead09]

would it be alright to never have a 2 day break? Like say this coming week i switch my workout schedule to Monday, Wednesday, Friday then Sunday, Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday then back to Monday....get what i meen? It would be no different than if i did what Wendler recommended for a 4 day split with Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday workout days. That split would never have a 2 day rest period either. So would this be okay because i love working out in the mornings which i can do only every other morning due to school

[Ownster8932]

I just started 5/3/1 at the beginning of this calendar year. It's been going good so far.

Here is what I have been doing:

Monday- Squat:

I do 5 work sets instead of the three (so say 65%x5, 75%x5, 85%x5+, 75%x5, 75%x5+)
Then I do 5x10 at 60%
Some type of hamstring movement (RDL, lying leg curls) 5x10
Lunges 5x10

Tuesday- Rest

Wednesday- Jump workout or Sprints during the day; bench at night:

50%x10 for warm-up, then the 5 work sets like for squats
5x10 incline (Alternate between DBs and BB every other week)
5x10 skull crushers
5x10 decline
Then maybe some dips or something if I feel like doing more

Thursday- vball practice

Friday- Deadlifts:

60%x10 (warm-up) then the 5 work sets like for squats
5x10 front squat
5x10 RDL
5x10 lying leg curl
5x10 weighted situps
5x10 calf raises

Saturday- Sprints or jump workout

Sunday- Mil Press:

5 work sets like for squats
5x10 at 55%
5x10 shrugs
5x10 chin-ups or superset seated rows + pulldowns (5x10 each)
5x10 Preacher curls (I throw these in to get some isolated bicep work since it doesn't have it in the schedule for the workout)
5x10 weighted situps

It seems to be working well so far. I kind of combine the BBB and triumvirate and stuff together to get more work in.

QUESTION- what should I do for deload week? Me and my roommate were kind of confused. Should we still do the 5x10 of the main lift at the 50-60% or decrease that to 30-40% or something? What about accessory exercises, should they be done at the weights they normally are?

[pfuddy]

how do I fix a lagging chest? for bodybuilding

Boring but big seems too low volume as well

[xcessive1]

could you run 5/3/1 while on CKD? or would this yield better results with a non-keto diet? (Assume both diets are 500 cals over maintenance)

[Amplifiedxx]

how do I fix a lagging chest? for bodybuilding

Boring but big seems too low volume as well

http://www.jimwendler.com/2011/09/531-and-bodybuilding/

Or add in chest work on both upper body days

or do BBB, but instead of your BBB sets on Military Press, do DB Press/CGBP/Incline Press

[BenW22]

Sorry for the noob 5/3/1 question, but how heavy are you supposed to go on the accessory movements? A weight you can do for the BBB 5x10? What if that weight is greater than the main movement? For example: with my current bench max I'd be doing 135x5, 155x5 and 175x5 during week one. But if I can do like 70x10x5 on DB bench would that be going too heavy?

[Bumpus]

Sorry for the noob 5/3/1 question, but how heavy are you supposed to go on the accessory movements? A weight you can do for the BBB 5x10? What if that weight is greater than the main movement? For example: with my current bench max I'd be doing 135x5, 155x5 and 175x5 during week one. But if I can do like 70x10x5 on DB bench would that be going too heavy?

BBB lifts are suggested to be done at 50% of the training max for that lift. If you can do 70x10x5 and not hinder your advancement on BB Bench, then go for it. All accessory lifts should be carefully chosen to advance a main lift. If the accessories start to hinder a main lift, then a reevaluation of those lifts should be considered. If anything you should start low for a cycle and then add weight to the accessories.

EDIT: It sounds like you have not read the e-book, obtaining and reading should be a priority if considering this program. You can also google Wendler's 5/3/1 FAQ, which addresses many common questions.

[Smokejr2]

5/3/1 program is ****ty! My maxes decreased! **** that. I do not reccomend it.

[Bumpus]

5/3/1 program is ****ty! My maxes decreased! **** that. I do not reccomend it.

If you hit your hand with a hammer, don't blame the hammer.

[micky666]

i started 531 today heres my workout planed for the month wot do u guys think???its in kgs aswell

week1
bench 60x5 65x5 67+ 10reps
dbpress 3x8 20kg
dips 3x5 10kg

squat 87x5 92x5 100+
leg ex 3x8 50kg
sldl 3x5 80kg

deadlift 120x5 130x5 137+
bbrow 3x8 65kg
chin 3x5

ohp 32x5 35x5 37+
pp 5x3 55kg
dbfr 3x8 7.5kg


week2
bench 65x3 67x3 72+
dbpress 3x9 20kg
dips 3x6 10kg

squat 92x3 100x3 105+
leg ex 3x9 40kg
sldl 3x6 80kg

deadlift 130x3 137x3 145+
bbrow 3x9 65kg
chin 3x6

ohp 35x3 37x3 40+
pp 5x4 55kg
dbfr 3x9 7.5kg


week3
bench 60x5 67x3 77+
dbpress 3x10 20kg
dips 3x7 10kg

squat 87x5 100x3 110+
leg ex 3x10 40kg
sldl 3x7 80kg

deadlift 120x5 137x3 152+
bbrow 3x10 65kg
chin 3x7

ohp 32x5 37x5 42+
pp 5x5 55kg
dbfr 3x10 7.5kg




week4
bench 50x5 52x5 55x5
squat 70x5 75x5 80x5
deadlift 97x5 105x5 112x5
ohp 27x5 30x5 32x5

[kmal2t]

I'm gonna try this for a 4 week cycle and see how it goes. I'm a little skeptical though.

(without me reading 13 pages) Has anyone done this and seen strong gains that wasn't a beginner and wasnt on a bicycle like I"m sure Wendler and other PL's who do these routines are?

[5_02ls1]

just finished 2 cycles...squat went from 405 to an easy 425...deadlift went from 465 to 475...
bench went nowhere benched 310 before i started tried 315 missed it...

im going to run a few more cycles and try adding a lil more volume into the upperbody days...

[Amplifiedxx]

I'm gonna try this for a 4 week cycle and see how it goes. I'm a little skeptical though.

(without me reading 13 pages) Has anyone done this and seen strong gains that wasn't a beginner and wasnt on a bicycle like I"m sure Wendler and other PL's who do these routines are?

Yes, I have. Also, LOL at your comment. Every single PL is on a cycle. Wendler started folling with after his powerlifting days....

[Bumpus]

i started 531 today heres my workout planed for the month wot do u guys think???its in kgs aswell

week1
bench 60x5 65x5 67+ 10reps
dbpress 3x8 20kg
dips 3x5 10kg

squat 87x5 92x5 100+
leg ex 3x8 50kg
sldl 3x5 80kg

deadlift 120x5 130x5 137+
bbrow 3x8 65kg
chin 3x5

ohp 32x5 35x5 37+
pp 5x3 55kg
dbfr 3x8 7.5kg

I would make OHP on day 3 and deadlift day 4. You will likely want the extra day between the lower body lifts. Accessory lifts are really dependent on you and your goals, nothing really stands out as odd to me.

[BenW22]

BBB lifts are suggested to be done at 50% of the training max for that lift. If you can do 70x10x5 and not hinder your advancement on BB Bench, then go for it. All accessory lifts should be carefully chosen to advance a main lift. If the accessories start to hinder a main lift, then a reevaluation of those lifts should be considered. If anything you should start low for a cycle and then add weight to the accessories.

EDIT: It sounds like you have not read the e-book, obtaining and reading should be a priority if considering this program. You can also google Wendler's 5/3/1 FAQ, which addresses many common questions.

Thanks for the reply. I got the ebook and read through it...changed up the routine a bit. My first chest day looked like this:

Bench press
135x5, 155x5, 175x12

Then for the accessory exercises:

Dips
5 sets of 10 reps @BW

DB Incline bench
5 sets of 10 reps @50 lbs.

Weighted pushups
5 sets of 10 reps @+25

Definitely got in and out the gym quicker than usual.

[H1t_V3r4c]

Finally joining my uni's gym next week. I like to plan ahead, so after my run of SS, I'm going to move onto 5/3/1. I like the idea of the "simplest strength template", so here's what I've made from the model. Any additions/suggestions please!

5/3/1 Bench
50/60/70%x10 Incline Bench Press
3x Chin Ups
3x8 Barbell Rows

5/3/1 Press
50/60/70%x10 Close Grip Bench Press
3x Pull Ups
3x8 Dumbbell Rows

5/3/1 Squat
50/60/70%x10 Straight Leg Deadlift
3x8 Lying Leg Curls
3x10 Hyperextensions
3x10 Calves

5/3/1 Deadlift
50/60/70%x10 Front Squat
3x8 Seated Leg Curls
3x8 Leg Extensions
3x10 Calves

I think my lower days are ok, not sure about the leg extensions however. I'm thinking of adding another press movement to both upper days, a shoulder press on my bench day and dips or another press variant on my press day?