Cost No Object Machines and Free Weights, the Best of the Best

[Regeneration]

Machines look awesome Chris. I know you have to be excited. Your stuff from us should be ready to ship this week, including the seat back shaft with 5 holes. and we cut your movement arm jack 4 inches. I know you were wanting to have it a few weeks ago, and I take full blame for that. Ill send ya a couple Avenger T-shirts when they get done, We designed some new ones.

P.S, the Avenger logo on the seat back in is the correct spot too lol.

[Regeneration]

Have to agree with you TJ, we to have heard mixed reviews, which is why we are still up in the air on if we should start manufacturing them.

Thanks for posting that is a beauty iorngym. That is the only avenger that I have yet to use. It looks as if It would be a direct hit on the delts from a variety of angles. I have heard mixed reviews of this piece but I have liked 90% of the avengers so far and i am sure I would like it very much.

[Regeneration]

I will not comment on the Ren-X "machines" themselves, But Harris saying "they state their machines/training theories are by far the best and try to prove their point by putting down other equipment manufacturers in order to try to make their own stuff look better" That has been my thought for a while now.

And again, I am not saying anything bad about machines, they could be awesome, I have never tried them.

Hi, welcome to the forum. As far as the avenger pieces are concerned the general consensus around here is the avenger leg press is the best avenger piece. It will set you back about 6 g's new including delivery. The next in line is the row, and probably the converging chest press is next. Both these pieces will set you back around 4 g's. A lot of people on this forum also really like the avenger leg extension, which will run you about $3,200. I've done quite a bit of research on the Ren X stuff myself. You are correct that it's strongly influenced on Ken Hutchins superslow theories. Their equipment is ridiculously high priced. Just out of curiosity I contacted their figurehead, Joshua somebody, and he quoted me $7, 500 for their pulldown! The more that I investigated Joshua, Ken Huthchins, and that whole Renaissance/Ren X group the more it made me think the whole thing is one big marketing ploy. Every business has to have their own niche, if you know what I mean. Their claims that their equipment and their training theories are optimal with respect to strength training have never been proven scientifically. However, they state their machines/training theories are by far the best and try to prove their point by putting down other equipment manufacturers in order to try to make their own stuff look better. When I was on the phone with Joshua all he could do is put down MedX and their equipment. He said the only piece that was decent in their line was their chest press. Yeah, whatever dude!

[irongym]

Health nut, how much is the varc going for? What kind of space does it take up?

On the Atlantis vertical chest, did you ever compare it to the old flex vertical chest?

[HealthNutMD]

Machines look awesome Chris. I know you have to be excited. Your stuff from us should be ready to ship this week, including the seat back shaft with 5 holes. and we cut your movement arm jack 4 inches. I know you were wanting to have it a few weeks ago, and I take full blame for that. Ill send ya a couple Avenger T-shirts when they get done, We designed some new ones.

P.S, the Avenger logo on the seat back in is the correct spot too lol.

That all sounds great, I look forward to receiving those items. Look forward to the T-Shirts as well! Thank-you...

[HealthNutMD]

Health nut, how much is the varc going for? What kind of space does it take up?

On the Atlantis vertical chest, did you ever compare it to the old flex vertical chest?

I can't recall how much I paid... as soon as I get a chance to find the receipt, I'll post it. Might take a week with all the stuff going on...


As far as comparing the Flex to the Atlantis... it has been too long since I have used the Flex, but I don't recall anything being remotely as good as the Atlantis.

[deyler1]

Healthnut, Your gym is just amazing. My girlfriend was asking where I wanted go for a trip this summer. I told her I wanted to swing by an see Healthnut's gym, lol.

[HealthNutMD]

Thanks...

I also like Maluket's idea of getting an old Flex Hamtractor (seated leg curl) and replacing the lighter weights with full plates. That Flex Hamtractor is a great seated leg curl machine, the best as far as I can remember--it just needed more weight on the stack. Not sure how many smaller weights are on top of the stack that could be replaced by full sized plates...

[jackbravo]

Healthnut, Your gym is just amazing. My girlfriend was asking where I wanted go for a trip this summer. I told her I wanted to swing by an see Healthnut's gym, lol.

Hey...if there's a site-seeing trip trip to HNMD's gym, I'm coming along.

[Maluket]

I also like Maluket's idea of getting an old Flex Hamtractor (seated leg curl) and replacing the lighter weights with full plates. That Flex Hamtractor is a great seated leg curl machine, the best as far as I can remember--it just needed more weight on the stack. Not sure how many smaller weights are on top of the stack that could be replaced by full sized plates...

I have the Hamflexor (kneeling leg curl), but yeah, same idea.

I haven't actually replaced my plates yet. I can do the stack, but for where it is in my workout, I get maybe eight reps, so it's still sort of OK. I need to deal with it at some point, though. I figure replace the fives with twenties and I'll have more than I'll ever need.

I don't know if the Hamtractor has the same weight stack. Mine has seven fives and seven tens for 110 with the top plate. I've measured, and it looks like the 20 pound plates from these guys...

http://www.exercise-equipment-parts.com/ws-20bsa.html

...will fit in the space as long as the shroud is removed (I've already removed mine). All measurements are correct EXCEPT for the guide rod bushings, which are 3/4" on the replacements, and 5/8" on the real stack. So the new plates might be a little loose, but I assume they'd work fine. So it seems like it can be done with no need to shorten the belt or do anything else "difficult". Just a direct replacement of the plates. I assume the Hamtractor needs more weight than the Hamflexor, but if it has the same 110-pound stack, and you replaced everything with twenties, you'd have a 285-pound stack. No idea if that's enough or not since it depends on so many factors.

[HealthNutMD]

I thought you mentioned the Hamtractor at some point? Were you thinking of getting that as well?

The Star Trac kneeling leg curl (identical biomechanics) has a total of 160 lbs, (150 + 5 + 5) (2) 5 lb plates at the top which you can drop down)

[Maluket]

I thought you mentioned the Hamtractor at some point? Were you thinking of getting that as well?

Eh, I probably misspoke in some post somewhere. They both have ham names.

But I love hitting my hamstrings on good equipment, so if the Hamtractor is great (and if I can find room for it), it's something I'd consider. I had a seated leg curl and hated it, but it was a New York Barbells piece of junk, so I probably shouldn't hold that against all seated leg curls. I'm not sure I can justify having a third machine for hamstrings, though (also have a Legend GHD). I've also seen the Flex Fitness lying leg curl come up on ebay. Ah, there's one right now:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Used-Commerc...item460bf89982

[qaz123]

Thanks...

I also like Maluket's idea of getting an old Flex Hamtractor (seated leg curl) and replacing the lighter weights with full plates. That Flex Hamtractor is a great seated leg curl machine, the best as far as I can remember--it just needed more weight on the stack. Not sure how many smaller weights are on top of the stack that could be replaced by full sized plates...

some guys in Dallas sell pretty cheap weight stacks in custom sizes. They are also called atlantis fitness btw. You would have to ensure the distance between the top plate and the frame stays the same because the flex designer/owner Dan Block made those machines so there was no spare space at the top of the weight guides when the movement arm is fully contracted. You may have to have some spacing plates made for the top and bottom if the distance between guide rods is different although I have made them out of plywood before and they worked fine. The other option is remove the metal weight stack shroud from the back and have someone make you a weight horn to add 45 lb plates to the stack.

[qaz123]

Eh, I probably misspoke in some post somewhere. They both have ham names.

But I love hitting my hamstrings on good equipment, so if the Hamtractor is great (and if I can find room for it), it's something I'd consider. I had a seated leg curl and hated it, but it was a New York Barbells piece of junk, so I probably shouldn't hold that against all seated leg curls. I'm not sure I can justify having a third machine for hamstrings, though (also have a Legend GHD). I've also seen the Flex Fitness lying leg curl come up on ebay. Ah, there's one right now:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Used-Commerc...item460bf89982

you ever use a nautilus lying leg curl like nitro or the plate loaded ones? I find them really good for tall guys like us. Hamtractor might be a tight fit to get into I would use one first.

[HealthNutMD]

Eh, I probably misspoke in some post somewhere. They both have ham names.

But I love hitting my hamstrings on good equipment, so if the Hamtractor is great (and if I can find room for it), it's something I'd consider. I had a seated leg curl and hated it, but it was a New York Barbells piece of junk, so I probably shouldn't hold that against all seated leg curls. I'm not sure I can justify having a third machine for hamstrings, though (also have a Legend GHD). I've also seen the Flex Fitness lying leg curl come up on ebay. Ah, there's one right now:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Used-Commerc...item460bf89982

I guess the fact that I have yet to add a seated leg curl says something also... I need to re-demo the hamtractor again. The Legend/Westside Inverse Leg curl is amazing by the way.

Yes, the Star Trac kneeling leg curl = Hamflexor but with 160 lb stack.

That Prone Leg curl you are linking is outstanding on EBAY. A+

[HealthNutMD]

you ever use a nautilus lying leg curl like nitro or the plate loaded ones? I find them really good for tall guys like us. Hamtractor might be a tight fit to get into I would use one first.

The weight stack is a joke on that machine unfortunately... can knock off 20+ reps with the Hamtractor stack... From what I recall, it had the best biomechanics of any seated leg curl... so a plate mod would be great to know if possible. Either way, its not a priority for me... I just remember Maluket talking about modifying the Hamtractor, or so I thought (but I guess he meant the Hamflexor). Its worth a demo anyway...

[HealthNutMD]

By the way, what are peoples opinions of the Hammer seated/standing shrug? What is the complete list of alternatives? It is both seated and standing, so not sure which other brands offer both and which you would consider your top choice of this type of machine.

http://www.lifefitness.com/commercia...specifications








Power-Lift version is standing only:






Then we have the Pendulum 5 way which has seated shrug (no standing).







Then you have the Legend Unilateral Trap Shrug/Lunge/Deadlift #6008 (no seated shrug)








Atlantis version D-335 Shrug and Deadlift Machine:






Which brands am I missing? The Hammer seems to be unique in the sense it is the only one who offers seated and standing and is a pure shrug machine. Thoughts on these machines and thoughts on seated vs standing?

As a pure shrug machine, the Hammer seems to have appeal in this regard?

[deadwoodgregg]

The Legend and the Atlantis have the most adjustment. The Legend has both handle angle and height adjustment and the foot roller pads w/height adjustment. I know that the Hammer has the seat but you could place a chair in front of the others to do seated shrugs.

[TLYNCH777]

Nautilus also has a nice one that you can go ISo or fused option

By the way, what are peoples opinions of the Hammer seated/standing shrug? What is the complete list of alternatives? It is both seated and standing, so not sure which other brands offer both and which you would consider your top choice of this type of machine.

http://www.lifefitness.com/commercia...specifications








Power-Lift version is standing only:






Then we have the Pendulum 5 way which has seated shrug (no standing).







Then you have the Legend Unilateral Trap Shrug/Lunge/Deadlift #6008 (no seated shrug)








Atlantis version D-335 Shrug and Deadlift Machine:






Which brands am I missing? The Hammer seems to be unique in the sense it is the only one who offers seated and standing and is a pure shrug machine. Thoughts on these machines and thoughts on seated vs standing?

As a pure shrug machine, the Hammer seems to have appeal in this regard?

[nflan113]

Mr. Goalder is set to arrive tomorrow afternoon! Finally, I just measured things yesterday and I definately need to do some rearranging tonight, since it looks like I slightly underestimated the size of the Rogers Incline shoulder/chest.

Man I'm pumped for tomorrow!

[Skyaura]

By the way, what are peoples opinions of the Hammer seated/standing shrug? What is the complete list of alternatives? It is both seated and standing, so not sure which other brands offer both and which you would consider your top choice of this type of machine.

http://www.lifefitness.com/commercia...specifications








Power-Lift version is standing only:






Then we have the Pendulum 5 way which has seated shrug (no standing).







Then you have the Legend Unilateral Trap Shrug/Lunge/Deadlift #6008 (no seated shrug)








Atlantis version D-335 Shrug and Deadlift Machine:






Which brands am I missing? The Hammer seems to be unique in the sense it is the only one who offers seated and standing and is a pure shrug machine. Thoughts on these machines and thoughts on seated vs standing?

As a pure shrug machine, the Hammer seems to have appeal in this regard?

Much prefer the Legend piece just for the versatility. The Power-Lift and Atlantis pieces I would pick way before the HS for the same reasons.

[OutKlast]

By the way, what are peoples opinions of the Hammer seated/standing shrug? What is the complete list of alternatives? It is both seated and standing, so not sure which other brands offer both and which you would consider your top choice of this type of machine.

http://www.lifefitness.com/commercia...specifications


Power-Lift version is standing only:






Then we have the Pendulum 5 way which has seated shrug (no standing).



Then you have the Legend Unilateral Trap Shrug/Lunge/Deadlift #6008 (no seated shrug)

Atlantis version D-335 Shrug and Deadlift Machine:

Which brands am I missing? The Hammer seems to be unique in the sense it is the only one who offers seated and standing and is a pure shrug machine. Thoughts on these machines and thoughts on seated vs standing?

As a pure shrug machine, the Hammer seems to have appeal in this regard?

Don't forget the Hammer standing version. Pretty similar to the Powerlift I suppose just lighter and probably a bit cheaper.

Hammer Strength Squat Lunge






-------

I think the Legend looks the most interesting with those hand positions adjustments for both angle and height along with the leg support.

[-aesop-]

There's also the Sorinex Hurricane, which looks like a wonder machine

[HealthNutMD]

There's also the Sorinex Hurricane, which looks like a wonder machine

Please see earlier in this thread... I owned it. Huge footprint and not very good at anything in my opinion. The guy who bought it from me at 50% of what I paid for it tryied to trade it away or sell it 2 weeks later to another forum member.


It is obvious to me that the Legend unit seems the best 'overall' of the above units shown, but that was not so much my point I suppose. The legend unit has much more to offer than the Hammer unit and the other units, but it does not offer seated shrugs.

That being said you could get a Hammer seated shrug and the Legend unit as well. As Gregg said you could perhaps put a utility chair in that machine, but it would have to be an adjustable utlity bench chair at the least, and even then, the Hammer seat is optimized for the movement (and convenience is an issue, in reality, convenience plays an important role).

TJ mentioned a Nautilus version, maybe an XPLOAD? I'll look on their website to see what TJ is talking about.

I guess it is just about the seated shrug, and if you like that movement. I used to use the Hammer unit at various gyms in the 90's and 00's. It has been a while since I have used one. I guess I never emphasized traps to much to become concerned about it... Just wondering if anyone has opinions on seated shrugs. Obviously the Pendulm 5 way neck offers seated shrugs, which makes that a unique piece (but does not offer standing shrugs).

[HealthNutMD]

Mr. Goalder is set to arrive tomorrow afternoon! Finally, I just measured things yesterday and I definately need to do some rearranging tonight, since it looks like I slightly underestimated the size of the Rogers Incline shoulder/chest.

Man I'm pumped for tomorrow!

Congrats, post some pics. Yes, that Chest/Incline/Shoulder is a beast... But you can tell that from the pictures I posted a few days ago... Def post some pics!

[Skyaura]

Please see earlier in this thread... I owned it. Huge footprint and not very good at anything in my opinion. The guy who bought it from me at 50% of what I paid for it tryied to trade it away or sell it 2 weeks later to another forum member.


It is obvious to me that the Legend unit seems the best 'overall' of the above units shown, but that was not so much my point I suppose. The legend unit has much more to offer than the Hammer unit and the other units, but it does not offer seated shrugs.

That being said you could get a Hammer seated shrug and the Legend unit as well. As Gregg said you could perhaps put a utility chair in that machine, but it would have to be an adjustable utlity bench chair at the least, and even then, the Hammer seat is optimized for the movement (and convenience is an issue, in reality, convenience plays an important role).

TJ mentioned a Nautilus version, maybe an XPLOAD? I'll look on their website to see what TJ is talking about.

I guess it is just about the seated shrug, and if you like that movement. I used to use the Hammer unit at various gyms in the 90's and 00's. It has been a while since I have used one. I guess I never emphasized traps to much to become concerned about it... Just wondering if anyone has opinions on seated shrugs. Obviously the Pendulm 5 way neck offers seated shrugs, which makes that a unique piece (but does not offer standing shrugs).

Healthnut,

Never have done seated shrugs. I have done plenty of standing shrugs with an Olympic bar (and with a trap bar). Just never saw much value in doing a seated shrug. That is why I would pick the Legend over the HS because there are so many other exercises that you can do with it. HS does offer a Squat/ Lunge but it does not have the adjustability of the Legend nor does it offer the unilateral arms of the Legend. Someone mentioned Nautilus as a company that offered the same machine. Promaxima also sells a Squat/ Lunge machine.

Just my take.

[HealthNutMD]

Yes, I have the Diamond Bar from Sorinex/REFLEX that is good for shrugs.

I also have the Elite FTS/Williams Strength PRO Rickshaw that is good for shrugs.

I do remember liking the seated shrug of the Hammer, but as I mentioned, traps are not a priority... but I do like the seated shrug.

Yes, of the above items I would agree the Legend unit has the most use, and the Pendulum is also unique combing the seated shrug with the neck.

TJ must be talking about this XPLOAD unless there is an older model no longer made:







Off subject, this XPLOAD seated dip looks interesting if that bar holds you in securely. I still think the Hammer Seated dip is the one to beat until proven differently.


Four-bar linkage design overcomes the limitations of standard leverage movements

Adjustable thigh roller pads anchor user position without seat belts

Walk-in design allows easy entry/exit

Would like to demo this unit:







I still say the Hammer is th eway to go, but would like to demo the above...

[Renzinho]

Doesn't anyone have something to say about these machines?

magnumfitness.com/template.php?p=catalog&action=display_prod&m=0&cat =Plate%20Loaded&sub=Upper%20Body&prod=502

magnumfitness.com/template.php?p=catalog&action=display_prod&m=0&cat =Plate%20Loaded&sub=Upper%20Body&prod=503

Furthermore, for comparance, I think the new instinct line from star trac has a superb version of the seated leg curl. The best one I've used for sure, but then again I don't have much to campare with. However, the feel of that machine, and the adequecy of the weightstack makes me doubt that there are many contenders to this one,

[deadwoodgregg]

Doesn't anyone have something to say about these machines?

magnumfitness.com/template.php?p=catalog&action=display_prod&m=0&cat =Plate%20Loaded&sub=Upper%20Body&prod=502

magnumfitness.com/template.php?p=catalog&action=display_prod&m=0&cat =Plate%20Loaded&sub=Upper%20Body&prod=503

They both look very interesting but I wouldnt know where to demo them other than the factory showroom. Just judging from the pics alone, I would guess that they are both excellent. I have demoed older versions of their other two plateloaded Bicep and Tricep pieces. The Bicep (431) was very good but not as good as the Strive pl bicep. The Tricep (432) was the best of its style that I have ever used except for the fact that it didn't have back support which kept me from buying it.

[jackbravo]

Super pullover if anybody's looking

http://newlondon.craigslist.org/spo/3623374196.html