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  1. #1
    RIP aziz segeyevich valiantmiller16's Avatar
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    carb loading on keto?

    my question is i am currently cutting and have hit a wall i have decided to bring my carbs down to 70g a day would it be benefecial to add a carb load day once a week with say 250g carbs? or would i be fine on 70g a day?

    measly reps for opinions lol
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  2. #2
    Registered User RyanRev's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by valiantmiller16 View Post
    my question is i am currently cutting and have hit a wall i have decided to bring my carbs down to 70g a day would it be benefecial to add a carb load day once a week with say 250g carbs? or would i be fine on 70g a day?

    measly reps for opinions lol
    well for keto you usually want to stay below 30g of CHO during the week. And if your doing CKD you should already be carbing up on the weekend. I would say go ahead and have a high carb day of like 300-500g of carbs but keep the fat low
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  3. #3
    THE FREAK SHOW PBateman2's Avatar
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    Wise to have a carb up day/refeed:

    One day per week increase calories to maintenance (or higher), increase carbs 50-100% (endo-ecto), protein at 1g per pound of bodyweight, and fat as low as possible.
    Last edited by PBateman2; 09-16-2010 at 07:11 PM.
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  4. #4
    RIP aziz segeyevich valiantmiller16's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by PBateman2 View Post
    Wise to have a carb up day/refeed:

    One day per week increase calories to maintenance (or higher), increase carbs 50-100% (endo-ecto), protein at 1g per pound of bodyweight, and fat as low as possible.
    i was thinking something like this just wasnt sure how much carbs to take on load thanks repped! although i disagree on the low fats i like to keep fat an protein as high as possible especially when my carbs are so low 100g fat a day is my usual intake i also think it's whats helped me keep my metabolism high whist dieting to be honest.
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  5. #5
    THE FREAK SHOW PBateman2's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by valiantmiller16 View Post
    i was thinking something like this just wasnt sure how much carbs to take on load thanks repped! although i disagree on the low fats i like to keep fat an protein as high as possible especially when my carbs are so low 100g fat a day is my usual intake i also think it's whats helped me keep my metabolism high whist dieting to be honest.
    Google "leptin" and you will find out why its important to keep fats as low as possible on your refeed day (not talking about your normal daily diet).

    All good though. Good work thus far.

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  6. #6
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    Originally Posted by valiantmiller16 View Post
    i was thinking something like this just wasnt sure how much carbs to take on load thanks repped! although i disagree on the low fats i like to keep fat an protein as high as possible especially when my carbs are so low 100g fat a day is my usual intake i also think it's whats helped me keep my metabolism high whist dieting to be honest.
    glucose raises leptin mor than fructose, protein or fat
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  7. #7
    RIP aziz segeyevich valiantmiller16's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by PBateman2 View Post
    Google "leptin" and you will find out why its important to keep fats as low as possible on your refeed day (not talking about your normal daily diet).

    All good though. Good work thus far.

    Train hard.
    cheers for that man had a great read on leptin will be sure to keep fats low on refeed day now then for sure im 5 ft 9 170 pounds at the moment (disregard profile stats) so was thinking of carbing up with around 300g?
    Last edited by valiantmiller16; 09-17-2010 at 01:09 AM.
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  8. #8
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    Are you on a keto diet or not?
    Yes... I've started a log - http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=159357321
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  9. #9
    Burlesque Performer MajorTwang's Avatar
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    A weekly carb up is not so much 'beneficial' as 'essential'.

    Most practicioners of the cyclic keto diet talk about 4-6g of carbs per pound of lean to refeed, so if you're a lean 170, you're looking at 600-900g of carbs. That figure is derived from the total amount of glycogen stored in the body, and the principle that you are going from carb depleted to carb full.

    A lot of people (myself included) simply can't stomach that much carb in one day. If so, spread it over two days.

    Personally, I'm in ketosis as soon as my carbs go below ~100g a day, higher if I'm doing cardio, so super-low carb levels may not be neccessary. Remember that ~60% of your total protein intake will eventually become glucose, so 300g of protein a day is (from a ketogenic POV) equivalent to 180g of carbs.
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  10. #10
    make each pound count OrcaLifter's Avatar
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    i did not realize that i needed to keep fats low on carb up days. thanks for the heads up.
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  11. #11
    Burlesque Performer MajorTwang's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by PBateman2 View Post
    Google "leptin" and you will find out why its important to keep fats as low as possible on your refeed day (not talking about your normal daily diet).
    On top of that, there is the general issue of calories. Refeed days will probably put your calories over maintenance even if you keep your fats low.

    Any extra fat is just surplus calories that can be stored as bodyfat, and all those insulin spikes that do such a good job of driving glucose & amino acids into muscles will also drive any spare dietary fat into the adipose cells.
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  12. #12
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    Originally Posted by MajorTwang View Post
    A weekly carb up is not so much 'beneficial' as 'essential'.

    Most practicioners of the cyclic keto diet talk about 4-6g of carbs per pound of lean to refeed, so if you're a lean 170, you're looking at 600-900g of carbs. That figure is derived from the total amount of glycogen stored in the body, and the principle that you are going from carb depleted to carb full.

    A lot of people (myself included) simply can't stomach that much carb in one day. If so, spread it over two days.

    Personally, I'm in ketosis as soon as my carbs go below ~100g a day, higher if I'm doing cardio, so super-low carb levels may not be neccessary. Remember that ~60% of your total protein intake will eventually become glucose, so 300g of protein a day is (from a ketogenic POV) equivalent to 180g of carbs.
    so lets say i'm eating 100g carbs a day would adding a 300g refeed and dropping fa
    ts for the refeed help me substantially or would i be alright to stay on 100g< a day without a refeed an still not risk muscle loss?
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  13. #13
    Burlesque Performer MajorTwang's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by valiantmiller16 View Post
    so lets say i'm eating 100g carbs a day would adding a 300g refeed and dropping fa
    ts for the refeed help me substantially or would i be alright to stay on 100g< a day without a refeed an still not risk muscle loss?
    The refeed would help substantially. It keeps your metabolism higher, and gives your muscles an anabolic response that it misses out on during the low carb phase.

    As I said before, I've never got on with 1 day a week going mad with carbs, and I don't believe the body benefits from extreme measures like that. 2 days on moderate to high carbs always 'feels' so much better.

    Spend too long on a low carb diet, and unless you are someone who does fantastically well on ketosis, you will ineviably lose muscle. Ketones are protein sparing, but they are not magic bullets. Inevitably, the body will interpret the restricted calories & loss of bodyfat as a potentially fatal famine, and decide that it doesn't need to keep hold of all that metabolically active muscle. The trick with cutting is to minimise & pospone that inevitable response as much as possible
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    If you read Lyle's info on the CKD it says you can eat things such as a pizza on carb refeed which is obviously loaded with fat.

    However, reading more and more about people's experiences on carb refeeds, you do need to keep the fat as low as possible and get a good mix of High GI and Low GI carbs in.
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    feels good to carb up when you restrict carbs on days on keto, muscle so filled-up and full everywhere the next day, huge difference on workouts in trenght increases next day... good stuff carb is very anabolic on keto.
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