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  1. #1
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    Gain Muscle and lose fat at the same time on keto?

    Keto uses fat as energy so you lose fat, but what if you eat more then what you need? I need 2,500 calories a day. I'm overweight, If I go on a 4:1 Keto Diet on 3,500 calories, would I still lose fat? Would I gain muscle too?
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  2. #2
    Rebelling in my psychosis thegymbum's Avatar
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    If you eat 1,000 calories over maintainence, no matter where the calories are coming from (keto or not), you're going to gain weight, and unfortunately, the majority is going to be fat. It IS possible but VERY difficult to lose fat and gain muscle at the same time, but it can be done with rigorous training and eating at approximately maintenance. If you are overweight, I would suggest training while eating 200-300 below maintenance to maintain about half a pound a week of weight loss. Good luck
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    Registered User johnPNY's Avatar
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    I started with way too high cals for the first few weeks, and my strength either declined or stayed the same.

    Around the 3rd week of keto I started putting a lot more thought into it, and currently eat just a little under what I burn calorie wise - and I am consistently hitting at least one PR per workout. I don't monitor my weight, but I am getting leaner and getting stronger at the same time. People say it's not possible and I'd like to agree with science, but so far I have found the results to be otherwise with some careful thought and planning.

    Good luck!
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  4. #4
    granma lifts more than u! ¡STFU!ˇNˆLIFT!'s Avatar
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    Originally Posted by thegymbum View Post
    If you eat 1,000 calories over maintainence, no matter where the calories are coming from (keto or not), you're going to gain weight, and unfortunately, the majority is going to be fat. It IS possible but VERY difficult to lose fat and gain muscle at the same time, but it can be done with rigorous training and eating at approximately maintenance. If you are overweight, I would suggest training while eating 200-300 below maintenance to maintain about half a pound a week of weight loss. Good luck
    in bold - so not true at all ..
    just lift HEAVY A$$ weights & eat on dat healthy isht . * hellabutt psychology 101 *
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    Registered User rbp1583's Avatar
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    Train hard every single day and eat 2-300 calories below maintenance. Make sure you're getting a lot of protein and (approximately 1gram per lbs of body weight) and then the rest of your calories should be from fat. you won't lose weight as fast as you want, but you will be gaining muscle and losing fat at the same time. It will be frustrating since you won't see results at first, but just stick to it.

    I recommend just keto to hit a target weight and then doing a slow bulk. Its more fun, more proven, and you're setting yourself up to get the body you want without having to worry about bull**** like losing fat and gaining muscle at the same time. Just my 2 cents. Either way it's all about patience and dedication.
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  6. #6
    Burlesque Performer MajorTwang's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by johnPNY View Post
    I don't monitor my weight, but I am getting leaner and getting stronger at the same time. People say it's not possible and I'd like to agree with science, but so far I have found the results to be otherwise
    It is possible to gain muscle & burn fat at the same time - but you need to hit just the right combination of diet, exercise & hormonal factors, and it doesn't last for long.

    I recently started training again after a layoff of a couple of years, and for the first month or two I got much leaner & stronger without my scale weight changing at all.
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  7. #7
    Ketogenic and Bionic. BritishFighter's Avatar
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    That particular "sweet spot" is possible, but very hard to find. It would take a lot of trial and error.....wash rinse repeat.
    _______________________________________________________________
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  8. #8
    garantead KillDowzer's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by MrLovrLovr View Post
    in bold - so not true at all ..

    It is in fact true. Anything that includes even a calorie can and will be converted to fat if over maintenance.
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  9. #9
    Everyday=5/3/1+GPP+IFCTKD Atavis's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KillDowzer View Post
    It is in fact true. Anything that includes even a calorie can and will be converted to fat if over maintenance.
    Why would the "majority is going to be fat" be true?
    "Arterial plaque is primarily composed of unsaturated fats particularly polyunsaturated ones." (Felton, C V, et al, Lancet, 1994, 344:1195)

    How to bulk: http://70sbig.com/food/

    Diet = http://i52.tinypic.com/21bhop.png
    ...or something like this daily. Problem? ;)

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  10. #10
    Registered User Brianterz's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by thegymbum View Post
    If you eat 1,000 calories over maintainence, no matter where the calories are coming from (keto or not), you're going to gain weight, and unfortunately, the majority is going to be fat.
    yes and no.. you will gain weight.. not all will be fat.. may people have bulked on keto... usually most is muscle with some fat gain
    THE KETO DIET-- www.bodybuildingdungeon.com/forums/nutrition/2156-ckd-cyclical.html

    http://www.coconutoil.com/truth_saturated_fats.htm
    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,584922,00.html
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  11. #11
    Rebelling in my psychosis thegymbum's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Brianterz View Post
    yes and no.. you will gain weight.. not all will be fat.. may people have bulked on keto... usually most is muscle with some fat gain
    The problem is in how FAST youre buking. If you bulk slowly, by doing, say, 250 calories over maintenance an gaining half a pound a week, you can easily gain mostly muscle. But if you're going 1,000 over maintenance, youre going to gain 2lbs a week, and the max rate of muscle growth is about .5lbs of muscle per week. That means at least 3/4 is going to be fat.
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  12. #12
    Registered User Brianterz's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by thegymbum View Post
    The problem is in how FAST youre buking. If you bulk slowly, by doing, say, 250 calories over maintenance an gaining half a pound a week, you can easily gain mostly muscle. But if you're going 1,000 over maintenance, youre going to gain 2lbs a week, and the max rate of muscle growth is about .5lbs of muscle per week. That means at least 3/4 is going to be fat.
    In theory your right.. but plenty of people have bulked at say 4500 calories and gained a few pounds of fat with a few pounds of muscle.. it would also depend on your workouts and how much stress you put on them...its usually a combination of the two not mostly fat gain
    THE KETO DIET-- www.bodybuildingdungeon.com/forums/nutrition/2156-ckd-cyclical.html

    http://www.coconutoil.com/truth_saturated_fats.htm
    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,584922,00.html
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  13. #13
    Everyday=5/3/1+GPP+IFCTKD Atavis's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Brianterz View Post
    In theory your right.. but plenty of people have bulked at say 4500 calories and gained a few pounds of fat with a few pounds of muscle.. it would also depend on your workouts and how much stress you put on them...its usually a combination of the two not mostly fat gain


    Right, my last bulk was 12 lbs and my fat% didn't change.
    "Arterial plaque is primarily composed of unsaturated fats particularly polyunsaturated ones." (Felton, C V, et al, Lancet, 1994, 344:1195)

    How to bulk: http://70sbig.com/food/

    Diet = http://i52.tinypic.com/21bhop.png
    ...or something like this daily. Problem? ;)

    FFMI = 24
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  14. #14
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    Originally Posted by Atavis View Post
    Why would the "majority is going to be fat" be true?
    as a natty u can only gain about 5solid pounds a year. so if u bulk up 11pounds in a year that leaves mostly fat gain. but most people add around 20-30 in a bulk. unless u have freakish genetics. and if u did have freakish genetics you wouldny be doing a ketogenic diet. u would be having fun loading up on carbs everyday.
    Point the biggest skeptic out, I'll make him a believer.

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  15. #15
    Registered User AnabolicFyre's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Atavis View Post


    Right, my last bulk was 12 lbs and my fat% didn't change.
    That's bullshyt, you have a 38 inch waist you're already such a high bodyfat that you prob didn't even realize you gained fat.... You didn't gain 12 solid lbs of muscle.
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  16. #16
    Everyday=5/3/1+GPP+IFCTKD Atavis's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AnabolicFyre View Post
    That's bullshyt, you have a 38 inch waist you're already such a high bodyfat that you prob didn't even realize you gained fat.... You didn't gain 12 solid lbs of muscle.
    HAD a 38" waist. Of course I gained fat and not 12 lbs of muscle. I said as much given that a 12 lb gain in muscle would be a significant decrease in body fat% by total weight. My body fat% did not change, i.e. I gained fat along with the lean mass.

    What did not happen though was that I did not gain 3/4 of the weight in fat. Some gains in lean mass, plenty of sarcoplasm, and some fat gain.
    "Arterial plaque is primarily composed of unsaturated fats particularly polyunsaturated ones." (Felton, C V, et al, Lancet, 1994, 344:1195)

    How to bulk: http://70sbig.com/food/

    Diet = http://i52.tinypic.com/21bhop.png
    ...or something like this daily. Problem? ;)

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  17. #17
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    Originally Posted by TheHeirApparent View Post
    as a natty u can only gain about 5solid pounds a year. so if u bulk up 11pounds in a year that leaves mostly fat gain. but most people add around 20-30 in a bulk. unless u have freakish genetics. and if u did have freakish genetics you wouldny be doing a ketogenic diet. u would be having fun loading up on carbs everyday.
    That's complete BS... 5 pounds of muscle a year? U really believe that? lol
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    garantead KillDowzer's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Brianterz View Post
    In theory your right.. but plenty of people have bulked at say 4500 calories and gained a few pounds of fat with a few pounds of muscle.. it would also depend on your workouts and how much stress you put on them...its usually a combination of the two not mostly fat gain
    basically this.
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  19. #19
    Milk is for babies bbrock293's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheHeirApparent View Post
    as a natty u can only gain about 5solid pounds a year. so if u bulk up 11pounds in a year that leaves mostly fat gain. but most people add around 20-30 in a bulk. unless u have freakish genetics. and if u did have freakish genetics you wouldny be doing a ketogenic diet. u would be having fun loading up on carbs everyday.
    This is completely false.
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    Originally Posted by ¡STFU!ˇNˆLIFT! View Post
    in bold - so not true at all ..
    Originally Posted by AnabolicFyre View Post
    That's bullshyt
    Originally Posted by Davy19 View Post
    That's complete BS... 5 pounds of muscle a year? U really believe that? lol
    Originally Posted by bbrock293 View Post
    This is completely false.
    This thread is not going well...
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