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  1. #1
    Registered User e45's Avatar
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    LONG HEAD OF BICEPS TENDONITIS (rehab help)

    So long story short around the end of 08 I had this bad.I first felt the pain when I was bench pressing and then I got told in phisyio I had muscle imbalances in my rear delts I think.

    I went back to training 3 months later after I thought my arm healed and it hadn't,this is when it started hurting so I couldn't even reach up into a cupboard.

    I Done rehab stuff for months and then the beginning of this year I started to do the weights again.Started of with the machines for my chest then I was just doing one arm dumbbell bench and then I moved on to barbell bench.

    Now the pain come back 3 weeks ago and I need some help on how to permanently fix it.

    this is what I have been doing every other day

    External Rotation with a resistances band.http://www.bullz-eye.com/furci/2004/...tadducted2.JPG

    External Rotation with 4lb dumbell http://www.bullz-eye.com/furci/2004/...tabducted1.JPG

    y,t,w,l with 2lbs hand weights http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgCs7...eature=related

    scare crows on an incline bench http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JY0TMsw7W74


    after this I have been doing body weight exercises
    pushups + diamond pushups for triceps
    inverted rows
    squats
    pullups


    Now after 2weeksof doing I thought I would be fine to go back to the weights.I have been doing a light weight full body workout and today my arm is slightly hurting (not pain but I can feel discomfort)

    So does any one know what I can do to heal this up completely ?

    btw I am taking a high strength omega oil and vitamin c sup (approx a gram a day) would you recommend anything else ? cissus bromine "sp" nitric oxide
    Last edited by e45; 09-02-2010 at 06:55 AM.
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  2. #2
    Banned chantu's Avatar
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    squats
    pullups


    Now after 2weeksof doing I thought I would be fine to go back to the weights.I have been doing a light weight full body workout and today my arm is slightly hurting (not pain but I can feel discomfort)

    So does any one know what I can do to heal this up completely ?

    btw I am taking a high strength omega oil and vitamin c sup (approx a gram a day) would you recommend anything else ? cissus bromine "sp" nitric oxide[/QUOTE]

    yes
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    muscle 'imbalance' is what you mean? and you have bicep tendonitis where? at the insertion at the deltoid?
    are you saying your rear deltoid was underdeveloped? and you have inflammation near the anterior (front) deltoid because you have involved it in cheating on the bicep curl?
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    I'll Mod Til I'm Dead ironwill2008's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by e45 View Post
    So does any one know what I can do to heal this up completely ?
    From what you've posted, you've given the injury every opportunity to heal on it's own, and it hasn't. I'd suggest you have your doc refer you to a Sports Medicine specialist.
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  5. #5
    Registered User e45's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KrohDaddi View Post
    muscle 'imbalance' is what you mean? and you have bicep tendonitis where? at the insertion at the deltoid?
    are you saying your rear deltoid was underdeveloped? and you have inflammation near the anterior (front) deltoid because you have involved it in cheating on the bicep curl?
    Its at the top of the bicep thats all I got told.

    And yeh I think the rear deltoids was undeveloped. I also think it had something to do with my trap as well because at first my neck/trap was very tight so they gave me stretching exercises for it.

    No nothing to do with curls I was on ripptoes if I remember so I was just following it how it is with just the main compound exercises.

    Originally Posted by ironwill2008 View Post
    From what you've posted, you've given the injury every opportunity to heal on it's own, and it hasn't. I'd suggest you have your doc refer you to a Sports Medicine specialist.
    I am in the uk they will just send me back to normal phisio and there ****e any way (well the nhs ones are)
    This is my 4th time going back with my knee and finally someone has said that my knee isnt tracking right just what I thought in the first place.
    I have went twice. The first time all one of them said was do the stretches the "specialist" gave me 3 x a day and this took him 40mins.(he was a student)
    Then I phoned up and told them I dont want to see a student next time they give me the specialist the second time and from now on,and all she done was wobble my knee and said this is for mobility but it will only provide temporary relief :s I already told them it doesnt hurt in general.

    Any way sorry for ranting but am just trying to say physio has never worked for me
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    Registered User e45's Avatar
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    is it worth paying for one my self ?I dont want to go and waste my money because they are expensive here is what one person is charging

    Physio
    Initial Assessment (45 minutes) £35.00
    Initial and follow-up sessions (30 minutes) £32.00
    Neuro-physio initial Assessment £45.00
    Neuro-physio follow-up sessions from £32.00

    someone else is charging £50 a session :|
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  7. #7
    I'll Mod Til I'm Dead ironwill2008's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by e45 View Post
    is it worth paying for one my self ?
    You're the only person who can answer this question.
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    Registered User e45's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ironwill2008 View Post
    You're the only person who can answer this question.
    Well what will the one I have to pay for do differently ?

    Doesn't any one else here know of how I can fix it rather than go back to Physio?
    All there going to do any way is give me stretches and exercises
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  9. #9
    I'll Mod Til I'm Dead ironwill2008's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by e45 View Post
    Well what will the one I have to pay for do differently ?

    Doesn't any one else here know of how I can fix it rather than go back to Physio?
    All there going to do any way is give me stretches and exercises
    There are no doctors posting in this forum regularly, and if there were, I'm sure they'd all tell you to seek furthur medical care. You've given the injury sufficient time to heal on it's own.

    I don't know how else to advise you. Good luck.
    No brain, no gain.

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  10. #10
    Banned KrohDaddi's Avatar
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    "Its at the top of the bicep thats all I got told."

    you need to be able to tell them where its at. have you studied a muscle chart?
    has anyone done any manipulation of the bicep or tendon that you would describe as 'with firm pressure, mildly painful but relieving'?

    if it's tendonitis and you can reach it, you can probably massage a lot of the swelling and dissipate the inflammation yourself by using the thumb of your opposing hand to feel around for the twinge, don't jab it too harshly but roll it around under your thumb with steady pressure, possibly grip it between thumb and forefingers and squeeze without jerking.
    Professional who can help will likely use words like 'deep-muscle manipulation', some chiropracters here deal with sports-related nerve entrapments and will understand this problem.
    Last edited by KrohDaddi; 09-02-2010 at 08:08 AM. Reason: more
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    Registered User e45's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ironwill2008 View Post
    There are no doctors posting in this forum regularly, and if there were, I'm sure they'd all tell you to seek furthur medical care. You've given the injury sufficient time to heal on it's own.

    I don't know how else to advise you. Good luck.

    I know that I was asking here because maybe someone else has had the same type of injury (am sure there is) and could tell me what they did to fix there arm.


    Originally Posted by KrohDaddi View Post
    "Its at the top of the bicep thats all I got told."

    you need to be able to tell them where its at. have you studied a muscle chart?
    has anyone done any manipulation of the bicep or tendon that you would describe as 'with firm pressure, mildly painful but relieving'?

    if it's tendonitis and you can reach it, you can probably massage a lot of the swelling and dissipate the inflammation yourself by using the thumb of your opposing hand to feel around for the twinge, don't jab it too harshly but roll it around under your thumb with steady pressure, possibly grip it between thumb and forefingers and squeeze without jerking.
    Professional who can help will likely use words like 'deep-muscle manipulation', some chiropracters here deal with sports-related nerve entrapments and will understand this problem.
    its at the very top by the delt just above the armpit.or on line with the armpit ends and about 1/4 inch in on the arm.

    Last time I went the physio for my arm woman done that about 3 times but it didn't feel like a massage,she basically just pushed her thumb dead hard on it.It didnt do anything and I already do that every now and then when it hurts.
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    define 'permanently'
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    Registered User e45's Avatar
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    So it doesn't ever come back for no reason unless I have ****ty form on a certin exercises or injur it some other way
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    Banned KrohDaddi's Avatar
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    I would recommend continuing the massage thing because it costs nothing, risks nothing, and works most often.
    Google something about inflammation and diet because I know that there are certain foods or substances in foods that raise your susceptibility to retaining inflammatory secretions in tissue but it has been more than twenty years since I had an inflammation that was serious enough for me to go this far. If your doctor prescribes anti-inflammatory medications they will require you to adjust your eating schedule around taking them because they are harsh on your stomach lining unless you take the most modern ones which are very expensive the last I heard.

    and then be careful about hyperextending that bicep. were you using a preacher-curl bench or one of those bicep-machines?
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    I have been suffering from a similar pain for several months and have done rest, physio, and workout modification throughout that whole time and never really (until recently) got it feeling better. Have a look at this link and you'll see where the bicep tendons go up in your shoulder so you can see if this is the area you are suffering the pain.

    http://www.whatafeeling.net/bicipital.php

    So just recently my shoulder has been feeling better, who knows if I finally found a combination to help prevent it or not but I'll tell you what I've done recently and maybe it will help.

    I did have wavefront therapy done at a physio therapist back in June (2 treatments), it could be that this took a while to heal from that but my shoulder still hurt like a bugger for 2 months after the treatment.

    Workout Modifications/Stretches:
    1) I do regular chest and back stretches as I had read that is key to overall shoulder health. A muscle imbalance will cause your shoulders to sit in the wrong spot and cause the bicep tendon to move poorly in the bicipital groove.
    2) Posture, try to always keep your shoulders down and back. I think the argument here is most people have an over developed chest from focusing too much on BP.
    3) Perform various forearm stretches which will also stretch out your biceps.
    4) I modified my form on Bench Press. I initially tried altering grip width , bringing the bar closer to the bottom of my rib cage instead of across the nipples etc. but none of that worked on it`s own. Now I bring the bar towards my lower ribcage but also only come to within 1-2 inches from touching my chest rather than touching the chest. I started with a lower weight and found the spot just where I felt the twinge in my shoulders and I don`t go any lower anymore.
    5) I dropped chest dips altogether.
    6) I do Internal and External shoulder rotations once a week. 2 sets each with low weight and high reps.

    Like I said, these may help but if not, you should still seek professional help. Watch some youtube videos on bicipital tendonitis and you`ll see it can be pretty nasty if you just work through it.

    D
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    I'm in physical therapy and I've seen this a few times. Unfortunately, with those cases where its a recurring injury, its due to a possible bone spur on the acromion process. Typically, they'll stop activities that cause pain, let it heal, resume activities and the pain comes back; this sounds like what you're describing.

    If you do have a muscle imbalance (post delt vs anterior delt or rotator cuff) the humeral head translates anteriorly and superiorly pinching the biceps tendon against the acromion process. Usually there is some possible rotator cuff tendonitis and bursitis along with this, not just bicep tendon specific pain.

    Have you had an MRI/Xray to rule out bone spurs or biceps tendon fraying or RC tendonitis/bursitis?

    The massage is a great idea, even ice massage with a styrofoam cup (freeze water in it, peel back about 1/2 inch at the top and massage it with the ice for about 5 minutes). Ultrasound has been shown to help with decreasing the inflammation too.

    Long term, if there are structural changes, the only thing you can do is modify your routine or have surgery. That's the important thing though: MRI/XRAY to confirm specific cause.

    As far as exercise, be careful with external rotation too far (causes the biceps tendon to snap across the acromion) and overhead stuff, or barbell bench press, military press (this causes impingement if you get the humerus above 80-90 degrees of abduction or flexion. Decline bench press, dumbell bench (keep your elbow at about 45 and don't drop elbows below your body (try on a swiss ball or on ground) to keep from causing the humeral head to push forward taking up space and impinging.

    Strengthen your lats and subscapularis with internal rotation and lat pulldowns (in front of the head to limit anterior humeral displacement) to help keep the humerus depressed and posteriorly in the joint.

    You can also check to see if you have some weak serratus muscles or winging scapula (youtube or google) and does it hurt to reach up behind your back, like to scratch between your shoulder blades? Does it hurt to have your arm out to the side, thumb pointing down, then raise your arm straight up? These are signs of rotator cuff/biceps tendon impingement too.

    Lastly, the biceps tendon attaches to the anterior part of the labrum, there may be a labral tear, but doesn't sound like it and they may have found it in PT with testing, but just a thought.

    Hope this helps. I know its wordy.
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  17. #17
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    Originally Posted by e45 View Post
    So long story short around the end of 08 I had this bad.I first felt the pain when I was bench pressing and then I got told in phisyio I had muscle imbalances in my rear delts I think.

    I went back to training 3 months later after I thought my arm healed and it hadn't,this is when it started hurting so I couldn't even reach up into a cupboard.

    I Done rehab stuff for months and then the beginning of this year I started to do the weights again.Started of with the machines for my chest then I was just doing one arm dumbbell bench and then I moved on to barbell bench.

    Now the pain come back 3 weeks ago and I need some help on how to permanently fix it.
    <Snipped>
    I just finished a rehab program for my right shoulder, bicep tendonitis. The exercises actually seemed to make it linger even when under a doctor's care. It was suggested that it could be a combination of bicep tendonitis, bursitis, and good old fashioned arthritis from wear and tear.

    I stopped going to physio when I was no longer seeing improvement but at the same time was feeling better. I took 2 weeks off and eventually the pain disappeared. Went back to training using light weights and it showed up again. My guess is that it will take a long long time to go away and I'll have to work through it - take it slow with the weight and accept that my body is wearing out and I'm not 18 anymore.
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    This post is base on what I think is the most common reason for impingement related injuries in most regular gym goers. If your injury is due to accident or some kind of trauma then what I'm repeating here can be disregarded. e45, I know I've already given you this advice on previous posts of yours but it's worth repeating. You must realize that this stuff can take months and sometimes years to correct not just a few weeks. And if it is found that posture is part of the problem then correct posture round the clock is a must. If not then everything you do in the gym will be for not.

    I hope the fact that your problems keep returning isn't lost on you. The common denominator between pain cycles is the rest. You have a structural/muscular problem that needs to be dealt with or you will always reach a certain load ceiling beyond which you can't go or injury occurs. You need to check out what's happening. See a good PT for an assessment.

    Your arm is attached to your scapula. Muscle imbalance and kyphotic posture will always lead you to re-injure. Desk jobs and improperly balanced workouts are two reasons for this.

    If you have problems getting the range of motion in this while keeping your head, upper back and butt touching the wall, then you have scapular issues.: http://ericcressey.com/exercise-of-t...ar-wall-slides

    These explain it better than I ever could:
    http://www.martialartsandsportscienc...ter%20PDF_.pdf (I can't emphasize enough how important the concept in this PDF is to anyone who trains.)
    http://www.t-nation.com/article/perf...and_shrugs&cr=

    Sticking to your bodyweight exercises for now, while you work on this, is a good idea. If you can you might want to add these to your BW routine while you work on re-balancing the muscles controlling your scaps:

    http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=.../5/K7DaRCQh0lY
    http://www.t-nation.com/readArticle.do?id=459314 if you don't have access to a length of smooth flooring, walking around randomly on your hands is just as effective. The point to these is the loading of the stabilizers in various angles because of the constantly changing movements.

    If these hurt, you aren't ready, you're not stable enough. These require that your scapular muscles are strong enough to stabilize all the various angles involved.
    Last edited by tonester; 09-03-2010 at 04:46 AM.
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  19. #19
    Registered User e45's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by tonester View Post
    This post is base on what I think is the most common reason for impingement related injuries in most regular gym goers. If your injury is due to accident or some kind of trauma then what I'm repeating here can be disregarded. e45, I know I've already given you this advice on previous posts of yours but it's worth repeating. You must realize that this stuff can take months and sometimes years to correct not just a few weeks. And if it is found that posture is part of the problem then correct posture round the clock is a must. If not then everything you do in the gym will be for not.

    I hope the fact that your problems keep returning isn't lost on you. The common denominator between pain cycles is the rest. You have a structural/muscular problem that needs to be dealt with or you will always reach a certain load ceiling beyond which you can't go or injury occurs. You need to check out what's happening. See a good PT for an assessment.

    Your arm is attached to your scapula. Muscle imbalance and kyphotic posture will always lead you to re-injure. Desk jobs and improperly balanced workouts are two reasons for this.

    If you have problems getting the range of motion in this while keeping your head, upper back and butt touching the wall, then you have scapular issues.: http://ericcressey.com/exercise-of-t...ar-wall-slides

    These explain it better than I ever could:
    http://www.martialartsandsportscienc...ter%20PDF_.pdf (I can't emphasize enough how important the concept in this PDF is to anyone who trains.)
    http://www.t-nation.com/article/perf...and_shrugs&cr=

    Sticking to your bodyweight exercises for now, while you work on this, is a good idea. If you can you might want to add these to your BW routine while you work on re-balancing the muscles controlling your scaps:

    http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=.../5/K7DaRCQh0lY
    http://www.t-nation.com/readArticle.do?id=459314 if you don't have access to a length of smooth flooring, walking around randomly on your hands is just as effective. The point to these is the loading of the stabilizers in various angles because of the constantly changing movements.

    If these hurt, you aren't ready, you're not stable enough. These require that your scapular muscles are strong enough to stabilize all the various angles involved.
    Thanks for the reply.
    I think a lot of it is to do with my posture because I never sit up right but that's because when I do my knee hurts so I am either slouched down or lying down,I am always sitting around as well I sit down alot in my job and I only work part time so besides like an hour workout a day am useauly just sitting off some where.
    The physio was telling me should also try to sit up more so she must of noticed that a bit as well.
    I also feel my left shoulder feeling tense through the day,like it will be shrugged up instead of relaxed I don't know why I do this though.

    I think next week when I go back to physio I am going to ask the woman if she can treat my arm's (left one sometimes hurts as well) as well as my knee if not I will go back the docs and try the nhs ones out AGAIN if that doesnt work next year I will try a proper sports sports physio.

    I am laying of the weights again completely as I tried a light weight full body workout yesterday and mill press started aggravating my arms
    I am going to stick to just body weight stuff hopefully I will still improve my body(looks and strength) by doing them.

    The thing is though it proper piss's me of because Its all I like doing in my spare time and I just cant do it.out grew my ****ty concrete weights like 4 years ago so I bought a proper setup and then I start getting injury's .
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