pauline nordin....fighter diet!!!

[juliacheh]

On her blog she has pictures of when she was 19 and she calls herself fat. I think she looks her best there! Fit and beautiful with a little bit higher body fat.

She is thinking in black and white extremes - all people are either lean (like she is), or jiggly and fat. I don't want to be super-lean ever, this look is not healthy and does not appeal to me. And I'm definitely not jiggly or fat either.
There are plenty of women on this board who look great without being super-shredded - fitlover, kimm4 etc. She never recovered from her ED, and I would never train under her supervision or buy any diet plans from her.

[fitlover]

She is thinking in black and white extremes - all people are either lean (like she is), or jiggly and fat. I don't want to be super-lean ever, this look is not healthy and does not appeal to me. And I'm definitely not jiggly or fat either.
There are plenty of women on this board who look great without being super-shredded - fitlover, kimm4 etc. She never recovered from her ED, and I would never train under her supervision or buy any diet plans from her.

Thanks girl You look great yourself!


I agree that she still is deeply into her ED. Even moreso now than she used to be! Now she's chronically over-exercising to the point of exhaustion, AND eating very little calories. Aside from her refeeds (which are super high calorie - up to 7k) she doesn't eat over 1700 calories on a given day, REGARDLESS of her training. And she doesn't even have refeeds every week, sometimes she goes for MONTHS without them. I think that's absurd.

I couldn't lead a life that required me to give up everything in order to maintain an unrealistic perception of myself, and struggle just to make it through the day so I can have a veggie binge at 9:00pm because I'm so goddamn hungry. Wake up...repeat the same cycle over again, for the rest of my days.

I'm not trying to put anyone down, but I just can't see how anyone else can be inspired by her. I was only inspired by her when I was still in my ED, and I'm just warning anyone else...you have to be VERY careful when reading her blogs and writings, because you can get really caught up in them, and they can really f*ck with your mind, and install some pretty bad habits and unrealistic body images in your head. It's like playing with fire, in all seriousness.

[heidismommy]

She is thinking in black and white extremes - all people are either lean (like she is), or jiggly and fat. I don't want to be super-lean ever, this look is not healthy and does not appeal to me. And I'm definitely not jiggly or fat either.
There are plenty of women on this board who look great without being super-shredded - fitlover, kimm4 etc. She never recovered from her ED, and I would never train under her supervision or buy any diet plans from her.

Well said, I agree 100%. Her veggie "binges" and super restrictive intake, her twice-a-day cardio, her distorted body image---all signs that she's still very much caught up in an eating disorder. That isn't normal, her workouts and eating habits have taken over her life in a bad way. She may say that it's what she likes, but it's what she knows and she's scared to move in any other direction, lest she get "fat" (healthy-lean) again. No one can really enjoy such a restrictive lifestyle, it's called denial. I know, I've been there and was good at rationalizing how what I was doing was okay.

[drumchick34]

I don't want to be mean but in my opinion women are not supposed to look like that. It is just too much and not attractive at all.

[sonti]

Pauline reminds me of those rock stars whose fans and media glorify their drug use and excess.. so many admirers cloud them into thinking that what they are doing is okay for themselves because of their public lifestyle (Nordin is not known by the overall public really, but well-known within her niche). As she said in M&F Hers, "she lives in the extremes because she wants to". I'm not sure she actually wants to, but that her brain is so convinced that she HAS to in order to be worthy ~ just like any other person with ED.

[Linds33]

She is thinking in black and white extremes - all people are either lean (like she is), or jiggly and fat. I don't want to be super-lean ever, this look is not healthy and does not appeal to me. And I'm definitely not jiggly or fat either.
There are plenty of women on this board who look great without being super-shredded - fitlover, kimm4 etc. She never recovered from her ED, and I would never train under her supervision or buy any diet plans from her.

I 100% agree with you on this one. I remember a girl i knew who was recovering from a serious ED disorder saying that a lot of the girls she was in treatment with started doing figure competitions afterwards. Many of them had not fully recovered from their eating disorders and were using the "figure lifestyle" as a way to maintain their eating disorder in a more acceptable fashion. They could be restrictive and obessive about body weight, food etc. but when questioned about it they could say "oh i am just preping for such and such a competition".

This is often why I have wondered bodybuilding have become too disordered, or that it has encourage more disordered eating and lifestyles for both men and women.

That isn't to say that all bodybuilders and figure/fitness compeditors have eating disorders. We have some wonderful women on this board like Kimm, and fitlover and many others who show us that they can be lean and muscular but they go about it in a very healthy manner both physically (with their diet, and workouts) as well as mentally (with the way they view themselves and other people). To me that is inspirational !!

Fitlover: you are right about being careful while reading her blogs. It can warp the way you look at yourself. After reading her blog, i quickly jumped over to Krista Smashe's website just so that i could get myself re-motivated and out of the funk i was in!

[Suzash]

I 100% agree with you on this one. I remember a girl i knew who was recovering from a serious ED disorder saying that a lot of the girls she was in treatment with started doing figure competitions afterwards. Many of them had not fully recovered from their eating disorders and were using the "figure lifestyle" as a way to maintain their eating disorder in a more acceptable fashion. They could be restrictive and obessive about body weight, food etc. but when questioned about it they could say "oh i am just preping for such and such a competition".

Interesting point and I totally agree that many people with EDs have not necessarily recovered, but instead mask their issues by acting in a way that fits into societal norms. By getting into figure/bodybuilding these people can justify their exercise/nutrition/anti-social behaviors to both themselves and others while never truly healing their body image issues.

ALSO, I think that Nordin's strict diet is the blueprint of an ED, but I think many many many people have the same mental issues she does but just don't have the energy to "pull it off" like she does. Very sad...and I hope I'm wrong with that.

[alocke83]

I always assumed an eating disorder meant you were eating a large deficit in calories compared to maintenance calories. Eating veggies and lean meat, as long as calories are adequate, isn't an eating disorder. Pauline pushes her body to the limit when it comes to diet/exercise. She's addicted, just as I am, to health and fitness. It seems that she is being belittled for living this lifestyle year round rather than a typical bulk/cut lifestyle. Yeah Pauline does make judgements on others who don't work as hard as she does but that's pride....I think most people that are fit can recall seeing an overweight person eating a supersized triple meat combo and laughing a little when they swig a diet coke. Bottom line, paulines lifestyle isn't for everyone and is the extreme end of the fitness/nutrition scale, but she looks great and shouldn't be criticized for everyones inability to dedicate themselves to this lifestyle. To each her own.

[juliacheh]

I always assumed an eating disorder meant you were eating a large deficit in calories compared to maintenance calories. Eating veggies and lean meat, as long as calories are adequate, isn't an eating disorder. Pauline pushes her body to the limit when it comes to diet/exercise. She's addicted, just as I am, to health and fitness. It seems that she is being belittled for living this lifestyle year round rather than a typical bulk/cut lifestyle. Yeah Pauline does make judgements on others who don't work as hard as she does but that's pride....I think most people that are fit can recall seeing an overweight person eating a supersized triple meat combo and laughing a little when they swig a diet coke. Bottom line, paulines lifestyle isn't for everyone and is the extreme end of the fitness/nutrition scale, but she looks great and shouldn't be criticized for everyones inability to dedicate themselves to this lifestyle. To each her own.

You don't have to cut and bulk at all to be healthy and look good.
Veggies and lean meats only is unbalanced diet. Period. Regardless of calories.

Oh, and she is not menstruating without a pill. How healthy is that?

[heidismommy]

I always assumed an eating disorder meant you were eating a large deficit in calories compared to maintenance calories. Eating veggies and lean meat, as long as calories are adequate, isn't an eating disorder. Pauline pushes her body to the limit when it comes to diet/exercise. She's addicted, just as I am, to health and fitness. It seems that she is being belittled for living this lifestyle year round rather than a typical bulk/cut lifestyle. Yeah Pauline does make judgements on others who don't work as hard as she does but that's pride....I think most people that are fit can recall seeing an overweight person eating a supersized triple meat combo and laughing a little when they swig a diet coke. Bottom line, paulines lifestyle isn't for everyone and is the extreme end of the fitness/nutrition scale, but she looks great and shouldn't be criticized for everyones inability to dedicate themselves to this lifestyle. To each her own.

It's the obsessiveness that screams eating disorder. Trust me, I've been there and can see disordered behavior in others. It is one thing to be healthy and fit, but she has crossed the line into pathological territory. There is no way she can ever have a "real life" if she is consumed so much with maintaining such a rigid routine as far as diet and workouts. You can struggle with an eating disorder without necessarily going into a caloric deficit---you're thinking of anorexia nervosa which is just one form of an eating disorder. However, she is consuming way less than her body needs considering her activity level, that is how she maintains such an unhealthy body fat percentage. Sure, some may think she looks great, but her health WILL suffer as a result. Women aren't meant to walk around that lean all the time---some fat is beneficial for health and general well-being. So while she may not be clinically anorexic due to the fact she does have some muscle, she most certainly is eating disordered.

"shouldn't be criticized for everyones inability to dedicate themselves to this lifestyle"

Her lifestyle isn't healthy. Trust me, I spent half my life "dedicating myself" to a rigid lifestyle and it sucked up so many years of my life that I can never get back. She's being criticized by people that can see through her "eating disorder disguised as a healthy lifestyle". And she does come across as judgmental and condescending. It isn't pride, it's rude and disrespectful.

Veggies and lean meats only is unbalanced diet. Period. Regardless of calories.

Oh, and she is not menstruating without a pill. How healthy is that?

Exactly

[discdoggie]

Yeah Pauline does make judgements on others who don't work as hard as she does but that's pride....I think most people that are fit can recall seeing an overweight person eating a supersized triple meat combo and laughing a little when they swig a diet coke.

I wasn't going to jump in on this discussion becasue I don't know anything about Pauline Nordin, and I tend not to talk about things I don't know about unless it's asking questions to learn more.


With that said, making judgements about others who don't have the same veiws as you is NOT "pride." It's mean-spiritedness and arrogance, with a touch of ignorance thrown in there as well.

And secondly, I think I'm pretty fit and I have never laughed at an overweight person eating a supersized triple meat combo while sipping a diet coke. I don't laugh at people for weight problems, period, but also am too busy worrying about my own self, life, and personal problems to notice what other people are eating. Even back in the days when I was a bartender and served people food and drink for a living.

[alocke83]

If ones weight does not change wouldn't that mean they are consuming what their body needs for maintenance? Like I said before, she is on one end of the health/fitness spectrum. It's just crazy to me that she is being degraded as if she is some 400lbs woman that eats snack cakes all day. Lean meat, vegetables, and grains (oats or bran) isn't healthy? Explain exactly what's missing to make this diet more healthy? While you're at it, some of you get out the bodyfat calipers because from the pics I'm seeing, there are some very lean "unhealthy" women posting up.

[heidismommy]

If ones weight does not change wouldn't that mean they are consuming what their body needs for maintenance? Like I said before, she is on one end of the health/fitness spectrum. It's just crazy to me that she is being degraded as if she is some 400lbs woman that eats snack cakes all day. Lean meat, vegetables, and grains (oats or bran) isn't healthy? Explain exactly what's missing to make this diet more healthy? While you're at it, some of you get out the bodyfat calipers because from the pics I'm seeing, there are some very lean "unhealthy" women posting up.

But she is maintaining at a level that isn't healthy for her body so she isn't giving her body what it needs. She doesn't eat grains by the way (or does she?), she eats lean meats and veggies and that is pretty much it. I know she doesn't eat fruit or dairy and if she does include any grains it isn't much.

I'm not sure if I'm one of the pics you're referring to, maybe I'm not. But if I am, I can assure you that my diet is very balanced (meat, healthy fats, dairy, grains, fruits, and veggies) and I include plenty of treats and splurges. I know I'm at a level that is right for my body because my body is working correctly (menstruating regularly right up until I got a positive pregnancy test in June).

[viridian]

If ones weight does not change wouldn't that mean they are consuming what their body needs for maintenance? Like I said before, she is on one end of the health/fitness spectrum. It's just crazy to me that she is being degraded as if she is some 400lbs woman that eats snack cakes all day. Lean meat, vegetables, and grains (oats or bran) isn't healthy? Explain exactly what's missing to make this diet more healthy? While you're at it, some of you get out the bodyfat calipers because from the pics I'm seeing, there are some very lean "unhealthy" women posting up.

I am kinda on the line with this one.

I do find her inspirational. Whatever she's doing, it cant be that unhealthy because she is able to keep her lean mass and strength. Is she as strong as she would be if she werent doing so much cardio and eating more strachy carbs? No. But she does have a pretty balanced diet. Lean meats and veggies are still proteins, fats, and carbs. Her pistachio kick is alot of healthy fat. Is it low calories for the average person with her stats, yes. But alot of people do low calorie for the majority of things and then have a really high refeed.

Honestly, I think if julia or hmommy had more lean mass, either of you would resemble pauline quite a bit more.

The pictures she takes are without makeup, she has no tan. I look horrendous without a tan too - incredibly unhealthy looking, its just my skin. Pale, thin, blech. And her period - alot of top female athletes dont have one.

As far as her blogs - I think she proobably is just overreaching a bit in the effort of standing out. She doesnt wanna be another one of those fru-fru trainers spewing all this BS about having your cake and eatin it too.

I do view food similarly... if you dont NEED it, why bother allowing it? Cake is good, but its really not nutritionally beneficial. Do I eat it anyway, yeah, cause I want to. But I dont need it and I fully realize that. Anytime I have a piece of cake, someone out there is skipping a piece and getting ahead of me in the fit-game. But that's something Im allowing

[juliacheh]

I am kinda on the line with this one.

Honestly, I think if julia or hmommy had more lean mass, either of you would resemble pauline quite a bit more.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by this. I'm not at a low body fat, I think I'm about 17-18 right now, and I'm quite happy with my body ATM. Pauline would call me fat and jiggly, no doubt about that. I don't have glute striations and not even a lot of quad separation, and I have some fat on my hamstrings (god forbid).

Pauline Nordin maintains body fat percentage that is below essential level for women. The fact that top athletes do not have periods means nothing to me - first, top athletes are not healthy, second, Pauline is not even an athlete, she is a fitness model. Have you ever read about female athlete triad? Amennorhoea, osteoporosis and eating disorders. Sounds fun, right?

I've only been training with weight since January 2009, of course, I can't have the muscle mass as somebody who has been training for more than a decade. I will never resemble Pauline Nordin, because it is not my intention to get down to a level which is dangerous and bad for my health, let alone try to maintain it.

I understand that you or some other people may find her inspirational. I will never find her inspirational or motivational, and I have outlined my exact reasons for this. Having a balanced varied diet has nothing to do with eating cakes all day long, although I don't see anything wrong with having a piece of cake once in a while. Actually, I like some simple carbs before I run, gives me way more energy than eggwhites and oatmeal (anecdotal experience).

[Linds33]

If ones weight does not change wouldn't that mean they are consuming what their body needs for maintenance? Like I said before, she is on one end of the health/fitness spectrum. It's just crazy to me that she is being degraded as if she is some 400lbs woman that eats snack cakes all day. Lean meat, vegetables, and grains (oats or bran) isn't healthy? Explain exactly what's missing to make this diet more healthy? While you're at it, some of you get out the bodyfat calipers because from the pics I'm seeing, there are some very lean "unhealthy" women posting up.

I am not degrading her, I just feel that the "image" and "ideals" she promotes are unhealthy and can be constrewed as an eating disorder. You also must remember (correct me if i am wrong) that she is someone who is recovering from a previous eating disorder.

From what I understand she does not get any fats (lean proteins are LEAN, thus they do not contain proper amounts of fats for a balanced diet) and while veggies are carbohydrates, they aren't the complex cardohydrates that your body needs in order to build and maintain muscle and bodily function. Many people that count macros don't even include veggies in their net carbs because of this. She also neglects eating fruit and dairy. This is not a balanced diet.

Notice how in many of her blogs she seems to speak about being lethargic and has low energy. That is often a sign of under-nourishment that bodybuilders experience in the weeks before a show (they don't experience this all year round though). She goes above and beyond what is necessary with regards to her diet and training which can ultimatley lead to a decline in health.

Some people would say that I am obsessive because i am picky about what I eat. Most of my food choices stems from politics and the actual science of knowing what goes into the food that i eat. To me, food is something intimate that nourishes me and i choose to be involved in the process of my food from start to finish. This is something that i actually enjoy doing. I like being involved in growing my own food. I am proud to support local farmers when buying dairy or meat. However, it isn't something that i obsess over and I do not make people feel bad if they don't follow the same diet practices that i do. If they ask me questions on why i do something i will tell them why, but i would never judge them for their own decisions.

But aside from diet, it is the attitude that is unhealthy. She does not seem to be happy or fulfilled based on what I have read. Someone who is mentally healthy is happy with what they have accomplished, the are balanced and they don't obsess. If you compate her blog to that of say Krista Smash, they are both saying similar things (fitness and health = good) but they do it in two totally different ways. Krista is a regular person, looks amazing, trains hard and while her profession now is in the fitness industry, it doesn't occupy her life in an unhealthy way. When you read Krista's blog you feel inspired and you can't wait to get into the gym. She talks about women and men that have overcome many obstacles which to me is motivating.

As for her looking really muscular and fit in her pictures, a lot of that is an illusion of sorts. When you become very lean you often look more muscular then you actually are. And in pictures you can look heavier then you are in reality. People mentioned on here mentioned that people often think she is anorexic when she goes out. I wonder what we would think about her if we saw her in person.

[ToraAdams]

I actually tried the fighter diet she describes . I was rarely hungry and held no water which can really upset me. Her web site has much much less info than it did a few years ago and she included back then many of her foods.

I don't think Pauline is depressed or lethargic due to her diet. Her exhaustion is mainly a result from extrmeme physical exertion. Her web site used to include a fit but uncut version of herself before she began implementing her diet regime . The change was remarkable and for her thrilling. It all came about when she decided what she wanted out of her "look" and adjusted accordingly which she does not claim to have been easy . She is crazy about her cardio and would do 2 hour kickboxing sessions daily she then changed to the step machine which she seems to attribute to her fabulous back side.

Pauline is a very petite woman who found it difficult to gain the muscularity with leanness she so desired. Personally I found the diet much easier than the workout regime and I was rarely if ever hungry . Pauline eats huge and I mean huge amounts of cabbage which is very low cal but very filling and full of nutrition. My hair skin were always glowing and I rarely had muscle aches and pains. Google cabbage I'm telling you its a lifesaver for cravings.

Why am I not implementing her diet now? My answer Pure Laziness

[fitlover]

I think many many many people have the same mental issues she does but just don't have the energy to "pull it off" like she does. Very sad...and I hope I'm wrong with that.

You're absolutely right. Which is why you must be careful over your thoughts and the way you view eating, dieting, etc.

If ones weight does not change wouldn't that mean they are consuming what their body needs for maintenance? Like I said before, she is on one end of the health/fitness spectrum. It's just crazy to me that she is being degraded as if she is some 400lbs woman that eats snack cakes all day. Lean meat, vegetables, and grains (oats or bran) isn't healthy? Explain exactly what's missing to make this diet more healthy? While you're at it, some of you get out the bodyfat calipers because from the pics I'm seeing, there are some very lean "unhealthy" women posting up.

Her body fat percentage is not healthy for a woman. It doesn't f*cking matter whether she's maintaining or not. There's such a thing as an opposite extreme...you shouldn't be obese, but you shouldn't be that low in body fat either. Your fat is there for a reason, it's not just there to make you "feel ugly". It serves a valuable purpose in your body and with regulating your hormones, and making you fit for survival. Why do you think your menstrual cycle shuts down when you reach such a low %? It's because that's not how the body is supposed to be, and thus it freaks the hell out.

No one is degrading her, we're just not agreeing with her methods.

[ToraAdams]

i don't see what her body fat is? Could you tell me . When I look at recent pictures of her she does not look too lean .

My life is surrounded by athletes I know this kind of attitude she speaks of. I have been around these kind of attitudes and yes they are hard to keep up with. I have never met one seriouse athlete who was not obsessive about food . Every athlete knows its the food that's the fuel and builder that's why so many can't do it naturally and take steroids.

Mental toughness is not an eating disorder just because the topic is food .

I understand that its seems to a regular person she is obsessive but she is not a regular person she has no interest in being regular she wants to stand apart from all that and prove to herself that she is the best.

I am not advocating doing anything she does but I most definitely disagree with a lot of the statement posted about her here read all the blogs of females who are doing the same gig most are taking steroids and are holding a good 20lbs off season I personally think that is allot of extra to pack around and its unhealthy to gain and lose all the time.

[fitlover]

i don't see what her body fat is? Could you tell me . When I look at recent pictures of her she does not look too lean .

Who knows, and who cares? It's very lean, that's all.

My life is surrounded by athletes I know this kind of attitude she speaks of. I have been around these kind of attitudes and yes they are hard to keep up with. I have never met one seriouse athlete who was not obsessive about food . Every athlete knows its the food that's the fuel and builder that's why so many can't do it naturally and take steroids.

I don't know too many athletes who can perform on the kind of diet she has. They're strict with their diets, yes. No one is telling anyone to eat whatever they want...but the point is that you eat.

Mental toughness is not an eating disorder just because the topic is food .

No one's talking about mental toughness. We're talking about the way she views food, the way she views herself, her daily habits, etc. All of it is related to eating disorders, and those of us who were unfortunate enough to have them can certainly relate. And it's even worse for those who had eating disorders to go and read her blogs, because it can really make you fall back into that mindset of, "Am I ever good enough?". You start beginning to believe you're "fat and jiggly" because you don't look like Pauline. That's ridiculous.

I understand that its seems to a regular person she is obsessive but she is not a regular person she has no interest in being regular she wants to stand apart from all that and prove to herself that she is the best.

And indeed she does - but it's not the healthiest demonstration either, is it?

I am not advocating doing anything she does but I most definitely disagree with a lot of the statement posted about her here read all the blogs of females who are doing the same gig most are taking steroids and are holding a good 20lbs off season I personally think that is allot of extra to pack around and its unhealthy to gain and lose all the time.

It's healthier and more natural for your body to gain and lose fat than it is to maintain below the level of essential body fat year after year, after year.

And no one is speaking for the opposite extreme either. You're totally missing the point.

And look at these and tell me if you think she's "not that lean":

[juliacheh]

i don't see what her body fat is? Could you tell me . When I look at recent pictures of her she does not look too lean .

If Pauline does not seem too lean too you, of course you will disagree with the statements posted here. So, what is too lean to you then?
I also liked your suggestion to google cabbage. I assumed most of the people here would know what cabbage is .

These are off-season pictures of national level figure competitor Sarah Gwynn.
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/im...WMulv1534.jpeg
Here you can see her at different stages in prep and offseason.
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/US...n=progresspics
She is fat and unhealthy offseason, right?

[ToraAdams]

I don't claim to have any expertise in being super fit or super lean but I don't hear anything she writes as any different that what I here woman speak about themselves all the time.

No I do not see too lean . I see her flexing and very vascular after a work out. Personally I love her look I love thin and muscular to me its the ideal. I'm weird most people think I'm off base I could care less the last two years of my life have been the best since I started seriously training. I train around and with seriouse people the things she writes is not foreign to me I hear it almost everyday. It sounds obsessive to most people to me it sounds different I hear disciplined and passionate. She takes a hard line approach to the whole fit body thing . I take a hard line approach to allot of stuff in my life becasue I feel I have to.

Cheers

[juliacheh]

Wow... So, this is just being vascular and pumped after a work-out. Not too lean and maintainable.
I am speechless...

[heidismommy]

No one's talking about mental toughness. We're talking about the way she views food, the way she views herself, her daily habits, etc. All of it is related to eating disorders, and those of us who were unfortunate enough to have them can certainly relate. And it's even worse for those who had eating disorders to go and read her blogs, because it can really make you fall back into that mindset of, "Am I ever good enough?". You start beginning to believe you're "fat and jiggly" because you don't look like Pauline. That's ridiculous.

Exactly! I agree, 100%. And those photos of her are alarming.

No I do not see too lean . I see her flexing and very vascular after a work out. Personally I love her look I love thin and muscular to me its the ideal. I'm weird most people think I'm off base I could care less the last two years of my life have been the best since I started seriously training. I train around and with seriouse people the things she writes is not foreign to me I hear it almost everyday. It sounds obsessive to most people to me it sounds different I hear disciplined and passionate. She takes a hard line approach to the whole fit body thing . I take a hard line approach to allot of stuff in my life becasue I feel I have to.

Cheers

I understand that what is aesthetically pleasing to one person may not be for another. You may like the way she looks, that may be your ideal, but it isn't healthy. I can guarantee she's going to have issues with bone mass (if she doesn't already) as well as other problems brought about by maintaining such an unhealthy level of body fat. Women aren't meant to walk around that lean. Our bodies function better with adequate amounts of body fat (meaning neither too fat nor too thin). Pauline doesn't menstruate on her own which means her body isn't working correctly. Many people talk about the discrepency between males and females with regards to body fat due to differences in essential fat stores---but when you get to her level of leanness you lose most of those essential fat stores.

Keep in mind that there is a whole niche of people out there that think anorexic women are ideal. I don't mean supermodel women, I mean seriously emaciated anorexic women. Just because some people think it's ideal doesn't make it right. I think people become desensitized to seeing very very thin and/or very very lean women and the more we see this, the more it loses it's shock value. But now that I have a much healthier mindset and am out of the rigid perfectionistic behavior, seeing it has regained it's shock value.

There is nothing wrong with training hard. There is nothing wrong with eating well. But when it becomes pathological and gets in the way of life it's no longer healthy.

[KyleAaron]

Why do you think your menstrual cycle shuts down when you reach such a low %? It's because that's not how the body is supposed to be, and thus it freaks the hell out.

As I understand it, like many other mechanisms in the body, it's simply the body protecting itself. If you're that low bodyfat, you won't be able to successfully carry a foetus to birth. Miscarriages - in nature, without our wonderful medicine - can kill you. So the body - knowing nothing about medicine, or bulking and cutting cycles and bodybuilding competitions and "fitness" model photoshoots - protects you by shutting down the menstrual cycle.

What it comes down to is that physical training can change three things, how we

• look
• feel - our health, which is more than simply the absence of illness, and
• perform - in our work if physical, or in sports, etc.

and which one we put first, the others will suffer somewhat, and some of us will get carried away with just one of them, and the others will suffer badly.

Each of us differs in that we put one of those ahead of the other two. And over time our priorities can change. Many people come into physical training just wanting a smaller bum or belly (looks), but along the way improve the way they feel (health), and get an interest in some kind of sport (performance). And that's okay.

The problem comes when one of the three is such a high priority that the others are left in the dust. If you put health first that will limit your performance in a sport. You simply can't win national or international level competitions unless you're willing to suffer overuse injuries, end up with knee reconstructions and so on.

If you put performance first then as above, health will suffer. The ultimate example of putting performance first such that it harms health is drug abuse, amphetamines and steroids and so on.

If you put looks first, then both health and performance will suffer. If you're on a cutting diet going from healthy average bodyfat, then you'll get sick more often, if a woman your menstrual cycle will be disrupted or stopped, and as for performance, well your strength, cardiovascular fitness and so on will drop. No woman is going to win national powerlifting competitions at 12% bodyfat.

The other issue is that with performance there's an objective scale - numbers to the lifts or times for the cycle or swim, goals scored and so on, and of course getting first or tenth place. For health, a lot of it is subjective, such as how you feel, but lots more is objectively measurable. They can look at your heart and joints and so on. Having these objective measures to health and performance somewhat limits how fanatical most of us get in pursuing them.

I mean if you win, you win, what more can you do? If you're healthy, well done, now what? So there are limits to it for most of us. Some can still go crazy with it, sure. But most won't.

But there's no objective scale for looks. Whatever the fashionable look is today, where does it end? How much muscle is enough? How low bodyfat? There's no end to it. So it can lead to some obsessive behaviour that makes us unhappy, and is more likely to end in disordered eating and drug abuse.

[drumchick34]

Oh wow that first picture is scary! She looks gaunt and tired.

[IronCitGrl]

If Pauline does not seem too lean too you, of course you will disagree with the statements posted here. So, what is too lean to you then?
I also liked your suggestion to google cabbage. I assumed most of the people here would know what cabbage is .

These are off-season pictures of national level figure competitor Sarah Gwynn.
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/im...WMulv1534.jpeg
Here you can see her at different stages in prep and offseason.
http://bodyspace.bodybuilding.com/US...n=progresspics
She is fat and unhealthy offseason, right?

The photos of Sarah are beautiful! That is what I want to look like! She looks good in all her photos.

The photos of Pauline are shocking. I don't think she looks impressive at all. She looks sick to me and I can't believe she maintains that. If she were tan she would look contest ready. I have never read her blog but judging by her photos it looks like she might be going a little overboard. I beat myself up a lot too but I don't get mad if I "binge" on some vegetables either.

[onnadafit]

Wise words from everyone! Good stuff Kyle, as usual!

QUOTE=KyleAaron;527305133]I agree, you have put into simple words what I was trying to figure out how to say. The way I see it, most people's physical limits are way up here, and their mental limits are a bit below that - for some there's a small gap, for others there's a big gap. As trainers - or article writer, I guess - it's our job to narrow that gap. Many people coming into the gym or to trainers are really lacking in self-confidence in that, "I might fail, but I might succeed! so I'll give it a go!" kind of spirit. A little encouragement goes a long way.

Just yesterday I was talking to a gym-goer, she was returning after a period of slacking off. She was on the leg press machine, one where the chair and your body move rather than a plate. She was pushing 15kg, and it was obviously very easy for her. I asked her about her goals, she wanted to "get in shape."

"Well, if you want your body to change, you must challenge it. Let's up the weight." I moved the peg to 55kg. And she did it. It wasn't easy - she didn't have to grind it out while screaming, but she wasn't cruising any more. I gave her tips on form and told her, "there you go, you did it, well done mate." And we kept chatting, then I gave her another set. Afterwards I complimented her on her strength.

So it's a step-by-step thing. Progressive resistance training means that in every session, we do more than we did before - more weight, more reps or more sets. It can be 0.25kg or 1 rep more, that's okay. It doesn't have to be straight up to state records in one session.

Likewise with the kind of workout the person is doing. This woman I spoke to was young and healthy, with good bodily awareness. So she was physically quite capable of barbell squats rather than the leg press. But one step at a time - she was already on the leg press, that was a step up from being on the couch. From the leg press to the squat rack was a very big step, from the leg press with 15kg to the leg press with 55kg was a smaller step, but still one which would help her.

She may or may not have been mentally capable of going from the leg press to the squat rack. With a trainer standing there, sure, no worries. But had I shown her, would she have done it again on her own? Judging from her surprised reaction to adding weight to the leg press, probably not. Since I was only acting as a gym instructor for her, not personal trainer, I had to amp it up to a level she was likely to stick with on her own. So just adding weight was enough. But that was in any case progress. She was doing more than she had done before.

Progress is progress, it doesn't have to be immediate progress to the top. And that's something missing from the writings of people like Nordin. With them, it's all or nothing - and if you're not all, you really are nothing.

Which is not to say that Nordin's approach is "the top" or anything like that.

[/QUOTE]

[imperfectly_lou]

She looks to me to be about 8-10% body fat. Which is FINE for a woman about to step on stage and who is only going to stay that body fat for a couple of weeks tops. But for someone to maintain year round with twice daily, 6 day a week workouts and an extremely restrictive diet is just plain unhealthy. I would imagine she either already suffers from osteopenia or is likely to in the future. You can call is mental toughness if you like - I call it mental illness, idiocy and vanity rolled into one.

When I first began "recovering" from anorexia and bulimia, I used fitness as the guise in which to "recover". I soon found out it wasn't recovery at all, just a way of channelling my issues into something that is a bit more respectable, even revered by others.

My other issue with her is she posts a lot of RUBBISH - stuff with no scientific backing. She refuses to even look into the science behind a lot of things because it works for her. fair enough, but don't give your poor advice onto thousands of uneducated followers.

[Linds33]

I actually tried the fighter diet she describes . I was rarely hungry and held no water which can really upset me. Her web site has much much less info than it did a few years ago and she included back then many of her foods.

I don't think Pauline is depressed or lethargic due to her diet. Her exhaustion is mainly a result from extrmeme physical exertion. Her web site used to include a fit but uncut version of herself before she began implementing her diet regime . The change was remarkable and for her thrilling. It all came about when she decided what she wanted out of her "look" and adjusted accordingly which she does not claim to have been easy . She is crazy about her cardio and would do 2 hour kickboxing sessions daily she then changed to the step machine which she seems to attribute to her fabulous back side.

Pauline is a very petite woman who found it difficult to gain the muscularity with leanness she so desired. Personally I found the diet much easier than the workout regime and I was rarely if ever hungry . Pauline eats huge and I mean huge amounts of cabbage which is very low cal but very filling and full of nutrition. My hair skin were always glowing and I rarely had muscle aches and pains. Google cabbage I'm telling you its a lifesaver for cravings.

Why am I not implementing her diet now? My answer Pure Laziness

Someone please correct me if i am wrong but if you are getting enough rest/sleep and adequate nutrition for your particular activity level you should not be lethargic and tired/down all the time. In fact, you should be the opposite. When you watch professional athletes prepare for an event they get lots of sleep and tweek their nutrition for performance. They have to be "obsessed" with food for performance sake and to maintain homeostasis when they are performing their specific sport. Most athletes eat higher cardohydrates and crazy amounts of calories because their body needs this in order to function properly.

The men and women here are not strangers to mental toughness and dedication. And we are not regular people either. Regular people are the ones you sit next to at work that see what we do on a daily basis as obsessive and difficult. While many of us have different goals we all have to have some form of dedication and toughness in order to achieve what we want. But there is a point where your life starts to suffer and i can see that she is getting to that point. I personally would not want her lifestyle because it would prevent me from accomplishing and experiencing many things. I wouldn't be able to summit the mountains that I plan of summiting if i was at 5% bodyfat and had to obsess with my diet like she does. No, i am not like everyone else and I choose not to be like everyone else. I am strict with what i eat from a politic and personal standpoint, but i have fun doing it and i get excited about it! She doesn't seem to enjoy what she does and that is the big problem where it goes from being "healthy" to "unhealthy"

What Kyle said is perfect and I would not have said it better myself. When you train and eat for health or performance there is a measure there. Even with health you get the reward of not being sick all the time, feeling more energized and in general have a sense of well being. But when you train soley for the way you look, there isn't a measure because how we view ourselves is so much different then actual reality. This goes for both men and women as women are not the only ones that have BDD (Body Dysmorphic Disorder).

Yes there may be some men and women on here who gain and loose weight through the year, take steroids and participate in percieved unhealthy lifestyles, but there is a balance that is both healthy and appealing. For example i believe Kimm (i know we mention her a lot but she rocks!) maintains a lower body fat in the off season (i beleibve she said around 14-15%) which is healthy and normal for a woman to maintain with proper nutrition. She still gets her period and while she works out hard, she isn't exhausted all the time. And she looks Fantastic to boot! To me that is optimal and healthy and in no way disordered.