New to Keto and I have a few questions

[davygravyt]

Hello all,

First of all, thanks for all the info from everyone. There really is a wealth of knowledge here like nowhere else on the web I've been able to find. Also, the community here seems far more mature than other forums. This is all greatly appreciated.

Anyways, I have a few "specific to me" questions, that I've had a hard time finding searching through hundreds of these posts.

Firstly, here is my situation. I am 22 years old, 5'4, and 175 lbs. I have a pretty big frame, so my target weight I think is around 145ish. I was 200 lbs about 2-3 months ago, and all that weight was lost lifting 3 times a week, doing cardio on rest days, and just overall healthier eating (your basic complex carbs and lean protein diet). However, I have reached a fat loss plateau and want to try Keto.

Here are a few questions I have:
1. How important is it to count carbs/calories/fat/protein if the foods I'm eating are similar to the meals I've seen on the meal plans/suggestions on here? I basically don't eat any carbs, except I usually have a generous helping of green vegetables with 2 or 3 meals a day, and occasionally there are 5 or less carbs in sauces, peanut butter, etc. I eat. As it's hard to count carbs in green vegetables and such, do you think it's likely this type of diet will yield me the 30-50 carbs I need a day (not including pre/post workout shakes)? I do fine with willpower and cravings and what not, so sticking to diets isn't that hard, but i have a REALLY hard time counting calories/carbs/protein.

2. I'm a little bit confused as to what to take pre/post-workout. I have read some posts that I should take only simple, not complex carbs, and they should be taken only before the workout, and not after, some that say a mix of simple and complex carbs is better, and that they should be taken before and after the workout (lifting, not cardio). My plan was to take some sort of pre-workout supplement (probably NO Xplod or Presurge Unleashed), and then a protein shake (8 oz orange/apple juice for carbs, 52g protein, creatine, bcaa's, glutamine, etc.). Is that the way I should be doing it?

3. For maximum fat loss, should I still do the carb load-up day? Or should I go with more of a TKD and only take carbs before/after workouts? And if I should do the carb load-up day, what do you think is an appropriate number of carbs?

I'm sure these have been answered before, but like I said, it's hard to find info specific to me sifting through hundreds of these posts.

Thanks a lot for the help.

[mike0o2]

Hello all,

First of all, thanks for all the info from everyone. There really is a wealth of knowledge here like nowhere else on the web I've been able to find. Also, the community here seems far more mature than other forums. This is all greatly appreciated.

Anyways, I have a few "specific to me" questions, that I've had a hard time finding searching through hundreds of these posts.

Firstly, here is my situation. I am 22 years old, 5'4, and 175 lbs. I have a pretty big frame, so my target weight I think is around 145ish. I was 200 lbs about 2-3 months ago, and all that weight was lost lifting 3 times a week, doing cardio on rest days, and just overall healthier eating (your basic complex carbs and lean protein diet). However, I have reached a fat loss plateau and want to try Keto.

Here are a few questions I have:
1. How important is it to count carbs/calories/fat/protein if the foods I'm eating are similar to the meals I've seen on the meal plans/suggestions on here? I basically don't eat any carbs, except I usually have a generous helping of green vegetables with 2 or 3 meals a day, and occasionally there are 5 or less carbs in sauces, peanut butter, etc. I eat. As it's hard to count carbs in green vegetables and such, do you think it's likely this type of diet will yield me the 30-50 carbs I need a day (not including pre/post workout shakes)? I do fine with willpower and cravings and what not, so sticking to diets isn't that hard, but i have a REALLY hard time counting calories/carbs/protein.

2. I'm a little bit confused as to what to take pre/post-workout. I have read some posts that I should take only simple, not complex carbs, and they should be taken only before the workout, and not after, some that say a mix of simple and complex carbs is better, and that they should be taken before and after the workout (lifting, not cardio). My plan was to take some sort of pre-workout supplement (probably NO Xplod or Presurge Unleashed), and then a protein shake (8 oz orange/apple juice for carbs, 52g protein, creatine, bcaa's, glutamine, etc.). Is that the way I should be doing it?

3. For maximum fat loss, should I still do the carb load-up day? Or should I go with more of a TKD and only take carbs before/after workouts? And if I should do the carb load-up day, what do you think is an appropriate number of carbs?

I'm sure these have been answered before, but like I said, it's hard to find info specific to me sifting through hundreds of these posts.

Thanks a lot for the help.

1.) When I started keto, I used Fitday to calculate my ratios. I still use it when I am trying to be extra strict or when I want to make changes in the foods I am eating. After awhile though, it gets easier to calculate them on your own. Now that beach season is almost here, I am using Fitday to make sure that I am right around 65% Fat, 30% Protein, and 5% carbs. I never get to worried about hitting my carbs, I usually just have some veggies with dinner and some natural PB with another meal.

2.) I think that this really depends on the person. I have always done CKD, but just recently I have started adding in post workout carbs in the form of dextrose (corn sugar) and maltodextrin. I was having some problems getting into keto quickly, so I took this out for now. I think the most important thing is to find what works for you. Maybe give both a try.

I had been making the mistake of using orange juice for post workout carbs. This is bad because it is fructose and it refills you liver glycogen, hence keeping you out of keto. I took this out and I have been getting into keto much faster (like 2 days instead of 4). Not that I didn't have results from doing it with orange juice, but obviously the goal is to be in keto longer. My previous weight loss results were probably due more to the calorie deficit.

3.) I am not the best person to advise on this. My carb-ups range from 1-2days on the weekend and they are pretty sloppy. I try to eat clean, but I don't really hold myself to it during the whole carb-up. While I am sure I would see better results if I tweaked my carb-up, these cheat meals are what has kept me on keto for almost a year now and helped me to go from 190lbs to 150lbs while increasing my muscle and strength.

Hope this helps, but I am sure that there are more knowlegable people on the subject that can advise you better. I would keep reading the posts on these forums, this is where I learned keto and stil keep improving from. The posts from fitnessman seemed to get me on the right track.

[mworrel1989]

I would definitely suggest you count calories!! That is very important especially on ketosis in my opinion.

Reason I say this is because there is 9 calories per gram of fat vs Protein/carbohydrates that only have 4 calories per gram. So basically when your consuming fat at 65% of your daily intake, at 9 calories per gram if you make a mistake or your just using ur judgment, a small error can be worth HUNDREDS of calories.

Do what you think was best, I attempted to guesstimate with ketosis in the past and it was a horrible idea. Take the time, buy a notebook and document. Also all that stuff is really good to know and get the hang of. It will really help you control what happens with your body(gain/lose ect).

GL

[BritishFighter]

What Mike0o2 said. That was good info.

To elaborate, and confirm......

1. Yes, counting calories is very important. Do it. :-)

2. I started with TKD, and found that it just straight-up didn't work for me. I felt crappy after workouts, and felt generally drained. Starting CKD and only getting carbs during my weekly carb-up took care of all that, and the results have been great for me. Most of your regular supplements are fine.....just watch out for sneaky carbs in the pre-workout mixes. BCAAs are great....Creatine etc are all good.

If you're going to target your carbs around your workout, I believe that carbs after, are more important than carbs before....although most people will say that they require some carbs before, in order to power their workout. Dextrose is the most recommended form of carb before and after, because it is goes towards glycogen replenishment. Again Lyle recommends 20-30grams for this purpose.

3. Lyle McDonald recommends 7grams of carbs per pound of Lean Body Mass during carb-up days.
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/nut...-you-need.html

One last piece of advice......instead of sticking religiously to 65/30/5....start by getting at least 1gram of protein per day for every pound of Lean Body Mass.....then divide the rest of your calories into 65% fat, and 5% carbs.

[kudostojen]

BritishFighter gave some good advise, and i can't stress enough, you must count your cals. Keto is still a cals in vs. cals out diet, it's not magic. You'd be amazed how far off you can be, even with your carbs. 2-5 carbs here and there add up.

..and yes, stay away from fruit, it will take your out of ketosis or prevent you from going into ketosis as it refills your liver.

The CKD isn't a simple diet, it'll take a couple off carb ups before you really hit hte nail on the head, so to speak.

good luck and welcome to keto

[davygravyt]

Alright, I guess I'll have to start counting calories. I'm just so lazy!

I'm still a little confused on the pre/post workout stuff though, because I've always been under the impression that it's necessary to have carbs in your post-workout shake for proper protein synthesis to occur and for the creatine to be quickly absorbed. I think the same is true for the creatine in the pre-workout supplements. Is the best solution to use a Pre-workout supp with no carbs, work out, then take a shake with 30g dextrose? Isn't the post-workout shake just about pointless without the carbs?

I could be wrong. It's hard to try new things.

[BritishFighter]

Alright, I guess I'll have to start counting calories. I'm just so lazy!

I'm still a little confused on the pre/post workout stuff though, because I've always been under the impression that it's necessary to have carbs in your post-workout shake for proper protein synthesis to occur and for the creatine to be quickly absorbed. I think the same is true for the creatine in the pre-workout supplements. Is the best solution to use a Pre-workout supp with no carbs, work out, then take a shake with 30g dextrose? Isn't the post-workout shake just about pointless without the carbs?

I could be wrong. It's hard to try new things.

The protein in your PWO shake alone, will raise insulin enough to enable some protein synthesis. Protein itself enables protein synthesis because it is used as a secondary energy preference to carbs.....ironic I know. But if you really think you need some additional dex, then go for it. There's nothing to say you can't. It's not pointless without carbs though, no.

[davygravyt]

Alright. I decided to start counting, so I fired up my old fatsecret account, since I have a matching app for it on my phone I can sync it with.

Anyone care to critique it?

Breakfast
1 Caesar salad (Dole romaine mix, newman's own caesar dressing, parmesan cheese)
1 cup cottage cheese

Lunch
3 servings All Natural Uncured Beef Hot Dogs
1 serving Beef Meatballs
2 oz cheddar cheese
1 tsp yellow mustard

Dinner
3 oz cheddar cheese slices
1 serving summer sausage (2 oz)

Snacks
1 1/2 servings body fortress whey protein shake - strawberry

Daily Totals:

total calories: 2143

Fat(g) Carbs(g) Prot(g) KCals
152.50 29.91 149.55 2143

Calorie Breakdown:
Carbohydrate (6%)
Fat (64%)
Protein (30%)

I'll normally eat more green vegetables for the carbs, and probably skip the meatballs, but otherwise that is probably pretty close to what a normal day would look like, except for a PW protein shake (I'm up in the air as to whether or not I will put dextrose in it) on lifting days.

Also, is 2100 calories enough if my main objective is fat loss? I used a BMR calculator and came up with 1819.45, and then multiplied that by 1.5 (because that's what they recommended for a moderately active person), and got 2728.5, so I was thinking of aiming between 2000 and 2200 calories every day to maintain a 500+ deficit.