Anarchy & Agony - SuffolkPunch's C&P training

[SuffolkPunch]

looll! You dropped 55kg on your head!? Ouch XD

I spend my day off miscing and playing video games...and you spend your day off doing crazy volume work To each his own I guess.

Haha, no I wouldn't be here replying now if that happened - it was the empty bar...

cool to see you working the 5/3/1 in there....on the failure on top set, Wendler says he always leaves at least 2 in the tank personally...also says for people who want to go to failure, pick your battles...i.e. don't do it every week...with preference on the x3 week and the 5/3/1 week. I personally probably do it half the time, just depending on if I feel great that day since I am 80 pounds deep in a cut and don't always feel very good! I imagine you could work the heavy top sets in depending on your carb cycling...

It's certainly good stuff and I'm glad to work in some properly heavy sets. It would be cool if I work up to a situation where I am setting new PRs on 5/3/1 days every 3 weeks.

Jim probably has to leave some in the tank because his poundages are so high it would burn him out fast if he didn't. I don't have the same 'problem' so I can do it now and again although in practice, it's usually my core that limits me rather than actual failure in quads or glutes.

[SuffolkPunch]

My hybrid mass/strength program:

1: Back squat 5/3/1 + 3x10x50-60%, Military press
2: Bench, Cheat rows
3: Deadlift 5/3/1 narrow stance + 3x10x50-60% sumo, Klokov press
4: Bench, Weighted pullups
5: Front squat, Military press (15/5), Stiff leg deadlift 3x5
6: Incline bench press, Weighted pullups (10/2)
7: rest

RED = strength training: Unless otherwise stated, this is a total of 15 heavy reps with the same weight. Once I can get 4 sets of 3, I increase the weight. Otherwise, I have to finish off the 15 with doubles or singles. Note that a different progression number can be given e.g. (10/2) means 10 reps in 2 sets or less.

BLACK = hypertrophy training: Unless otherwise stated, this is 5x5. The idea is to milk every single rep of every set using a moderate tempo. If the tempo gets too fast or the weight gets too heavy, I decrease the weight for subsequent sets. Progression is when the first set gets too easy.

Accessory exercises get added as feel like it - mostly higher rep pump stuff and prehab exercises (shrugs, face pulls etc).

[SuffolkPunch]

Weight: 84.9kg -- huh? My body seems to insist on the weight gain, oh well.

Day 4 of my program:
Bench: 92.5kg: 3,3,3,2,2,2

Pullups:
3 x 5 x 13.75kg
2 x 5 x 12.5kg

Shrugs: 2 x 15 x 100kg

Incline DB curl: 2 x 13 x 13kg

[SuffolkPunch]

Weight: 84.8kg

Day 5

Front squat: 102.5kg: 3,3,3,3,2,1 -- good, increase to 105

Military press: 62.5kg: 3,3,2,2,2,2,1 -- Keep same. I think I shall only progress this lift when I can get 15/5 (ie: 15 reps in 5 sets or less)

Stiff leg deadlift: 3 x 5 x 122.5kg -- first two sets were a bit easy, increase weight (this is a hypertrophy exercise so I can drop the weight for the last set if required)

Kneeling ab crunch: Green + Red bands: 17, 15

[SuffolkPunch]

Weight: 84.4kg

Day 6

Incline bench:
2 x 5 x 60kg
3 x 5 x 57.5kg
- my body just doesn't agree with inclines... but perhaps I should work on my weakness

Pullups: +16.2kg: 5,5,5 -- increase to 17.5

Bodyweight dips: 20, 16

Poundstone curls: 45 x bar -- owww the pump, it burns, this is not like cumming at all

[SuffolkPunch]

Didn't weigh myself this morning, it was too fricken cold in the house.

Day 1...

Back squat 3x3 day:
3 x 100kg
3 x 115kg
7 x 127.5kg -- had one more. I wonder if I should increase by 5kg after my 5/3/1 day?

3 x 10 x 77.5kg

Military press:
5 x 57.5kg
5 x 57.5kg -- new weight, this really burned me out
5 x 55kg
5 x 52.5kg
5 x 50kg

Upright rows:
20 x 30kg
20 x 35kg

[SuffolkPunch]

lol, I had to post this, it's my 10 year old sons first ever workout...

Weight: 34.4kg (76lbs)

Back squat: 9kg EZ bar: 6, 6, 6 -- I was quite pleased with his form after a little coaxing

Incline bench press: 9kg: 6, 6, 5

Bent row: 9kg: 6, 7, 7 -- he found this very easy so we upped the reps a little

The squats made his legs "feel funny" and the bench press looked like it took some effort. I'm going to take it very slow and increase the reps to 3x8 before increasing the weight by a tiny amount - then going back to 3x6, a little like all pros.

[SenorSenorAbeja]

mini-Punch! That's pretty cool. You gonna have him rotate a couple exercises every few days, or something like that?

[JustBulk]

lol, I had to post this, it's my 10 year old sons first ever workout...

Weight: 34.4kg (76lbs)

Back squat: 9kg EZ bar: 6, 6, 6 -- I was quite pleased with his form after a little coaxing

Incline bench press: 9kg: 6, 6, 5

Bent row: 9kg: 6, 7, 7 -- he found this very easy so we upped the reps a little

The squats made his legs "feel funny" and the bench press looked like it took some effort. I'm going to take it very slow and increase the reps to 3x8 before increasing the weight by a tiny amount - then going back to 3x6, a little like all pros.

Cool as fuk.

I always wish I started lifting earlier and have made a pact with my future son (I'm not even married at the moment, lol) that I will introduce him to lifting. Not sure if it would be as young as 10 tho (not saying it is bad tho).

[SuffolkPunch]

mini-Punch! That's pretty cool. You gonna have him rotate a couple exercises every few days, or something like that?

I think we'll stick with just those 3 for now... when he can squat the bar, I might let him deadlift

What's with the name change? Is that MrMrBill in Spanish?

Cool as fuk.

I always wish I started lifting earlier and have made a pact with my future son (I'm not even married at the moment, lol) that I will introduce him to lifting. Not sure if it would be as young as 10 tho (not saying it is bad tho).

Yeah, I wish I started early too - I did do some machine work when I was 18 but had no real plan and no good advice (no internet back then!).

Todays:

Weight 84.4kg

Deadlift 5/3/1
5 x 140
3 x 157.5
2 x 175kg -- first rep was good, second was with round back

3 x 10 x 100kg sumo

Klokov press
2 x 57.5
2 x 57.5 -- just kept refusing to budge. Maybe DL took something out of me
1 x 57.5
5 x 50
5 x 50

[Saintsqc]

lol, I had to post this, it's my 10 year old sons first ever workout...

Weight: 34.4kg (76lbs)

Back squat: 9kg EZ bar: 6, 6, 6 -- I was quite pleased with his form after a little coaxing

Incline bench press: 9kg: 6, 6, 5

Bent row: 9kg: 6, 7, 7 -- he found this very easy so we upped the reps a little

The squats made his legs "feel funny" and the bench press looked like it took some effort. I'm going to take it very slow and increase the reps to 3x8 before increasing the weight by a tiny amount - then going back to 3x6, a little like all pros.

Niiiiiiice! Haha I love that!

I loled @ legs feel funny Little kinesiolog tips : form and speed is really important at this age. His CNS is developping at high speed and he can make great speed improvement and if his form is good right at the beginning, it will benefit him in the long term.

[SuffolkPunch]

Niiiiiiice! Haha I love that!

I loled @ legs feel funny Little kinesiolog tips : form and speed is really important at this age. His CNS is developping at high speed and he can make great speed improvement and if his form is good right at the beginning, it will benefit him in the long term.

Good point. He plays football so I might throw in some jump squats and hang cleans after a while.

We had another session today and put up more reps. He had a little bit of DOMS from the last session. He noted that his second set of squats was easier than the first because his foot positioning was wrong in the first. Baby steps... add 1-2kg a week and see how long we can keep that going...

He also did 5 chinups with the assistance from a band...

[SuffolkPunch]

Front Squat: 105kg: 3,2,2,2,2,1,1,1,1 - pretty intense

Military press: 62.5kg: 3,3,3,3,2,1 -- good progress from last week. Need 5x3 to progress

Stiff leg deadlift: 5x125kg, 2x5x122.5kg

[BeleiveTheHype]

I"m exciting to try this workout plan seems pretty legit. I'm at a solid 181 and trying to get to 215 and then cut back down to 200 for a more solid ripped look anyone have any good recommendations on here?

[SuffolkPunch]

I"m exciting to try this workout plan seems pretty legit. I'm at a solid 181 and trying to get to 215 and then cut back down to 200 for a more solid ripped look anyone have any good recommendations on here?

You are welcome to try it as long as your realise it's experimental, not time proven by a lot of different people. Still, like any routine if you work hard it will never be a waste of time.

Weight: 84.4kg

Back squat 5/3/1:
5 x 107.5kg
3 x 120kg
4 x 135kg -- May have been able to grind out one more. First 3 perfect form.
-- I am pleased with how this is going and am only going to increase by 2.5kg. I am going to take as long as possible before I start hitting true 1RMs on 5/3/1 day... SOMETHING is working very well on back squat and the limiting factor (my weak core) is being swept aside. I put this down to front squats and maybe the high rep BBB (on both squat and dead) stuff too.

3 x 10 x 77.5kg -- tedious but toned

Military press:
5 x 57.5kg
5 x 57.5kg
5 x 55kg
5 x 52.5kg
5 x 50kg
-- Tough, not sure performance was any better than last week but it's all about making it tough for yourself for every rep which I did. First set was definitely deliberately slow tempo.

Band pull throughs: 20 x Green (doubled) -- felt dizzy after this so called it a day.

[SuffolkPunch]

Weight: 84.5 - I am eating more and more. Seems my maintenance is rising.

Bench press: 92.5kg: 3, 3, 3, 3, 2, 1 -- good. 95kg up next

Pullups:
5 x 15kg
5 x 13.75kg
5 x 12.5kg
5 x 11.25kg
5 x 10kg
-- actually a lower weight than last time but I am slowing the tempo

Shrugs: *** felt twinge in my neck. That will teach me for neglecting to do this often enough. Will try again with lighter weights later today.

[auntAuntieBea]

yeah... well... what about Mini-Punch? You should get 'im on a journal here, bro'!

[acrawlingchaos]

Catching up in here. See you changed up the routine. Weights climbing nicely and cool to see you getting your kid into it!

[SuffolkPunch]

yeah... well... what about Mini-Punch? You should get 'im on a journal here, bro'!

He's only had two workouts so far, it's hard to find time since he plays sports a lot of the time. Will definitely find time and keep it moving - I'll see to that...!

Catching up in here. See you changed up the routine. Weights climbing nicely and cool to see you getting your kid into it!

Thanks man.

Unfortunately my neck/trap was very uncomfortable last night. I am planning to throw in a temporary upper body plan which will start with high reps for a while. It'll go like this:

Bench, military and chin ups 3x a week per exercise... 3 sets of AMRAP (1 rep shy of failure). Starting with low weights (approx 60% 1RM) and increasing every session by 2.5kg.

Starting weights:
Bench: 70kg
Military: 40kg
Pullups: +5kg

This will last 2-3 weeks and then I'll go back to my previous routine. Lower body routine will remain the same.

I'm also making shrugs mandatory twice a week...

[SuffolkPunch]

Weight: 85kg - bit bloated, slept badly

Front squat: 100kg: 5,4,3,2,1

Military press: 40kg: 16,10,9 -- lol @ dropoff in second set, really felt the pump + burn

Stiff leg deadlift: 2x5x125kg 1x5x122.5kg

Light shrugs, facepulls. Neck is feeling OK today and was not aggravated by military pressing. I think I'm going to like this 3xAMRAP method, it will work a little like Smolov junior but with more of a mass slant and shouldn't burn me out with 3x frequency I hope.

[SuffolkPunch]

Weight: 85kg

Bench press: 70kg: 15, 10, 8

Pullups: +5kg: 16, 10, 9

Kneeling ab crunches...

dat pump

[SuffolkPunch]

My hybrid mass/strength program:
Update... the program before was eventually leading to connective tissue problems in my shoulders so I have decided to periodise the reps for upperbody:

1: Back squat 5/3/1 + 3x10x50-60%, Military press
2: Bench, Weighted pullups, Shrugs 2x15
3: Deadlift 5/3/1 narrow stance + 3x10x50-60% sumo, Military press
4: Bench, Weighted pullups
5: Front squat (15:12/4), Military press, Stiff leg deadlift 3x5
6: Bench, Weighted pullups, Shrugs 2x15
7: rest

Lower body:
(15:12/4) means: total of 15 reps as heavy as possible with the same weight. Progress when 12 reps achieved in 4 sets.
Back squat and deadlift use Wendlers 5/3/1, assistance is like Boring But Big except I only do 3 sets since I have the extra work on day 5

Upper body cycle:
This is a coordinated cycle designed to start with high reps and end with low reps similar to HST

Each main exercise (bench, military, chin) performed 3x a week
- Starts with 60-65% of 1RM (>= 15 reps in the first set)
- Minimum of 3 sets per exercise
- Minimum of 15 reps total per exercise – add sets if required
- Each set AMRAP (as many reps as possible) – to first grinding rep
- Each exercise weight is incremented every workout
- End cycle and reset when all first sets <= 5 reps
- Once an exercise reaches 5 reps, I'll freeze the weight whilst waiting for the other exercises to catch up
- Choose starting weights and increments so all main exercises reach this point at about the same time

I shall calculate rep max with lowest rep set at end of cycle to check progress.

Some possible modifications: (bench/military/chin are still the 'main' exercises which determine when the cycle ends)
2x chin (+2.5) + 1x row (+5)
2x military (+2.5) + 1x Klokov (start higher +2.5)
2x bench (+2.5), 1x incline or dips (+5)
I'l use these to balance the workout so they end at about the same time. Also I don't want ultra low reps with chins or high reps with Klokovs.


Accessory exercises get added as feel like it - mostly higher rep pump stuff and prehab exercises (band pull throughs, face pulls etc).

Deloads: Since 5/3/1 and my HST style protocol run in cycles of about 3 weeks, I can coordinate them and if necessary, can do a deload at the end... I still have not experienced the need to deload whilst in a caloric surplus however.

[auntAuntieBea]

Shoulder probs suck. Row volume and other horiz. pulls (for me) has been the most reliable fix.

[JustBulk]

I often see you giving others advice in the forums, so I thought I would just swing by and wish you all the best.

[Miketoc]

Shoulder probs suck.

^Yes they do.

I often see you giving others advice in the forums, so I thought I would just swing by and wish you all the best.

I came by to wish you all the worst!!

Also my dog is stinking up the room with his farts.

[Saintsqc]

I really like how you plan your upper body progression. Did you think this out yourself?


You seem to enjoy working out 6-7x a week. May I ask you why? Wouldnt be easier for your body to reduce the frequency and increase cardio/rehab/flexiblity days?

[SuffolkPunch]

I came by to wish you all the worst!!

Also my dog is stinking up the room with his farts.

If the worst happens, I'll know who to blame. I will send a flatulent dog back in time to exact my revenge.

I really like how you plan your upper body progression. Did you think this out yourself?


You seem to enjoy working out 6-7x a week. May I ask you why? Wouldnt be easier for your body to reduce the frequency and increase cardio/rehab/flexiblity days?

The total workload is actually about the same as JasonDB's 5x5 workout. I just split each FBW day into two. Obviously the result is not exactly the same since I'm hitting only two major lifts with the benefit of being much fresher each time. And connective tissue gets no rest hence the problems I've had.

I PM'd Jason about it and he predicted that it could become a problem. I got the reps idea from HST which has a high rep phase to counteract the later phase where you do heavy negatives.

[SuffolkPunch]

5/3/1 back squat: 5 rep day
5 x 95kg
5 x 110kg
8 x 125kg -- not bad although I rushed the set a bit and my core wasn't tight

3 x 10 x 80kg -- jelly legs = good

Military press: 42.5kg: 16, 7, 6
-- Totally overcooked the first set. Should have stopped at 14 or 15 then would have got 9s or 10s in the next two sets.

Band pullthrough: 2 x 15 x Green (doubled up)

[Saintsqc]

The total workload is actually about the same as JasonDB's 5x5 workout. I just split each FBW day into two. Obviously the result is not exactly the same since I'm hitting only two major lifts with the benefit of being much fresher each time. And connective tissue gets no rest hence the problems I've had.

I PM'd Jason about it and he predicted that it could become a problem. I got the reps idea from HST which has a high rep phase to counteract the later phase where you do heavy negatives.

You also never let the possibility to your CNS to rest and recover. Anyway, you've been doing that for a long and you probably are well adapted.

The modification from HST is smart IMO. It's simple and more intense than HST.

5/3/1 back squat: 5 rep day
5 x 95kg
5 x 110kg
8 x 125kg -- not bad although I rushed the set a bit and my core wasn't tight

3 x 10 x 80kg -- jelly legs = good

Military press: 42.5kg: 16, 7, 6
-- Totally overcooked the first set. Should have stopped at 14 or 15 then would have got 9s or 10s in the next two sets.

Band pullthrough: 2 x 15 x Green (doubled up)

Good work out!

[SuffolkPunch]

Weight 84.4kg

Bench press: 72.5kg: 14, 10, 10

Pullup: 7.5kg: 14,11,8

Much better control over the first set this time... could have got 14,10,10 in pullups as 11 in the 2nd was too much

My joints are feeling pretty good, don't even feel the need to shrug or do any accessories at this point in the program. I'm thinking about how to work Klokovs into the next cycle. I might go from 12 reps to 3 reps with these instead of 15->5