Questions on factors effecting water balance

[AustrianOakJr]

Just out of curiosity on how things work, I have a couple questions. Once carbohydrates are seated in the muscle with the water that accompanies it, what factors influence whether or not it stays there? Asuming glycogen isnt used for energy, can the water come out of the muscle? For instance, if you were loaded and dry and calories came up to maintenance (so you arent using glycogen) and you cut your water intake at that point, what could cause water to leak out of the muscle into the insterstitial space? In other words.....once its seated, can it become unseated? If water cannot escape the muscle unless glycogen is used, can water come from elsewhere to blur muscle definition?

[Whomper107]

Originally Posted by AustrianOakJr

Just out of curiosity on how things work, I have a couple questions. Once carbohydrates are seated in the muscle with the water that accompanies it, what factors influence whether or not it stays there? Asuming glycogen isnt used for energy, can the water come out of the muscle? For instance, if you were loaded and dry and calories came up to maintenance (so you arent using glycogen) and you cut your water intake at that point, what could cause water to leak out of the muscle into the insterstitial space? In other words.....once its seated, can it become unseated? If water cannot escape the muscle unless glycogen is used, can water come from elsewhere to blur muscle definition?

I don't have an answer... but I'm curious as well, so I'll give this a bump.

[J_Bo]

Originally Posted by Whomper107

I don't have an answer... but I'm curious as well, so I'll give this a bump.

Mos' def

Layne Norton

[AustrianOakJr]

No one on this? For instance....can a diaretic pull water from within the muscle once its loaded? What factors can pull water from within the muscle?

[stayfit2008]

Originally Posted by AustrianOakJr

No one on this? For instance....can a diaretic pull water from within the muscle once its loaded? What factors can pull water from within the muscle?

Sean,..I'm not sure how it worked for me but my protocal for peak Week Theo prepared for me was a full 180 from what I was used to. It also is very different from Tommy's and Laynes and probably most everyone esle who uses those methods. Theo did explain it to me where cells are super saturated with carbs then SLOW introduction of water absorbs witht hese super saturated cells for some incredible skin tearing fullness! Just drinking 20oz of water within a three hour time frame before prejudging left me feeling super pumped and shredded.

This is what I can compare it to:

Last April NPC original Peak Week protocal I weighed in a t 165lbs. Dry to the bone, shredded but flat

2 weeks prior to this comp. I did the NPC Natural as a warm up show, Old protocal I weighed in at 166lbs. soft and not nearly as dry and flat

Buffalo Olympus, I didn't want to come in flat anymore,..so NEW Protocal, weighed in at 171lbs. at my dryest, Full muscle bellies, andsuper pumped. This was achieved through Scooby's Cell Absorption approach.

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by stayfit2008

It also is very different from Tommy's and Laynes and probably most everyone esle who uses those methods.

Chris, not to sound like a jerk, but please don't pretend to know what my protocols involve since you and I have never worked together. My methods vary per individual, as should any trainer's protocols who understands what they are doing. If you are going to drop my name like this assuming you know what all my protocols involve, then you should have at least worked with me and know what you are talking about.

Originally Posted by stayfit2008

Theo did explain it to me where cells are super saturated with carbs then SLOW introduction of water absorbs witht hese super saturated cells for some incredible skin tearing fullness! Just drinking 20oz of water within a three hour time frame before prejudging left me feeling super pumped and shredded.

Fluid balance combined with carb-loading is more complex than that. Sean, I will call you tonight with a full detailed explaination of the many variables that are involved and how this all works. You'll then see why it's so important to pay close attention to how you respond to one method and then adjust certain ways depending on how your body reacted. If you understand the science, making the small adjustments becomes rather easy.

Sporto

[AustrianOakJr]

Originally Posted by Sporto1633

If you understand the science, making the small adjustments becomes rather easy.

Sporto

Precisely why I want to further understand the science..... Not that I dont trust what you say, but only for the reason that I want to understand WHY I do what I do.

[stayfit2008]

Originally Posted by Sporto1633

Chris, not to sound like a jerk, but please don't pretend to know what my protocols involve since you and I have never worked together. My methods vary per individual, as should any trainer's protocols who understands what they are doing. If you are going to drop my name like this assuming you know what all my protocols involve, then you should have at least worked with me and know what you are talking about.

No doubt, each individual is case specific,..I was going on what others post or talk about concerning your protocal,...again,..not nearly enuff information for me to have made an assumption like that,..especially taking in cionsideration the different physiques/conditioning and diet someone may have done prior to Peak Week performance.

Maybe what I could ahve stated was the approach I did was very different from some you one may find as far as water/carbs and sodium manipulation. Agian case specific, Consider the assumption retracted.

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by stayfit2008

No doubt, each individual is case specific,..I was going on what others post or talk about concerning your protocal,...again,..not nearly enuff information for me to have made an assumption like that,..especially taking in cionsideration the different physiques/conditioning and diet someone may have done prior to Peak Week performance.

Maybe what I could ahve stated was the approach I did was very different from some you one may find as far as water/carbs and sodium manipulation. Agian case specific, Consider the assumption retracted.

I just found it interesting that you had both pigeon-holed me with Layne AND assumed that my protocols are so very different from what you had bought at the last minute from Jason, even though you hadn't been working with him up to that point. Jason and I have very similar approaches because they are based off of fundamentals of science. I do have some clients taper water among other things, just so you know, but it mostly depends on what approach(es) they have been using up to that point.

Originally Posted by AustrianOakJr

Precisely why I want to further understand the science..... Not that I dont trust what you say, but only for the reason that I want to understand WHY I do what I do.

You were right, something had come up, but we will talk tonight for sure! But a general answer for those looking at this thread:

The main variable that we have control over that influences whether the water sits inside or outside the cell is the electrolyte balance/difference.

You also have to consider that there are other tissues holding water, not just the glycogen in muscle - which makes this a vastly complex subject and why I bolded the part about variables that we have control over. Anything beyond that is moot and a crapshoot anyway

Sporto