Theists, what do you dislike most about atheism?

Duckenheimer · 10-04-2009, 06:17 PM

The actual stance.

(ie NOT the people who hold it!)

(Serious thread for theists for a proper mirror image to Harbingers thread, please keep things respectful)

DaCougarMech · 10-04-2009, 06:32 PM

might as well pimp this thread since hybridfart's thread was deleted

Levrone147 · 10-04-2009, 06:33 PM

nothing against, they can believe whatever they want...but they're way of debating is just to insult religion.

kingtego · 10-04-2009, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levrone147

nothing against, they can believe whatever they want...but they're way of debating is just to insult religion.

Strong generalizations.

99% of the time if you see an atheist who comes across as insulting, it is because he has been in 'debates' with theists before, and realized that theists cannot be reasoned with.

Melkor · 10-04-2009, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duckenheimer

The actual stance.

(Serious thread for theists for a proper mirror image to Harbingers thread, please keep things respectful)

I can actually understand the atheist mindset. If I wasn't Mormon I am pretty sure I would be atheist, or an Odinist just for the lulz. I do have a problem when atheism creates arrogance, which I've noticed can be an unfortunate side-effect. Some atheists seem to think along the lines of "I have discovered the truth, these people have not, therefore I am > than these people", which is a) based on the assumption that atheism is true and b) not true even if it is.

Anyway, on average I like almost every atheist on this board, other than just those who show no other part of their personality than JUST the above noted side-effect.

Weightaholic · 10-04-2009, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melkor

I can actually understand the atheist mindset. If I wasn't Mormon I am pretty sure I would be atheist, or an Odinist just for the lulz. I do have a problem when atheism creates arrogance, which I've noticed can be an unfortunate side-effect. Some atheists seem to think along the lines of "I have discovered the truth, these people have not, therefore I am > than these people", which is a) based on the assumption that atheism is true and b) not true even if it is.

Anyway, on average I like almost every atheist on this board, other than just those who show no other part of their personality than JUST the above noted side-effect.

Lets not forget the flip side of that. The smug arrogant theist, who is of the opinion that everyone else is wrong, he's right, everyone else is going to hell, and so merely interjects with smug comments.

Melkor · 10-04-2009, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weightaholic

Lets not forget the flip side of that. The smug arrogant theist, who is of the opinion that everyone else is wrong, he's right, everyone's going to hell, and so merely interjects with smug comments.

Absolutely. I have an easier time with most atheists than with fundies, because at least atheists can be swayed by logic and rationality where fundies have a force field. I'd much rather have a discussion with even an angry atheist (within reason) than a fundie.

SpiderSense · 10-04-2009, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levrone147

nothing against, they can believe whatever they want...but they're way of debating is just to insult religion.

Exactly.

I don't care what people believe, I only care when they insult what I believe.

Then they're natural response to that is blah blah blah door to door as if BBC was made up of nothing but door to door Jehova's witness.

Personally I'm not one of those Christians who is out trying to "save" people.

I mind my own business, and I'd love if others did exactly the same.

SpiderSense · 10-04-2009, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingtego

Strong generalizations.

99% of the time if you see an atheist who comes across as insulting, it is because he has been in 'debates' with theists before, and realized that theists cannot be reasoned with.

Maybe theists don't care about your reasoning?

I mean you guys sit here and try and disprove my religion and I'm supposed to sit there and agree with you or not be offended by you attacking things that I believe in?

I don't even understand the point of discussing it, I believe what I do, you believe what yo do.

That's pretty much it.

Mr Beer · 10-04-2009, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melkor

Absolutely. I have an easier time with most atheists than with fundies, because at least atheists can be swayed by logic and rationality where fundies have a force field. I'd much rather have a discussion with even an angry atheist (within reason) than a fundie.

You are close to the Dark Side young padawan...feel the hate...

SpiderSense · 10-04-2009, 09:05 PM

I mean go look at the opposite thread and see how misinformed and insulting it it.

One of the first posts "theism is faith and that's a weakness I have no interest in".

Something along those lines.

Not insulting at all?

Or if I say something like "I'd like to thank God for..."

But I shouldn't because it bothers some atheists?

Who gives a ****???

And if I say "purple monkey dishwasher" would that also bother you?

Bahai.Lifter · 10-04-2009, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duckenheimer

The actual stance.

(Serious thread for theists for a proper mirror image to Harbingers thread, please keep things respectful)

I don't blame them in some ways. There undoubtedly is much hypocrisy and other problems in the world coming from people who affiliate themselves with certain religions. But as an independent investigator of truth, if one closes his mind to the possibility of God, that isn't beneficial either. Surely, if he keeps an open mind, and if he prays sincerely for God to lead him the truth, he will eventually arrive at it. There definitely are many open-minded atheists/agnostics who are on the way to arriving at the truth. Open-mindedness is key, but attachments hinder a seeker from attaining his goal. For example, strong love or attachment to ideas will mislead a seeker, just as much as strong hatred will. We should let go of our emotions, biases, preconceived notions, and sincerely pray to God to guide us; and we should also put in the effort ourselves of investigating religions and seeing if we can find the Religion of God for today.

Duckenheimer · 10-04-2009, 09:17 PM

Some off topic responses here... Nothing wrong with it happening a bit but this looks like getting completely sidetracked so keep in mind that this thread is not about what you dislike most about atheists. It is about what you dislike about the stance of atheism.

jackal337 · 10-04-2009, 09:22 PM

I find it frustrating that many atheists seem to be oblivious to the fact that they are moral nihilists. They walk around living their lives as though they have a reason to.

Then these amoralists have the gall to profess the immorality of faith!

Weightaholic · 10-04-2009, 09:26 PM

Melkor, see what I mean?

Even though jackal's not a theist, this is a fairly typical response.

Karcist · 10-04-2009, 09:34 PM

How inflammatory most followers are. How most demand respect yet show none except to eachother.

Duckenheimer · 10-04-2009, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karcist

How inflammatory most are. How most demand respect yet show none except to eachother.

Care to make an on topic post?

Karcist · 10-04-2009, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duckenheimer

Care to make an on topic post?

My bad, edited.

An hero · 10-04-2009, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karcist

How inflammatory most followers are. How most demand respect yet show none except to eachother.

Are you referring to christians and muslims?

Blindead · 10-04-2009, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jackal337

I find it frustrating that many atheists seem to be oblivious to the fact that they are moral nihilists. They walk around living their lives as though they have a reason to.

Then these amoralists have the gall to profess the immorality of faith!

Do you even know what nihilism is? This is something I'd expect from someone who learned philosophy from their 9th grade history teacher at a catholic school.

VTheKing · 10-04-2009, 10:04 PM

How can I dislike a lack of belief - which is not really a "belief" itself?

Now, I do seesome issues with how some atheists behave... but the same applies to some theists as well. Heh.

jackal337 · 10-04-2009, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blindead

Do you even know what nihilism is? This is something I'd expect from someone who learned philosophy from their 9th grade history teacher at a catholic school.

Yes I know what nihilism is. No I never went to Catholic school.

Blindead · 10-04-2009, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jackal337

Yes I know what nihilism is. No I never went to Catholic school.

So your stance is that anyone who does not derive their morals from a God is in a state of believing in no morals, yes? You are speakong moral nihilism I hope, and not existential nihilism, because that would make no sense in this context. And you're also operating under the preconceived notion that all atheists are existential nihilists, yes?

Duckenheimer · 10-04-2009, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karcist

My bad, edited.

Still off topic... adding in the word "followers" didn't change anything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karcist

How inflammatory most followers are. How most demand respect yet show none except to eachother.

"The actual stance. (ie NOT the people who hold it!)"

Looks like I'll be deleting this thread, unless a couple of on topic responses start showing up in the next half hour. I guess I failed in this one.

Blindead · 10-04-2009, 10:12 PM

Don't delete it...that's pointless.

Pay_Me · 10-04-2009, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duckenheimer

Still off topic... adding in the word "followers" didn't change anything.

"The actual stance. (ie NOT the people who hold it!)"

Looks like I'll be deleting this thread, unless a couple of on topic responses start showing up in the next half hour. I guess I failed in this one.

Mine as well delete.

All of the threads end the same way. Every fundie of both sides, "proved" how they are right.

I think order goes Religion in stubborness, then Politics, followed by Money.

jackal337 · 10-05-2009, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blindead

So your stance is that anyone who does not derive their morals from a God is in a state of believing in no morals, yes? You are speakong moral nihilism I hope, and not existential nihilism, because that would make no sense in this context. And you're also operating under the preconceived notion that all atheists are existential nihilists, yes?

I never said all atheists are moral nihilists, I said many of them are. This is just in my experience. My complaint is that they claim they are moral, but that morals are subjective. I believe that subjective morality is no morality at all.

As far as existential nihilism, no I don't think all atheists believe that life has no value. Obviously that is not the case. I was just suggesting that they have no reason to believe otherwise... even if they do.

I like to think of myself as a fairly objective person. This is what led me to embrace atheism. However, the same objective thinking that annihilates all gods also annihilates all true morals. Most atheists don't seem to realize this, or if they do, it doesn't bother them. Well having no objective morality bothers me, and herein lies my frustration: I feel a distance from most atheists.

Queequeg · 10-05-2009, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duckenheimer

The actual stance.

(ie NOT the people who hold it!)

(Serious thread for theists for a proper mirror image to Harbingers thread, please keep things respectful)

Saying you have a problem with athiesm is essentially saying you disagree with it because.....

Saying you have a problem with athiests is like saying I have a problem with people how don't eat bread.

I do not object to atheism in the same why I do not object to theism, but one appears more likely to me.

If I was objecting to theists or athiests I would actually be objecting to a select number of theists or athiests I have had experience with

freshgrease · 10-05-2009, 01:42 PM

I don't really care to argue or fight against atheists. Everyone has their right to decide for themselves what they believe in. I just don't like it when people just out of the blue start a **** flinging storm on either side of the issue. As a Baptist, I see a lot of fellow Christians that do nothing but bring guilt to these people. I also get accosted on the street should I be carrying a Bible (at my college campus for example.)

Cliffs - don't be an extremeist on either side. Don't force your beliefs. ETC.

rockyl686 · 10-05-2009, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melkor

I can actually understand the atheist mindset. If I wasn't Mormon I am pretty sure I would be atheist, or an Odinist just for the lulz. I do have a problem when atheism creates arrogance, which I've noticed can be an unfortunate side-effect. Some atheists seem to think along the lines of "I have discovered the truth, these people have not, therefore I am > than these people", which is a) based on the assumption that atheism is true and b) not true even if it is.

Anyway, on average I like almost every atheist on this board, other than just those who show no other part of their personality than JUST the above noted side-effect.

pretty much how I feel about it, although I will say that after spending so much time around, the atheists here, the good ones anyway, that I am starting to develop a greater understanding of their philosophy and at the same time a greater distance than the philosophy I knew for so long, maybe one day they will win me over, however, they won't do it with the I'm smarter than you because I don't believe in God argument.