Lactic acid pain, any tips?

[seanybabe1986]

Just switched up my routine to include drop sets and compound sets, someone mentioned to me about lactic acid pain, and I seem to be getting this on my combined sets, is there any supps to help with it?
Or wat to u do to combat it, I don't wanna stop mixing up sets with some compound and drop sets and some just straight sets, but this mad burn pain is limiting my second set of them. Any idea? Cheers guize

[seanybabe1986]

Also is it deffo lactic acid build up causing the pain, it's much worse on compound and drop sets and feels like ive reached complete failure and a slight burning sensation

[in10city]

Actually it's not lactic acid causing the pain. Lactic acid disassociates to lacate and H+ in the blood. It's the pH drop from the H+ that is the primary cause.

You've got to keep training your body to deal with it or go the supplemental route.

[Antz1980]

Actually it's not lactic acid causing the pain. Lactic acid disassociates to lacate and H+ in the blood. It's the pH drop from the H+ that is the primary cause.

You've got to keep training your body to deal with it or go the supplemental route.

Whats H+ ???

[seanybabe1986]

Actually it's not lactic acid causing the pain. Lactic acid disassociates to lacate and H+ in the blood. It's the pH drop from the H+ that is the primary cause.

You've got to keep training your body to deal with it or go the supplemental route.

Cheers mate, whats h+ and also wat would u suggest supplement wise, so u say it's not lactic acid, do u think it's the muscle reaching intense failure as I said mostly 2 sets for the same muscle back to back causes the biggest burn and pain, kinds feels good but it's a real barrier I have to get past when I do 10 reps on the second set, I can describe it by saying after the second set I couldn't even lift 20% of my 1rm cos of the pain and fatigue, kinds good

[in10city]

Whats H+ ???

Hydrogen ion / proton.

[crackyflipside]

Contrast shower: do hot water for a few minutes then switch to as cold as you can go for a few minutes, do for a few cycles of hot and cold and end on cold.

Descending shower: start hot and slowly make it colder.

Massage: for quads you can use your elbows while sitting down. You can also just shake your muscles during rests between sets.

[seanybabe1986]

Contrast shower: do hot water for a few minutes then switch to as cold as you can go for a few minutes, do for a few cycles of hot and cold and end on cold.

Descending shower: start hot and slowly make it colder.

Massage: for quads you can use your elbows while sitting down. You can also just shake your muscles during rests between sets.

Cheers, I'll try the shaking muscles but it's during the sets I get the pain and that, it doesn't effect me afterwards, also cheers I'll check out the hydrogen thing unless anyone could quickly. Explain it thanks

[sirbobmontgomery]

If this is something happening during your workout where you get lightheaded, stomach hurts, a feeling of needing to vomit then it's lactic acid.

For that, lay down on your back, put your legs and feet straight up in the air. This allows the blood flow from your legs to circulate and helps with the lactic acid that's accumulated in the stomach.

Otherwise, producing lactic acid isn't necessarily a bad thing, it makes you feel like **** but it puts you in an anaerobic state in which your body uses strictly glucose and glycogen for it's energy source.

[seanybabe1986]

If this is something happening during your workout where you get lightheaded, stomach hurts, a feeling of needing to vomit then it's lactic acid.

For that, lay down on your back, put your legs and feet straight up in the air. This allows the blood flow from your legs to circulate and helps with the lactic acid that's accumulated in the stomach.

Otherwise, producing lactic acid isn't necessarily a bad thing, it makes you feel like **** but it puts you in an anaerobic state in which your body uses strictly glucose and glycogen for it's energy source.

Thanks for ur help atm, it's just intense pain in the muscle trying to squeeze out the second set of the compound set, can't say I have any of the above symptoms although huge amounts of sweat with this type of training, but I believe that's due to a constanly high heart rate cos of the compound sets, so do u think it's just extreme failure, once again thanks for ur input

[sirbobmontgomery]

It could be a whole mess of things.

Honestly, my advice is if it hurts, don't do it. There's definitely some other kind of routine you can do to gain a great benefit from that won't cause pain.

[seanybabe1986]

It could be a whole mess of things.

Honestly, my advice is if it hurts, don't do it. There's definitely some other kind of routine you can do to gain a great benefit from that won't cause pain.

Yea man, well I just changed from doin straight sets of 6-8 and now I'm doin compound and supersets of 10-12 reps so over a compound sets it usually worksout over the set together 20 reps 10 on each excercise so I'm thinking the change of volume is causing this, I really wanna stick with this hypertrophy specific idea of drop and compound sets,

Do u think people get used to or tolerant of what i'm talking about?
Thanks again

[gonna_be_big]

Actually it's not lactic acid causing the pain. Lactic acid disassociates to lacate and H+ in the blood. It's the pH drop from the H+ that is the primary cause.

You've got to keep training your body to deal with it or go the supplemental route.

so in the end isnt it still lactic acid building up that is the problem?? less lactic acid buildup = less H+ causing less burn in the muscle?

hey OP i been doing a bit of reading and i think a routine that you might be interested in that is a bit higher volume could be FST-7.

the last exercise of each muscle group is an isolation that you perform 7 sets of with only 30 seconds break inbetween... it has a lot of people that do it with great results.

[seanybabe1986]

so in the end isnt it still lactic acid building up that is the problem?? less lactic acid buildup = less H+ causing less burn in the muscle?

hey OP i been doing a bit of reading and i think a routine that you might be interested in that is a bit higher volume could be FST-7.

the last exercise of each muscle group is an isolation that you perform 7 sets of with only 30 seconds break inbetween... it has a lot of people that do it with great results.

Cheers dude appreciated that, I'll have a look in a min so what it's kind of straight sets then a burn out on the last excercise for that muscle, still confused regarding this possible lactic acid, btw if I cud rep u I would bro

[gonna_be_big]

Cheers dude appreciated that, I'll have a look in a min so what it's kind of straight sets then a burn out on the last excercise for that muscle, still confused regarding this possible lactic acid, btw if I cud rep u I would bro

yeh me too... in10city is a real smart guy so i know when he comes back on he could probably give you the whole lowdown...

from what he said its not lactic acid buildup (to a large degree) because that makes you wanna puke... anyone who has done sprinting/long distance running knows what this feels like :P but it could be that the larger amount of lactid acid causes more h+ to be released into the bloodstream (going from in10city's post) and causing that burning sensation.

yeh its basically like you do your normal 12 - 16 sets per muscle group then for the last exercise you do 7 sets x 15 reps with 30 - 45 seconds break inbetween.

the theory is that it causes a huge muscle pump and stretches the muscle fascia so your muscles can grow bigger, easier. i think im gonna incorporate this into my HIT routine.. so do my low volume - high intensity sets first then the 7 set burnout at the end.

if u have time look up www.fst-7.com and look on the forums, it even has a sample routine.

i saw this thread and i figured after our convo that you liked the huge pump of the compounds, so this routine might be what your looking for!

[Ironlife]

light massage and light jogging.

[seanybabe1986]

yeh me too... in10city is a real smart guy so i know when he comes back on he could probably give you the whole lowdown...

from what he said its not lactic acid buildup (to a large degree) because that makes you wanna puke... anyone who has done sprinting/long distance running knows what this feels like :P but it could be that the larger amount of lactid acid causes more h+ to be released into the bloodstream (going from in10city's post) and causing that burning sensation.

yeh its basically like you do your normal 12 - 16 sets per muscle group then for the last exercise you do 7 sets x 15 reps with 30 - 45 seconds break inbetween.

the theory is that it causes a huge muscle pump and stretches the muscle fascia so your muscles can grow bigger, easier. i think im gonna incorporate this into my HIT routine.. so do my low volume - high intensity sets first then the 7 set burnout at the end.

if u have time look up www.fst-7.com and look on the forums, it even has a

sample routine.


i saw this thread and i figured after our convo that you liked the huge pump of the compounds, so this routine might be what your looking for!

Yea lol was just checking that out, looks interesting, especially since some big pros have used the style, I may well change to this, so it's kind of saying the last sets stretch to allow the muscle to grow in to that u have gained from the heavy sets if that makes sense, god knows wat the lactic pain would be like after 7 intense sets lol

[gonna_be_big]

Yea lol was just checking that out, looks interesting, especially since some big pros have used the style, I may well change to this, so it's kind of saying the last sets stretch to allow the muscle to grow in to that u have gained from the heavy sets if that makes sense, god knows wat the lactic pain would be like after 7 intense sets lol

if you read through the forum 70 - 80% of them vomit after most leg sessions :P

so im guessing pretty insane. i would def use creatine and beta-alanine while doing this style of training

[in10city]

so in the end isnt it still lactic acid building up that is the problem?? less lactic acid buildup = less H+ causing less burn in the muscle?

hey OP i been doing a bit of reading and i think a routine that you might be interested in that is a bit higher volume could be FST-7.

the last exercise of each muscle group is an isolation that you perform 7 sets of with only 30 seconds break inbetween... it has a lot of people that do it with great results.

The accumulation of H+, an imbalance between the rate of H+ release and the rate of H+ buffering and removal, is the root of the problem. H+ is formed from ATP hydrolysis and glycolysis, among other potential sources. Lactic acid doesn't build up per se because it would disassociate to lactate and H+ in the blood. Lactate is produced. And lactate is recycled and is used for energy and has been theorized to assist in the consumption and removal process of H+.

Many people misuse the terms lactic acid and its conjugate base lactate interchangably - which really isn't correct. I find myself doing it too sometimes lol Believe it or not, researchers are still arguing about the biochem behind this metabolic acidosis.

[seanybabe1986]

The accumulation of H+, an imbalance between the rate of H+ release and the rate of H+ buffering and removal, is the root of the problem. H+ is formed from ATP hydrolysis and glycolysis, among other potential sources. Lactic acid doesn't build up per se because it would disassociate to lactate and H+ in the blood. Lactate is produced. And lactate is recycled and is used for energy and has been theorized to assist in the consumption and removal process of H+.

Many people misuse the terms lactic acid and its conjugate base lactate interchangably - which really isn't correct. I find myself doing it too sometimes lol Believe it or not, researchers are still arguing about the biochem behind this metabolic acidosis.

Thanks for your in depth description, v interesting but is there anything u can suggest to help the pain /fatigue, maybe less scientific, thank u v much though