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Old 07-26-2009, 06:33 AM   #1
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Exclamation Stop Obamacare Now!

Stop Obamacare Now!
By David McKalip, M.D.
Published 07/23/09

The Majority in Congress and the President are promising to change the "status quo" by pushing a government run-medicine plan (HR 3200). The plan would create rationing through government committees, force all Americans to buy over-priced, politically created health insurance, create an economically unsustainable government-run insurance plan and impose economy-crushing taxes. In fact, the President would break yet another promise by imposing a 2.5% income tax on each person who refused to buy government improved insurance. Further, after 2013 people would be forced to stay in their current plan for life or buy only a government-approved plan since no further enrollment will be allowed in non-approved insurance. Insurance companies would profit endlessly from the free business of the mandate. As medical care demands increased and artificially high profit margins became unacceptably low (for them) they would join the bailout game. In other words, there would be absolutely no change to the status quo ? just an expansion of more people into the currently bad system with the added feature of state-sanctioned rationing of medical care.

President Obama and Congress are building a medical cage that would trap all Americans and their doctors. Doctors who chose to provide the best, most innovative care with the fewest side effects to their patients would be punished. Doctors will be coerced to buy electronic medical records and send the private medical data of their patients and the details of their medical decisions to the government and insurance companies. The data of your doctors? medical practice would then be scanned by bureaucrats to see that they have complied with rules designed to force them to ration care. They must practice "efficiently" to avoid a 5%-40% pay cut or to avoid being driven out of practice altogether. The same government that recently accidentally posted all the nation?s sensitive nuclear sites on the internet would then have to be trusted to keep your data confidential. With full access to every bit of your medical data, government and insurance companies would have an excuses to deny care for your "non-compliance" with, for instance, a diabetes control or tobacco cessation program. Congressional plans would likely add to the cost of health insurance by adding mandated benefits to plans you must buy ? perhaps even forcing pro-life taxpayers to subsidize abortions.

Congress is foolishly basing its health system reform proposals on the same approach used in Massachusetts. The state has failed to achieve "universal coverage" with about 200,000 (2.6%) of their state still uninsured. In fact, most of the newly insured were covered by receiving heavily subsidized insurance from the state ? not due to the mandate to buy private insurance out of pocket. Due to budget overruns, they recently voted to remove coverage from 30,000 legal aliens for a $130 million savings and last year released others who couldn?t afford costly coverage from the mandate. Health care costs are rising much faster than nationally with spending up by 23 percent. Insurance premiums have increased 10-12 percent per year, nearly double the national average. The state is facing $1.5 billion this year in health spending and now is considering cost control programs that will limit care doctors provide to patients. There are too few providers for the increased demand - due to price fixing of doctor pay for decades by the federal government. Thus patients are waiting long periods to see doctors ? especially in primary care. Congressional proposals to fix this included allowing nurse practitioners to be designated primary care "providers", negating the years of training doctors receive and discouraging more doctors from entering the profession to compete against nurses for the same business.

Fortunately there are good Congressional proposals to address these problems and to allow American to escape from the government?s medical cage. Congressman Ron Paul has authored HR 2630, the "Protect Patients and Physician?s Privacy Act". The bill states that all individuals shall have the ability to opt out of any federally mandated, created, or funded electronic system for maintaining health care information. He also is offering HR 2629 the "Coercion is Not Health Care Act'" which forbids the Federal Government from forcing any American to purchase health insurance, and from conditioning participation in any federal program, or receipt of any federal benefit, on the purchase of health insurance.

Free market economist and philosopher of freedom, Friedrich Hayek defined freedom as "the absence of coercion". In his classic The Road to Serfdom he describes how parliamentary bodies (like Congress) prefer to delegate their power to unelected committees to insulate themselves from criticism ? especially when they create economically unsustainable programs which are promises that they cannot keep. Modern Congressional promises that can?t be kept include Medicare, SCHIP and now a proposed public option and heavily subsidized, but mandated, universal health insurance. Congressman Paul is channeling Hayek when he works to protect us from coercion proposed by Congress and from the power their appointed committees would gain by using the valuable medical information essentially looted from each American alive. As a free American, it is in your your best interest to use the freedom you have now to rise up to stop this very un-American intrusion into your lives. Some would say it is your duty ? but that would be coercion too. Yet remember that Benjamin Franklin told us that when you fight for your own freedom, you are helping the cause of liberty for all. And a society with more freedom is in everyone?s individual interest. You can start by calling your Congressman and ask them to support HR 2629 and HR 2630. Then recruit others who have an open mind to the cause....
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Old 07-26-2009, 06:47 AM   #2
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I'm not that old, but never in my life did I think I'd ever see this level of socialism/communism in our nation. It makes me want to get sick.
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:21 AM   #3
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Here we go again
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:33 AM   #4
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If they are going to give people free heath care money there should be some required health maintance on the persons part too.

There are so many problems with doing this
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:36 AM   #5
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So does this mean "Obamacare" wouldn't be appropriate for treating the Autism, Schizophrenia, Diabetes and Heart Disease I developed from drinking milk protein
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:38 AM   #6
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im convinced hes a bot.

periodically every 2-4 days he finds something controversial to post,
then posts it and never revisits the thread again.


dirty hippie bot!
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:39 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalgoodtime View Post
Stop Obamacare Now!
By David McKalip, M.D.
Published 07/23/09

The Majority in Congress and the President are promising to change the "status quo" by pushing a government run-medicine plan (HR 3200). The plan would create rationing through government committees, force all Americans to buy over-priced, politically created health insurance, create an economically unsustainable government-run insurance plan and impose economy-crushing taxes. In fact, the President would break yet another promise by imposing a 2.5% income tax on each person who refused to buy government improved insurance. Further, after 2013 people would be forced to stay in their current plan for life or buy only a government-approved plan since no further enrollment will be allowed in non-approved insurance. Insurance companies would profit endlessly from the free business of the mandate. As medical care demands increased and artificially high profit margins became unacceptably low (for them) they would join the bailout game. In other words, there would be absolutely no change to the status quo ? just an expansion of more people into the currently bad system with the added feature of state-sanctioned rationing of medical care.

President Obama and Congress are building a medical cage that would trap all Americans and their doctors. Doctors who chose to provide the best, most innovative care with the fewest side effects to their patients would be punished. Doctors will be coerced to buy electronic medical records and send the private medical data of their patients and the details of their medical decisions to the government and insurance companies. The data of your doctors? medical practice would then be scanned by bureaucrats to see that they have complied with rules designed to force them to ration care. They must practice "efficiently" to avoid a 5%-40% pay cut or to avoid being driven out of practice altogether. The same government that recently accidentally posted all the nation?s sensitive nuclear sites on the internet would then have to be trusted to keep your data confidential. With full access to every bit of your medical data, government and insurance companies would have an excuses to deny care for your "non-compliance" with, for instance, a diabetes control or tobacco cessation program. Congressional plans would likely add to the cost of health insurance by adding mandated benefits to plans you must buy ? perhaps even forcing pro-life taxpayers to subsidize abortions.

Congress is foolishly basing its health system reform proposals on the same approach used in Massachusetts. The state has failed to achieve "universal coverage" with about 200,000 (2.6%) of their state still uninsured. In fact, most of the newly insured were covered by receiving heavily subsidized insurance from the state ? not due to the mandate to buy private insurance out of pocket. Due to budget overruns, they recently voted to remove coverage from 30,000 legal aliens for a $130 million savings and last year released others who couldn?t afford costly coverage from the mandate. Health care costs are rising much faster than nationally with spending up by 23 percent. Insurance premiums have increased 10-12 percent per year, nearly double the national average. The state is facing $1.5 billion this year in health spending and now is considering cost control programs that will limit care doctors provide to patients. There are too few providers for the increased demand - due to price fixing of doctor pay for decades by the federal government. Thus patients are waiting long periods to see doctors ? especially in primary care. Congressional proposals to fix this included allowing nurse practitioners to be designated primary care "providers", negating the years of training doctors receive and discouraging more doctors from entering the profession to compete against nurses for the same business.

Fortunately there are good Congressional proposals to address these problems and to allow American to escape from the government?s medical cage. Congressman Ron Paul has authored HR 2630, the "Protect Patients and Physician?s Privacy Act". The bill states that all individuals shall have the ability to opt out of any federally mandated, created, or funded electronic system for maintaining health care information. He also is offering HR 2629 the "Coercion is Not Health Care Act'" which forbids the Federal Government from forcing any American to purchase health insurance, and from conditioning participation in any federal program, or receipt of any federal benefit, on the purchase of health insurance.

Free market economist and philosopher of freedom, Friedrich Hayek defined freedom as "the absence of coercion". In his classic The Road to Serfdom he describes how parliamentary bodies (like Congress) prefer to delegate their power to unelected committees to insulate themselves from criticism ? especially when they create economically unsustainable programs which are promises that they cannot keep. Modern Congressional promises that can?t be kept include Medicare, SCHIP and now a proposed public option and heavily subsidized, but mandated, universal health insurance. Congressman Paul is channeling Hayek when he works to protect us from coercion proposed by Congress and from the power their appointed committees would gain by using the valuable medical information essentially looted from each American alive. As a free American, it is in your your best interest to use the freedom you have now to rise up to stop this very un-American intrusion into your lives. Some would say it is your duty ? but that would be coercion too. Yet remember that Benjamin Franklin told us that when you fight for your own freedom, you are helping the cause of liberty for all. And a society with more freedom is in everyone?s individual interest. You can start by calling your Congressman and ask them to support HR 2629 and HR 2630. Then recruit others who have an open mind to the cause....
Why did you post this here for??? It should be in the MISC section
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:40 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illilian View Post
I'm not that old, but never in my life did I think I'd ever see this level of socialism/communism in our nation. It makes me want to get sick.
You know folks throw those terms out but are you really happy with supporting private run insurance firms? What good have they done the past 20 years??? After my mom got sick I found out how well they support you when the bills start racking up... not well. Personally I don't think private firms should profit off the sickness of others for obvious reasons, i'd rather have the gov. taking a hit and making it up in taxation especially if it made health care cheaper.

I know fox news has been strong lately in it's anti Obama spewage but i'd give him a chance first and cast aside the fear Republicans are spreading. It's worked for canada so far, sure taxes may go up, it's inevitable. But anything he does regardless will get them riled up.

If you ask me they should tax foods into brackets, healthy foods get the lowest tax while cheap processed **** foods gets heavy taxes that go toward his health care plan.
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:41 AM   #9
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i cant wait to pay for other douche bags health care!!!!!!!!!
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:42 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattyH7688 View Post
i cant wait to pay for other douche bags health care!!!!!!!!!
Location: Canada


... i dont have a problem
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:44 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nano.ix View Post
im convinced hes a bot.

periodically every 2-4 days he finds something controversial to post,
then posts it and never revisits the thread again.


dirty hippie bot!
In before he offers discounted shoes and handbags.
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:48 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nano.ix View Post
Location: Canada


... i dont have a problem
lol i remember my friend from canada was telling me how his dad(airplane pilot) only brought home $125,000 from his $250,000 salary

that is insane


I am going to be honest.. I dont give a **** about anyone about myself and family and could give a **** if some guy who has no effect on my direct life is getting health care. I already am 5 seconds away from losing it when i see the morons at the store using food stamps for ridiculous stuff.

yes some people have an excuse, after being laid off and stuff so i have no problem helping them as i know a lot of hard working people do experience problems but so many *******s abuse the system it makes me sick.
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:52 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illilian View Post
I'm not that old, but never in my life did I think I'd ever see this level of socialism/communism in our nation. It makes me want to get sick.
Get your own opinion man.

You're just ripping off what you hear on TV.
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:54 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattyH7688 View Post
lol i remember my friend from canada was telling me how his dad(airplane pilot) only brought home $125,000 from his $250,000 salary

that is insane


I am going to be honest.. I dont give a **** about anyone about myself and family and could give a **** if some guy who has no effect on my direct life is getting health care. I already am 5 seconds away from losing it when i see the morons at the store using food stamps for ridiculous stuff.

yes some people have an excuse, after being laid off and stuff so i have no problem helping them as i know a lot of hard working people do experience problems but so many *******s abuse the system it makes me sick.
Take a walk in their shoes. It's a whole different ball game when you are struggling to make ends meet day by day to support your family and kids. Some one gets sick and no you have to make the decision of weather you will go to the hospital to get treatment or eat dinner tonight.

... alcohol is still in my system

/extremist rant
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Old 07-26-2009, 07:55 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattyH7688 View Post
lol i remember my friend from canada was telling me how his dad(airplane pilot) only brought home $125,000 from his $250,000 salary

that is insane


I am going to be honest.. I dont give a **** about anyone about myself and family and could give a **** if some guy who has no effect on my direct life is getting health care. I already am 5 seconds away from losing it when i see the morons at the store using food stamps for ridiculous stuff.

yes some people have an excuse, after being laid off and stuff so i have no problem helping them as i know a lot of hard working people do experience problems but so many *******s abuse the system it makes me sick.
lmao. You can only buy food with food stamps. What ridiculous things are you seeing people buy?

You make minimum wage, brah. At least wait till you graduate college and make $10 an hour at your lame ass job before complaining.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:02 AM   #16
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I'm all for helping out people that need it but that's the problem, a lot of the people that are taking from the system don't really need to.

I work 50 hours a week while also going to college hoping that i can support the family i hope to have one day. Then i have buddies who sit around all day smoking weed and playing beer pong and night while not having jobs what so ever.

A couple kids i went to high school with both just got INTENTIONALLY fired from their jobs so they could start collecting welfare and unemployment checks and still be able to drink every night, wake up late and smoke while watching TV.

Guess whose paying for it.... ME. While i'm trying to pay for college i'm getting 30% of my damn paycheck taken away to help support these d-bags. **** that.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:03 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nano.ix View Post
Take a walk in their shoes. It's a whole different ball game when you are struggling to make ends meet day by day to support your family and kids. Some one gets sick and no you have to make the decision of weather you will go to the hospital to get treatment or eat dinner tonight.

... alcohol is still in my system

/extremist rant
i lived in the "ghetto" i guess you could call it, since it was close to my college

these people are the laziest pieces of **** i have ever seen and met on a daily basis.... most people would just sit on the porch all day when i was working 7 days a week. Living in that neighborhood made me hate most poor people, in my city anyways. Seeing how they acted on a daily basis made me so bitter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 40-Yard Dash_2 View Post
lmao. You can only buy food with food stamps. What ridiculous things are you seeing people buy?

You make minimum wage, brah. At least wait till you graduate college and make $10 an hour at your lame ass job before complaining.
does anyone need 3 boxes of brownie mix or 10 2 liters of mountain dew?

I am going to college and paying for everything i might add, for what? To have the money i earn to be pissed away on someone who decided they didnt even want to graduate high
school

my plan is to do very well after college, but its looking like less of a reality with all these imposed taxes to help "less fortunate"

I am a greedy bastard and honestly if it was up to me, i wouldn't give a penny away to these social services.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:05 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattyH7688 View Post
i lived in the "ghetto" i guess you could call it, since it was close to my college

these people are the laziest pieces of **** i have ever seen and met on a daily basis.... most people would just sit on the porch all day when i was working 7 days a week. Living in that neighborhood made me hate most poor people, in my city anyways. Seeing how they acted on a daily basis made me so bitter.

does anyone need 3 boxes of brownie mix or 10 2 liters of mountain dew?

I am going to college and paying for everything i might add, for what? To have the money i earn to be pissed away on someone who decided they didnt even want to graduate high
school

my plan is to do very well after college, but its looking like less of a reality with all these imposed taxes to help "less fortunate"

I am a greedy bastard and honestly if it was up to me, i wouldn't give a penny away to these social services.


You hit it right on the head. This is exactly what i was trying to say in my post.

You sound like your in the same boat as me, respect man
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:20 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by MattyH7688 View Post

I am a greedy bastard and honestly if it was up to me, i wouldn't give a penny away to these social services.
There is nothing wrong with being greedy if it is your own stuff rightfully earned.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:27 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nano.ix View Post
Take a walk in their shoes. It's a whole different ball game when you are struggling to make ends meet day by day to support your family and kids. Some one gets sick and no you have to make the decision of weather you will go to the hospital to get treatment or eat dinner tonight.

... alcohol is still in my system

/extremist rant
we have medicare and medicaid already in the US that people can apply for. Not onlly that but every state has Community Health Centers and Rural Health Centers that are state and goverment funded through grants. These grants that pay for individual healthcare is based upon how well the CHC and RHC center treat individuals (cronic diseases like diabetes hypertension asthma etc.) . I work with many of these groups across the US and can't believe the quality of care that patients recieve much better then private physicians in my opionion. They base your finally charges off of family income and size if you don't have coverage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 40-Yard Dash_2 View Post
lmao. You can only buy food with food stamps. What ridiculous things are you seeing people buy?
what gets me is I see people using food stamps checking out and then being able to come uup with the money to pay for two cases of beer. I am all for helping people out as long as they are welling and trying to help themselves get in a better situation. I see way to many people depend on the gov to take care of them instead of taking care of themselve
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:33 AM   #21
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:37 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 40-Yard Dash_2 View Post
lmao. You can only buy food with food stamps. What ridiculous things are you seeing people buy?

You make minimum wage, brah. At least wait till you graduate college and make $10 an hour at your lame ass job before complaining.
When I lived on new Britain CT, almost every person I met in my area was on food stamps. They most often redeemed them at 7-11 for slurpees and go-go tacitos.



I always though welfare systems made sense until I made some friends in the area and saw the reality. All the people on welfare and each if them claimed it meant they never had to work again. Why would they? Sell 5-10 baggies of "insert illegal drug here" a week and they had enough spending money + everything else they need paid for by welfare. They all felt the same it seemed...**** working. Uncle Sam OWES me.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:39 AM   #23
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For all of you in favor check out pages 880-81 of this bill if you can get a hold of it and tell me if you still want it.

What those pages refer to is the issuing of grants from the government to medical schools. The criteria basically comes down to those that have given the most money/training to blacks will get the most money (no racist).

If we let this pass, it will only be a matter of time before the government is controlling who gets into Medical School and what he/she ultimately practices.

Anyone that has taken Econ 101 can tell you this will create shortages and hurt the quality of the service. It was also cost more money.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:48 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VaughnTrue View Post
When I lived on new Britain CT, almost every person I met in my area was on food stamps. They most often redeemed them at 7-11 for slurpees and go-go tacitos.
That's food, no?
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:49 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VaughnTrue View Post
When I lived on new Britain CT, almost every person I met in my area was on food stamps. They most often redeemed them at 7-11 for slurpees and go-go tacitos.



I always though welfare systems made sense until I made some friends in the area and saw the reality. All the people on welfare and each if them claimed it meant they never had to work again. Why would they? Sell 5-10 baggies of "insert illegal drug here" a week and they had enough spending money + everything else they need paid for by welfare. They all felt the same it seemed...**** working. Uncle Sam OWES me.
^^^^ this is what gets me. I have no problem helping those that truely need help but the welfare system has turned into lets not ever work because the gov is suppose to take care of me system. Instead of trying to pass this horrible healthcare bill congress and Obama should be working of welfare reform, social security reform, and medicare reform.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:51 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 40-Yard Dash_2 View Post
That's food, no?
r u serious. To me thats more of a treat then food and a waste of food stamps. Shouldn't individuals on food stamps be a little bit more wise on what they use them for. I don;t feel like paying for someones slurpee when I'm at work working my ass off and these people have time to run to the local 7-11 and piss away the day.
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:52 AM   #27
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:52 AM   #28
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When I lived on new Britain CT, almost every person I met in my area was on food stamps. They most often redeemed them at 7-11 for slurpees and go-go tacitos.
... this came to mind
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http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=117646471
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:52 AM   #29
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I actually approve of this post...

Questions about Obama's plan..


Will more doctors be hired?

How many people are actually uninsured? There are probably 10 to 15 million people who can be insured under Medicare and Medicaid if they apply. 10 million illegal immigrants in this country. Some people don't want healthcare.

Will cost go down?

I like my current healthcare, so can I keep it?
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Old 07-26-2009, 08:54 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cervasa1977 View Post
r u serious. To me thats more of a treat then food and a waste of food stamps. Shouldn't individuals on food stamps be a little bit more wise on what they use them for. I don;t feel like paying for someones slurpee when I'm at work working my ass off and these people have time to run to the local 7-11 and piss away the day.
Especially when they could by a box of brown rice or something else cheaper (and healthier) that will make for more that one meal.
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