A Unique Approach

kitebean · 07-15-2009, 03:22 PM

futurebird · 07-15-2009, 03:50 PM

This guys has never been depressed. I'm depressed right now. $100,000 won't fix it. I *do* act happy as much as I can. But, you know what, I don't feel happy. This video just made me very very angry.

kitebean · 07-15-2009, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by futurebird

This guys has never been depressed. I'm depressed right now. $100,000 won't fix it. I *do* act happy as much as I can. But, you know what, I don't feel happy. This video just made me very very angry.

that is bollox, imo - most people are depressed at some time in their lives, don't judge him. I have been depressed, granted I am not at this particular moment, but I can see how it may have made me angry..

I think what he is trying to say is that it is our moral imperative not to force our depression or bad mood on other humans. If you are depressed, fine, just don't turn that to nastiness or anger or bitterness or vitriol towards others.

We are ALL CONNECTED, and what we put out there matters.

futurebird · 07-15-2009, 04:12 PM

I don't know to me it was just like "well you suck since your sad, why don't you just be happy you loser who makes everyone feel bad."

It just didn't work for me. It's like I'm not TRYING to act happy and get along and not be a drag. But the thing is I am trying.

futurebird · 07-15-2009, 04:13 PM

But I guess if it works for some people it's good.

Miranda · 07-15-2009, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitebean

I think what he is trying to say is that it is our moral imperative not to force our depression or bad mood on other humans. If you are depressed, fine, just don't turn that to nastiness or anger or bitterness or vitriol towards others.

We are ALL CONNECTED, and what we put out there matters.

mean people are often unhappy people, not depressed per se.
one doesn't necessarily cause the other.

depression will not not lift with a lil positive thinking and sunshine.
all they create is a facade, a mask. falsehood in behaviour and thought.

don't know about you, but i'd rather be true to how i feel and not prance around with a forced smile on my face.

kitebean · 07-15-2009, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miranda

don't know about you, but i'd rather be true to how i feel and not prance around with a forced smile on my face.

Being true to oneself and presenting pleasant countenance are not mutually exclusive in my opinion. IT'S NOT ALL ABOUT YOU at the end of the day, and as silly as it sounds, I agree with the man that presenting an angry or ugly or aggressive countenance DOES EFFECT PEOPLE AROUND YOU. If you smile at someone, you might just make their day, if you snap or growl at someone, it might just ruin their day. And that is not fair.

Do you think that when you snap at the checkout girl because you are having a bad day that it doesn't effect him or her? Do you think tht when you stand on your horn and flip that driver off because they have just done something stupid and didn't realise and are very embarassed and caused you a bit of inconvenience that it doesn't matter? IT ALL MATTERS. WE ARE ALL CONNECTED. People notice and are effected by what you put out there.

I no way am I insinuating that depression isn't real, and it makes you feel horrible and not want to smile. Don't smile then. Just don't take it out on other people. That's all he's saying.

Miranda · 07-15-2009, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitebean

I no way am I insinuating that depression isn't real, and it makes you feel horrible and not want to smile. Don't smile then. Just don't take it out on other people. That's all he's saying.

i responded mainly because you used 'depression' as an example of 'mean' people.

if you've ever experienced true depression - and i don't mean to have a 'mine is more awful than yours' contest here - you should know better.

valby · 07-15-2009, 11:46 PM

This is interesting. I like the thought that feelings can follow behaviour and I guess it holds some weight for the "fake it till you make it" philosophy.

But putting it into practice I have found is HARD.

What I have found, and was thinking about last night is that when I allow my depression to effect my actions/behaviour towards my partner he becomes increasingly unhappy. This then causes me to alter my behaviour because I can't stand seeing him so down and I do try to act more happy and it does help how I feel, even if short lived.

But I think we also need to create a distinction between being unhappy and being depressed. Being clinically depressed is often a chemical imbalance in the brain not just being unhappy due to some event.

PS screw the $100 000....take away some of my health issues and I would be much happier. Having said that I am well aware there are people in much worse circumstances than me.

Oh and I have worked with someone of the opinion that the world is against them I really don't think this attitude helps. At some point you have to decide to change how you feel. PS for me that mean't making the decision to go on "meds" because I wasn't coping alone.

Miranda · 07-16-2009, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by valby

This is interesting. I like the thought that feelings can follow behaviour and I guess it holds some weight for the "fake it till you make it" philosophy.[...]when I allow my depression to effect my actions/behaviour towards my partner he becomes increasingly unhappy. This then causes me to alter my behaviour because I can't stand seeing him so down and I do try to act more happy and it does help how I feel, even if short lived.

i fully understand and approve of positivity creating more positivity. how it's better to filter and let go of negativity rather than pass it on. it is an appealing idea. but it has nothing to do with depression. depression is apathy, indifference, withdrawal from the world, from other people. i treat any humans i happen to encounter in daily life with friendliness. my depression is not their fault, or their concern in any way.

but if i feel like death and i get that 'how you doin?' crap i'm not going to put on a socially accepted mask of chirpy chirpy and lie to them. if someone equates my feeling like death with being nasty then i'd suggest he/she never leave the house.

kitebean · 07-16-2009, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miranda

i responded mainly because you used 'depression' as an example of 'mean' people.

no, what I said was:

I think what he is trying to say is that it is our moral imperative not to force our depression or bad mood on other humans. If you are depressed, fine, just don't turn that to nastiness or anger or bitterness or vitriol towards others

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miranda

if you've ever experienced true depression - and i don't mean to have a 'mine is more awful than yours' contest here - you should know better.

maybe not, but I have lived with a man who is manic-depressive (who has been medicated) for 15 years. I know how hard and desperate it is. But I also know that he, despite himself and in spite of everything, tries to remain polite and/or professional with non-intimates. Sure, he isn't always. But even in his darkest moments, he would be mortified if he thought/knew he hurt an innocent with reactive behaviour. I'm not saying he is some super-evolved depressive, but he is able to be in his dark place without turning it to 'nastiness or anger or bitterness or vitriol' towards acquaintances or strangers. He's allowed to do it with me though!

Quote:

Originally Posted by valby

This is interesting. I like the thought that feelings can follow behaviour and I guess it holds some weight for the "fake it till you make it" philosophy.

I think this is slightly missing the point - IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU! (not not about you Val, but not about the person in the 'dark place', or the 'mean person') it's about the IMPACT ON OTHERS.

EVERYONE IS PERFECTLY ENTITLED TO HAVE AND BE IN THEIR OWN PLACE, whether that is dark or light or mean or depressed or manic or nasty or benevolent or WHATEVER!

But I don't think we are entitled to ruin other peoples days with nastiness. That's all!

For goodness sake I would NEVER THINK to belittle anyone who is struggling with ANYTHING.....we ALL HURT, we ALL STRUGGLE, we ALL fight against negative thoughts, feelings, ideas, and you are right, WE ARE NOT ALWAYS HAPPY!!!! Sometimes we are angry, sometimes we are mean, sometimes we are downright nasty. And it's OK to share that with people we love, people who know us and accept us - it's their 'job' to support us. BUT PEOPLE WHO ARE INNOCENT BYSTANDERS DO NOT DESERVE TO BE BROUGHT DOWN!

Quote:

Originally Posted by valby

But putting it into practice I have found is HARD.

Never a truer thing said!

Miranda · 07-16-2009, 12:59 AM

we do agree . . . read my above post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitebean

I think this is slightly missing the point - IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU! (not not about you Val, but not about the person in the 'dark place', or the 'mean person') it's about the IMPACT ON OTHERS.

hm. ever thought happy folks make us creepies feel even worse by their mere presence?

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitebean

BUT PEOPLE WHO ARE INNOCENT BYSTANDERS DO NOT DESERVE TO BE BROUGHT DOWN!

what 'innocent bystanders'?

we're all connected, no?
it is a mesh, with high points, low points. it all averages out in the end.

slightly OT - i do think that it is not possible fully comprehend what it is to 'feel' if you haven't experienced the whole range in the extremes. this makes me an expert, a snob

kitebean · 07-16-2009, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miranda

slightly OT - i do think that it is not possible fully comprehend what it is to 'feel' if you haven't experienced the whole range in the extremes. this makes me an expert, a snob

au contraire, because you can bet your bottom dollar that I (by virtue of my age) have experienced numerically more experiences across all strata, and yes, in the extremes (albiet maybe different extremes than are in your experience).....so you could never be an expert or snob in the accumulated range of 'feelings' of Susan.

Miranda · 07-16-2009, 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitebean

au contraire, because you can bet your bottom dollar that I (by virtue of my age) have experienced numerically more experiences across all strata, and yes, in the extremes (albiet maybe different extremes than are in your experience).....so you could never be an expert or snob in the accumulated range of 'feelings' of Susan.

that made me smile

futurebird · 07-16-2009, 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miranda

hm. ever thought happy folks make us creepies feel even worse by their mere presence?

Seriously! When I'm depressed happy people really make me feel even worse. I like it better when people don't hide how they feel. I don't get dragged down by my depressed friends and I'm not angry when they are sad.

I just help them along because I know what it's like.