high protein/low carb = liver damage?? HELP

[Jordanbid]

be nice to the liver man once its damaged it cant heal itself, you can help support healthy liver function with milk thisle and other herbs.It really cant be as bad as an alchoholics liver though.Iv always played it safe by staying at 1g per lb because im paranoid as well lol you make me want to go get checked myself.

[thegymbum]

be nice to the liver man once its damaged it cant heal itself, you can help support healthy liver function with milk thisle and other herbs.It really cant be as bad as an alchoholics liver though.Iv always played it safe by staying at 1g per lb because im paranoid as well lol you make me want to go get checked myself.

Actually... the liver actually has pretty much the HIGHEST regenerative capacity of any organ in the body. It is REMARKABLY proficient at recovery. On the other hand, if you get to the latest stages of liver disease so that your liver becomes cirrhotic, regenerative capacity declines. But up until that point, the liver is highly efficient at repairing damage. Elevat3ed enzymes are a very, very early point in liver damage, and sometimes are even "pre damage" where there's no actual phyiscal derrangement. Which is likelty the case here. It's always best to play it safe but the liver heals itself very well.

[GeeBees]

Well anything above 2g per kg of bodyweight is hard for your organism to digest and process. Especially that daily ammount for healthy adult male is around 0.6g/kg.

[kodyt21]

Well anything above 2g per kg of bodyweight is hard for your organism to digest and process. Especially that daily ammount for healthy adult male is around 0.6g/kg.

Well I am 23 yr old and have been low carb high protein for last at least 4 years. My insurance just kicked in so I just set an appointment to do some blood test to see what is going on inside my liver/kidneys as well so I will be sure to post results these next coming weeks..btw I have felt fine every since starting the low/no carb thing and do not over dose the protein 1-1.5 grams per pound of body weight thats it. As long as you use it it really isnt bad for you..kinda just like carbs.

[ExScientia]

Actually... the liver actually has pretty much the HIGHEST regenerative capacity of any organ in the body. It is REMARKABLY proficient at recovery. On the other hand, if you get to the latest stages of liver disease so that your liver becomes cirrhotic, regenerative capacity declines. But up until that point, the liver is highly efficient at repairing damage. Elevat3ed enzymes are a very, very early point in liver damage, and sometimes are even "pre damage" where there's no actual phyiscal derrangement. Which is likelty the case here. It's always best to play it safe but the liver heals itself very well.

While it is true that the liver does regenerate itself, it does not retain the native architecture of hepatocytes when it does. That is why a long-standing alcoholic may have a HUGE liver (due to the years of damage and regeneration), but it is cirrhotic and does not function well. The cells have no problem regenerating but the new hepatocytes do not have the same levels of functionality as the native cells. Therefore it is important to catch liver damage early on.

[oton]

Hello,

I was reading the "Jamie Eason Fat Loss Program" and in the calorie calculator if you enter, for example, a woman of 150lb the result is that she should eat 175g of protein. This is not too much??? Specially for a female and, in most cases, beginners.

[FitnessFan828]

If you take in too much protein in one meal (over 30g), your body won't be able to digest it, and your kidneys will be in trouble. You can eat a lot of protein throughout the day, but spread it out so your liver and kidneys aren't put through crazy amounts of stress!

[nobrah]

If you take in too much protein in one meal (over 30g), your body won't be able to digest it, and your kidneys will be in trouble. You can eat a lot of protein throughout the day, but spread it out so your liver and kidneys aren't put through crazy amounts of stress!

I'm afraid you've been misinformed.

The 30g number is completely imaginary, but I suspect it's not wholly arbitrary either. My guess would be that another ritual of eating every 2-3 hours (lets round up to 3) is combined with the factual information of a roughly 10g per hour absorption rate of protein to produce 30g per meal. Since you have a meal every 3 hours, that gives the body time to absorb 30g of protein.

It's a nice, neat little package, but it's wrong. First, absorption and utilization are two very different things. The usual argument is that the excess protein won't be used, but that's so utterly nonsensical that it's not really worth addressing. Your argument that the kidneys are stressed is true, after a fashion. The stress from more protein is certainly present and provable, but unless you already have damaged kidneys, that extra stress is completely harmless.

The statement that you won't be able to digest excess protein with the further explanation that the kidney's can't handle it suggests a lack of understanding about how digestion works, or a confusion of terms. By the time "protein" has reached the kidneys, it's already been digested, absorbed, and utilized. The kidneys are processing the waste nitrogen from amino acids.

I notice you also added in the liver at the end, which extends the description of how proteins are digested and used, but the conclusion is the same: your liver is safe from excess protein unless it's already damaged, in which case excess protein can exacerbate the damage.

[KLMARB]

You're talking about Aminotransferases here (Aspartate Aminotransferase, AST, and Alanine Aminotransferase, ALT). These are enzymes that are present in liver cells (hepatocytes) and leak into the blood with liver damage. AST is also present in heart and skeletal muscle, therefore raised levels are seen in heart attacks or skeletal muscle damage (such as in bodybuilding). ALT is more liver specific as it is only present in liver cells so its value would show how much damage has occurred.

As far as I know, creatine affects the kidneys more than the liver (kidney functions would decline by time, which is why it is recommended that you don't over do it and only use it for a period of 5 months and then stop for a while). I used to use creatine, but in lower doses than the ones recommended (less than 5 grams per day), but I completely stopped using it after knowing about its effects on the kidney.

I've never heard of high protein diet damaging your liver (at least not at Medical school!) but there might be other reasons that you might not be aware of. In fact, your liver might not be damaged (that's one possibility), and saying this because there are many drugs around that alter your liver function tests but once you stop them (granted no permanent harm was done to your liver), your liver functions should return to normal gradually over time (won't happen in a single day or week!). It is good that you stopped all those supplements because you actually don't need them if you can find organic resources for them. Check with your doctor and let us know your results. I'm assuming that you do not suffer from any live disease or abuse alcohol (both can damage your liver and increase those enzymes).

A normal healthy diet should be:

- low in sugar (though not sugar-free)
- high in starchy carbohydrate (especially foods with a low glycaemic index such as pasta). Carbs should represent about 40-60% of total energy intake
- high in fibre
- low in fat (especially saturated fat) which should represent less than 35% of total energy intake
- include protein representing about 15% of total energy intake (1 g per kg ideal bodyweight)

Bodybuilding diet has changed over time and the current one consists of ridiculously high amounts of protein (that's how supplement companies make their money!). YES, you do need more protein than the average individual to rebuild your muscles but don't over do it because no matter how many grams of protein you eat, your body will ONLY use the amounts that it requires and then flush the rest out of the system and you'd be wasting your money and your whey protein supplement!

I have written an article on bodybuilding diet on my website (you can access it here: click on my website in my signature or check my profile as I'm not allowed to post links yet!)
Feel free to grab a copy of the free report "The ABC's Of Bodybuilding, Diet And Fitness" were bodybuilding diet and competition diet is covered. (just click on my website link below or you'll find a link if you visit the article)

I hope that you found this post a little bit helpful and if you have any questions , I'll gladly answer them when possible.

Jay Q.

Disclaimer: I'm NOT a doctor, YET! I'm a Senior Medical Student so yes, my knowledge is fresh and updated but you should ALWAYS consult your personal doctor as he knows about your personal medical history more than anyone else!

Excellent example of a gross oversimplification of nutritional science.

[pepe25l]

I have had high liver readings for awhile now, consensus with the doctor last year was that all the supplements i was taking (NO, Creatine, Test) damaged the liver. 6 months later after stopping supplements, numbers were still way way above normal (both categories AST and ATP???) normals are 0-55 mine were in both categories about 150-200. Wondering why the numbers didn't go back down after stopping supplements but I guess for people with "liver disease" a high protein/low carb diet is harmful, not giving the liver a chance to heal, before my second test i was eating around 300g of protein a day and carb cycling with a few no carb days and the other days were about 200g. My liver glycogen was really low as well. Any1 else have this issue? I stopped all extra whey powders, now just eating about 24g of protein from whole foods, 6 meals a day with high clean carbs such as oats, pasta, fruit, bread (1000g). Hopefully this will help it heal up so i can cut for the rest of summer but interesting to see if anyone had any thoughts on this, but hey at least i get to eat carbs b/c i love my carbs,

I had the same situation, test show the liver levels kind of high. My doctor said it was due to the creatine I was taking. After the second test results came normal. I did stop proteins and creatines. I am olny taking multivitamins.

[soccerdad5]

Anyone else go through this?

[TPriz]

Not sure if you've considered this, but have you thought of fasting? Try to fast 24 hours once or twice a week. Drink lots of water. It will give your digestive system time to repair and clean out the body. This could really help you. Fasting also causes better absorption of nutrients after the fast. Low carb is such an unrealistic diet. I stay away from it totally. If I was you I would just eat at a calorie deficit in order to lose weight.

[walterCorrey]

damn thats scary

[internalmeddoc]

Hello Dave, sorry to hear about your liver problem. your AST and ALT can be high due to multiple reasons, it is true that the live has a majore role protein metabolism and over loading it may cause problems. However, also pay attention to other things such as tylenol, NSAIDS(advil, ibuprofen etc), alcohol consumption, anabolic steroids. Generally high protein damages the kindeys as excess amino acids and peptides are dumped out in the urine, as our bodies are not made to store protein as it is able to for fats and carbs. the extra protein can place pressure on your kidney's ability to filter and cause damage. the biggest misconception in the BB world is that your have to take
1-2grams of protein/g body weight...this is total BS all this does it lighten your wallet and makes your piss more expensive. the recommended protein intake for an athelete is 1-2grams protein/Kg bodyweight.

there are also other considerations regarding your liver, which im sure your doctor evaluated you for, do you get jaundiced, do you have abdominal pain, gas after meals, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea...

I used to take 400grams of protein/day, then I went to medical school and found out I was likely peeing out 80 percent of that...its very easy to get fooled into the marketing of supplements, they promise way more than they can ever deliver. You have no idea who makes these supplements, or under what conditions they were made in, did they have quality measures, do they get audited by some governing body to make sure their manufacturing is up to standards, are there any standards, etc.

good luck and I hope your liver enzymes improve

I have had high liver readings for awhile now, consensus with the doctor last year was that all the supplements i was taking (NO, Creatine, Test) damaged the liver. 6 months later after stopping supplements, numbers were still way way above normal (both categories AST and ATP???) normals are 0-55 mine were in both categories about 150-200. Wondering why the numbers didn't go back down after stopping supplements but I guess for people with "liver disease" a high protein/low carb diet is harmful, not giving the liver a chance to heal, before my second test i was eating around 300g of protein a day and carb cycling with a few no carb days and the other days were about 200g. My liver glycogen was really low as well. Any1 else have this issue? I stopped all extra whey powders, now just eating about 24g of protein from whole foods, 6 meals a day with high clean carbs such as oats, pasta, fruit, bread (1000g). Hopefully this will help it heal up so i can cut for the rest of summer but interesting to see if anyone had any thoughts on this, but hey at least i get to eat carbs b/c i love my carbs,

[Roke]

Been wondering the same thing myself....I really don't consume much but have been getting this drunk brain foggy feeling...

Every time I get blood test the results are good, no liver enzymes, but I know what I'm feeling and it's not placebo.

[Rockstaraditya]

i have had high liver readings for awhile now, consensus with the doctor last year was that all the supplements i was taking (no, creatine, test) damaged the liver. 6 months later after stopping supplements, numbers were still way way above normal (both categories ast and atp???) normals are 0-55 mine were in both categories about 150-200. Wondering why the numbers didn't go back down after stopping supplements but i guess for people with "liver disease" a high protein/low carb diet is harmful, not giving the liver a chance to heal, before my second test i was eating around 300g of protein a day and carb cycling with a few no carb days and the other days were about 200g. My liver glycogen was really low as well. Any1 else have this issue? I stopped all extra whey powders, now just eating about 24g of protein from whole foods, 6 meals a day with high clean carbs such as oats, pasta, fruit, bread (1000g). Hopefully this will help it heal up so i can cut for the rest of summer but interesting to see if anyone had any thoughts on this, but hey at least i get to eat carbs b/c i love my carbs,

just suffered severe pain visited a doctor then a radiologist for ultra sound
liver mildly increased in size
reason high protein low carb

[ironwill2008]

Ancient thread, but a topic that continues to come up frequently.


Currently, there is no study data to indicate that a high protein intake causes liver or any other problems in otherwise healthy people.

As far as those posters who report liver problems from protein intake, the question remains, was the liver healthy previously, or was there always some underlying issue of liver illness that only became apparent later?

[willyamw]

So Rockstaraditya's doctor is giving the wrong info re. protein causing the problem?

[Riccardo717]

There is a medical network in the U.S. which has been working on Drug Induced Liver Injury Network including those caused by anabolic steroid and Herbal and dietary supplements. This is one of the largest research network on its kind in the U.S. If you wish to know more visit their ******** page at ******** dot com/DILIN

[jinkty]

From a speculative point of view....

If you're on a high protein diet, some of the protein is inevitibly going to be converted to different forms of carbohydrate. Alanine will often be converted to pyruvate for use as fuel or conversion to acetyl coa for storage, requiring alanine aminotransferase. I've never seen actual documentation that an extra demand for this reaction will raise ALT levels, but it does make sense, no? Similarly, aspartate is transaminated to oxaloacetate, another very important storage molecule. Required enzyme? Aspartate transaminase.

I can definitely see that, theoretically, if you're taking in a very high amount of protein, and having to use a lot of that protein for fuel (i.e. lack of dietary fat and carbohydrate, limited use of body fat as fuel), the enzymatic reactions would be siginficantly increased. In order to facilitate that, I can see that the key enzymes woiuld be upregulated. Any thoughts? Or anyone actually read any evidence for that?

In theory this is true, I'd be interested to see a case study even