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    Registered User WiLDFLeX's Avatar
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    Grains making me tired?

    Hi all,

    Just wondering if anyone else ever get's this, and if so what do you eat instead?

    I have noticed for years now that whenever I eat any of the grains (grasses) I get tired after, lasting for a day or so. Anything such as rice, pasta (wheat), breads and cakes and even oats! (Which sucks because I love oats and eat it about every day at the moment).
    For example, I may eat some bread / oats/ etc, one evening and it'll make me tired very soon after, and the next morning I will be really tired - like I can't get up. Oats taste great but after them as breakfast by midmorning or lunch I am groggy from them.

    I should and probably will avoid these things in future - but I have found it quite difficult getting any decent amount of bulk carbs in my diet aside from the potatoe family. (I love fruit though)

    My issue is that even though I love fruit if I avoid the grains altogether I end up real hungry, so that I instinctively go for cake or something simply for the concerntrated carbs and fats otherwise I am pretty much a useless zombie (hypoglycaemic or something ).

    I am not complaining, no problem, I'll figure it out and will have grasses, but in moderation I think, I am just curious how many others have noticed this?

    I have heard that grains are a very recent addition to our diets - originating in the middle-east or the near-east a few thousand years ago (relatively short in human scale terms), I suppose genetically some of us haven't adapted to it yet and would be better off following a paleolithic diet or what have you.

    When I have experimented with this kind of diet (lean unprocessed meats and fish, nuts and seeds, fruits and green vegetables) I did feel a lot more energetic, slept less and felt more clear headed- but I lost weight and my strength wasn't quite as good.

    Your thoughts? Your experiences?
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    Registered User Yankee's Avatar
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    Sounds like one of two options:

    (A) You have an intolerance to gluten. Google "gluten intlerance" read the symptoms and go see your doctor.

    (B) You have an insulin sensitivity meaning you are choosing refined breads, pastas, white rices, cakes (what is "cakes"...be more specific....like Little Debbies?). If this is the case, choose high fiber grains (whole wheat bread, Fiber One, NO CAKE, wild rice...) you should notice you stay fuller longer and dont have a slump.

    If the lean meat/veg/fruit clean cut thing worked for you but you lost weight....make sure you are supplementing the lack of grains (energy) with fats (your other form of energy). Bump up your fish intack (omegas), nut butters, olive oil intake, etc nd you wont come out at a deficit.
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    hamsom brah Dom_88's Avatar
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    Grains are not your friend, it's alot more common than you'd think. The key to a diet in this manner is to eat a lot to ensure that you're getting all your required cals and also the required FIBER you need. The mistake a lot of people make is they eat the right foods, just nowhere near enough and they end up binging.
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    Originally Posted by WiLDFLeX View Post
    For example, I may eat some bread / oats/ etc, one evening and it'll make me tired very soon after
    Rebound hypoglycemia. As people age, insulin sensitvity decreases.

    Eat grain -> blood glucose rises -> insulin released -> blood glucose decreases -> blood glucose too low because of impaired insulin regulation.

    Get a diabetes test.
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    I suggest digestive enzymes you are probably not producing enough enzymes to digest carbs. Also try chewing your food well this helps activate the enzymes.
    It's all about portion control.
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    Registered User WiLDFLeX's Avatar
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    Thank's for the responses so far;
    I am not diabetic - I have been tested for both types at least 2 times each.

    When I have low blood sugar I do 'crash', and the longer it goes for the worse I get. BUT, that is another story - I can have stable blood sugar levels but still get fatigued from the grains. I eat brown rice and wholemeal bread when I do eat grains, as well as my oats which are actually raw (I don't like cooked oats). So it isn't that I consume them as simple or refined, it's just what they are per se - or that at least every indication is telling me so.
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    Originally Posted by WiLDFLeX View Post
    Thank's for the responses so far;
    I am not diabetic - I have been tested for both types at least 2 times each.

    When I have low blood sugar I do 'crash', and the longer it goes for the worse I get. BUT, that is another story - I can have stable blood sugar levels but still get fatigued from the grains. I eat brown rice and wholemeal bread when I do eat grains, as well as my oats which are actually raw (I don't like cooked oats). So it isn't that I consume them as simple or refined, it's just what they are per se - or that at least every indication is telling me so.

    Sounds to me like someone is eating too many high carb low fat meals, of course it's gonna crash your blood sugar, cut back on the carbs, add some more fat to your diet to replace the calories lost to carb cutting, eat more protein. By reducing the number of carbs you are eating and by adding more fat to your meals you will reduce if not eliminate your blood sugar crashes. Light exercise after eating can also help reduce the chances of your blood sugar crashing.
    Last edited by Kelei; 04-25-2009 at 11:28 AM.
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  8. #8
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    Originally Posted by Dom_88 View Post
    Grains are not your friend, it's alot more common than you'd think.
    Gluten intolerance is a common problem? Not statistically it isn't. Quack/Alternative Medicine/CrossFit it is a common theme, but not in the real world.
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    Registered User WiLDFLeX's Avatar
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    I don't pig out on carbs lol, for example - breakfast is usually a mix of:

    Oats (100 gm dry weight = 60 carbs)
    1 banana What's that, 20-30 carbs?
    half a handful of raisins again - 20 carbs
    Nuts and seeds which add proteins and fats.
    All combined as a museli with water (I don't like milk)

    And 3 eggs.

    So about 100-110 carbs and that's fairly standard for me. Other meals are between 100 and at the very very most 150 carbs, but usually closer to 100.
    I eat 3 times a day usually.

    Honestly, it's not me 'pigging out' on carbs that does it, I will admit that I am hypoglyceamic - so my blood sugar levels are important, but even so, as I have said when I avoid all grains in my diet I feel different - less lethargic and fatigued, but of course it is much harder to then get the bulk carbohydrates.

    I don't mind people critiqiuing what I eat and so forth, but I do have a feeling that some of us simply are not compatible with having grains in our diets.

    What I am trying to do is just see how other people have found it - any similar stories? Any thoughts? What they do about it?

    I bought some tree nuts today to help with the fats and fibre - but these packs are expensive, a penny a gram it works out to.

    For those who ae interested here are a few links I was reading the other day regarding this subject;

    Evolution, Diet and Health by S. Boyd Eaton, MD and Stanley B. Eaton III
    http://www.cast.uark.edu/local/icaes...aton/eaton.htm


    5 Simple Ways to Improve Your Diet
    http://www.tbkfitness.org/5ways.html

    The Paleolithic Diet Page: What the Hunter/Gatherers Ate
    http://paleodiet.com/


    Please don't take this as an offense to the standard eating habits of most people - I am in no way trying to discredit it, if it works for you then more power to you, but if it doesn't, or if you would just like to look into it, then here are some interesting reads, that is what this is for.

    I am no nutritionalist or scientist, just a guy. But I know how my body responds to different foods, and not that long ago in human terms my ancestors were eating green leafy plants, fruits like berries, maybe root veg I don't know - certainly not potatoes of course, and definitely fish, shellfish and (wild, free range, organic) meats.

    Again - not trying to make anything of this, just exploring it as a subject - all welcome to have your say on experiences and theories.
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    Yes, I do think you are going overboard with the carbs...and if you are hypoglycemic this isn't hard to figure out....

    Just look at your breakfast alone:
    Oats (100 gm dry weight = 60 carbs)
    1 banana What's that, 20-30 carbs?
    half a handful of raisins again - 20 carbs
    Nuts and seeds which add proteins and fats.
    All combined as a museli with water (I don't like milk)

    ____________

    Oats (good fiber here)
    Banana (high glycemic index...wouldn't matter for most but you are hypo)
    Raisins (concentrated fructose...again...high GI and if you are having a "handful"...based on the size of your arm that's a mighty handful...way more than 20 carbs and all concentrated sugar)
    Nuts (fat, good)
    Museli (a very high carb cereal)

    3 eggs and some nuts is all that is balancing out a whole lotta carbs. If you are hypo- you should know that you are most insulin sensitive in the a.m. and if you are flooding the system with this much sugar no wonder you are having crashes.

    If I was you.....I'd change things around like:

    Eggs + slice of quality ham or cheese on whole grain bread sandwich

    OR

    Oats with peanut butter and whey

    OR

    Cottage cheese w/ banana, sweet potato with PB
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  11. #11
    Registered User WiLDFLeX's Avatar
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    When I said museli I mean that combination of beakfast makes a muesli - not that I was adding any.

    So 100-150 carbs three times a day is over the top for me?? :/
    Maybe I need to rethink this.. when I have too few carbs though I get weak, slow and fatigued and start falling asleep..

    Still think I should be shooting for 1gm per 1 pound bodyweight of protein? I don't manage that though - maybe 100 grams a day average admittedly, I do occasionally take whey but usually I avoid it because it makes me react the same way as if I had just eaten a bowl of sugar! lol.

    See, this is why I am so interested in exploring the paleolithic diet, natures food!

    So, what would you advise I shoot for in terms of daily carbs? Assuming I now get around 300 to 400 I think.
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    Originally Posted by Yankee View Post
    Sounds like one of two options:

    (A) You have an intolerance to gluten. Google "gluten intlerance" read the symptoms and go see your doctor.

    (B) You have an insulin sensitivity meaning you are choosing refined breads, pastas, white rices, cakes (what is "cakes"...be more specific....like Little Debbies?). If this is the case, choose high fiber grains (whole wheat bread, Fiber One, NO CAKE, wild rice...) you should notice you stay fuller longer and dont have a slump.

    If the lean meat/veg/fruit clean cut thing worked for you but you lost weight....make sure you are supplementing the lack of grains (energy) with fats (your other form of energy). Bump up your fish intack (omegas), nut butters, olive oil intake, etc nd you wont come out at a deficit.
    You mean insulin resistance, not sensitivity.

    And no, I don't have that. Grains are awesome for me. I unlike many here am not some pre-diabetic disaster waiting to happen.
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    Originally Posted by WiLDFLeX View Post
    When I said museli I mean that combination of beakfast makes a muesli - not that I was adding any.

    So 100-150 carbs three times a day is over the top for me?? :/
    Maybe I need to rethink this.. when I have too few carbs though I get weak, slow and fatigued and start falling asleep..

    Still think I should be shooting for 1gm per 1 pound bodyweight of protein? I don't manage that though - maybe 100 grams a day average admittedly, I do occasionally take whey but usually I avoid it because it makes me react the same way as if I had just eaten a bowl of sugar! lol.

    See, this is why I am so interested in exploring the paleolithic diet, natures food!

    So, what would you advise I shoot for in terms of daily carbs? Assuming I now get around 300 to 400 I think.
    1 g/lb. in carbs and 1.5 g/lb. in protein seems ideal for you.

    Honestly though you're eating around 100 g of protein and you're in great shape. You're doing something right or your genetics are awesome.
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    Originally Posted by Scott~ View Post
    Gluten intolerance is a common problem? Not statistically it isn't. Quack/Alternative Medicine/CrossFit it is a common theme, but not in the real world.
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    Man, I have the same probs as you... I can jump off walls like a little kid when I eat a diet with less grains. But eating bread, cakes, rice or other **** I fail at life. Fruits and a bit of grains is how I get my carbs.

    I dont have a gluten intolerance or anything like that, just the human body isnt made to consume large amounts of highly cooked/processed grains... You never see animals or cavemen eating bags full of grain if they eat it at all.

    Look at a rhino or gorilla, eats raw food, and they are tanks. Look at the Chinese and their diets, they're friken super humans.
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    Originally Posted by Marcus8880 View Post
    Man, I have the same probs as you... I can jump off walls like a little kid when I eat a diet with less grains. But eating bread, cakes, rice or other **** I fail at life. Fruits and a bit of grains is how I get my carbs.

    I dont have a gluten intolerance or anything like that, just the human body isnt made to consume large amounts of highly cooked/processed grains... You never see animals or cavemen eating bags full of grain if they eat it at all.

    Look at a rhino or gorilla, eats raw food, and they are tanks. Look at the Chinese and their diets, they're friken super humans.
    No.

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