Rippetoe/Arnold/20 Rep Squat Hybrid Program

[MafdetX]

I've been doing Rippetoes workout for the past 3 months. I've gotten some pretty significant gains in size and strength. I feel like I'm nearing the end of the program but am not nearly out of the beginners phase of training. I still think that I can build my strength up a little more in a Rippetoe style program.

I plan on doing the Maddcow 5x5 but not for a little while.

So I was considering doing a 20 rep squat program, or Reg Park's Power Training.

Here's the 20 Rep Program:

Parallel Squats 1x20
Pullover 1x20
Bench press 3x12
Military Press 3x10
Bent over rows 2x15
Stiff Leg DL 1x20
Standing Curl 2x10
Toe raises 3x20
Crunches 1x25

Here's the Reg Park Power Training Program:

Schedule 1 - To be performed 3x/week for 5 weeks before continuing onto Schedule 2

Back Squat - 5x5
Bench Press - 5x5
Power Clean - 8x2
Standing Press - 5x5
Barbell Curl - 3x5 strict, add 20-30lbs then 2x5 cheat curls
Deadlift - 5x1, working up to a top weight (Only performed on Day 3) Beginners should do 1x5

Schedule 2 - To be performed 3x/week for 5 weeks.

Front Squat - 5x5
Clean and Press, warmup w/ 2 sets of 2, 5x2 Stabilizing sets. Optionally perform 2 more sets of 3 Push Jerks
Upright Row - 5x5
Dips - 5x8
Dumbbell Curls - 5x5
Deadlift - 5x1, working up to a top weight (Only performed on Day 3) Beginners should do 1x5

1) How do these two programs compare? They seem to have very similar elements to them, work on basic exercises and progression. Both of these programs should yield me pretty serious gains right? I think I'm about 60% done with the beginner period.

2)What are your thoughts on a modified 20 rep program? This program is kind of a hybrid of Rippetoe and 20 rep squats. I modified it myself. I understand that I shouldn't be ****ing with proven routines, but I thought that a hybrid could be powerful.

*This routine would be started at a moderately low weight, so that I could add weight to every workout. Just like Rippetoes.

MWF Routine

Workout A
Squats 1x20
Bench press 3x5
Military Press 3x5
Deadlift 1x5
Dips 2x10
Calf Raises 2x20
(Crunches 1x25) or some light core/ab work

Workout B
Squats 1x20
Bench press 3x5
Power Clean 3x5 or Bent Over Row 3x5
Deadlift 1x5
Pullups 2x10
Calf Raises 2x20
(Crunches 1x25) or some light core/ab work

I'm sure there are some issues with it, but I thought it was worth an attempt at designing a program. Basically this program would just implement 1x20 squats instead of 3x5. Bench 3 times a week, Deadlift 3 times a week, and hit calves.

Or could I possibly just do 1x20 squats in Rippetoes instead of 3x5 and leave everything else the same? Thoughts?

[ThiZzNation925]

Are you doing the 20 reppers at your 10RM (like stated in the original 20 rep program)?

[Hut*Hut]

I've been doing Rippetoes workout for the past 3 months. I've gotten some pretty significant gains in size and strength. I feel like I'm nearing the end of the program but am not nearly out of the beginners phase of training. I still think that I can build my strength up a little more in a Rippetoe style program.

I plan on doing the Maddcow 5x5 but not for a little while.

So I was considering doing a 20 rep squat program, or Reg Park's Power Training.

Here's the 20 Rep Program:

Parallel Squats 1x20
Pullover 1x20
Bench press 3x12
Military Press 3x10
Bent over rows 2x15
Stiff Leg DL 1x20
Standing Curl 2x10
Toe raises 3x20
Crunches 1x25

Here's the Reg Park Power Training Program:

Schedule 1 - To be performed 3x/week for 5 weeks before continuing onto Schedule 2

Back Squat - 5x5
Bench Press - 5x5
Power Clean - 8x2
Standing Press - 5x5
Barbell Curl - 3x5 strict, add 20-30lbs then 2x5 cheat curls
Deadlift - 5x1, working up to a top weight (Only performed on Day 3) Beginners should do 1x5

Schedule 2 - To be performed 3x/week for 5 weeks.

Front Squat - 5x5
Clean and Press, warmup w/ 2 sets of 2, 5x2 Stabilizing sets. Optionally perform 2 more sets of 3 Push Jerks
Upright Row - 5x5
Dips - 5x8
Dumbbell Curls - 5x5
Deadlift - 5x1, working up to a top weight (Only performed on Day 3) Beginners should do 1x5

1) How do these two programs compare? They seem to have very similar elements to them, work on basic exercises and progression. Both of these programs should yield me pretty serious gains right? I think I'm about 60% done with the beginner period.

2)What are your thoughts on a modified 20 rep program? This program is kind of a hybrid of Rippetoe and 20 rep squats. I modified it myself. I understand that I shouldn't be ****ing with proven routines, but I thought that a hybrid could be powerful.

*This routine would be started at a moderately low weight, so that I could add weight to every workout. Just like Rippetoes.

MWF Routine

Workout A
Squats 1x20
Bench press 3x5
Military Press 3x5
Deadlift 1x5
Dips 2x10
Calf Raises 2x20
(Crunches 1x25) or some light core/ab work

Workout B
Squats 1x20
Bench press 3x5
Power Clean 3x5 or Bent Over Row 3x5
Deadlift 1x5
Pullups 2x10
Calf Raises 2x20
(Crunches 1x25) or some light core/ab work

I'm sure there are some issues with it, but I thought it was worth an attempt at designing a program. Basically this program would just implement 1x20 squats instead of 3x5. Bench 3 times a week, Deadlift 3 times a week, and hit calves.

Or could I possibly just do 1x20 squats in Rippetoes instead of 3x5 and leave everything else the same? Thoughts?

Not a great plan, IMHO. If you are beginning to stall on SS it's because as you get stronger, the program is becoming too tough for your recovery ability. The answer isn't to chose a program which is twice as tough, it's to start adjusting the program to make it easier. An abbreviated 20 rep squat program would be an option, but not the one you've listed (that thing would bury your average greek God). The Reg Park routine would be an option if you feel that SS is still TOO EASY for you. But if you're beginning to stall that isn't the case.

[MafdetX]

Are you doing the 20 reppers at your 10RM (like stated in the original 20 rep program)?

I was actually considering starting a little lower. Maybe 20-40 pounds lighter, just to insure that I am able to make consistent progression.

One reason I wanted to do 20 rep squats was that doing heavy squats has been killing my lower back. (I messed up my lower back a while ago) I wanted to take some time off from heavy squats before I jump back into them and try to increase my 5rm.

Not a great plan, IMHO. If you are beginning to stall on SS it's because as you get stronger, the program is becoming too tough for your recovery ability. The answer isn't to chose a program which is twice as tough, it's to start adjusting the program to make it easier. An abbreviated 20 rep squat program would be an option, but not the one you've listed (that thing would bury your average greek God). The Reg Park routine would be an option if you feel that SS is still TOO EASY for you. But if you're beginning to stall that isn't the case.

Yeah I definitely want to do the Reg Park program next.

In terms of my lifts, I built my squat up from 135 to 265. My lower back has been messed up for a while, and because of that pain the last time I did 265 it wrecked my back.

I wanted to lighten up my load to take pressure off my back and challenge my muscles a little bit. I'm pretty sure I'm very close to plateauing on Squat. However, I think my Bench and Deadlift can still gain a little more.

I thought that doing a lighter load for 20 rep squats might be helpful and change things up a little bit.

What do you think of doing SS, but replacing 3x5 squats with 1x20 squats for a 2-4 weeks? And then going back to 3x5?

[Lonewolf24]

The thing about 20 reppers is that you'll notice in the program that no lifts go below 10 reps.

20 reppers are done at your 10rm and at the end of that 20 rep set, you'll be FRIED. And I mean TORCHED. If you aren't, youre doing it wrong. to competently do 5 rep sets with heavy weight is nearly impossible after 20 reppers, and it should be. Stick to the 20 rep program or don't, but understand that using 20 reppers in with a 5x5 program is going to = overtrained and underlifted.

My advice if you decide on the 20 reppers, is to put military first in the routine. It gets your CNS going strong and keeps it away from bench. I've read a lot about people doing this and it seemed to benefit them completely. Me personally, I do 20 reppers on my leg day (2x a week), but thats it. Intensity, then done. 20 reps, SLDL and Leg extensions, then shower.