Post Workout Supplementation & Waxy Maize Starch

[Nitric]

What do you guys think about this article? Thanks.





Lately there has been a huge rise in the popularity of a post-workout product called waxy maize starch. Not by any means because of its effectiveness, but rather due to the hype that some major labels are putting behind it. In reality, it?s a cheap ingredient that is just that ? a lot of hype. I wanted to take a few minutes to explain the correct way to handle your post workout nutrition and why it needs to be done in that very specific way. In doing that I?ll also dispel a few of the marketing myths about post-workout that you might have already run into over time and a few more that I see spreading across the internet forum sites.
Note: If you jumped on the waxy maize starch bandwagon and think it?s the shiznat, you might not want to read on. This article will shatter your waxy maize dreams and probably make you a little mad because?and there is no easy way to say this?you got taken! Should you be mad? Hell yes! I?m not only going to shed light on the truth, I?m going to show you how to keep supplement companies from EVER ripping you off again!
The truth is, the correct way to do post workout nutrition, that has been scientifically proven to build muscle, does not contain waxy maize starch at all. If anyone tells you different?well?they?re wrong. I?ll show you exactly why.
Post-Workout Nutrition - The Right Way!
When you are training in the gym you are not building muscle; you are, in fact, tearing it down. You are creating miniscule little tears on your muscle fiber that are referred to as micro-trauma. After you are done training, the body?s process of repairing these tears is when ?muscle building? takes place. In addition to creating micro-trauma, you are also severely depleting your glycogen stores. Glycogen is your body?s on board energy supply. To attain maximum muscle growth and recovery, it is vital to have all of the muscle-building supplies on hand specifically when they are needed ? immediately after you train.

When you leave the gym your body doesn't know you're done training and it is still in a catabolic state and will continue to break down muscle tissue for the next 6-12 hours. It's your job to stop this catabolic process as soon as you can stop it dead in its tracks and get it moving the other direction and create an anabolic environment in your body. First of all, we need to halt the breakdown process you have going by creating an insulin spike. To spike your insulin, you need glucose. Without the glucose, it will take your body 12-14 hours to replenish your glycogen stores and start the muscle recovery process. This means that without glucose, during those 12-14 hours almost everything you eat will be inefficiently converted to glycogen, including that expensive protein powder. This is why you must give your body the glucose right alongside your protein immediately post workout so that it can start the glycogen replenishment and muscle recovery processes simultaneously and instantly.

By putting glucose with your protein post workout you are giving your body exactly what it needs to get the job done.(8) The glucose will cause an insulin spike, which in-turn will put an immediate halt to the catabolic process of breaking down your muscle along with delivering the nutrients exactly where they need to go. The glucose gets delivered and stored in your body as glycogen and the protein is delivered directly into the muscle cell for muscle repair. This is THE MOST IMPORTANT CONCEPT to understand when it comes to getting benefits from weight training. If you aren't doing the proper post workout nutrition then you need not waste your money on any other supplements, period! - It's that important!

Think about this: If it takes your body 12-14 hours to start muscle recovery without proper glucose supplementation immediately post-workout, and you train that body part once a week, then every two-weeks you are losing a FULL DAY of recovery per body part trained. That's one full day of muscle growth that you missed out on! Add that up over the course of a year. One day every two weeks, 52 weeks in a year, that's 26 days per body part of muscle growth you are missing out on. Almost a full month of recovery time that you missed out on - That's quite a bit of muscle growth you?re missing out on!

Now that we know how our body works and what does and doesn't work for our bodies, its time to get specific about what you should be taking. The best product available to address all of these post-workout issues is Ignition by 1st Phorm. Ignition is pure dexanhydrous glucose crystals, which are the highest quality, fastest absorbing sugars known to man. It's the highest glycemic carbohydrate source available. Ignition induces 6x the insulin response that normal table sugar would, which basically means that it makes your body 6x as receptive for delivering glucose and protein to the cells. Upon using Ignition you will notice the immediate effects of increased energy, increased muscle stamina, huge pumps and increased mental alertness.

[Nitric]

Now, let?s get cracking at some of those myths and get you set for success:
Myth: Waxy Maize is the best thing to use to restore glycogen post workout.
FALSE!! Waxy Maize Starch, which is just a fancy name for Corn Starch, is not post workout nutrition; it's post workout fiction. The "theory" behind waxy maize starch, and I emphasize the word "theory" there, is that it's a fast absorbing carbohydrate so it?s perfect for post workout, right? WRONG! Waxy maize starch is slow absorbing carbohydrate with a high molecular weight. Supplement companies and ?bro science? claims that waxy maize is faster absorbing because of its high molecular weight. Now, I don?t know how this theory got started or how it could have possibly grew legs enough to become a supplement trend, but its bass-ackwards. Its common knowledge in professional sports nutrition circles that the higher the molecular weight the slower a product absorbs. So the lower the molecular weight, the faster a product absorbs.
Now to completely put this theory to bed, let?s talk raw numbers: Molecular weight is measured in a unit called Daltons. Waxy maize starch has a molecular weight of 500,000 Daltons, sucrose or table suger comes in at 342, and pure dexanhydrous glucose has a molecular weight of only 180 Daltons. 500,000 vs. 180 ? That is quite a contrast as far as speed of absorbency goes! That right there, should make the choice pretty clear on which of the two is the superior product! Not only is dexanhydrous glucose a lot faster absorbing than waxy maize starch, it?s one of the fastest absorbing substances known to man! This is why you get very little if any insulin spike with waxy maize(1), its very slow absorbing. This is also why you get a huge insulin spike with dexanhydrous glucose. Slow absorbing = low insulin response, Fast absorbing = high insulin response.
The fact is, companies have made, and are continuing to make, hundreds of unsubstantiated claims on the effectiveness of waxy maize starch, one being that its high molecular weight actually makes for faster gastric emptying, which as we have already discussed, is not true. They also claim that because of its supposed faster gastric emptying, it causes less bloat and less discomfort. The ?less bloat? theory has been understandably backed up from ?real world evidence? given by users of this product. The truth is, waxy maize doesn?t bloat you and the reason waxy maize doesn?t bloat you is because it?s actually slowly digesting in your system. The reason a lot of dexanhydrous glucose and protein can make some people feel bloated and queasy is that you just dumped a ton of carbohydrates and protein into your stomach and your body is trying to digest it all at once ? because of its low molecular weight. The ensuing insulin spike can make people feel a little queasy. That?s just you feeling it go to work! So here is what you get with waxy maize: no insulin spike, no quick glycogen replenishment and no bloat. The bottom line is waxy maize starch has no place in bodybuilding or sports nutrition at all. No exceptions.
The whole purpose of taking a product like Ignition is not only because it?s a fast absorbing form of glucose that hits your cells immediately, but also because it causes a massive insulin spike! Insulin is a hormone in the human body that is responsible for a variety of things, one of them being protein conversion and retention.(2,3) When you have an insulin spike, your body becomes super efficient at utilizing all of the nutrients that you throw at it. If you've got a huge dose of protein right there with it, your body will shuttle all of that immediately into the muscle cell for growth and recovery. With waxy maize starch based products you get a slow absorbing carb and you get zero insulin spike! You are missing out on the main igniting force of muscle growth. In addition waxy maize has shown no significant result at glycogen synthesis or re-synthesis even over a 24-hour period.(4)
So if it doesn?t work at all why do so many companies use waxy maize? Because it's cheap! It can be found on commodities exchanges for as little as 15? a pound and the method by which it is manufactured renders it almost useless to the human body.(5) Dexanhydrous Glucose is the most refined pure source, so gram per gram it is far more expensive and absorbed faster and at a much higher rate. Unfortunately, most companies are about what's cheap, highly profitable, readily available and easy to produce. They'd rather spend their time and effort hyping their product up than actually delivering quality products to the end consumer. Using sub-par ingredients like waxy maize starch helps companies keep product costs down at the expense of their customer's results, so they can pump their products in 4 page ads or spend that extra scratch sponsoring MMA fighters.
I can hear the board meeting now: ?Lets come out with a little known substance, we can buy the raw material for 15 cents a pound, tell people its special and better, market the crap out of it to make it popular, and sell 2lbs of it for $50 and because its so rare, unknown and mysterious people will pay it?. I know in your mind, you are thinking, ?they can?t really do that!?, but I assure you they can and they have. It?s morally and ethically wrong and a total lie!
Personally, I never use a company?s products if any product in their line contains waxy maize starch. To me it is a sure sign that they are cutting corners on quality and using lower quality ingredients is a testament to their integrity and the integrity of the products they produce. They?ll stick it to you if you don?t know any better with that waxy maize starch product, why wouldn?t they do that with any of their products? The answer is?.they are! Crazy to think that some people are so loyal to those marketing gimmicks that they?ll go get tattoo of that company?s logo! I don't want to name names, but all I'm saying is this ... If you haven?t already, you will start to hear soon, more and more about waxy maize starch, because there's a certain product label, that is know industry wide as a hype machine that is pushing a product so hard that you?d think The Pope blessed each bottle himself. The truth is that this new waxy maize starch product is just like all the rest of the waxy maize starch products that saturate the industry - hype and marketing with very little quality to back up the claims!
If you are going to spend your money on a supplement you obviously want to get results ? Spend it on a supplement that will deliver you results, not some over-hyped ?next best thing.? Don?t let the companies take advantage of you. Be smarter than them. Next time you are looking to use a company?s products that you aren?t familiar with and you find yourself wondering if they are a reputable company or not, look to see if they manufacture a waxy maize starch product and you?ll have your answer. I would like to make a quick mention of how many ?experts? and companies have been preaching how great this stuff is for you. Take notice because this is exactly where you shouldn?t be getting your information from. Anyone who has ever recommended, marketed or produced waxy maize starch as a bodybuilding post/intra-workout product is uninformed, uneducated and very possibly unethical and in my eyes their integrity is shot, but that?s just my opinion. With that being said, there are a lot of well meaning individuals out there that just got caught up in the hype, after all it is very hard to ignore millions of dollars in marketing in your face every month. It is most people?s nature to trust these ads and companies, because nobody wants to think that these companies would blatantly rip you off?.but they do every day?and I?m doing what I can to stop it.
Lets move on?
Myth: I can just use table sugar instead of Ignition and it'll work the same.
FALSE!! This couldn?t be any further from the truth! Table sugar is sucrose, which is a disaccharide of glucose and fructose. For the disaccharide sucrose to be digested and absorbed its molecules first have to cleaved apart into a monosaccharide through the digestive process (an extra step) which means slower digestion time and less insulin response. Fructose is processed through the liver and therefore replenishes liver glycogen; it will distribute glycogen slowly to the bloodstream over a period of time as opposed to delivering it rapidly to the muscle cells for growth. I don?t know about you, but I don?t do many sets of ?liver? in the gym, so I wouldn?t waste my time and money on my liver glycogen levels: I want my muscle glycogen levels restored! In addition to that, Ignition is 100% pure Dexanhydrous Glucose, an ultra refined monosaccharide, and solicits 6x the insulin response as sugar. It?s no coincidence that top-level bodybuilders shoot up with insulin. Insulin is a hormone and allows for much higher protein retention.(2,3) With Ignition you are not only replenishing your glycogen levels, you are also spiking your insulin, stopping catabolism and allowing the hydrolyzed and pre-digested whey isolate protein you take with it to absorb directly into the muscle cell.
Myth: I can use my regular protein with Ignition and get same results.
FALSE!! The insulin spike you get from Ignition peaks about 30 minutes after you take it. Even a good whey concentrate or blend will take several hours to digest so you can see that they are not timed out at the same digestion rate. An insulin spike essentially opens the door for protein to come in?.literally. Insulin actually opens up the receptors located on the muscle cell that absorb amino acids, but you need an amino acid (protein) source there at the same time the receptors are open in order for it to work. Think of it this way ... If you are having a party and tell all your guests (proteins) to come over at 9:00, you don?t go open your door (insulin spike) at 6:00 look for people, wonder where they are at and the lock them at 6:45 do you? Of course not, because it?s not time and nobody would be able to get in. A whey protein isolate that is hydrolyzed and predigested is the only source of protein that can digest at the same rate as Ignition and take full advantage of the protein retention and absorption offered by the insulin spike.(7,11) So your normal protein is less than optimum ? no pun intended - and won?t work for this purpose.

[Nitric]

Myth: I can use white bread and get the same result.
FALSE!! White bread is in fact a simple carbohydrate and indeed it does rate high on the glycemic index, but it is a food source that takes your body several hours to break down. That means that the insulin spike that you get from it is incredibly weak in comparison to Ignition. Because Ignition is pure dexanhydrous glucose, it offers 6 times the insulin response as its disaccharide cousin, table sugar. A piece of white bread has 12 grams of sugar, so you would have to eat 4 slices of it to equal what you get in a serving of Ignition. However, because Ignition?s effective response is 6x higher, you would have to eat roughly 24 slices of bread to yield the same insulin response because the glycemic load of white bread is so much lower. That is an entire loaf of bread and the 288 grams of sugar and 1,584 calories that come with it. Even if you did do that, it would still take several hours to digest completely defeating the purpose of post workout nutrition while making you fat at the same time. You can clearly see that Ignition is a more efficient, not to mention more cost effective, approach when it?s broken down like that. People who tell you this simply have no clue! It?s an old school technique that doesn?t work. All technologies change and evolve and supplements are no different. If someone is actually doing this it would be the equivalent of a present day video game company producing new games for the original Atari system. It?s outdated technology, so don?t let someone tell you? ?this is what my Dad told me to do because its what Arnold used to do? or something like that. It?s the wrong advice plain and simple.
Myth: I can use Whatever-ade and get the same results as Ignition.
FALSE!! While I am glad that you are trying, energy and power drinks are a less than optimal option for your recovery ... and substantially more expensive. It does contain simple sugars, but the simple sugars that it contains are primarily high fructose corn syrup and sucrose (a.k.a. table sugar), which means that, like table sugar mentioned above, these will be processed in your liver. This diminishes the insulin response as well as the raw amount of glucose that will eventually be pushed out into your bloodstream for delivery to your muscle cells.(6) Sucrose is a disaccharide made of equal parts of fructose and glucose, so if your Whatever-ade has 40 grams of sugar ? at best only 20 of that is glucose that your liver has to filter and separate from its bonded partner, fructose. All of this takes time, and wasted time in delivery is wasted time in muscle growth. Ignition is the most efficient way because it uses pure dexanhydrous glucose and does not need to be filtered by your liver ? it drops straight into the bloodstream for delivery to the muscle cells.
Myth: If I use Ignition, it?s going to make me fatter and I'm trying to lose weight so I?m not going to use it.
FALSE!! Ignition will not and cannot make you fat if used correctly. In fact, if used correctly post weight training workout (Ignition should not be used post cardio for someone trying to lose body fat) it will actually cause you to burn fat faster. Contrary to what you might have read about carbs being the devil, it?s just not true ? Your body has the capacity post workout to take in hundreds of grams of carbs without storing any as fat.(12) (Of course this only applies if you are training intensely, but then again, if you?re not training intensely, you have no business taking supplements anyway.) During intense training your body will tear through and utilize almost all of your glycogen stores, which will amount to hundreds of grams of carbs your body needs to replenish glycogen stores. The reason being that you are providing your body with the proper material to start the recovery process and also grow and maintain new muscle mass. Muscle is the only tissue in your body that is metabolically active, which means muscle takes an energy source (calories) to maintain it self. This means the more muscle you can hang on to while dieting, the higher capacity your body?s metabolism will have. This simply translates into more calories burned and less body fat. This means that for someone who is trying to lose fat and get ripped, Ignition is a must have, especially when you consider the natural catabolic nature of dieting. The goal of dieting is to lose as much fat as you can while holding on to as much muscle as possible. Proper post workout nutrition is a MUST HAVE to create this result, otherwise your going to burn off more equal parts muscle and fat and end up looking like a soft, skinny, lighter version of yourself instead of a leaner, ripped, completely in shape specimen like you are going for.
Myth: I can just use Ignition to replenish my glycogen stores and will get the same results as if I would take it with a protein.
FALSE!! Believe it or not people always ask which one they should take and the answer is ? BOTH! I always tell people the same thing: It?s like going to buy a brand new car and the salesman asks you if you need tires or a steering wheel to drive your car safely off the lot. You don?t need one or the other ? You need both!
Ignition?s purpose is three-fold: 1) Create an insulin spike to stop catabolic processes, 2) To replenish glycogen stores, and 3) For the insulin to help deliver the hydrolyzed, pre-digested whey-isolate that you take with it directly in to the muscle cells for maximum protein retention and absorption. (8,10) Taking Ignition solo will indeed spike insulin and begin to replenish your glycogen stores, but you are only taking advantage of part of the product. With your glycogen levels fully compensated and the insulin spike you get from it, your body begins looking for protein (amino acids) to shuttle into the muscle cell and if you don?t have anything there for it to move, you missed the bus! Throwing a hydrolyzed, pre-digested whey isolate in there at the same time is the only way to take full advantage of that insulin spike. That is the only form of protein that digests fast enough and at the same rate as the Ignition. It?s all about timing with your post-workout!
Myth: I can just use Iso Blast/VP2 post workout and get proper recovery.
FALSE!! Without a source for glycogen, your body will scavenge the protein you just spent good money on and turn it into glycogen anyway, very inefficiently mind you. Glycogen is your body?s own internal energy stores ? kind of like a battery. When the battery is low, the human body is genetically programmed to focus on replenishing glycogen levels to charge it back up. When you walk out of the gym, your body does not care about building muscle, getting big, burning fat, or any of those other things that YOU are concerned about, it is too busy scavenging for glycogen. Your body is programmed for survival first and everything else second. You need glycogen to survive?.you don?t need big muscles. When you deplete your energy stores when you train, your body?s main focus is to charge those batteries back up and anything you give it, it will turn into glycogen.
Think of it this way: Let?s say there are two construction sites. At job site A, we drop off a load of lumber; at job site B we drop off a tree. We tell both sites to build a house with their materials ? Who?s getting done first?! Of course the site with the lumber because the materials they were given are already ready to be put together. The other site has to take their tree and make lumber first, then it can build. That site will spend twice as long building their house as the first group. Your post-workout is the same way: Your body will get what it needs, no matter what you give it, but if you cooperate with your body and give it the materials it needs, your recovery will occur much quicker. While the whey isolate you mentioned is indeed a key part of this, the Ignition is what truly seals the deal! (7,9)
Bottom-Line:
The bottom-line is that post-workout is your number one dietary supplement priority. It?s not an optional thing you add to your program ? it is the foundation of it all. If you?re not practicing proper post workout nutrition don?t waste your money on anything else. There is no better way to handle your post workout than by combining Ignition with a hydrolyzed, pre-digested whey protein isolate such as VP2 or Isolate Blast 800.
Come on in and let us get you on your way to your best body ever!
Yours in Victory,
-Andy Frisella
Co-Founder,
Supplement Superstores
Note: Several months ago, I wrote an in depth article on Proper Post-Workout Nutrition. Some of the information covered there was covered here as well, but it also goes into a little more detail in some areas as well. If you are looking for more in-depth information on your post-workout nutrition, you should definitely consider reading that piece as well - Proper Post-Workout Nutrition.
1. Goodpaster BH, Costill DL, Fink WJ, Trappe TA, Jozsi AC, Starling RD, Trappe SW. The effects of pre-exercise starch ingestion on endurance performance. Int J Sports Med. 1996 Jul;17(5):366-72.
2. Miers WR and Barrett EJ. The role of insulin and other hormones in the regulation of amino acid and protein metabolism in humans. Journal of Basic Clin Physiol & Pharm. 1998. Vol 9 # 2-4:235-253.
3. Zhang X, chink DL, Wolf S, E and Wolfe RR. Insulin but not growth hormone stimulate protein anabolism in skin wound and muscle. Am.J.Physiol.1999.276; 39: E712-E720.
4. Jozsi AC, Trappe TA, Starling RD, Goodpaster B, Trappe SW, Fink WJ, Costill DL. The influence of starch structure on glycogen resynthesis and subsequent cycling performance. Int J Sports
5. He J, Liu J, Zhang G. Slowly digestible waxy maize starch prepared by octenyl succinic anhydride esterification and heat-moisture treatment: glycemic response and mechanism. Biomacromolecules. 2008 Jan;9(1):175
6. Bowtell JL, K. Gelly, ML Jackman, A Patel, M. Simeoni, and M. J. Rennie Effect of different carbohydrate drinks on whole body carbohydrate storage after exhaustive exercise. J Appl Physiol 88: 1529-1536, 2000
7. Roy BD, MA Tarnopolsky, JD Macdougall, J Fowles, and K E Yarasheski. Effect of glucose supplement timing on protein metabolism after resistance training. J Appl Physiol 82: 1882-1888, 1997. 8
8. John L. Ivy, Harold W. Goforth Jr., Bruce M. Damon, Thomas R. McCauley, Edward C. Parsons, and Thomas B. Price. Early postexercise muscle glycogen recovery is enhanced with a carbohydrate-protein supplement. J. Appl. Physiol. 93 4, 1337-1344, 2002.
9. Cribb PJ, AD Williams, A. Hayes, MF Carey. The effect of Whey isolates and resistance training on strengthening, body composition, and plasma glutamine levels. 34 (5) A1688, 2002
10. Pollain MG, et al. Effect of Whey proteins, their oligopeptide hydrolysates and free amino acid mixtures muscle growth and nitrogen retention in fed and starved by. JPEN. Vol 13, No4 :382-386, 1989.
11. PPKeohane et al.Influence of protein composition and method Hydrolysis on intestinal absorption of protein in man. Gut.26 p907-913. 1985
12. Folch N. P?ronnet F, Massicotte D Duclos M, Lavoie C, HILLAIRE-Marcel C. Metabolic response to small and large 13C-labeled pasta meals following rest or exercise in man. Bri J. nutria. (5) 671-680, 2001.

[Autobody]

Wall of text slaughtered my mom.

Seems like a marketing piece. The need for high glycemic PWO nutrition has taken a back seat to just carbs. In fact Pre workout carbs may just be enough, read Alan Aragon's January review. www.Alanaragon.com

[jonathan76]

Regardless of wether this is marketing piece there is a heap of useful information in there. Thanks for the post Nitric very educational.

[Kyle.Lgk]

cliffs?

[Wamrage]

I am still confused whether or not waxy maze starch is good.

[TheWaffleIron]

I am still confused whether or not waxy maze starch is good.

Unless you're engaging in endurance training for hours and/or multiple times per day, muscle glycogen is not depleted; and, thus, rapid "glycogen replenishment" is not necessary.

[edplayer]

if I win the lottery I will buy you paragraphs

[Bersa45]

Glad I read this.

[methodice]

Unless you're engaging in endurance training for hours and/or multiple times per day, muscle glycogen is not depleted; and, thus, rapid "glycogen replenishment" is not necessary.

From the article or not?

Either way I tend to feel better with more rapid glyc replenishment... dont many?

[TheWaffleIron]

From the article or not?

In the interest of full disclosure, I did not read the article.

Either way I tend to feel better with more rapid glyc replenishment... dont many?

My point is that "rapid glycogen replenishment" can not occur; unless you're training for hours in an overnight fasted state, muscle glycogen will not be depleted.

[the0hulk87]

In the interest of full disclosure, I did not read the article.



My point is that "rapid glycogen replenishment" can not occur; unless you're training for hours in an overnight fasted state, muscle glycogen will not be depleted.

Haha lol. Oh **** wait ur telling me my biology and personal training book is wong and glycolysis doesnt occur during excersise???
Well damn them!

Ps. Sorry for the bump!

[Socalchoirboy]

Haha lol. Oh **** wait ur telling me my biology and personal training book is wong and glycolysis doesnt occur during excersise???
Well damn them!

Ps. Sorry for the bump!

Resistance-exercise will deplete muscle glycogen stores around 20~%, depending on the intensity of your workout and the duration of it. Stores replenish themselves over time; there is no magical carb that speeds up the process immensely.

[the0hulk87]

Resistance-exercise will deplete muscle glycogen stores around 20~%, depending on the intensity of your workout and the duration of it. Stores replenish themselves over time; there is no magical carb that speeds up the process immensely.

Oh crap! The National Academy of Sports Medicine are a bunch of lyers, huh? They told me glycogen stores are completely depleted after 50 minutes of intense resistance training... I'm just gonna believe you (a 17 yo kid) over them. Lol
And glycogen is replenished just as fast without carbs as it would be with a pre-digested monosaccaride?
Ok....

[REALDEAL012]

Oh crap! The National Academy of Sports Medicine are a bunch of lyers, huh? They told me glycogen stores are completely depleted after 50 minutes of intense resistance training... I'm just gonna believe you (a 17 yo kid) over them. Lol
And glycogen is replenished just as fast without carbs as it would be with a pre-digested monosaccaride?
Ok....

First off, glycogen will most likely only be completely depleted if a few prereq's are considered..

1) A diet consisting of very low CHO i.e. <50g/day
2) Multiple endurance training sessions per week i.e. 7+ long duration workouts
3) 12 sets of +15 rep compound exercises per muscle group

I challenge you to try and COMPLETELY deplete glycogen in your body without meeting at least 2 of the 3 above.. It just won't happen, especially if eating an even moderate amount of CHO i.e. 200+g CHO

[Ghosting]

They told me glycogen stores are completely depleted after 50 minutes of intense resistance training

Pls go. Seriously.

[Iechine]

Oh crap! The National Academy of Sports Medicine are a bunch of lyers, huh? They told me glycogen stores are completely depleted after 50 minutes of intense resistance training... I'm just gonna believe you (a 17 yo kid) over them. Lol
And glycogen is replenished just as fast without carbs as it would be with a pre-digested monosaccaride?
Ok....

You've heard of hitting the wall right? That point in a marathon roughly 20 miles in when a runners stored glycogen (rough average of 2200 calories worth of energy) has been depleted and depending on the runners
good/bad nutrition during the race, they bonk because their glycogen stores have actually been depleted. This isnt going to happen 50 minutes into 'intense resistance training'. Hell, it takes runners doing sub
5 minute miles for an entire marathon to get there.

My input on waxy maize is that its fantastic for someone like me, I am an ultra runner doing regular distances of 30+ mile runs and 50/100 mile races. I always have a can of it and I appreciate the long lasting effects
through a workout, its very marked. As for a most workout, I typical mix a little with my protein depending on how rough it was. I certainly prefer it over simple carbohydrate.

[the0hulk87]

You've heard of hitting the wall right? That point in a marathon roughly 20 miles in when a runners stored glycogen (rough average of 2200 calories worth of energy) has been depleted and depending on the runners
good/bad nutrition during the race, they bonk because their glycogen stores have actually been depleted. This isnt going to happen 50 minutes into 'intense resistance training'. Hell, it takes runners doing sub
5 minute miles for an entire marathon to get there.

My input on waxy maize is that its fantastic for someone like me, I am an ultra runner doing regular distances of 30+ mile runs and 50/100 mile races. I always have a can of it and I appreciate the long lasting effects
through a workout, its very marked. As for a most workout, I typical mix a little with my protein depending on how rough it was. I certainly prefer it over simple carbohydrate.

Thats a completely different scenario. I'm talking 50 of weight training! Running or cardio in general will force your body to use different sources of energy. There are three pathways of energy: ATP-CP; Glycolysis; Oxidative. Its known as the Bioenergetic continuum.

[Ghosting]

Thats a completely different scenario. I'm talking 50 of weight training! Running or cardio in general will force your body to use different sources of energy. There are three pathways of energy: ATP-CP; Glycolysis; Oxidative. Its known as the Bioenergetic continuum.

God, I wish I would have cared enough about such an idiotic topic to have saved the data showing that a weight training session will not even come close to depleting glycogen stores, but then again I didn't think anyone would be this big of an idiot that I would have to prove them that the info the got from some 1990s copy of Flex magazine was wrong. I was wrong. That or you're just a troll.

[the0hulk87]

God, I wish I would have cared enough about such an idiotic topic to have saved the data showing that a weight training session will not even come close to depleting glycogen stores, but then again I didn't think anyone would be this big of an idiot that I would have to prove them that the info the got from some 1990s copy of Flex magazine was wrong. I was wrong. or you're just a troll.

Good job! Your Ad Hominem put everyone on your side.
Now go run arround online with your Availability bias and find the proof to back up ur "argument" lol
Fatty

[Iechine]

Thats a completely different scenario. I'm talking 50 of weight training! Running or cardio in general will force your body to use different sources of energy. There are three pathways of energy: ATP-CP; Glycolysis; Oxidative. Its known as the Bioenergetic continuum.

You're joking right?

[Ghosting]

Good job! Your Ad Hominem put everyone on your side.
Now go run arround online with your Availability bias and find the proof to back up ur "argument" lol
Fatty

You mean like how you backed your argument :

The National Academy of Sports Medicine are a bunch of lyers, huh? They told me glycogen stores are completely depleted after 50 minutes of intense resistance training

/facepalm

I don't care if you provide a link to them now or not, they are wrong and so a you. Deal with it. You ego driven kids are all the same.

[Ghosting]

Now go run arround online

BTW, outside of spending time replying to someone that is obviously mentally handicapped, I will not spend ONE second searching for this. Not ONE.

[the0hulk87]

[/QUOTE] they are wrong and so a you. Deal with it. [/QUOTE]

Lol GTFO!

[olympicgold2016]

Interesting thread. IMO carb source dosnt matter, and some of the biggest, and leanest people I have ever met drink waxy maze starch... on the other hand some huge guy eat poptarts pwo(and not the fat free kind) your body is more efficient at restoring muscle glycogen than most people think! Dont need to be 'spiking insulin', In fact when im entering pre contest time, I drop my carbs pre workout and go for a meal of chopped liver, and a shake with whey iso, two tbsp pb, two tbsp coconut. burns fat like a hot damn, and I dont all of a sudden loose muscle pump or whatever lol. Your body will grow if you tell it too ie. heavy lifting and eat enough food. follow the example of the old pros like arnie or fanco and eat oats all day haha and quit worrying about carb source