Reversitol dosing protocol wrong? according to PA

[Rippedtohell]

So with PA saying that about reversitol(see below, last sentence) shouldnt we be dosing it up 1/2/2/3 during PCT versus the 3/2/2/1 PCT protocol that I force recommends so there is not estrogen rebound?

"Estrogens form a relatively long actcing pool in the form of inactive sulfates (estrone sulfate primarily) which can be reactivated by enzymes throughout the body. testosterone does not have this property. therefore estrogens have a longer half life


with that in mind SERMS are problematic in that you will go through a period of estrogen domination after discontinuation that can cause problems. this is one reason why AIs are recommended to be used during withdrawal from SERMS."

Original thread
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...3953731&page=4

[VaughnTrue]

So with PA saying that about reversitol(see below, last sentence) shouldnt we be dosing it up 1/2/2/3 during PCT versus the 3/2/2/1 PCT protocol that I force recommends so there is not estrogen rebound?

"Estrogens form a relatively long actcing pool in the form of inactive sulfates (estrone sulfate primarily) which can be reactivated by enzymes throughout the body. testosterone does not have this property. therefore estrogens have a longer half life


with that in mind SERMS are problematic in that you will go through a period of estrogen domination after discontinuation that can cause problems. this is one reason why AIs are recommended to be used during withdrawal from SERMS."

Original thread
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...3953731&page=4

We have yet to see any issues with current dosing procedure, hwoever if you want to dose it that way log it! let us know how it works

[chasinSKURT]

So with PA saying that about reversitol(see below, last sentence) shouldnt we be dosing it up 1/2/2/3 during PCT versus the 3/2/2/1 PCT protocol that I force recommends so there is not estrogen rebound?

"Estrogens form a relatively long actcing pool in the form of inactive sulfates (estrone sulfate primarily) which can be reactivated by enzymes throughout the body. testosterone does not have this property. therefore estrogens have a longer half life


with that in mind SERMS are problematic in that you will go through a period of estrogen domination after discontinuation that can cause problems. this is one reason why AIs are recommended to be used during withdrawal from SERMS."

Original thread
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...3953731&page=4

Nowhere on that page was Reversitol even mentioned... PA was talking about using an AI after a SERM.

[Rippedtohell]

Nowhere on that page was Reversitol even mentioned... PA was talking about using an AI after a SERM.

reversitol has an AI in it

[chasinSKURT]

reversitol has an AI in it

Your missing the point. iForce makes the recommendation on the assumption that your not running a SERM; reversitol is supposed to be an alternative to a SERM.

PA's recommendation was about using an AI after using a SERM.

[Craig Mack]

Your missing the point. iForce makes the recommendation on the assumption that your not running a SERM; reversitol is supposed to be an alternative to a SERM.

PA's recommendation was about using an AI after using a SERM.

/Thread.

[Rippedtohell]

Your missing the point. iForce makes the recommendation on the assumption that your not running a SERM; reversitol is supposed to be an alternative to a SERM.

PA's recommendation was about using an AI after using a SERM.

I understand that its an alternative to a serm, but he recommends titrating up with an AI not down. So dosing 1/2/2/3 leaves your estrogen supressed and then you come off leaving possible rebound? Im sure the blend ingredients doesnt help answering this question.

Can PA chime in on this?

[chasinSKURT]

I understand that its an alternative to a serm, but he recommends titrating up with an AI not down. So dosing 1/2/2/3 leaves your estrogen supressed and then you come off leaving possible rebound? Im sure the blend ingredients doesnt help answering this question.

Can PA chime in on this?

Estrogen rebounds are a myth. Once again, PA's comments about dosing were directed towards those coming off of a SERM; thus they are not applicable to those running reversitol solo.

Your worrying about nothing here... but there's nothing wrong with a little curiosity.

[Sldge]

Actually I have been saying this (for a while now) repeatedly so maybe you are combining the thought of a few posts together?

[THEHUGE]

Starting with the max dose of an AI in pct makes no sense.I've always been saying this.

[chasinSKURT]

Actually I have been saying this (for a while now) repeatedly so maybe you are combining the thought of a few posts together?

Starting with the max dose of an AI in pct makes no sense.I've always been saying this.

I kind of like the idea of loading up on I3C... am I totally off?

[THEHUGE]

I kind of like the idea of loading up on I3C... am I totally off?

You're totally right!!

[kincaid82]

You're totally right!!

hmmmmm. interesting, I3C is something new to me i know it was added to AX to help with the over all formula. By the way the new AX is a step up from the old, which was very good in it's own right.

[iForce Dave]

You're totally right!!

Agreed

And I think the current dosing reccommendation makes sense. As ChasinSkurt explained

[chasinSKURT]

You're totally right!!

I see where you guys are coming from though in regards to AI dosing. How counterproductive would you think it would be to take high doses when they are not necessary? If sldge sees this, I'd also be curious to know if 6-bromo has any effect on SHBG, I know he's very well read when it comes to 6-bromo.

[THEHUGE]

I see where you guys are coming from though in regards to AI dosing. How counterproductive would you think it would be to take high doses when they are not necessary?

An excessive and bad planned use of an AI in PCT could lead to an unbalanced total/free test ratio and so low LH output...early pct: very little testosterone and suppressed LH-->AI-->lowered SHBG and higher free test---->low LH--->low total test.

[kincaid82]

I see where you guys are coming from though in regards to AI dosing. How counterproductive would you think it would be to take high doses when they are not necessary? If sldge sees this, I'd also be curious to know if 6-bromo has any effect on SHBG, I know he's very well read when it comes to 6-bromo.

Same here, seems i will be running the ONE from AN as my first PH in almost 5 years, and i was not very well educated in the past, i like to make sure i get it right this time. 2nd Gear(6-Bromo) and DRIVE are the main recommendations for the PCT, and i like to make sure it is enough.

[iForce Dave]

early pct: very little testosterone and suppressed LH-->AI-->lowered SHBG and higher free test---->low LH--->low total test.

lol I think I see what your saying

[THEHUGE]

lol I think I see what your saying

I bet you can..

[Adjusting]

I bet you can..

This would make increasing total test the primary concern over free test in the pct environment, correct?

[THEHUGE]

This would make increasing total test the primary concern over free test in the pct environment, correct?

Speaking of HPTA recovery,correct.

[VaughnTrue]

This would make increasing total test the primary concern over free test in the pct environment, correct?

in my opinion, yes.



you could add a divanil based tbooster to ur pct like AX or TV2 to help raise free test also

[chasinSKURT]

An excessive and bad planned use of an AI in PCT could lead to an unbalanced total/free test ratio and so low LH output...early pct: very little testosterone and suppressed LH-->AI-->lowered SHBG and higher free test---->low LH--->low total test.

Makes perfect sense. Though many will be stumped. lol

This is something you could really go into detail with. Probably @ LB.

I guess I'm curious as to what type of body chemistry must be present to support suppressed LH, while estrogen is also crushed; how high must free test be to continue to suppress LH in the presence of low estrogen levels?

I'd also be curious as to the efficaciousness of aromatase inhibitors in a state of hypogonadism.

[THEHUGE]

Makes perfect sense. Though many will be stumped. lol

This is something you could really go into detail with. Probably @ LB.

I guess I'm curious as to what type of body chemistry must be present to support suppressed LH, while estrogen is also crushed; how high must free test be to continue to suppress LH in the presence of low estrogen levels?

I'd also be curious as to the efficaciousness of aromatase inhibitors in a state of hypogonadism.

Androgen negative feedback is strong enough to keep the LH suppressed even in a estrogen crushed state.

It has already been extensively discussed @ LB,but I believe you already know that...

[chasinSKURT]

Androgen negative feedback is strong enough to keep the LH suppressed even in a estrogen crushed state.

It has already been extensively discussed @ LB,but I believe you already know that...

LB is a place I don't visit nearly enough. Bar none the most informing forum around!

[Adjusting]

in my opinion, yes.



you could add a divanil based tbooster to ur pct like AX or TV2 to help raise free test also

But AI's already increase free test. Why would we want to add in another free tbooster? Increasing free test may decrease LH once supplementation ceases...right?

[VaughnTrue]

But AI's already increase free test. Why would we want to add in another free tbooster? Increasing free test may decrease LH once supplementation ceases...right?

i dont think itll lower LH...it might SLIGHTLY lower total test however.

[Beejis60]

I understand that its an alternative to a serm, but he recommends titrating up with an AI not down. So dosing 1/2/2/3 leaves your estrogen supressed and then you come off leaving possible rebound? Im sure the blend ingredients doesnt help answering this question.

Can PA chime in on this?

What don't you understand what skurt said?

An excessive and bad planned use of an AI in PCT could lead to an unbalanced total/free test ratio and so low LH output...early pct: very little testosterone and suppressed LH-->AI-->lowered SHBG and higher free test---->low LH--->low total test.

You copying and pastin brah?

But AI's already increase free test. Why would we want to add in another free tbooster? Increasing free test may decrease LH once supplementation ceases...right?

lulz. AIs increase test by binding to the aromatase enzyme. AX or testabolan does not work in that way.

[Adjusting]

lulz. AIs increase test by binding to the aromatase enzyme. AX or testabolan does not work in that way.

I realize that. The outcome is similiar, an increase in free test.

[Sldge]

I kind of like the idea of loading up on I3C... am I totally off?

Nope. We used it for a good reason. I wouldnt go totally nuts with the dosing but the only issues Ive ever seen with it is improper storage.

hmmmmm. interesting, I3C is something new to me i know it was added to AX to help with the over all formula. By the way the new AX is a step up from the old, which was very good in it's own right.

Thanks. I was waiting to see what your feedback of it was. I know you really liked the last version.

I see where you guys are coming from though in regards to AI dosing. How counterproductive would you think it would be to take high doses when they are not necessary? If sldge sees this, I'd also be curious to know if 6-bromo has any effect on SHBG, I know he's very well read when it comes to 6-bromo.

High doses of AI's when they arent necessary? Ill check and see what our blood work was on it. Keep in mind though we were using it for a totally different reason.