What do you think of this 4 day split???

[Darnaldo]

Monday - Chest

Wednesday - Arms

Friday - Shoulders/Traps

Saturday - Back

(Currently not working legs due to sport)

[james0566]

what sport are you doing that would prohibit working your legs?

[Darnaldo]

what sport are you doing that would prohibit working your legs?

I phrased that poorly,

I play soccer.

This is really my legs workout each week.
We have fairly intense training tuesday and thursday with a game usually on Saturday and occasionally on Wednesday.


This makes it difficult to do legs in the gym as the recovery time isnt sufficient.
Basically I train legs in the off season so thats why right now i'm leaving it out...

[DavisForman]

Well thats really not detailed enough for anyone to critique. What exercises, rep/set ranges are you planning on doing?

[Darnaldo]

Well thats really not detailed enough for anyone to critique. What exercises, rep/set ranges are you planning on doing?

Ya i know, i was just seeing first what people thought of the split??

(Have a feeling this will be hammered but its the only way to learn)

Here goes:

Monday - Chest
Reps
1. Dumbell Press : 12, 10 , 10, 8

2. Incline Dumbell Press : 12, 10 , 8

3. Decline Dumbell Flyes : 12 , 10, 8

4. Cable Crossovers : 12, 10, 8, 6

Wednesday - Arms

Biceps
1. Preacher Curl 10, 8, 6

2. Dumbell Curl 10, 8, 6

3. Last exercise is difficult to describe:

Its a barbell curl but I do 3*(3*6)
where the 3*6 consits of 6 reps starting from rest and coming half way up, then 6from half way to chin say, and finally 6 full barbell curls
I do this 3 times so roughly 54 reps in total but with a relatively light weight.

Triceps

1. push ups, 3*12(warmup really)

2. skull crushers 3 * 8, increasing the weight each time

3. dips 3*10 or 3*8 (depends on weighted or not)

4. close grip bench *press 3*8, inc weight each time

Friday - Shoulders/Traps

1. Seated Dumbell Press 12, 10, 8

2. Upright Barbell Row 10, 8, 6

3. Side Lateral Raise 12, 10, 8

4. Barbell Shrugs 12, 10, 8


Saturday - Back

1. Wide Grip Pull Ups 3*6

2. Lat Pull Downs 12, 10, 10, 8

3. Deadlift - 10, 8, 6

4. Barbell Row 10, 8, 6


I occasionally mix around the exercises every once in a while to keep the routine fresh.

So whats the verdict??

[FlyingIllini]

Monday - Chest

Wednesday - Arms

Friday - Shoulders/Traps

Saturday - Back

(Currently not working legs due to sport)

I prefer something like this:

M: back, bis
T: Chest, tris
W: off
TH: off
F: Shoulders
S: legs

Shoulders get worked on back and chest days so this gives plenty of rest between shoulder/chest and shoulder/back. Also, the bis and tris don't get worked twice a week, except for a little minor stress on tris from shoulder day (again with plenty of rest o both sides).

[DavisForman]

Ya it looks pretty decent. But why no barbell press on chest days? I have nothing against using dumbbells, but I find the barbell works a little better for me. What I do is switch between the two for some variety. So maybe you could do Barbell flat, dumbbell incline, barbell decline. Then next week do dumbbell flat, barbell incline, dumbbell decline?

Becuase your active in soccer 3-4 times a week, I think it looks pretty solid. Not to hardcore, nice amount of volume, and your sticking to compound exercises. I still would say try and get legs in some where, but if soccer is as demanding as you say, I think you'd be ok.

[Darnaldo]

Ya it looks pretty decent. But why no barbell press on chest days? I have nothing against using dumbbells, but I find the barbell works a little better for me. What I do is switch between the two for some variety. So maybe you could do Barbell flat, dumbbell incline, barbell decline. Then next week do dumbbell flat, barbell incline, dumbbell decline?

Becuase your active in soccer 3-4 times a week, I think it looks pretty solid. Not to hardcore, nice amount of volume, and your sticking to compound exercises. I still would say try and get legs in some where, but if soccer is as demanding as you say, I think you'd be ok.

Sometimes i do use the barbell, i had a lot of problems with form on both barbell press and dumbell press. Slowly getting rid of bad habits thankfully

What do you think of the wednesday session? Too much maybe?

Also my reps/sets of 12 10 8, does that seem ok?

[tydragonfly]

ya whatever works for you. I think that should help with muscle mass more than strength gain. I do the chest/tri, back/bi thing but whatever works for you. I don't know if I really have bad barbell form but the dumbell press gives me a way better pump than using the barbell. I use DB for flat, incline and then decline with a barbell and then cable flies seem to work really well for me. Sounds like a pretty solid routine to me though. I might do 4 sets instead of 3 on your chest exercises but really looks pretty solid to me.

[Darnaldo]

ya whatever works for you. I think that should help with muscle mass more than strength gain. I do the chest/tri, back/bi thing but whatever works for you. I don't know if I really have bad barbell form but the dumbell press gives me a way better pump than using the barbell. I use DB for flat, incline and then decline with a barbell and then cable flies seem to work really well for me. Sounds like a pretty solid routine to me though. I might do 4 sets instead of 3 on your chest exercises but really looks pretty solid to me.

Cheers, that seems to work really well for you judging by your profile pic...

Do you take any supplements/vitamins?

[tydragonfly]

Do you take any supplements/vitamins?

I'm taking creatine and I have a couple whey shakes a day. I got my first gym membership at the end of dec. I've been working out pretty intently for 2 and half months. I've been trying to eat a lot of complex carbs and just hitting the gym 4-5 times a week. I haven't really taken any vitamins faithfully :S I just ordered some lean Xtreme that I plan to start in about a month and some AST Multi pro 32X multivitamins that I plan to take more faithfully

[DavisForman]

Sometimes i do use the barbell, i had a lot of problems with form on both barbell press and dumbell press. Slowly getting rid of bad habits thankfully

What do you think of the wednesday session? Too much maybe?

Also my reps/sets of 12 10 8, does that seem ok?

It looks like it could possibly be too much, but it might not be either. As long as your keeping it around an hour (give or take 10 minutes), you should be fine. If your watching this ThickAsABrick, I am about to go into further detail When I say an hour, that means an hour of intense exercise. No more than 2 minutes in between sets. If your sticking to that, I don't think you should shoot past an hour.

Ya, try if you can to incorporate barbell work.

I won't make the mistake of commenting on something I really don't know all that much about. I'm still learning things, and have yet to do a rep/set range like what you stated. So I don't really know if that will work or not. I personally do 3x8 and that works really well for me. My advise: try it out and see if it works, or ask someone else on here.

I think that should help with muscle mass more than strength gain.

It boggles my mind when I see people say this. Do you reall think its possible to gain muscle without also gaining strength? SOO many people on this site believe that you can only achieve one or the other. If you simply use your common sense, can you not see that muscle is what gives you strength? More muscle = greater strength. You become stronger = more muscle, because that strength didnt come out of thin air.

[tydragonfly]

lol, but it's true. Muscle Mass does NOT equal strength. Of course you're going to become stronger when you do more reps but you're 1RM may increase very little. My arms are bigger than alot of my friends and they still have a higher 1RM and 12RM. why? because muscle mass does NOT equal strength.

[DavisForman]

Do you realize what your saying? Are their bones assisting in the lifting to make them stronger? No. The only thing that moves weight around is your muscle. Therefore to get stronger, you need more of it. Show me a powerlifter that isn't big. Can't be done bro.

[Darnaldo]

Do you realize what your saying? Are their bones assisting in the lifting to make them stronger? No. The only thing that moves weight around is your muscle. Therefore to get stronger, you need more of it. Show me a powerlifter that isn't big. Can't be done bro.

lets not stray off topic, input has been good so far...

That argument will be around until the end of time...Agree to disagree

Any thoughts on chest day? Ive only started Decline flyes in the last few weeks as something new

Is that enough for chest? I try to keep it fairly intense on chest days, hence the reason its not grouped with another muscle

[DavisForman]

lets not stray off topic, input has been good so far...

That argument will be around until the end of time...Agree to disagree

Any thoughts on chest day? Ive only started Decline flyes in the last few weeks as something new

Is that enough for chest? I try to keep it fairly intense on chest days, hence the reason its not grouped with another muscle

You could add a fifth exercise if you want. 5 exercises a week isn't too bad.

[TAWS6]

Bad idea to hit tris the day after chest. Chest presses hit your tris secondary.

[Darnaldo]

Bad idea to hit tris the day after chest. Chest presses hit your tris secondary.

Its not really the day after though is it?

i mean is 48 hours not enough recovery time?

I hear what your saying man but im gonna give this a go and see how it fares,
opinions?

[DavisForman]

48 hours should be enough. Just feel it out the first couple of weeks, and if it does seem like its too much, move your days around.

[Darnaldo]

I'm taking creatine and I have a couple whey shakes a day. I got my first gym membership at the end of dec. I've been working out pretty intently for 2 and half months. I've been trying to eat a lot of complex carbs and just hitting the gym 4-5 times a week. I haven't really taken any vitamins faithfully :S I just ordered some lean Xtreme that I plan to start in about a month and some AST Multi pro 32X multivitamins that I plan to take more faithfully

I recently got some BSN cell mass, and along with a few 100% ON whey protein shakes a day... I think ill keep it at that for now

What creatine do you use?

The cell mass is kind of strange because theirs no loading period, i'm suspicious already...

[Darnaldo]

48 hours should be enough. Just feel it out the first couple of weeks, and if it does seem like its too much, move your days around.

Ya good point, will creatine play much of a role in the recovery period?

I do really push myself in the gym and often i come out of there feeling that ive over done it...

Especially after a tough arms session, my arms dont seem to grow as they should...

[DavisForman]

Ya good point, will creatine play much of a role in the recovery period?

I do really push myself in the gym and often i come out of there feeling that ive over done it...

Especially after a tough arms session, my arms dont seem to grow as they should...

Creatine causes your muscles to take in more water than they naturally should be able to take in. This causes the ratio of water:nutrients to increase. Which in turn causes nutrients to diffuse through into the muscle at a faster rate to balance out the ratio.

It also assists in creating more ATP in your body, allowing you to work out harder without getting as tired.

I havn't come accross anything saying it speeds up your recovery though.

[tydragonfly]

What creatine do you use?

I just got some cheap stuff from GNC. I got 2 bottles of 90 or 100 servings for like 25 bucks. It's creatine monohydrate. I can check when I get back home

[dkfan9]

Do you realize what your saying? Are their bones assisting in the lifting to make them stronger? No. The only thing that moves weight around is your muscle. Therefore to get stronger, you need more of it. Show me a powerlifter that isn't big. Can't be done bro.

but there is also a difference in where the emphasis will be. And a muscle can become stronger without the individual getting stronger putting on weight... I put on 20 lbs in 2.5 months my Sophomore Year of High School, but when we got new coaches and they put us on a routine centered around lower reps and more compounds, I got stronger a lot quicker than I did during those 2.5 months of gaining weight and I barely put on any weight(mostly due to me not adjusting my diet for my new caloric needs, as well as the amount of cardio/mental toughness drills our coaches had us doing). However, that's not to say the muscle I had packed on didn't account for some of my strength gains i made after putting it on. That's not to say there's not a correlation; however, that correlation is not necessarily direct, 1:1.

[TAWS6]

I take back my comment. My bad. I thought you were working tris tuesday.

[Darnaldo]

However, that's not to say the muscle I had packed on didn't account for some of my strength gains i made after putting it on. That's not to say there's not a correlation; however, that correlation is not necessarily direct, 1:1.

Your gonna confuse the **** out of people on here with that kind of talk. I completely understand your point about correlation and I'm sure if someone was to go and do some sort of analysis on whether a relationship exists between muscle/weight gain and strength increase that they would find some very conclusive evidence...
I think alot of it is down to the person really, everyone is genetically different and two people following the exact diet, and workout plan wouldnt neccesserily have identical gains in strength or size...

[Darnaldo]

I take back my comment. My bad. I thought you were working tris tuesday.

You werent wrong really, tri's 48hours after a rigorous chest workout might just be too soon so...Ill def keep that in mind and If I start to falter, ill change it around...

Ill try keep this thread going with my progress over the next month or so because in all fairness it is an unusual split...

Roll on off season so i can get squatting again

[dkfan9]

Your gonna confuse the **** out of people on here with that kind of talk.

i know. that post of mine was pretty jumbled in the different directions it jumped and the multiple points i was trying to present. i just felt like it'd be a little too much work to go about editing it.

[Darnaldo]

You werent wrong really, tri's 48hours after a rigorous chest workout might just be too soon so...Ill def keep that in mind and If I start to falter, ill change it around...

Ill try keep this thread going with my progress over the next month or so because in all fairness it is an unusual split...

Roll on off season so i can get squatting again

I added in a fifth chest exercise tonight, decline BARBELL press... 3 sets of 10, 8, 6

That is all

[Darnaldo]

Ive come to the conclusion that isolation is for pro's and pro's only...

THis was never going to work from day 1...

I think im gonna go back to back/ bi's , chest/tri's and shoulders/ traps...

Makes more sense.

Any advice on what exercises to drop/keep from the ones above???

Im thinkin maybe 3 excercise per body part