Question, ladies.

[Jaw-Knee]

Do shows like Desperate Housewives and Sex and the City accurately project the way women think about stuff (particularly material wealth and males)?

[spank_lolz]

some women, sure. but there are so many different cultures and subcultures of women, people think different things

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by spank_lolz

some women, sure. but there are so many different cultures and subcultures of women, people think different things

Forgot to mention: Cop-outs aren't allowed.

[Finner]

Originally Posted by Jaw-Knee

Do shows like Desperate Housewives and Sex and the City accurately project the way women think about stuff (particularly material wealth and males)?

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Did I make myself clear?

I'm 34 years old and while I DO have an insane collection of shoes (a habit I started long before Carrie Frickin' Bradshaw ever graced HBO with her presence), those shoes are NOT representative of what real women - in those age categories - are like. Those shows take tiny facets of our thinking and then magnify them exponentially.

The problem, though, that I've run into are twenty-somethings (who were teens when Sex and the City came out) watching those shows and thinking that THAT IS THE WAY REAL LIFE IS SUPPOSED TO BE. Which, as we all know, is horse****.

The original writer of the columns "Sex and the City" (Candace Bushnell) has been annoyed with that issue for a long time. She gets so pissed when she hears that twenty-somethings move to NYC on their daddy's dime and think that life is full of nice apartments and fancy shoes. If you've ever been to NYC, you know that 1) not everybody. . .not even the majority dress like Carrie and her friends; 2) real estate - even rentals - are so phuccing expensive that you spend your entire salary just trying to get a crap apartment. Candace touches on this issue in a book she recently wrote. . .I can't remember what it's called. Something about 5th Avenue or something. She writes about a spoiled twenty-something who wants to live at 1 5th Ave. She really gives that sub-culture hell.

That being said - just like all women everywhere - it's not necessarily the status quo. Not "all" or even "most" ladies in their 20's think in such a bull****ty manner. Most of the women I know aren't like that at all and see the show for what it is: good storytelling.

[paulytosway]

Originally Posted by Finner

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Did I make myself clear?

I'm 34 years old and while I DO have an insane collection of shoes (a habit I started long before Carrie Frickin' Bradshaw ever graced HBO with her presence), those shoes are NOT representative of what real women - in those age categories - are like. Those shows take tiny facets of our thinking and then magnify them exponentially.

The problem, though, that I've run into are twenty-somethings (who were teens when Sex and the City came out) watching those shows and thinking that THAT IS THE WAY REAL LIFE IS SUPPOSED TO BE. Which, as we all know, is horse****.

The original writer of the columns "Sex and the City" (Candace Bushnell) has been annoyed with that issue for a long time. She gets so pissed when she hears that twenty-somethings move to NYC on their daddy's dime and think that life is full of nice apartments and fancy shoes. If you've ever been to NYC, you know that 1) not everybody. . .not even the majority dress like Carrie and her friends; 2) real estate - even rentals - are so phuccing expensive that you spend your entire salary just trying to get a crap apartment. Candace touches on this issue in a book she recently wrote. . .I can't remember what it's called. Something about 5th Avenue or something. She writes about a spoiled twenty-something who wants to live at 1 5th Ave. She really gives that sub-culture hell.

That being said - just like all women everywhere - it's not necessarily the status quo. Not "all" or even "most" ladies in their 20's think in such a bull****ty manner. Most of the women I know aren't like that at all and see the show for what it is: good storytelling.

wise beyond your years...

[Jaw-Knee]

^^^ Okay, that covers Sex and the City. What about Desperate Housewives?

Originally Posted by paulytosway

wise beyond your years...

I'm assuming that was meant to be ironic?

[paulytosway]

Originally Posted by Jaw-Knee

^^^ Okay, that covers Sex and the City. What about Desperate Housewives?



I'm assuming that was meant to be ironic?

not at all, i'm a huge fan of finner's I think she's absolutely brilliant...

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by paulytosway

not at all, i'm a huge fan of finner's I think she's absolutely brilliant...

But she's 34. You'd kinda hope that a 34-year-old woman would know a thing or two.

[Finner]

Originally Posted by paulytosway

not at all, i'm a huge fan of finner's I think she's absolutely brilliant...

Oh! You'll get noodz for that one, buddy. He he he.

Sorry 'bout not being able to answer your question about Desperate Housewives. I watched that show once, threw up and turned off the t.v. Terri Hatcher looks like the Crypt Keeper.

[Finner]

Originally Posted by Jaw-Knee

But she's 34. You'd kinda hope that a 34-year-old woman would know a thing or two.

You never know, Jaw-Knee. . .some of my friends are (bless their hearts) rather. . .umm. . .immature. LOL. How old is that Octomom again?

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by Finner

Oh! You'll get noodz for that one, buddy. He he he.

Sorry 'bout not being able to answer your question about Desperate Housewives. I watched that show once, threw up and turned off the t.v. Terri Hatcher looks like the Crypt Keeper.

I choose to believe that they made her up to look like that. (yes stiffy for Teri Hatcher)

Originally Posted by Finner

You never know, Jaw-Knee. . .some of my friends are (bless their hearts) rather. . .umm. . .immature. LOL. How old is that Octomom again?

As immature as frat rats, club rats and hood rats?

[norinicole]

I would love to be able to join in the discussion, but unfortunately I've never watched more than 3 episodes of SATC, and just recently saw my first ever Desparate Housewives episode.

I'm not sure what they are depicting? Although I do recall at one point asking my bf if there really are women who think like those on Desparate Housewives, cause I sure ain't one of them!

[paulytosway]

Originally Posted by Finner

Oh! You'll get noodz for that one, buddy. He he he.

Sorry 'bout not being able to answer your question about Desperate Housewives. I watched that show once, threw up and turned off the t.v. Terri Hatcher looks like the Crypt Keeper.

Now we have a problem, Terri Hatcher is on my top 10 list of hot women....First, Jen luv, Natalie Portman, Terri hatcher...list to be continued.

Anyway, if i read your prior response correctly, although you don't subscribe to the thinking expressed by the women in these shows, those teenage girls growing up now may come to expect life in those terms. Therefore, is it possible that 5-10 years from now a substantial sub set of women may then think in terms of Carrie and the rest of the gang?

Women who grew up prior to the era of "Desperate Housewives, and Sex In the City" know better than to quantify their own lives in terms of how these women live their lives. However, this may not be so for girls growing up today?

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by norinicole

I would love to be able to join in the discussion, but unfortunately I've never watched more than 3 episodes of SATC, and just recently saw my first ever Desparate Housewives episode.

I'm not sure what they are depicting? Although I do recall at one point asking my bf if there really are women who think like those on Desparate Housewives, cause I sure ain't one of them!

Okay, well Gabrielle (Eva Longoria) is fucking her gardener while her wealthy husband is out working his ass off to acquire more wealth to keep his wife living a luxurious lifestyle. The gardener is a high school kid (which makes me LOL when I think about how so many women give so many men so much **** for checking out jailbait).

At one point after dude finds out Gabrielle's been cheating on him (will give more details if you want me to ruin it for you), she's essentially like, "I said I was sorry, what more do you want?"

Part of their reconciliation is that dude gets to bang another woman, but then Gabrielle gets pissed at dude for banging the "wrong" woman and she kicks him out.

Do women really think that infidelity is acceptable for women but not for the men they're cheating on and that a simple "sorry" is always enough?

Originally Posted by paulytosway

Now we have a problem, Terri Hatcher is on my top 10 list of hot women....First, Jen luv, Natalie Portman, Terri hatcher...list to be continued.

Anyway, if i read your prior response correctly, although you don't subscribe to the thinking expressed by the women in these shows, those teenage girls growing up now may come to expect life in those terms. Therefore, is it possible that 5-10 years from now a substantial sub set of women may then think in terms of Carrie and the rest of the gang?

Women who grew up prior to the era of "Desperate Housewives, and Sex In the City" know better than to quantify their own lives in terms of how these women live their lives. However, this may not be so for girls growing up today?

Wow.

We're fucked.

[paulytosway]

Originally Posted by Jaw-Knee

Okay, well Gabrielle (Eva Longoria) is fucking her gardener while her wealthy husband is out working his ass off to acquire more wealth to keep his wife living a luxurious lifestyle. The gardener is a high school kid (which makes me LOL when I think about how so many women give so many men so much **** for checking out jailbait).

At one point after dude finds out Gabrielle's been cheating on him (will give more details if you want me to ruin it for you), she's essentially like, "I said I was sorry, what more do you want?"

Part of their reconciliation is that dude gets to bang another woman, but then Gabrielle gets pissed at dude for banging the "wrong" woman and she kicks him out.

Do women really think that infidelity is acceptable for women but not for the men they're cheating on and that a simple "sorry" is always enough?



Wow.

We're fucked.

In a nut shell ...yup

[Amanda76]

Originally Posted by paulytosway

Now we have a problem, Terri Hatcher is on my top 10 list of hot women....First, Jen luv, Natalie Portman, Terri hatcher...list to be continued.

Anyway, if i read your prior response correctly, although you don't subscribe to the thinking expressed by the women in these shows, those teenage girls growing up now may come to expect life in those terms. Therefore, is it possible that 5-10 years from now a substantial sub set of women may then think in terms of Carrie and the rest of the gang?

Women who grew up prior to the era of "Desperate Housewives, and Sex In the City" know better than to quantify their own lives in terms of how these women live their lives. However, this may not be so for girls growing up today?

I've never watched "Desperate Housewives," but don't the women in "Sex In the City" all make their own money for the most part? If teenage girls want that lifestyle and knows THEY'RE the ones who are going to have to bust their ass for it, what's wrong with that? Watching the show, I can see a girl wishing she had an "interesting, glamorous job" to afford that lifestyle...but I don't see where she'd get the idea that her daddy was gonna pay for it.

I've watched SINC enough (I actually like that show when I catch it) to see that all 4 women have different relationship personalities. So I'm not sure there's a broad generalization about women's views on men in that one. Maybe I'm missing it because I'm watching it for entertainment purposes instead of learning life values from it, though. LOL

[paulytosway]

Originally Posted by Amanda76

I've never watched "Desperate Housewives," but don't the women in "Sex In the City" all make their own money for the most part? If teenage girls want that lifestyle and knows THEY'RE the ones who are going to have to bust their ass for it, what's wrong with that? Watching the show, I can see a girl wishing she had an "interesting, glamorous job" to afford that lifestyle...but I don't see where she'd get the idea that her daddy was gonna pay for it.

I've watched SINC enough (I actually like that show when I catch it) to see that all 4 women have different relationship personalities. So I'm not sure there's a broad generalization about women's views on men in that one. Maybe I'm missing it because I'm watching it for entertainment purposes instead of learning life values from it, though. LOL

Very perceptive...true. However, playing devil's advocate once more, human nature makes us tend to ignore those things that are uncomofrtable and focus on those things that bring us pleasure. To a young person's delicate psyche they may seem to "conveniently" ignore the fact that these woman worked for there own things, and instead simply focus on the material and glamour. Could this also be possible? Again, I'm a person that loves to ask questions...

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by Amanda76

I've never watched "Desperate Housewives," but don't the women in "Sex In the City" all make their own money for the most part? If teenage girls want that lifestyle and knows THEY'RE the ones who are going to have to bust their ass for it, what's wrong with that? Watching the show, I can see a girl wishing she had an "interesting, glamorous job" to afford that lifestyle...but I don't see where she'd get the idea that her daddy was gonna pay for it.

I've watched SINC enough (I actually like that show when I catch it) to see that all 4 women have different relationship personalities. So I'm not sure there's a broad generalization about women's views on men in that one. Maybe I'm missing it because I'm watching it for entertainment purposes instead of learning life values from it, though. LOL

People can live their lives the way they want to. I'm just curious as to whether or not women in general actually think like the characters in the shows.

[Amanda76]

Originally Posted by paulytosway

Very perceptive...true. However, playing devil's advocate once more, human nature makes us tend to ignore those things that are uncomofrtable and focus on those things that bring us pleasure. To a young person's delicate psyche they may seem to "conveniently" ignore the fact that these woman worked for there own things, and instead simply focus on the material and glamour. Could this also be possible? Again, I'm a person that loves to ask questions...

If their parents never made them stop to think about how they were going to get things they want themselves, there might be some kind of disconnect, but otherwise I don't think so. I mean, most girls don't grow up in such a luxe environment. It's OBVIOUS life isn't that way.

[norinicole]

Originally Posted by Jaw-Knee

Okay, well Gabrielle (Eva Longoria) is fucking her gardener while her wealthy husband is out working his ass off to acquire more wealth to keep his wife living a luxurious lifestyle. The gardener is a high school kid (which makes me LOL when I think about how so many women give so many men so much **** for checking out jailbait).

At one point after dude finds out Gabrielle's been cheating on him (will give more details if you want me to ruin it for you), she's essentially like, "I said I was sorry, what more do you want?"

Part of their reconciliation is that dude gets to bang another woman, but then Gabrielle gets pissed at dude for banging the "wrong" woman and she kicks him out.

Do women really think that infidelity is acceptable for women but not for the men they're cheating on and that a simple "sorry" is always enough?

Oh I remember talking about that part!!! That made me so mad! Why the phuck would he take her back?!

So to your answer, NO. I do not think that infidelity is accepatable at all in any case. I also don't think it gives the partner that was cheated on a 'get out of jail free card'.

I have other thoughts too but I don't want to hijack

[Amanda76]

Originally Posted by Jaw-Knee

People can live their lives the way they want to. I'm just curious as to whether or not women in general actually think like the characters in the shows.

I think people who like to watch those shows can see little EXAGGERATED bits of themselves or people they know in those characters. But again, to me, in SINC all the characters are so different that I don't think you can generalize how women think even based on the show. Maybe I don't understand the generalization you're trying to make, though.

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by norinicole

Oh I remember talking about that part!!! That made me so mad! Why the phuck would he take her back?!

So to your answer, NO. I do not think that infidelity is accepatable at all in any case. I also don't think it gives the partner that was cheated on a 'get out of jail free card'.

I have other thoughts too but I don't want to hijack

He took her back because apparently the show is a representation of what women think and apparently women think it's only right for a husband that "neglects" his wife to take her back after she sleeps around on him. That's what I got out of it, anyway.

So infidelity is grounds for breakup/divorce, yes?

Ah, but if you get the okay to bang somebody outside the relationship then you don't get to set the parameters, right?

Fuck that, contribute. Contribute, I say. You're not hijacking.

Originally Posted by Amanda76

I think people who like to watch those shows can see little EXAGGERATED bits of themselves or people they know in those characters. But again, to me, in SINC all the characters are so different that I don't think you can generalize how women think even based on the show. Maybe I don't understand the generalization you're trying to make, though.

...?

SATC is about a bunch of uppity women who dig expensive material goods and big dicks. Each one is hot **** in her own mind (even the fuck-ugly redhead) and each one can always justify her own actions but criticize others for doing the same thing. All of them apparently enjoy using men. While they all have differing tastes in some respects, they're all fundamentally the same (except for the outspoken slutty one, she just doesn't seem to give a fuck about anything other than cock).

That's what I get out of it, at any rate.

[norinicole]

Originally Posted by Jaw-Knee

He took her back because apparently the show is a representation of what women think and apparently women think it's only right for a husband that "neglects" his wife to take her back after she sleeps around on him. That's what I got out of it, anyway.

So infidelity is grounds for breakup/divorce, yes?

Ah, but if you get the okay to bang somebody outside the relationship then you don't get to set the parameters, right?

Fu[color]ck[/color] that, contribute. Contribute, I say. You're not hijacking.

Yes. I wholeheartedly feel that infidelity is grounds for breakup/divorce. You can't tell me that someone still "loves" their partner and yet they still go off and phuck someone else? There were obviously problems and issues within the relationship that at least ONE of them was feeling, yet didn't communicate with the partner. There is no 'neglect'. If the woman feels neglected, then she better go up to her man and say "I feel neglected." How is the guy supposed to know that something needs to be changed and that his partner isn't happy if she doesn't TELL him?!

And what's with the getting the okay to bang somebody outside the relationship then you don't get to set the parameters?! Why would anyone take that up? It's not a 'Tit-for-tat' situation.

It's taken me a VERY long time to learn how to communicate in a relationship, and I've had my heart broken, and broken other's hearts along the way too because of it. MANY times. (no, never cheated on a bf - just to clarify )


Cheating has nothing to do with neglect. It's a sign of disrespect, distrust and loose phucking morals. And problems within a relationship.

I've also had the opportunity to be the 'other woman', and I've never taken it.

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by norinicole

Yes. I wholeheartedly feel that infidelity is grounds for breakup/divorce. You can't tell me that someone still "loves" their partner and yet they still go off and phuck someone else? There were obviously problems and issues within the relationship that at least ONE of them was feeling, yet didn't communicate with the partner. There is no 'neglect'. If the woman feels neglected, then she better go up to her man and say "I feel neglected." How is the guy supposed to know that something needs to be changed and that his partner isn't happy if she doesn't TELL him?!

And what's with the getting the okay to bang somebody outside the relationship then you don't get to set the parameters?! Why would anyone take that up? It's not a 'Tit-for-tat' situation.

It's taken me a VERY long time to learn how to communicate in a relationship, and I've had my heart broken, and broken other's hearts along the way too because of it. MANY times. (no, never cheated on a bf - just to clarify )


Cheating has nothing to do with neglect. It's a sign of disrespect, distrust and loose phucking morals. And problems within a relationship.

I've also had the opportunity to be the 'other woman', and I've never taken it.

Good. It should be grounds for kicking the cheating trash to the curb.

This begs the question--what do women who think the way you do think when they see a woman like Gabrielle banging other dudes? Dudes who are still in high school, no less?

I know it's better to just drop the cheating SO/spouse and not get into the tit-for-tat, but still--if you say it's okay, then you don't get to be pissed. That's how I see it, anyway. It takes the original cheating party down to an even lower level, in my mind.

Cheating isn't about neglect, but plenty of women are pretty damn quick to pin it on stuff like that.

"Oh, but I was lonely!"

"Oh, but you were at work all the time and there was nobody around to take care of my emotional needs!" (Lol, because sexing the gardener is totally about emotional connection, right?)

"Oh, but you never do anything romantic anymore!" (Further lulz.)

"Oh, but <insert whatever other lame excuse women use here>."

Good. Don't be the other woman.

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by AmandaFit

personally, I don't even watch those shows... they don't really affect me.

I didn't ask whether the shows affected you or not. I asked whether or not women actually think like the women in the shows.

[Finner]

Originally Posted by Amanda76

I think people who like to watch those shows can see little EXAGGERATED bits of themselves or people they know in those characters.

BINGO!

And I assumed that Jaw-Knee was referring to the overall materialism associated with the show. The Manolos, the Dior. . .

And you're correct - the women on Sex And the City all made their own money, with the exception of Charlotte (after she married Trey and quit work in order to have a baby. . .Yes. I've watched that show from begining to the bitter end, multiple times and snuck wine into the theatre when the movie came out. Ha ha ha!)

The show could definitely laugh at itself, too. They even had an episode where four young girls were mimicking their characters (The famous Bat Mitvah episode.). It was a riot.

The girls that I'm referring to, though, in my original response seem to MISS THE POINT of the gals making their own money. They seem to think you graduate college and move right up into a big apartment and "big girl shoes." It's really bizzarre. I keep seeing all these young women who think they are entitled to the finer things without putting in the work to get them. My brain is currently fried from my cardio, so I might not be explaining this very well.

And Pauly. . .I'm sorry. For the first time, we do not agree on something. While I think that Jen Luv and Natalie Portman RULZ ( I LOVE HER!), but Terri Hatcher makes me wanna throw up every time I look at her. I laughed when I saw "Coraline" . . .she played the voice of the evil "Other Mother" and looked JUST LIKE HER when she turned into a spider. Muah ha ha ha.

[Mindi911]

No

/thread

[Jaw-Knee]

Originally Posted by Finner

BINGO!

And I assumed that Jaw-Knee was referring to the overall materialism associated with the show. The Manolos, the Dior. . .

...using men for their money, prestige and penises, thinking it's cool to sleep around when your husband's at work, that sort of thing.

So if women see exaggerations of themselves or their friends, then is it safe to say that women do, to an extent, think like the women in these shows?

[Finner]

Originally Posted by Jaw-Knee

...using men for their money, prestige and penises, thinking it's cool to sleep around when your husband's at work, that sort of thing.

So if women see exaggerations of themselves or their friends, then is it safe to say that women do, to an extent, think like the women in these shows?

I wasn't thinking about the penis part. Hmmm. . .I loved and laughed at the show and I feel that each of the characters represents a small part of me. For example:

I am a writer (part time) and love clothing, like Carrie. I'm not as neurotic and I won't go without a meal for my shoes. . .but I do indulge.

I can be sarcastic (though to a much lesser degree) like Miranda (the red head).

I am rather traditional in certain aspects of my life - very *much* like Charlotte.

And I loooooooooooooooove sex. I'm married, so, I guess I should say "I love sex with my husband." My husband loves and respects me and therefore, I feel totally safe being a very sexual person with him. (shrug) So. . .I think that's what I mean when I say that each of the characters are women - exaggerated and condensed into one character.

Keep in mind that none of the women on Sex and the City "used" men for money. Ever. They all made their own. Charlotte quit working when Trey asked her to stay home so they could focus on a baby. So, that isn't really an issue on that show. So, that must be something out of Desperate Housewives. (Which I don't watch.)

[paulytosway]

Originally Posted by Finner

BINGO!

And I assumed that Jaw-Knee was referring to the overall materialism associated with the show. The Manolos, the Dior. . .

And you're correct - the women on Sex And the City all made their own money, with the exception of Charlotte (after she married Trey and quit work in order to have a baby. . .Yes. I've watched that show from begining to the bitter end, multiple times and snuck wine into the theatre when the movie came out. Ha ha ha!)

The show could definitely laugh at itself, too. They even had an episode where four young girls were mimicking their characters (The famous Bat Mitvah episode.). It was a riot.

The girls that I'm referring to, though, in my original response seem to MISS THE POINT of the gals making their own money. They seem to think you graduate college and move right up into a big apartment and "big girl shoes." It's really bizzarre. I keep seeing all these young women who think they are entitled to the finer things without putting in the work to get them. My brain is currently fried from my cardio, so I might not be explaining this very well.

And Pauly. . .I'm sorry. For the first time, we do not agree on something. While I think that Jen Luv and Natalie Portman RULZ ( I LOVE HER!), but Terri Hatcher makes me wanna throw up every time I look at her. I laughed when I saw "Coraline" . . .she played the voice of the evil "Other Mother" and looked JUST LIKE HER when she turned into a spider. Muah ha ha ha.

Say it ain't so finner..say it ain't so..