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  1. #1
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    Exclamation Does running make you lose muscle?

    OK so ive been bulking for a few months now. gained alot of strength and lots of muscle. I want to lose some of the bodyfat ive put on though and i was wondering if running on a treadmill make you lose so muscle while also reducing bodyfat.
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    Gluconeogenesis will occur after long bouts of intense exercise (2 hours +) without any form of glucose intake (e.g energy drink).

    Originally Posted by http://themedicalbiochemistrypage.org/gluconeogenesis.html

    All 20 of the amino acids, excepting leucine and lysine, can be degraded to TCA cycle intermediates as discussed in the metabolism of amino acids. This allows the carbon skeletons of the amino acids to be converted to those in oxaloacetate and subsequently into pyruvate. The pyruvate thus formed can be utilized by the gluconeogenic pathway. When glycogen stores are depleted, in muscle during exertion and liver during fasting, catabolism of muscle proteins to amino acids contributes the major source of carbon for maintenance of blood glucose levels.
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    www.crossfit.com

    Have a browse around there mate, a couple of metcon sessions a week might be what you're after.
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  4. #4
    flex Magazine June 2008 spirit3530's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by iSkinny View Post
    Gluconeogenesis will occur after long bouts of intense exercise (2 hours +) without any form of glucose intake (e.g energy drink).
    try this ^^^
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    OP.....Without all the chemistry.

    Take a good look at marathon runners. What do you see?

    Take a good look at sprinters. What do you see?

    Your body will adapt and change to the stress its' put under if given enough time. If you want to build muscle or maintain it and simultaneously reduce body fat levels think more like sprinters and less like marathon runners. In other words do short intense bouts of cardio. IMO no more than 20 minutes at a time 3-4 times a week. Any more than that may eat away at muscle. And your diet must be dialed in. Eat clean.
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    I've lost bodyfat by doing what I call intervals on the treadmill. Its short and sweet, but a real test of your cardiovascular system.

    Start at a slow pace for a couple minutes then gradually increase the pace every minute untill you reach five minutes, then slow the pace way down again. Repeat every five minutes and go for a total of 15 to 20 minutes. When I say increase the pace, I mean get it to a point where you're really busting your ass to keep up with the treadmill the last minute of the interval. Try to get on a treadmill that will incline and you can not only increase the pace, but the effort needed to climb that hill.

    Do this 3 or 4 times a week, preferably in the morning and with plenty of rest time before you lift.

    SquatTilYouDrop has good advice.
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  7. #7
    nevigsawkufelgnisaton in10city's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nickl1473 View Post
    OK so ive been bulking for a few months now. gained alot of strength and lots of muscle. I want to lose some of the bodyfat ive put on though and i was wondering if running on a treadmill make you lose so muscle while also reducing bodyfat.
    The answer to the question is, you guessed it, it depends.

    Energy substrate utilization and the catabolic nature of exercise in general is closely tied to many things, including the intensity & duration of the exercise, timing, current hormonal state [cortisol for example], substrate availability, conditioning, mitochondrial development, etc...

    Aerobic activity relies more on fatty acid oxidation. Anaerobic activity relies heavily upon the glycolysis pathway - meaning the activity is fueled by blood glucose, muscle glyocgen, and liver glycogen. And when these become low from aerobic or anaerobic exercise, there is a tendenacy to mobilize glucose from muscle via gluconeogenesis.

    Nevertheless, muscle amino use is typically small under most conditions encountered by "bodybuilders" as the body has an interest in keeping it and using other sources. However, lots of microeffects may give a macroeffect if done repetitively over time as things add up.

    Such things as EAA's/BCAA's and carbs can provide an alternative energy source other than yourself, can assist in the fat utilization process, and can attenuate cortisol elevation. So properly fueled HIIT or SS cardio that is not overly protracted can both be done without scavenging your muscle.

    Now mind you, you can loss muscle and/or size indirectly from the systemic effect of excess aerobic / endurance exercise as it can favor transformation / characteristic changes of muscle fibers like type II B fibers to type II A fibers, type II A to type I over time and can also have a negative hormonal impact [testosterone, thyroid, cortisol].
    Last edited by in10city; 01-17-2009 at 03:28 PM.
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  8. #8
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    Originally Posted by in10city View Post
    The answer to the question is, you guessed it, it depends.

    Energy substrate utilization and the catabolic nature of exercise in general is closely tied to many things, including the intensity & duration of the exercise, timing, current hormonal state [cortisol for example], substrate availability, conditioning, mitochondrial development, etc...

    Aerobic activity relies more on fatty acid oxidation. Anaerobic activity relies heavily upon the glycolysis pathway - meaning the activity is fueled by blood glucose, muscle glyocgen, and liver glycogen. And when these become low, there is a tendenacy to mobilize glucose from muscle via gluconeogenesis.

    Nevertheless, muscle amino use is typically small under most conditions encountered by "bodybuilders" as the body has an interest in keeping it and using other sources. However, lots of microeffects may give a macroeffect if done repetitively over time as things add up.

    Such things as EAA's/BCAA's and carbs can provide an alternative energy source other than yourself, can assist in the fat utilization process, and can attenuate cortisol elevation. So properly fueled HIIT or SS cardio that is not overly protracted can both be done without scavenging your muscle.
    Can someone please decipher these hieroglyphics?....
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  9. #9
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    haha yes please do
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  10. #10
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    [QUOTE=
    Do this 3 or 4 times a week, preferably in the morning and with plenty of rest time before you lift.

    SquatTilYouDrop has good advice.[/QUOTE]

    I thought cardio after..?Dammmmit
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  11. #11
    nevigsawkufelgnisaton in10city's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nickl1473 View Post
    haha yes please do
    Don't go ape**** with the cardio, keep the hard days hard and the easy days easy, keep the sesions of managable length, and fuel it as appropriate if necessary and you have nothing to worry about. Very few things are inherently good or bad. Only when you place them within a frame of reference can you have a meaningful discussion.

    Keep in mind that you lose most of your fat between sessions. Exercise for the most part is the catalyst for change.
    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
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  12. #12
    nevigsawkufelgnisaton in10city's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Keeptryin View Post
    I thought cardio after..?Dammmmit
    You can do cardio in the AM and lift in the PM or you can do them both in one session. Sequence and timing depends upon the individual, goals, available time, etc... Don't agonize over the best time - just do your cardio if you going to do it
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    Originally Posted by Keeptryin View Post
    I thought cardio after..?Dammmmit
    In my opinion, doing cardio right after a hard lifting session is not optimal as your body is hungry for nutrients, especially protein, after 45-60 minutes and delaying it just gives more time for your body to catabolize itself.

    I can only tell you what worked best for me, and that was getting up early in the morning and doing the 20 min of cardio, then lifting right after work. I put the cardio on days that I was not recovering from real heavy work like deadlifts and squats. This worked well for me and I only hit on it after trial and error.

    However, if you don't have the time or don't want to go to the gym twice some days, certainly doing your cardio AFTER lifting is ok (just not optimal IMO).
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    Originally Posted by nickl1473 View Post
    OK so ive been bulking for a few months now. gained alot of strength and lots of muscle. I want to lose some of the bodyfat ive put on though and i was wondering if running on a treadmill make you lose so muscle while also reducing bodyfat.

    If your diet is good then no, you won't lose much muscle. If you are running after weights then take a protein shake in between.
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  15. #15
    The generalist. iSkinny's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TheRealCartman View Post
    If your diet is good then no, you won't lose much muscle. If you are running after weights then take a protein shake in between.
    If you're running immediately after then something to replace glycogen stores - such as an energy drink - would be far more optimal. However if you're lifting AM and running PM then it would go without saying to have your PWO shake post lifting.
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    Originally Posted by in10city View Post
    Don't go ape**** with the cardio, keep the hard days hard and the easy days easy, keep the sesions of managable length, and fuel it as appropriate if necessary and you have nothing to worry about. Very few things are inherently good or bad. Only when you place them within a frame of reference can you have a meaningful discussion.

    Keep in mind that you lose most of your fat between sessions. Exercise for the most part is the catalyst for change.
    Is 30mins with the tredmill set to 5mph on a 3% grade incline too much?
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    Angry

    Originally Posted by A1rh3ad View Post
    Is 30mins with the tredmill set to 5mph on a 3% grade incline too much?
    If this is going to be one of those sites where people downrate you for asking a question then count me out. I'm sorry, I thought that was what these forums were for.
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