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  1. #1
    Registered User LiveForDaPump's Avatar
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    Measurements for deadlift - sumo or conventional?

    1. Secure a tape measure to the wall with the zero end at the floor. Make sure the metric side (centimeters) is what you are using.

    2. Stand with your back against the wall. Measure from the top of your shoulder to the floor. This will give you your total body measurement.

    3. With a straight arm and your hand in a fist, measure from the top of your shoulder to the middle of your fist. This is your total arm length.

    4. Raise your thigh to determine where your thigh rotates into your pelvis. Once located, lower your leg to the floor and measure from the top of the shoulder to this point. This is your trunk length. Also, subtract this measurement from your total body measurement to give you your lower body length.

    Record these measurements and perform the following calculations:

    1. Divide "trunk length" by "arm length".
    2. Divide "trunk length" by "lower body length".

    The resultant numbers will tell you the following:

    1. Arm to trunk length ratio. Example: If your truk is 50 cm and your armi is 65 cm, divide 65 into 50=0.77. This indicates that your trunk is 77% of your arm length or that your arm is 23% longer than your trunk.

    2. Trunk to lower body length ratio.

    These numbers will help you determine which method, conventional or sumo, will allow you to lift the most weight by biomechanical standards.

    CONVENTIONAL
    If your trunk to arm ratio is less than 0.82 and your trunk to lower body length is less than 0.55, you should consider the conventional style. With your arms longer than your trunk, you'll finish the pull with the bar below your hip joint. This finishing position indicates that the initial starting position of your trunk (trunk angle) will be larger (more upright). This would indicate more activity from the quads as well as the hamstrings and glutes. A more upright trunk angle will also create a larger knee angle at the starting position, making the shift of the shoulders, knee, and hip more uniform-that is, they rotate in a biomechanically correct sequence.

    SUMO
    If your ratios are larger than 0.82 and 0.55, the initial starting angle of your trunk would be smaller (more inclined) and will therefore position you in a biomechanically ineffecient position. With your trunk more inclined, the activity of your trunk and hip extension muscles will have to follow a different, more inefficient pattern. This will basically result in increased activity from your hamstrings and glutes and decreased activity from the quads. This will also increase stress on your erectors and particularly the lower back and could cause rounding of your upper back. The solution would be sumo.




    My trunk/arm got 0.80
    Trunk/leg got 0.575

    Should I do sumo or conventional? I have a long ass torso apparently.
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  2. #2
    I AM IRATE SoaringSwine's Avatar
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    Try them both and do the one which you can lift more with... Besides, many lifters train using both as they compliment eachother.
    My PL training Journal: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=115903511
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  3. #3
    Do you even squat? corozco's Avatar
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    I just go based on how I feel. Pulling conventional I don't feel secured in place, and my back tends to hurt a lot since I have disk problems. Sumo on the other hand, my back feels much more relaxed and in a sumo stance I just feel perfectly natural not uncomfortable as when pulling conventional.
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  4. #4
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    0.802816901
    0.587628866

    LiveForDaPump my ratios are just about the same as yours.

    Here is a thread about sumo deadlifting though.
    http://stronglifts.com/forum/sumo-de...ng-t10244.html

    Yesterday I was doing some sumo deadlifts and after I finished my sets I conventional deadlifted the weight and I noticed just how different it is, I used a mixed grip also. It was easy even with my boots on.

    So to answer your question do the one that you can lift most in.
    Last edited by Heavy_Beats; 01-07-2009 at 08:36 PM.
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    Registered User LiveForDaPump's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Heavy_Beats View Post
    0.802816901
    0.587628866

    LiveForDaPump my ratios are just about the same as yours.

    Here is a thread about sumo deadlifting though.
    http://stronglifts.com/forum/sumo-de...ng-t10244.html

    Yesterday I was doing some sumo deadlifts and after I finished my sets I conventional deadlifted the weight and I noticed just how different it is, I used a mixed grip also. It was easy even with my boots on.

    So to answer your question do the one that you can lift most in.
    Wait, what? Conventional was easier for you?
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    Originally Posted by LiveForDaPump View Post
    Wait, what? Conventional was easier for you?
    It sure felt like it, though I will not be testing my conventional deadlift I will stick with sumo deadlift until after my upcoming meet.
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  7. #7
    Registered User LiveForDaPump's Avatar
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  8. #8
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    Originally Posted by LiveForDaPump View Post
    Here's the test to determine sumo or conventional
    I've seen so many of these tests done and explained. I think all they do is confuse lifters. Determining what stance you should use is really as simple as this:

    Have you ever moved furniture? When you reach down to pick up the side of a couch (without thinking about it), what is your stance like? Ever tried to pick up an engine block? What's your stance? Your body will tell you what BASIC stance you should use if you let it. All the little quirks and details are worked out later in training (particularly if you wind up using sumo stance).
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  9. #9
    Strength Enthusiast Retardo-pex's Avatar
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    I would say do both but focus on the one you are stronger with. Meaning, if you were to compete, which way would get you more weight, do most of your heavy work with this form and maybe speed/rep work with the opposite. I pull sumo but will generally rackpull and deficit pull conventional. For general strength training its a matter of comfort but for competition focus on whatever gets you more weight.
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  10. #10
    Registered User notsostrong's Avatar
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    #1 - 1.07
    #2 - 0.72

    best conventional pull: 365lbs
    best sumo pull: 495lbs
    difference: 130lbs

    i SUCK at conventioal pulling. i didn't need a formula to tell me that.
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  11. #11
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    LiveForDaPump, the results of the formula indicate that you have a long torso and slightly short arms. Try switching to sumo and you might find that it's more comfortable.
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  12. #12
    Asian Sensation Billster's Avatar
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    by shoulders do u mean the highest part of the bone or the highest part as in the base of the neck?

    i did from highest part of shoulde bone and got 0.76 and 0.56, conventional is more comfortable for me anyways

    my shoulder height was 61 inches, my grip went down to 32 inches and my pelvic joint was at 39 inches

    Originally Posted by WowWeakForum View Post
    I've seen so many of these tests done and explained. I think all they do is confuse lifters. Determining what stance you should use is really as simple as this:

    Have you ever moved furniture? When you reach down to pick up the side of a couch (without thinking about it), what is your stance like? Ever tried to pick up an engine block? What's your stance? Your body will tell you what BASIC stance you should use if you let it. All the little quirks and details are worked out later in training (particularly if you wind up using sumo stance).
    that does really say much, i've moved things around, but those everyday things will be impossible to pick up "conventional style" coz they are so bulky
    Last edited by Billster; 01-08-2009 at 04:09 PM.
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  13. #13
    Registered User LiveForDaPump's Avatar
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    well the test is right, i am built for sumo

    prior to tday, i had never done sumo deadlifts seriously, just messing around with like 135 or so in the gym once in a while

    i used to struggle with 405x3 conventional style

    today i easily pulled 405x5 sumo style

    i also noticed with sumo i am in a much better position to brace my abs against my belt, conventional used to feel uncomfortable for me and even more so when i put on a belt

    and absolutely no lower back soreness that i used to have for up to 3-4 days after sessions heavy conventional pulling
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  14. #14
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    that does really say much, i've moved things around, but those everyday things will be impossible to pick up "conventional style" coz they are so bulky
    Uh, yeah..it actually says much more than measurements. I could watch you pick up the side of a couch or even the side of a heavy table that's waist high and immediately be able to ascertain what basic stance you should pursue in the deadlift.
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    the test ws right for me, i was conventional, all my numbers were alot lower then they had to be
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    Originally Posted by SoaringSwine View Post
    Try them both and do the one which you can lift more with... Besides, many lifters train using both as they compliment eachother.
    +1.
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