what do you guys think about this Plato quote...

[micky c]

"no man has ever died an athiest"

[bird72]

sure, because all mans, when are going to be face to face with dead said.


oh God, help me, please!

even they negg. him!

and that's no bad, is good to call God in times of afliction, because he is

going to help you.

[micky c]

Originally Posted by bird72

sure, because all mans, when are going to be face to face with dead said.


oh God, help me, please!

even they negg. him!

and that's no bad, is good to call God in times of afliction, because he is

going to help you.

what you wrote makes no sense

[Merakon]

Originally Posted by micky c

"no man has ever died an athiest"

Is he trying to say that mans fear of death is so powerful that it overcomes his rationality?

[Germanic]

What if an atheist is in a car crash and dies suddenly? Did he convert the millisecond before he died?

Stupid quote. Plato is dumb.

[RipThaJacker]

Originally Posted by Germanic

What if an atheist is in a car crash and dies suddenly? Did he convert the millisecond before he died?

Stupid quote. Plato is dumb.

this

[bird72]

Originally Posted by Germanic

What if an atheist is in a car crash and dies suddenly? Did he convert the millisecond before he died?

Stupid quote. Plato is dumb.

plato is dumb, wut!


is my brother born girl, then, i have a sister. noooooo!

[Ibanez]

Originally Posted by micky c

"no man has ever died an athiest"

What do I think about this Plato quote? Nothing, he never stated it.

[Germanic]

Originally Posted by Ibanez

What do I think about this Plato quote? Nothing, he never stated it.

I found it odd that Plato would say something so goddamn dumb...

[Push]

Originally Posted by bird72

is my brother born girl, then, i have a sister. noooooo!

wtf is going on here

[paolo59]

Plato, all things considered, was a very wise fellow. We quote him today, although that might not be a "qualifier" when you consider the **** that is bandied about as a "must know," in today's society. Plato is definately not Britney Spears, Bono, Al Gore, or any number of *******s who proport to be in the "know." I'm a classicist. I"ll take the word of a calcified, centuries removed intellect any day!

[saloman]

Originally Posted by Ibanez

What do I think about this Plato quote? Nothing, he never stated it.

That is what I'm thinking as well. I'm doubtful Plato would have said it for a few reasons, one among them being the lack of Atheists in that era.

[LethalOnGuitarZ]

Originally Posted by paolo59

Plato, all things considered, was a very wise fellow. We quote him today, although that might not be a "qualifier" when you consider the **** that is bandied about as a "must know," in today's society. Plato is definately not Britney Spears, Bono, Al Gore, or any number of *******s who proport to be in the "know." I'm a classicist. I"ll take the word of a calcified, centuries removed intellect any day!

x2

Him or William Blake.

[The Kurgan]

It's a philosophically meaningful statement, which is a good thing philosophy. It's also an empirically false one.

[908]

Sounds good to me. Of course you could try to generate situations that would falsify that claim but I think even atheists would be naive to say that if you know you're approaching your last seconds you won't say "I wonder if my choice in life was right... guess I'm going to find out now." Doesn't necessarily mean you convert right before you die and say "If there's a god please forgive me of all my sins" just more along the lines that while in everyday life as an atheist you spend time preaching that there definitely is no god for various reasons. In the time of death if you say anything but "Ha I'm glad I knew there wasn't a god so I could live my life how I wanted" then you have fulfilld the quote because even skepticism in a small form isn't true atheism.

[maurer]

honestly, i have NEVER found too much value in plato, maybe its because the things he taught have been so ingrained into people's heads through the years that they seem like things that any man could come up with...

but anyway i don't know if this is an actual quote of his, i don't even know that "atheism" was really a topic of discussion during his time (they probably had the idea but thought of it differently/called it something else). but the quote is stupid.

[stateless]

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en...ist%22&spell=1

Two results. Both from you . I guess he didn't say that exact quote.

[Ibanez]

Originally Posted by Germanic

I found it odd that Plato would say something so goddamn dumb...

This is one of those internet things, like the Darwin deathbed conversion.

[ElHombre]

OP, full citation (text, page number, etc) or GTFO. (yes dubious) (no mad)

i doubt Plato said anything like that. maybe the Christian and Islamic theologians who came after him tried to fit him to their religions (St. Augustine is a perfect example) , but Plato himself did NOT say anything like that. for two reasons.

1) Atheism as we understand it today didn't make any sense for the Greeks.

Even Socrates, who was purportedly an 'atheist' for not believing in Athen's gods (this was one of the charges against him when he was tried and sentenced to death), had this notion of a 'demigod' or spirit that was part personal god, part cosmic god, part guardian, part 'guiding force'...it really makes no sense to us Moderns.

The problem is that the Greek mind assumed the world contained in a neat little cosmos, with the earth below the sphere of the stars. While there was no Intentional Creator, the Greeks were impressed by the order and structured workings of Nature and so attributed to it a telos, or meaningful 'life-force.' While many Greeks could be called 'atheist' in the sense that they didn't believe in the gods of Herod and Heraclitus (you know, Zeus and all that jazz), by 480 BC (around Socrates/Plato's lives) most Greeks had merely relegated these to myth. But the same teleology--that there was somehow a force, a meaningfulness, in Nature and the world around them--was retained by the Greeks. Aristotle went to town on this idea.

2) For the reasons in (1), post-Socratic philosophers (namely, Plato, Aristotle) gave two and half ****s about 'god' or 'the god' or 'the gods' in the way we understand the concept.

Plato was arguably the MOST UNINVOLVED ancient philosopher when it came to atheism/god and other theology. theology is the child of Judeo-Christian philosophy (and some Islamic philosophy), NOT ancient Greek thought.

Plato concerned himself with metaphysics, which for him informed the ethics and political activities of man. He had nothing to say about atheism, again, because the notion didn't make sense to the Greek mind.

[5x10]

Originally Posted by Germanic

What if an atheist is in a car crash and dies suddenly? Did he convert the millisecond before he died?

Stupid quote. Plato is dumb.

there werent cars in plato's time brah

[Lucky_ROA]

Originally Posted by 908

Sounds good to me. Of course you could try to generate situations that would falsify that claim but I think even atheists would be naive to say that if you know you're approaching your last seconds you won't say "I wonder if my choice in life was right... guess I'm going to find out now." Doesn't necessarily mean you convert right before you die and say "If there's a god please forgive me of all my sins" just more along the lines that while in everyday life as an atheist you spend time preaching that there definitely is no god for various reasons. In the time of death if you say anything but "Ha I'm glad I knew there wasn't a god so I could live my life how I wanted" then you have fulfilld the quote because even skepticism in a small form isn't true atheism.

THIS^

[The Kurgan]

Again, it's only as true as long as the "proof" for it is speculative. It's as empirically false as the line "There are no atheists in foxholes", just a little less offensive.

[Mr Beer]

Originally Posted by micky c

what do you guys think about this Plato quote... "no man has ever died an athiest"

Since it's obviously incorrect...not much.

[1_COR_16.13_old]

Originally Posted by Germanic

What if an atheist is in a car crash and dies suddenly? Did he convert the millisecond before he died?

Stupid quote. Plato is dumb.

LOL!

I am sure many a people have died atheist, as in an above case but I also agree with bird72 that many do call on God when faced with death.

[DaCougarMech]

Originally Posted by 5x10

there werent cars in plato's time brah

horse crash?

[1_COR_16.13_old]

Originally Posted by DaCougarMech

horse crash?

Arrow through the heart?

[DaCougarMech]

Originally Posted by 1_COR_16.13

Arrow through the heart?

life comes at you fast

[jvinci]

Originally Posted by Ibanez

What do I think about this Plato quote? Nothing, he never stated it.

Originally Posted by Germanic

I found it odd that Plato would say something so goddamn dumb...

Originally Posted by saloman

That is what I'm thinking as well. I'm doubtful Plato would have said it for a few reasons, one among them being the lack of Atheists in that era.

Originally Posted by stateless

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en...ist%22&spell=1

Two results. Both from you . I guess he didn't say that exact quote.

Originally Posted by Ibanez

This is one of those internet things, like the Darwin deathbed conversion.

Originally Posted by ElHombre

OP, full citation (text, page number, etc) or GTFO. (yes dubious) (no mad)

i doubt Plato said anything like that.

LOL wow guise, youve honestly never heard that quote before?

No one has died an atheist. -- Plato (428-348 BCE) "The Republic" Bk. X, 888

http://www.totse.com/en/ego/literary.../philquot.html


you can look it up if you happen to have a copy of "The Republic, bk. 10" around lol





but i think you guise are reading too much into this. U know, people that lived that long ago had sense of humors too. and it was probably written down with a hint of sarcasm, considering how many people say stuff like, "oh no! oh please God no!!!" before they die.

just my 2 cents.

[AKR]

Originally Posted by micky c

"no man has ever died an athiest"

Just as dumb as the "no Atheist in a foxhole" quote. Stupid ideas from people who are so wrapped up in their religion, they can't see anyone else's view point.


Fear cannot create knowledge. If I don't know god exists, if nothing has lead me to become aware of his existence, then I cannot simply gain this knowledge from fear. This is one of the dumbest ideas religious people and Christians in general love to propagate. Probably because a lot of them confuse belief with desire.

[hittman]

Originally Posted by Germanic

What if an atheist is in a car crash and dies suddenly? Did he convert the millisecond before he died?

Stupid quote. Plato is dumb.

rofl

i guess plato never thought about motor vehicle accidents back in 300 bc