On the topic of creatine (informational only)

DLStar64 · 12-21-2008, 05:19 PM

I took this from moleculeoftheday.com. For those of you looking to take creatine or maybe put to rest some of the haters in your life, show them this.

Quote:

Here's one many will have heard of - creatine. Most people know it as a bodybuilding supplement; it is used to add lean mass (from working out harder, and it's contended, some intracellular water retention), as well as allow harder anaerobic workouts before failure. It's the latter we're interested in.

Creatine actually occurs endogenously, and it is synthesized by the liver. An enzyme called creatine kinase exists in the body to move a phosphate from ATP to creatine, making N-phosphocreatine and ADP. This reaction is not very thermodynamically favorable - you will only make 1 molecule of phosphocreatine for every 1000 molecules of ATP or so. This is good, because your body needs the ATP for other things (you've probably heard of ATP as the 'universal energy currency of the body) as well. Phosphorylation of creatine only happens when your body has a large excess of ATP.

The reverse reaction takes place too, and, as you might guess, phosphocreatine still would prefer to transfer its phosphate to ADP, regenerating ATP. It's favored in the low-ATP regime - such as during the last repetition of a weightlifting set. This latter reaction is shown below:

Phosphocreatine/creatine/creatine kinase/ATP/ADP is a system that allows your body to deliver energy very, very quickly. The slow system that generates most of this ATP is glycolysis, which breaks up sugar into useful carbon precursors for the body, as well as CO2 and substantial amounts of energy. It requires oxygen, creatine phosphate-delivered energy does not directly. It is from this that the approximate distinction between aerobic and anaerobic activity comes from - anaerobic activity, like weightlifting, gets energy delivered rapidly from ATP/Creatine phosphate and related systems . Aerobic activity uses energy sufficiently slowly that it can be carried on for longer periods of time, with glycolysis & related systems supplying a good chunk of the energy. Both systems are, of course, in effect constantly to one degree or another, whether you're biking or benching - it's not a black/white distinction.

If anyone has any extra questions or whatever, I'm down to help. As always, rest, a good routine, and solid meals is the key to achieving your maximal physique, not supplements or any tricks.

Pat

the1satanfears · 12-21-2008, 05:22 PM

This should be put in the creatine FAQ, IMO.

DLStar64 · 12-21-2008, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the1satanfears

This should be put in the creatine FAQ, IMO.

so are you saying i posted in the wrong place or that it should be there also? I'm not sure if you're complimenting me...? oh well. thought it could always help, thats how i learned the majority of my knowledge about intra and extracellular activity is through reading random stuff. If anyone is more interested in the scientific jargon involved I have a few good sites I could give them.

the1satanfears · 12-21-2008, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DLStar64

so are you saying i posted in the wrong place or that it should be there also? I'm not sure if you're complimenting me...? oh well. thought it could always help, thats how i learned the majority of my knowledge about intra and extracellular activity is through reading random stuff. If anyone is more interested in the scientific jargon involved I have a few good sites I could give them.

It's a compliment. I think this is pretty decent information, even though bringing it down to this level probably confuses the hell out of many of the people who post here.

HudsonHicks · 12-21-2008, 05:28 PM

Good info, clearly written. However as for putting to rest haters, the general public wont listen to logical argument.

The fact that most people struggle to stay dedicated to lift hard and eat clean means they use any excuse to belittle the achievement of those that do. 'Creatine is steroids and means your muscles are just water' etc.

Repped.

DLStar64 · 12-21-2008, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HudsonHicks

Good info, clearly written. However as for putting to rest haters, the general public wont listen to logical argument.

The fact that most people struggle to stay dedicated to lift hard and eat clean means they use any excuse to belittle the achievement of those that do. 'Creatine is steroids and means your muscles are just water' etc.

Repped.

"your muscle will just be all water" is my favorite argument!!! seeing as more than 2/3 of your muscle is water right....hahahah

BaGeL23 · 12-21-2008, 05:49 PM

Great stuff, although my brains much too tired to attempt to understand the diagram at this point in time. Will rep on recharge. This should be in the F.A.Q

SteezyChr · 12-21-2008, 05:50 PM

I guess im slow, this looks interesting and i couldnt grasp extacly what it was trying to say. Could some sum it up for me in simple words.

clickclickboom · 12-21-2008, 05:51 PM

the real way to convince parents and people like that is to show them something by a credible source - ie. an academic journal/doctors opinion

the1satanfears · 12-21-2008, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clickclickboom

the real way to convince parents and people like that is to show them something by a credible source - ie. an academic journal/doctors opinion

A lot of doctors have no idea about it. My dad's a doctor. He asked a friend of his about it before he let me take it.

clickclickboom · 12-21-2008, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the1satanfears

A lot of doctors have no idea about it. My dad's a doctor. He asked a friend of his about it before he let me take it.

hmm, I just mean like an online one that has spoken about it but yeah I know what you mean. A friend of mine asked his doc and he said it was bad but I asked mine and he said theres no problem with it

DLStar64 · 12-21-2008, 06:12 PM

most doctors will only be required to take or two to three chem/organ chem in their school and will most likely forget it because it in not in their working knowledge to remember equations. Therefor most of them are qualified to give advice of things pertaining to their field. Unless your dads friend is a biochemical engineer or something in that triad, he is just speculating. Its so ironic that americans/most people are so cynical and pessimistic when it comes to new things, and yet when someone claims to be an expert or "special" doctor, we drop our pants and let them **** us in the butt. Be cynical and make your own decisions based on logical information and connotative reports. pubmed.com is a good site for that.

Summary of article:

"ATP is very important to cell energy and work done in the muscles/. When we weightlift, we are using a direct transport system that involves creatine phosphate, which is in what we take when we take creatine. But there is really no distiction between weightlifting or biking in the sense that it makes our body rely on these systems more. Phosphorylation of creatine only happens when your body has a large excess of ATP, so therefore creatine is not naturally a very viable source."

just read it and reread it until you get more and more parts. if you don't understand certain words, look them up on wiki. you gotta learn somehow.