Bumping up to the next weight

[IR45N]

Lurking more than posting but here's a dilemma.

The other night, doing overhead dbell press for tris; 65#; no problem for 10 reps. Decided to try 75# with a spotter; got 6 extremely tough reps that seemed to target the whole upper body. Decided it'd be better to drop down to 70# and those did hit the groove, were all tri's and got 11 good reps.

Maybe it's me or my age, but seems a simple 5# dbell increase or 5#/side barbell increase all too often feels like a 50 or 500# increase. It'd be ok if the increase resulted in 4-6 tough, heavy reps, not d**n near impossible.

Torn between sticking with a weight until the 9th/10th/last rep are about as easy as the first few OR the 'you won't know unless you try' upping the weight (& not talking about an impossible, ridiculous amt. of weight). I do realize a, say, 38/yo can/should be able to up the weight faster and in larger increments.

[Skidmarx]

It's that exercise, man.

I do it with a tricep bar...it's the only exercise I do that I have to break out the 2 1/2 plates to add weight.

[IR45N]

If you mean French presses or skull crushers, I know they're good; they just seem to want to start inner elbow pain when I try them so I avoid them. I'll do press downs, CGB and overhead rope pulls instead in addition to the dbell presses.

[badocter]

Like Skidmarx said, you need to be able to increase in smaller increments on the press... I use a straight bar and have microplates down to 1/2 pound for fine tuning. Depending on the type of dumbbell you use maybe magnetic plates are an option. A quick check on amazon yielded these in 5/8 and 1.25 lb increments:
http://www.amazon.com/PlateMate-Micr...4506493&sr=1-4

[ntrllftr]

Maybe it's me or my age, but seems a simple 5# dbell increase or 5#/side barbell increase all too often feels like a 50 or 500# increase.

It's NOT you or the age.

I do realize a, say, 38/yo can/should be able to up the weight faster and in larger increments.

Not really.

Anyone at any age just starting out this statement may be somewhat true.
Regardless of age if you been training for a while big jumps in weight on any exercise are hard to come by.

[Skidmarx]

If you mean French presses or skull crushers.

French press, and I do it with one of these bars.



I do skull crusher after than, once my elbows are warmed up, otherwise it'll hurt.

[KingWill]

It may not seem like a big increase, but think about the ratio you increased. Going from 65 to 75 pounds on that movement, is like going from 200 to 230 on the bench. That weight change would also result in a dramatic impact on the number of reps. I try to go more instinctive on those lighter exercises with a wider range on my rep range. I typically try to keep it bewtten 8-12 and as soon as I can get 12, I will increase the weight, which might drop me back to 9 reps, and then I stay there until I progress back up to 12 before going up in weight. Even going from 65 to 70 is an increase of almost 8%.

[dbx]

It's NOT you or the age.
Anyone at any age just starting out this statement may be somewhat true.
Regardless of age if you been training for a while big jumps in weight on any exercise are hard to come by.

x 1000

[IR45N]

x 1000

I knew I'd get bit by the 'age' thing. I can hear BH's "*&@!" laced reply too

Cutting to the chase, sticking with the 70# & 10/12 reps for say, 3,4 wks (arms once a week) seems a bit like spinning your wheels vs trying the next heavier weight the 2nd wk. The only thing I can think is, if the 3rd rep @ 75# really sucked in targeting the specific muscle then don't waste the time, energy trying to get 2, 3 additional reps.

Thx guys, age won't be the excuse!

[dbx]

I knew I'd get bit by the 'age' thing. I can hear BH's "*&@!" laced reply too

Cutting to the chase, sticking with the 70# & 10/12 reps for say, 3,4 wks (arms once a week) seems a bit like spinning your wheels vs trying the next heavier weight the 2nd wk. The only thing I can think is, if the 3rd rep @ 75# really sucked in targeting the specific muscle then don't waste the time, energy trying to get 2, 3 additional reps.

Thx guys, age won't be the excuse!

There's also something that most don't want to admit or talk about; there will come a point where increasing weight isn't likely going to happen, and rep increases and/or periodization becomes even more important than ever. And that is age related. There's a lot of bull**** that gets slung around here, but think about it for a minute; if we could all advance just 5# per week, or hell, 5# per month on a given exercise....those who've been at this for 10yrs would be lifting small vehicles by now..... just for warm ups! Just sayin'.......

As long as you challenge yourself at each workout, you're doing fine. As long as I feel spent when I'm done, I don't particularly care what the weight was that I used. Well, at least not as much as I used to .

[ClarkDark]

It may not seem like a big increase, but think about the ratio you increased. Going from 65 to 75 pounds on that movement, is like going from 200 to 230 on the bench. That weight change would also result in a dramatic impact on the number of reps. I try to go more instinctive on those lighter exercises with a wider range on my rep range. I typically try to keep it bewtten 8-12 and as soon as I can get 12, I will increase the weight, which might drop me back to 9 reps, and then I stay there until I progress back up to 12 before going up in weight. Even going from 65 to 70 is an increase of almost 8%.

This is right on point. Once I stopped thinking in terms of upping by pounds, and instead looked at increasing the weight by percentage, I gained a greater and more realistic appreciation for how quickly I could expect to pyramid up. Especially on smaller body parts (such as arms, calves, shoulders) small-percentage increases go a long way.

[chodan9]

but think about it for a minute; if we could all advance just 5# per week, or hell, 5# per month on a given exercise....those who've been at this for 10yrs would be lifting small vehicles by now..... just for warm ups! Just sayin'.......

what
you can't??

what a loser!

[IR45N]

Again, thx.

Some random thoughts: T-nation did do an article in the past year; I think along the lines of upping a weight just 5#/month in 12 months you would have added 60#. Seems I recall they used the preacher curl as an example but I'd guess in some cases, adding 60# to one's bench wouldn't be too shabby either. The flaw (for me on this) probably would be sticking with x weight for a month before adding 5# total and not at some point fudging and adding a bit more and messing up or hitting a wall.

If I'd done 10 @ 65#, 6@ 70#, common sense would have told me not to try the 75#. Since the 65# was easy and when I backed down to 70# and found that not all that tough, it PO'ed me that the 75# crushed me. The 65,70#s I could see as being high rep/heavy weight training (that gets dissed sometimes).

The quality of the 70# reps for tri's was a reminder to me that the first order is building whatever muscle is on tap; the weight amt is secondary.

And yes, 'spent and satisfied' at the end does apply to the weights as well.

[Fifty+]

Again, thx.

Some random thoughts: T-nation did do an article in the past year; I think along the lines of upping a weight just 5#/month in 12 months you would have added 60#. Seems I recall they used the preacher curl as an example but I'd guess in some cases, adding 60# to one's bench wouldn't be too shabby either. The flaw (for me on this) probably would be sticking with x weight for a month before adding 5# total and not at some point fudging and adding a bit more and messing up or hitting a wall.

If I'd done 10 @ 65#, 6@ 70#, common sense would have told me not to try the 75#. Since the 65# was easy and when I backed down to 70# and found that not all that tough, it PO'ed me that the 75# crushed me. The 65,70#s I could see as being high rep/heavy weight training (that gets dissed sometimes).

The quality of the 70# reps for tri's was a reminder to me that the first order is building whatever muscle is on tap; the weight amt is secondary.

And yes, 'spent and satisfied' at the end does apply to the weights as well.

Actually, this is a key point in the progression. Not only do you have to move the weight, your body should become accustom to it. The longer you allow your body to get use to the weight, the less of a challange it becomes. Makes it a lot easier to move up. Unfortunately, we're not only humans, we're impatient bodybuilders. Don't let your mind / ego control the process. Time really is our friend. And you're right, adding 60 lbs. to any lift in 12 months is a good thing. If everyone of us added 60 lbs. to our squat, in 5 years we would all be squatting 300 lbs. and above. If you're going to use a program, believe in it or don't use it at all. There usually is something to the method in all this madness.

[csjunkie]

I would up the weight.

[EnigmaPower]

There is no reason whatsoever the weight or number of reps can't be increased from workout to workout provided one is trying to increase muscle mass. Strength (outside of CNS involvement) is proportional to the cross sectional area of a muscle. As long as your workout is sufficient to stimulate muscle growth. Follow your workout with proper rest, recovery and nutrition then there is no reason strength can't increase.

ETA - Anybody know what the general adaptation syndrome is?

[bird72]

i feel vindicated, with this theme!!!!!!
maybe because i have 1 pound plates for micro-loading and periodization.

remenber 1 pound plates,periodization, etc.

[...Kennedy]

Lurking more than posting but here's a dilemma.

The other night, doing overhead dbell press for tris; 65#; no problem for 10 reps. Decided to try 75# with a spotter; got 6 extremely tough reps that seemed to target the whole upper body. Decided it'd be better to drop down to 70# and those did hit the groove, were all tri's and got 11 good reps.

O/T, I sure hope I'm pressing near those weights when I'm your age...