O/T why no wsm in the olympics ?

[Farley1324]

There is nothing too "athletic" about the squat, dead and bench. Nothing. They are power movements done in single planes of motion. Check out the definitions of "athlete" and you'll find the word "agility" in almost everyone of them. As far as I have seen, not many elite lifters are agile.

Man, your right about synchronized diving. It's almost as dumb as speed walking... almost.

You have a point, but you know you don't want me to list the olympic sports that do not require agility....

[Kiknskreem]

There is nothing too "athletic" about the squat, dead and bench. Nothing. They are power movements done in single planes of motion. Check out the definitions of "athlete" and you'll find the word "agility" in almost everyone of them. As far as I have seen, not many elite lifters are agile.

Is that why they are foundational lifts to athletes in most every sport?

Seriously, come off your high horse back to reality. It is apparent you are high on the fumes of your bumper plates.

The major barbell lifts develop balance, inter and intramuscular coordination, kinesthetic awareness, etc, etc. Now, is that to say that a deadlift requires as much balance and flexibility as a snatch? Of course not, but the fact remains that your statement is objectively false, and also emonstrate a snobbish attitude.

[hatchi]

Holy Jesus, I thought you were joking when you said race walking was an Olympic event. That is one of the WORST sporting events I've ever seen. It's a version of long distance racing, with the most amazingly arbitrary rule that both feet must be on the ground at one point in every stride. They have judges follow them and hand out disqualifications for breaking "form".

How much longer before the Olympics is no more than an international joke? The whole organization is rife with arbitrary rules, poor judging, and retarded sports.

[skinnycalves]

Holy Jesus, I thought you were joking when you said race walking was an Olympic event. That is one of the WORST sporting events I've ever seen. It's a version of long distance racing, with the most amazingly arbitrary rule that both feet must be on the ground at one point in every stride. They have judges follow them and hand out disqualifications for breaking "form".

How much longer before the Olympics is no more than an international joke? The whole organization is rife with arbitrary rules, poor judging, and retarded sports.

NO table tennis is the worst olympic event ever

[Farley1324]

No way.

I vote the walking. Hands down. Let's see who is the fastest....oh, but you have to WALK. Huh?

[75kg]

You have a point, but you know you don't want me to list the olympic sports that do not require agility....

You don't have to tell me, I could list 'em too. Some of the crap "olympic" sports are just a joke.

Is that why they are foundational lifts to athletes in most every sport?

Seriously, come off your high horse back to reality. It is apparent you are high on the fumes of your bumper plates.

The major barbell lifts develop balance, inter and intramuscular coordination, kinesthetic awareness, etc, etc. Now, is that to say that a deadlift requires as much balance and flexibility as a snatch? Of course not, but the fact remains that your statement remains objectively false, and also emonstrate a snobbish attitude.

Ah boy, I've offended Kik. Another 30 post arguement. Listen man, I am not an olympic lifter and am not saying that Olympic lifting is a better sport for athletes than PLing. I AM saying simply, and not trying to disrespect the PLers among us, that the Big 3 are are not athletic lifts. Simply performing these 3 lifts will not make you athletic. Performing these 3 lifts along with other specific exericses will. Like you said, they are FOUNDATIONAL LIFTS in almost every sport, not the only lifts. Do footballers ONLY perform the big 3? Nope. Do Strongmen ONLY perform the big 3? Nope. Do crossfit guys ONLY perform the big 3? Nope. Do Track and Field athletes ONLY perform the big 3? Nope. Do anyone besides powerlifters ONLY perform the big 3 and focus on making those lifts bigger? Nope. Squatting 1000, pulling 900, and benching 1000 are all extremely impressive feats of strength, no matter the gear/fed. Will they give you a 50" High jump? Nope. Will they make you capable of a pullup? Nope. Will they give you a sub 6 minute mile? Nope. Will they give you a big throw? Nope. Will they make you an athlete? NOPE. They will make you an absolutley incredible powerlifter.

Snobbish? Your using the big words

[Kiknskreem]

I AM saying simply, and not trying to disrespect the PLers among us, that the Big 3 are are not athletic lifts.

They are athletic in that they help develop balance, inter and intra-muscular coordination, kinesthetic awareness, force production, commitment, etc, etc.

These are measurable qualities, demonstrated time and time again in the weight room and on the field. You may be of the opinion that the lifts are not as athletic as some others, but your blanket statement is wholly incorrect.

Simply performing these 3 lifts will not make you athletic. Performing these 3 lifts along with other specific exericses will.

Take group A.... 100 untrained persons. Take Group B... 100 persons trained in the performance of the squat, bench, deadlift, OH press, and ideally cleans, but we can omit them for the purpose of this exercise. Now, assume we have a random generator of physical tasks.

Which group do you think is going to come out on top most?

Like you said, they are FOUNDATIONAL LIFTS in almost every sport, not the only lifts. Do footballers ONLY perform the big 3? Nope. Do Strongmen ONLY perform the big 3? Nope. Do crossfit guys ONLY perform the big 3? Nope. Do Track and Field athletes ONLY perform the big 3? Nope. Do anyone besides powerlifters ONLY perform the big 3 and focus on making those lifts bigger?

Who the hell said anything about them being the only lifts? You are pulling this all squarely out of your sphincter my friend.

Is this what they call a "straw-man"?

Snobbish? Your using the big words

You know what we call equating "big words" to being snobbish?



Being a ****ing idiot.

[FatAzz]

They are athletic in that they help develop balance, inter and intra-muscular coordination, kinesthetic awareness, force production, commitment, etc, etc.

These are measurable qualities, demonstrated time and time again in the weight room and on the field. You may be of the opinion that the lifts are not as athletic as some others, but your blanket statement is wholly incorrect.




Take group A.... 100 untrained persons. Take Group B... 100 persons trained in the performance of the squat, bench, deadlift, OH press, and ideally cleans, but we can omit them for the purpose of this exercise. Now, assume we have a random generator of physical tasks.

Which group do you think is going to come out on top most?



Who the hell said anything about them being the only lifts? You are pulling this all squarely out of your sphincter my friend.

Is this what they call a "straw-man"?



I fail to see how olympic weightlifting is any more of a sport than powerlifting... I am assuming you consider weightlifter's athletes?

Olympic weightlifting is not going to effect your pullups and mile time any more than the powerlifts, and I'd like to know of any accomplished olympic lifters who don't squat... olympic weightlifting is, after all, a strength sport.



You know what we call equating "big words" to being snobbish?



Being a ****ing idiot.

But do you seriously think powerlifting will be a better spectator sport compared to wsm ? Of the 3 (bodybuilding, powerlifting and wsm), I felt the first two have very little chances, so I asked the q about wsm.

I also thought there were people here in the know how as to why it is not in and what steps were being taken to add it.

[75kg]

They are athletic in that they help develop balance, inter and intra-muscular coordination, kinesthetic awareness, force production, commitment, etc, etc.

These are measurable qualities, demonstrated time and time again in the weight room and on the field. You may be of the opinion that the lifts are not as athletic as some others, but your blanket statement is wholly incorrect.




Take group A.... 100 untrained persons. Take Group B... 100 persons trained in the performance of the squat, bench, deadlift, OH press, and ideally cleans, but we can omit them for the purpose of this exercise. Now, assume we have a random generator of physical tasks.

Which group do you think is going to come out on top most?



Who the hell said anything about them being the only lifts? You are pulling this all squarely out of your sphincter my friend.

Is this what they call a "straw-man"?



I fail to see how olympic weightlifting is any more of a sport than powerlifting... I am assuming you consider weightlifter's athletes?

Olympic weightlifting is not going to effect your pullups and mile time any more than the powerlifts, and I'd like to know of any accomplished olympic lifters who don't squat... olympic weightlifting is, after all, a strength sport.



You know what we call equating "big words" to being snobbish?



Being a ****ing idiot.

Haha, your real easy to rile up aren't you

You seem to think I'm saying the OLY lifts are better than the Big 3. You are wrong there, it's ok to admit it Simply squatting, pulling and pressing will not make you an athlete. They would undoubtedly make you a BETTER athlete, but they would not, by themselves, make you athletic. I never said OLY lifting was more of a sport than PLing. Quote me saying that and show me the post # and I'll eat my words. In fact, I believe I said exactly the opposite but that seems to have been missed in your multiple quotes. Your right, no one said they were the only lifts. That's exactly my point. But as I said a few sentences ago, simply performing those 3 lifts wont make you an athlete but they will make you a BETTER one. I do happen to consider weightlifters MORE ATHLETIC than PLers. What OLY lifters do requires flexibility, speed, coordination, and overall agility. 3 of those are missing in MOST PLers.

[75kg]

But do you seriously think powerlifting will be a better spectator sport compared to wsm ? Of the 3 (bodybuilding, powerlifting and wsm), I felt the first two have very little chances, so I asked the q about wsm.

I also thought there were people here in the know how as to why it is not in and what steps were being taken to add it.

I forget who said it, but 70 countries must compete in the sport. I'm not sure if Strongman has that many partcipating countries.

Strongman is too diverse to become an Olympic sport and the Strongmen competitors want it that way. The beauty of strongman is that you never KNOW what to expect in your next comp. All the tires are different, the FW implements are different, the axles are different, the stones are different, the odd objects aren't picked from an "approved lineup". For it to be an Olympic sport, all that would have to change so the judges could understand it better for scoring.

[isaku900]

hahaha, rugby needs to come back to being an olympic sport before powerlifting and strongman get any kind of consideration.

[Kiknskreem]

You seem to think I'm saying the OLY lifts are better than the Big 3. You are wrong there, it's ok to admit it

Yes, but how could I ever have gotten that impression?

All that aside, it shouldn't be an olympic sport in it's current format. There is nothing athletic about it. Now if they were to switch it up and make the lineup Snatch, Squat, C&J, Deadlift, it would be a different story. But it will never happen.

So there's nothing athletic about powerlifting with just the big 3, but if we add the snatch and C+J and eliminate bench the sport is now athletic?

I'm sure you can see how this is a little ambiguous, to say the least....

I do happen to consider weightlifters MORE ATHLETIC than PLers. What OLY lifters do requires flexibility, speed, coordination, and overall agility. 3 of those are missing in MOST PLers.

That I would agree that the olympic lifts are more athletic, but not that the big 3 are patently unathletic. A squat requires flexibility, coordination, and balance.

[75kg]

Yes, but how could I ever have gotten that impression?

So there's nothing athletic about powerlifting with just the big 3, but if we add the snatch and C+J and eliminate bench the sport is now athletic?

I'm sure you can see how this is a little ambiguous, to say the least....



That I would agree that the olympic lifts are more athletic, but not that the big 3 are patently unathletic. A squat requires flexibility, coordination, and balance.

I believe you got that impression because you felt offended by me saying the Big 3 were unathletic. So you immediatly jumped to "this guy is obviously an OLY lifter bashing PLers!". I'll admit it wasn't too much a jump, but a jump in logic nonetheless.

As a matter of fact, I made a post suggesting that exact thing on Marunde-Muscle.com. Why not get rid of the most controversal lift, the bench and replace it with the C&J and Snatch? Suddenly, squats would be the only lift to have a valid "gear debate" and no more ridiculous disproportionality where people's arms are artificially stronger than their legs. If you agree that OLY lifters are more athletic, then why would subtracting the Bench and adding the OLY lifts not make it at least as athletic as ONLY the OLY lifts?

Squats do require that, I cannot argue that. But, as best as I can figure, speed is missing. Sure, some guys can make a squat look super fast and effortless, but they, as a body, are not fast. Agility without speed is nothing.

[Kiknskreem]

I believe you got that impression because you felt offended by me saying the Big 3 were unathletic. So you immediatly jumped to "this guy is obviously an OLY lifter bashing PLers!". I'll admit it wasn't too much a jump, but a jump in logic nonetheless.

For whatever reason I already thought you were an oly lifter.

As a matter of fact, I made a post suggesting that exact thing on Marunde-Muscle.com. Why not get rid of the most controversal lift, the bench and replace it with the C&J and Snatch?

Because that would dramatically change the nature of the sport. If anything, the bench press should be replace by an overhead press.

If you agree that OLY lifters are more athletic, then why would subtracting the Bench and adding the OLY lifts not make it at least as athletic as ONLY the OLY lifts?

Both are sports, competitors in both sports are athletes. The olympic lifts do develop more overall athletic qualities, but that doesn't mean the slow lifts are unathletic. There is no debate over which sport develops greater overall athletic ability, just whether or not the big 3 are athletic themselves.

Squats do require that, I cannot argue that. But, as best as I can figure, speed is missing. Sure, some guys can make a squat look super fast and effortless, but they, as a body, are not fast. Agility without speed is nothing.

The slow lifts are the slow lifts. They have inherent strengths and weaknesses, just like the olympic lifts. Being stronger helps one get faster, velocity without force is equally meaningless. As well, the slow lifts can be performed dynamically, as made ever so popular by Louie Simmons.

[75kg]

Both are sports, competitors in both sports are athletes. The olympic lifts do develop more overall athletic qualities, but that doesn't mean the slow lifts are unathletic. There is no debate over which sport develops greater overall athletic ability, just whether or not the big 3 are athletic themselves.



The slow lifts are the slow lifts. They have inherent strengths and weaknesses, just like the olympic lifts. Being stronger helps one get faster, velocity without force is equally meaningless. As well, the slow lifts can be performed dynamically, as made ever so popular by Louie Simmons.

The key element missing from PLing is Agility.O ne of the key elements in athleticism is agility. Strength sits beside it, but agility goes beyond just physical movements. To move the body faster means your mind must work faster to keep up. If your sprinting, swimming, etc, you will encounter unforseen obstacles. Heck, even in OLY lifting you have to gauge when to get under the bar and then do it. .01 seconds too late and you miss the clean. You have to be able to make split second decisions in the more athletic sports. If you encounter an unforseen obstacle in PLing, that usually means injury or gear problems(no starting of a debate) and you either hurt yourself or stop the lift. The "slow lifts" do not train the brain the same way.

I challenge you to put your best C&J overhead without triceps. Your body IS developing force to push the weight overhead. It just doesn't all come from the triceps.

[Kiknskreem]

The key element missing from PLing is Agility.O ne of the key elements in athleticism is agility. Strength sits beside it, but agility goes beyond just physical movements. To move the body faster means your mind must work faster to keep up. If your sprinting, swimming, etc, you will encounter unforseen obstacles. Heck, even in OLY lifting you have to gauge when to get under the bar and then do it. .01 seconds too late and you miss the clean. You have to be able to make split second decisions in the more athletic sports. If you encounter an unforseen obstacle in PLing, that usually means injury or gear problems(no starting of a debate) and you either hurt yourself or stop the lift.

I've made no argument that the big 3 alone will make you an optimum athlete. But they are CLEARLY athletic, for multiple reasons that I have already listed.

I challenge you to put your best C&J overhead without triceps. Your body IS developing force to push the weight overhead. It just doesn't all come from the triceps.

And you think I think a jerk involves primarily a push from the triceps because????

The first time I ever power snatched I did my bodyweight... with atrocious form.

[75kg]

I've made no argument that the big 3 alone will make you an optimum athlete. But they are CLEARLY athletic, for multiple reasons that I have already listed.



And you think I think a jerk involves primarily a push from the triceps because????

The first time I ever power snatched I did my bodyweight... with atrocious form.

"Athletic" would imply they require some agility. It's more than mere semantics

No, look at the second sentence there. Your "body" is producing force. You arms have to help lockout the weight and then help the shoulders hold it there. Are we going to argue about the OLY lifts now?

[Kiknskreem]

"Athletic" would imply they require some agility. It's more than mere semantics

I disagree with the notion that because the big 3 lack a significant agility component, they are unathleitc. Basic strength is foundational to most all other motor qualities. Squatting is the basis for bipedal locomotion... the basic barbell lifts train the body for all the things it was designed to do.

When you squat, press, deadlift, and yes, snatch and clean, you are loading all the basic motor patterns of human movement.

Someone who performs the big 3 alone will have a big leg up on any given physical task than an untrained person. If that person also does presses and olympic lifts, among other things, even better.

No, look at the second sentence there. Your "body" is producing force. You arms have to help lockout the weight and then help the shoulders hold it there. Are we going to argue about the OLY lifts now?

I don't know wtf you are talking about here.

[Heavy_Beats]

If people are not interested in watching people lift heavy stuff they can go watch someone walk...

IMHO strongman and power lifting are very impressive events, its a shame they don't even show it on TV let alone the Olympics.

Equestrian is ridiculous, how about egg and spoon race.

[isaku900]

If people are not interested in watching people lift heavy stuff they can go watch someone walk...

IMHO strongman and power lifting are very impressive events, its a shame they don't even show it on TV let alone the Olympics.

Equestrian is ridiculous, how about egg and spoon race.

how about rugby?

btw: USA is undefeated in Olympic Rugby.

[cjdelaney]

"Athletic" would imply they require some agility. It's more than mere semantics

the argumement that a sport should have to require "agility" to qualify as an olympic event is ridiculous. You saw the race-walk crap in this thread, how about trap shooting? or that ****ing airsoft gun event? ever seen curling in the winter games?

obviously there are multiple precedents for events that dont require "agility".

I think any sane person would agree that a PLer is more "athletic" than an airsoft-gun-marksman.

you fail. Kik owns. as usual.

[slyf0z_87]

I'd like to see strongman in the Olympics, but let strongmen federations themselves decide what to do in these competitions. Their randomness makes it interesting.

Powerlifting, just would not .....I don't know I let my parents watch a powerlifting video once, in the deadlift my mom just said "Eh? Why'd he just drop the weights? Is it done?" and when squatting all my dad could say was "Darn...that wide's sure gonna give you some big hips...I hope you don't do that.?"

I guess with so many years of Oly lifting, people expect the weights to move above the head, not just stop at the thighs.

[BLARZEE]

the argumement that a sport should have to require "agility" to qualify as an olympic event is ridiculous. You saw the race-walk crap in this thread, how about trap shooting? or that ****ing airsoft gun event? ever seen curling in the winter games?

obviously there are multiple precedents for events that dont require "agility".

I think any sane person would agree that a PLer is more "athletic" than an airsoft-gun-marksman.

you fail. Kik owns. as usual.

I don't know man. You still have to hold the gun and everything. Wait nvm



But the bench shirt's doing all the work!

[45BIG]

I will simply add to this debate by saying this: SQUATS PHUCKING RULE the ground we walk upon, the air we breath, and the space we occupy. I don't care if they are front squats, back squats, zercker squats, or squatting while shouldering 600 pound women. There is no debate... squatting should be an Olympic event. Imagine chemically engineered fully geared three hundred pounders shouldering and squatting 1000 plus pounds. Whether we think it's exciting or not doesn't matter. People will watch anticipating the potential train wreck that will occur if the lift is missed.

[Farley1324]

I forget who said it, but 70 countries must compete in the sport. I'm not sure if Strongman has that many partcipating countries.

So, 70 countries compete in walking and trampoline? Really?

Bunch of idiots is what they are!

[Kiknskreem]

The problem is that 75kg is confusing agility, which is one component of athleticism, with being a requisite for something to be athletic.

By his logic, weightlifting is not athletic because it involves no endurance component. Long distance running is not athletic because it involves no power component. Triathalons are not athletic because there is no strength component.

[jonisocool]

Anyone watch that handball **** today. it was a bunch of butch dikes playing a combination of soccer and basketball/flagfootball.

If handball is in the olympics, then powerlifting should be.

EDIT: if they're making up new sports for the olympics, pl'ing should have the right to be in there.

[LessThanLuke]

how about rugby?

btw: USA is undefeated in Olympic Rugby.

I don't think a sport should be in the Olympics if winning a gold is not the pinnacle of that sport. So I would omit tennis to start with lol.

If rugby was in it it would have to be sevens.

[McCannons]

If table tennis is and Olympic event then so should beer pong!

[45BIG]

Anyone watch that handball **** today. it was a bunch of butch dikes playing a combination of soccer and basketball/flagfootball.

If handball is in the olympics, then powerlifting should be.

EDIT: if they're making up new sports for the olympics, pl'ing should have the right to be in there.

Yep, I am putting up drywall in the kitchen and was rushing in and out to watch the action. I figured someone would do a beaver dive in the middle of the court. I am pissed it didn't happen.

Now they have trampoline. LMFAO...phucking trampoline.