Question: Tucking Elbows During Bench Press?

[bbgonnabe]

There's an article on benching on testosterone nation that talks about tucking your elbows during the movement (http://www.t-nation.com/readArticle.do?id=459808).

Can someone explain that to me? What does that look like? How can one tuck one's elbows when doing a wide-grip?


I'm confused. Please help.

[rockhuddy]

you have to touch the bar lower on your chest/stomach, the more you tuck your elbows in the lower you'll need to touch

just remember to keep your wrists directly above your elbows

[thebm]

im pretty sure that if you kept your elbows tucked in, you would just be using your delts and your triceps with very little or no chest involvement, stupid idea imo. but i could be wrong about that...

[justarandomguy]

Originally Posted by thebm

im pretty sure that if you kept your elbows tucked in, you would just be using your delts and your triceps with very little or no chest involvement, stupid idea imo. but i could be wrong about that...

Bench isn't a chest builder, I recently linked a pic of Dave Tate (600lb+ bench) and his freakishly flat chest, but monstrous arms and delts.

Reason? Because lifting with your arms flared is how you tear pecs, lifting with your elbows in is how you build your bench, delts and triceps, you want big pecs specifically, start hitting flyes and crossover type exercises, do a neutral grip dumbell bench, but don't use the flat barbell press as your "chest builder" it's just another upper body exercise, not the solution to a flat chest.

It's just 1 tool in a box.

[bbgonnabe]

I would like more input on this. Anyone out there?

[thedestro]

Originally Posted by justarandomguy

Bench isn't a chest builder, I recently linked a pic of Dave Tate (600lb+ bench) and his freakishly flat chest, but monstrous arms and delts.

1 powerlifter out of thousands with massive pecs?

edit: but yeah, if you're benching primarily to build your chest, don't tuck the elbows excessively.

[bbgonnabe]

I'm not sure I understand what is meant by "tucking"? Does it mean keeping the elbows close to one's sides?

[XXX666]

at the top of the ROM the bar should be blocking your line of site, one the way down you collaspe your elbows into your torso, which in turn i mean your elbows should be pointed towards your knees as you lower the weight. continue this collaspe of elbows pointing down and into your toros, the bar should end up between the bottom of your sernum and the bottom of your chest line below your nipples.

your shoulders make archs, the further away your elbows are from your torso the weaker the synergy of your chest, delts and triceps; which in turns makes the press more of a delt/tricep press instead of a chest movement.

shoulder width or slightly wider, going extremely wide increases the distance of your arms to you torso which again hinders the synergy of the movement.

[aleeboy]

I heard from the trainer at my gym that tucking your elbows in, so the bar sits at nipple level (sorry... don't know how to describe this better) primarily works your triceps more. He said to take it between collarbone and this to engage the chest more.

Any others wanting to add to this?

[DtotheJtotheH]

Originally Posted by aleeboy

I heard from the trainer at my gym that tucking your elbows in, so the bar sits at nipple level (sorry... don't know how to describe this better) primarily works your triceps more. He said to take it between collarbone and this to engage the chest more.

Any others wanting to add to this?

this is about right...


tucking your arms inward will generally increase strength by utilizing your triceps and shoulders more...

you can make this happen somewhat naturally by bringing the bar down to your nipples at the bottom of the motion, and it ill be above your head at the top of the lift (it follows and arc)...

I think a lot of the articles that suggest things like this are more focused toward powerlifters than bodybuilders...flaring the elbows will target the chest more but you should use less weight and definitely avoid any ballistic movement that could cause a tear...

[DieHollywoodDie]

Originally Posted by justarandomguy

Bench isn't a chest builder, I recently linked a pic of Dave Tate (600lb+ bench) and his freakishly flat chest, but monstrous arms and delts.

Reason? Because lifting with your arms flared is how you tear pecs, lifting with your elbows in is how you build your bench, delts and triceps, you want big pecs specifically, start hitting flyes and crossover type exercises, do a neutral grip dumbell bench, but don't use the flat barbell press as your "chest builder" it's just another upper body exercise, not the solution to a flat chest.

It's just 1 tool in a box.

x2!!

[wazzucoug1]

When your lying on the bench, first off, you should have your shoulder blades squeezed together, dug into the bench. This helps concentrate the press onto the pectoral muscles and away from the deltoids.

So you've got your grip and your ready to bench, just before you lower the weight, turn your elbows in. Pretend your trying to physically bend the bar into an upside down "U" shape (lower case n).

Watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUcjOIZc80c

(Minute 3 is specifically what i'm talking about, but watch the entire video!)

[DaPlasurNDaPain]

intersting, will try

[Retardo-pex]

Triceps are the primary mover in the bench press, as stated before. You use several muscles in different portions of the lift, including your delts, pecs and lats, to complete the entire movement but triceps are the best thing you have going for that particular exercise. Any pro bencher, or hell even any mediocre powerlifter will tell you this, you don't get a huge bench from having strong pecs, you have a huge bench from strong tris. Tucking your elbows puts more load on them and will generally allow for greater lifts once you learn how to do it. I think the easiest way of describing a tucked bench press without going into to much detail, is say your normal flared BB type bench your upper arms are at 90 degrees in relation to your torso, in the tucked bench they are more like 45 degrees.

BB type |_o_| PL type \_o_/

not a perfect representation but you get the idea.

[Mark1T]

Originally Posted by justarandomguy

Bench isn't a chest builder, I recently linked a pic of Dave Tate (600lb+ bench) and his freakishly flat chest, but monstrous arms and delts.

Reason? Because lifting with your arms flared is how you tear pecs, lifting with your elbows in is how you build your bench, delts and triceps, you want big pecs specifically, start hitting flyes and crossover type exercises, do a neutral grip dumbell bench, but don't use the flat barbell press as your "chest builder" it's just another upper body exercise, not the solution to a flat chest.

It's just 1 tool in a box.

What a load of bull****. This poster looks at one guy and determines that Flat Bench is not a chest exercise. It is Dave Tate's genetic makeup and not his bench technique, is why he doesn't have a monstrous chest.

The fact is, Flat Bench Press may not be a chect builder for some - not all. And, it is for me.

Sure, if you want to work on increasing your Bench numbers, you tuck in your elbows. However, if you want to concentrate on the chest you do flare out your elbows.

Bench is only part of my chest routine when I periodize, but when executed for bodybuilding, it is very effective.

[J_Bo]

Usually a suicide grip helps you really get your elbows tucked. It's a little tougher to do with a full grip IMO

[thursday22dp]

I had shoulder issues for several months before I realized it was my benching.

For me, flaring my arms just the slightest bit results in extreme front delt soreness and often pain during the lift.


I always tuck my elbows as much as I can, as intructed by my gym owner.

My bench has flown through the roof since doing that.

Oh and you should bring the bar down a bit below nipple level like someone said.

[Retardo-pex]

Originally Posted by Mark1T

What a load of bull****. This poster looks at one guy and determines that Flat Bench is not a chest exercise. It is Dave Tate's genetic makeup and not his bench technique, is why he doesn't have a monstrous chest.

The fact is, Flat Bench Press may not be a chect builder for some - not all. And, it is for me.

Sure, if you want to work on increasing your Bench numbers, you tuck in your elbows. However, if you want to concentrate on the chest you do flare out your elbows.

Bench is only part of my chest routine when I periodize, but when executed for bodybuilding, it is very effective.

He never said bench doesn't work the pecs, but that's like saying squats are a quad builder when they will demolish your glutes/hams more. Rows are a bicep builder as well. His point is that the bench press is not the optimal exercise for pectoral hypertrophy since the pecs are not the prime mover in the exercise. He didn't say that no one who bench presses ever gets a big chest did he?

[Power_11]

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=xTAYAl4g7HE

I think that demonstrates what tucking the elbows is all about.

[Mark1T]

Originally Posted by Retardo-pex

He never said bench doesn't work the pecs, but that's like saying squats are a quad builder when they will demolish your glutes/hams more. Rows are a bicep builder as well. His point is that the bench press is not the optimal exercise for pectoral hypertrophy since the pecs are not the prime mover in the exercise. He didn't say that no one who bench presses ever gets a big chest did he?

I know his point and I made my point. My point is that when I do bench or curls or any exercise, my form is what makes the difference in what muscles are emphasized the most. It is not necessarily the exercise, but how you do it - subtle, but profound difference in technique and results.

[heidt410]

Originally Posted by Retardo-pex

He never said bench doesn't work the pecs, but that's like saying squats are a quad builder when they will demolish your glutes/hams more. Rows are a bicep builder as well. His point is that the bench press is not the optimal exercise for pectoral hypertrophy since the pecs are not the prime mover in the exercise. He didn't say that no one who bench presses ever gets a big chest did he?

keep in mind he is referring to his bench form that doesnt work the pecs as well as other exercises.

OF COURSE!!!!... if you keep you elbows tucked your pecs arent going to be involved as much. But to say that all forms of benching dont hit chest as well as flys is not true. Do all your benching with elbows flared and only doing the bottom 3/4 of the rep and tell me your pecs arent the major mover.

Its all just specific to form.

[Retardo-pex]

Your form can certainly increase the use of a particular muscle over another one, but a prime mover is a prime mover is all I'm saying. Flaring the elbows during the bench press does not turn it into a chest exercise, the prime movers are still the triceps, you are now just placing more stress on the chest and delts during the portions of the lift where they get the most work.

[Mark1T]

Originally Posted by Retardo-pex

Your form can certainly increase the use of a particular muscle over another one, but a prime mover is a prime mover is all I'm saying. Flaring the elbows during the bench press does not turn it into a chest exercise, the prime movers are still the triceps, you are now just placing more stress on the chest and delts during the portions of the lift where they get the most work.

I don't agree with you. What you are stating is your opinion, and not a fact.

By the way, on the flat bench, the closer your grip, the more emphasis is placed on the tris. The wider the grip, less emphasis is placed on the tri and more on the chest.

As an individual, I do not feel much in my delts, if any it is secondary.

You do not do flat bench for tris or for shoulders. Power lifting bench is different than bb'ing bench.

So, you do what you have to do, and I'll do what I have to do and I'll keep growing where I want to grow.

[Retardo-pex]

How is that opinion? I'm not trying to **** on your training style or anything, I'm simply saying the primary mover in the bench press is the tricep, which is a fact. If the pecs played a more important role for this exercise, don't you think more of the top benchers in the world would utilize a form that would involve more pec then tricep? If it were in fact a chest oriented movement the form would be modified by anyone interested in pure strength to utilize more of the chest for the lift, since it would be the stronger muscle group, but it isn't , the triceps are. Grip distance emphasizes some muscles more then other groups, yes. The difference is you can emphasize a particular muscle more, that doesn't mean it is taking over the role of the prime mover.

This is not my opinion.

[J_Bo]

Originally Posted by Retardo-pex

How is that opinion? I'm not trying to **** on your training style or anything, I'm simply saying the primary mover in the bench press is the tricep, which is a fact. If the pecs played a more important role for this exercise, don't you think more of the top benchers in the world would utilize a form that would involve more pec then tricep? If it were in fact a chest oriented movement the form would be modified by anyone interested in pure strength to utilize more of the chest for the lift, since it would be the stronger muscle group, but it isn't , the triceps are. Grip distance emphasizes some muscles more then other groups, yes. The difference is you can emphasize a particular muscle more, that doesn't mean it is taking over the role of the prime mover.

This is not my opinion.

But the point is you CAN make the prime mover be the pecs. It is just not the optimal form for getting the most wieght up. Which is why top powerlifters tuck their elbows. He didn't say that using your chest as the prime mover is going to make you bench more...it simply makes chest the prime mover. And what you're stating is not fact, it is opinion. I know for a fact that I CAN make my pecs the prime movers on bench press, by little subtlties in my form and mind muscle connection. Perhaps you don't have agood mind-muscle connection, but if you did, now that it is VERY possible to change the emphasis of certain lifts. If you couldn't why do many pro bodybuilders use Bench as their MAIN pec movement?

[Retardo-pex]

Originally Posted by J_Bo

But the point is you CAN make the prime mover be the pecs. It is just not the optimal form for getting the most wieght up. Which is why top powerlifters tuck their elbows. He didn't say that using your chest as the prime mover is going to make you bench more...it simply makes chest the prime mover. And what you're stating is not fact, it is opinion. I know for a fact that I CAN make my pecs the prime movers on bench press, by little subtlties in my form and mind muscle connection. Perhaps you don't have agood mind-muscle connection, but if you did, now that it is VERY possible to change the emphasis of certain lifts. If you couldn't why do many pro bodybuilders use Bench as their MAIN pec movement?

Because its pec movement that allows you to place a larger load on the muscle then a fly would. Putting more emphasis on a synergist is not making it the prime mover unless you could take the prime mover out completely. You know for a fact? How do you know that, fatigue? If your chest is not the primary mover in the bench, and you use a form that is meant to place more emphasis on it you A) probably aren't benching as much, which doesn't matter unless you are a powerlifter and B) are putting more stress on a possibly weaker muscle group causing fatigue and failure of the exercise due to more emphasis on the chest. The same can be said about using a close grip too, your triceps aren't all of a sudden weaker, but you will handle and fail with less weight due to more load on them vs if they had the assistance of your pecs. If one link in the chain fails, they all do.

I'm not saying everyone bench close grip or bb bench form is bad or anything, just that triceps are the prime mover, even though it is possible (with any exercise basically) to shift emphasis to a synergist, but that doesn't transform it to the prime mover.

[J_Bo]

Originally Posted by Retardo-pex

Because its pec movement that allows you to place a larger load on the muscle then a fly would. Putting more emphasis on a synergist is not making it the prime mover unless you could take the prime mover out completely. You know for a fact? How do you know that, fatigue? If your chest is not the primary mover in the bench, and you use a form that is meant to place more emphasis on it you A) probably aren't benching as much, which doesn't matter unless you are a powerlifter and B) are putting more stress on a possibly weaker muscle group causing fatigue and failure of the exercise due to more emphasis on the chest. The same can be said about using a close grip too, your triceps aren't all of a sudden weaker, but you will handle and fail with less weight due to more load on them vs if they had the assistance of your pecs. If one link in the chain fails, they all do.

I'm not saying everyone bench close grip or bb bench form is bad or anything, just that triceps are the prime mover, even though it is possible (with any exercise basically) to shift emphasis to a synergist, but that doesn't transform it to the prime mover.

We'll just have to agree to disagree, as you're right, my knowing for a fact is by me assesing my own body, and that doesn't count as proof.

BUT on another note, a Bodybuilding bench usually doesn't result in lockout, at which point I agree that no matter what triceps are the main mover. My elbows only get to about 120 degrees, so it wouldn't be a valid powerlifting bench, but I think it does take much of the triceps out and makes Pecs the prime mover IMO

[XXX666]

This is one of those threads where the misconception of an movement evolves because so many people are doing it wrong.

OP!
#1. when get set up on the bench pull your shoulders back and contract your traps, hold them contracted through the entire set

#2. when you lower the weight keep your elbows in and pointing down towards your knees as best as you can

#3. no need to go any wider than shoulder width

#4. the top of the movement the bar should be diretly in your line of site.

The bar has an arch to it, its not straight up and down. why does it have an arch, because your shoulder is a joint that rotates


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...de/Gray410.png

look at the photo in the above link, note how the strands of muscle fibers make a fan with its focal point being on the humerus.

do the bench presses they way i'm descrbing and i promise results. questions? PM me.

[Poppy83]

Originally Posted by thebm

im pretty sure that if you kept your elbows tucked in, you would just be using your delts and your triceps with very little or no chest involvement, stupid idea imo. but i could be wrong about that...

You are wrong about that. It's not a stupid idea if your goal is to press more weight.

If you have a little sister, then try pushing her with your elbows flared out. Then, measure how far she flies.

Now, keep your elbows tucked in and push your sister again. Measure the distance.


If your goal is to simply work the chest, then yes, a tucked-elbow bench is not going to be the best route.

[Retardo-pex]

Originally Posted by J_Bo

We'll just have to agree to disagree, as you're right, my knowing for a fact is by me assesing my own body, and that doesn't count as proof.

BUT on another note, a Bodybuilding bench usually doesn't result in lockout, at which point I agree that no matter what triceps are the main mover. My elbows only get to about 120 degrees, so it wouldn't be a valid powerlifting bench, but I think it does take much of the triceps out and makes Pecs the prime mover IMO

Yeah I wasn't really trying to start a fight over bench press.