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  1. #1
    Registered User GreenIvy's Avatar
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    Discouragement is taking its toll

    I've been going to the gym for a while now, and in the past month drinking protein powder and everything. I don't do enough cardio, true, but I'm thin to begin with so i just want more muscle so i focus on weights.
    But I naturally hold what seems like all my body in my legs. I want those pretty knees that most girls have, mine have like fat on them and it looks bad, and the slim little ankles I'll never get because mine are just thick, and I HATE the cellulite i get on my hamstrings. It seems like I'd have to workout for years to see any results and my legs are still ugly. I hate wearing skirts and going to the beach because i want very skinny legs and thats not what I've got. Even though i'm 5 10 and 130 pounds, it looks so untoned and i'm sooo discouraged. And i saw this girl at the gym yesterday with muscles you could clearly see when she walks and that what i want. I just feel like it will take me so long and so much work to get there, it will never happen. I want to not be embarressed about what I see in the mirror. I don't care what people try to tell me to feel better, I don't like what I see in the mirror and its taking an emotional toll on me and thats bad.

  2. #2
    deracate chinese frower Mindi912's Avatar
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    Ok calm down, it can't be as bad as it seems.

    What do you do for training exactly and what is your diet like?
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  3. #3
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    Ok, first of all - just want to send some encouragement your way. It takes TIME for these things to happen, and you may need more than a month (or a few months!) to start seeing a lot of progress.

    You mention you've been "drinking protein powder and everything" -- but what does your diet typically look like? Do you track your calories at all? Your diet is a huge factor in the results you will get, and if you're trying to build muscle ESPECIALLY, you need to be eating ENOUGH!

    I don't think the amount of cardio you're doing is the problem. A good weights routine 4x a week or so should put you on the right track. What are you doing right now?

    If you put more details up, I'm sure lots of people can help you out. Bottom line though, don't lose hope... you can definitely see the results you want, it will just take time, hard work and patience
    *Be miserable. Or motivate yourself. Whatever has to be done, it's always your choice.*

  4. #4
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    I feel your pain. I've wanted nothing more over the last 9 months then to have nice legs. Ain't there yet, but it's much improved. The problem with skinny fat is you just have to accept that the muscle is needed first and eat accordingly. Cardio is not necessary at all. It was easier over the cold months as legs are covered up. It's really hard in the warmer months and easy to get depressed. But it will happen. This is just a temporary let down. Keep pushing the protein and weights. I had figured 18 months for recomposition. It may still take me 18 months but I'm getting pretty darn close. I'll still want more muscle but at least I won't be so embarrassed.

    My thighs right above my knee and the backs of my legs are obviously going to be the last place to come in. And it's going to mean lowering body fat, which means I gotta have the muscle weight to do it. Muscle just takes time. So have patience! Shake off the depression and keep going for it! You can't quit!

  5. #5
    Registered User kimm4's Avatar
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    Post what you eat in a day. I'm telling you that's where your problem is...it's not the training.

    No worries...anything can be fixed!!

  6. #6
    Registered User GreenIvy's Avatar
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    Thanks for all your replies. I really appreciate it.
    This is what a typical eating day looks like for me.
    6am protein shake 10 am snack (~250 cals) lunch sandwich and peice of fruit dinner meat like chicken or steak /w rice or potatoes or sandwich or something along those lines (what i consider a mod-normal dinner) snack veggies w/ dip or fruit or something
    On days I eat more I have more energy to workout and get harder workouts, not so much on days i eat less
    Workouts are usually lower body related, 3 x 12 with med intensity. (kickbacks, adductors, abductors, squats, side lifts on multihip, leg press. My lunges are poor, I think i have weak quads, i can only do 2 x 8 at low intensity - working on it) Now adding leg extensions & hamstring curls
    I do this a couple times a week. And the other time I do an upper body workout for arms/ abs/ back and add a little cardio.
    Maybe I'm sitting at too low an intensity to see results or maybe I really need to watch everything I eat very carefully. I do notice when I drink a lot of protein powder I see a significant difference. Almost no cellulite and much sleeker looking legs. Its just hard to stay on just protein shakes though because of all the work lunches/eating with friends or boyfriend/family and thats where the trouble starts and when i notice the huge fluxes in the way my body looks.
    Thanks again for helping guys. Encouraging.
    Would anyone have a suggestion on a good lower body workout that really is good for legs?

  7. #7
    Registered User kimm4's Avatar
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    Your calories are too low and need to be adjusted. Each meal (snacks included) should consist of protein, clean carbs and healty fats.

  8. #8
    deracate chinese frower Mindi912's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by GreenIvy View Post
    Thanks for all your replies. I really appreciate it.
    This is what a typical eating day looks like for me.
    6am protein shake 10 am snack (~250 cals) lunch sandwich and peice of fruit dinner meat like chicken or steak /w rice or potatoes or sandwich or something along those lines (what i consider a mod-normal dinner) snack veggies w/ dip or fruit or something
    On days I eat more I have more energy to workout and get harder workouts, not so much on days i eat less
    Workouts are usually lower body related, 3 x 12 with med intensity. (kickbacks, adductors, abductors, squats, side lifts on multihip, leg press. My lunges are poor, I think i have weak quads, i can only do 2 x 8 at low intensity - working on it) Now adding leg extensions & hamstring curls
    I do this a couple times a week. And the other time I do an upper body workout for arms/ abs/ back and add a little cardio.
    Maybe I'm sitting at too low an intensity to see results or maybe I really need to watch everything I eat very carefully. I do notice when I drink a lot of protein powder I see a significant difference. Almost no cellulite and much sleeker looking legs. Its just hard to stay on just protein shakes though because of all the work lunches/eating with friends or boyfriend/family and thats where the trouble starts and when i notice the huge fluxes in the way my body looks.
    Thanks again for helping guys. Encouraging.
    Would anyone have a suggestion on a good lower body workout that really is good for legs?
    You don't have any proper routine in there it seems to me you just do what you feel and leave it as that.

    The way to get anywhere in this game is to have consistency.

    You aren't eating enough cals as Kim's already stated and you don't eat at regular times.

    Your body has stalled.

    It's time to change this up - eat 6 - 7 smaller meals a day and workout a proper program for the gym.

    btw food beats protein shakes any day - yes i have a couple of shakes a day pre and post workout but I don't live off them. Diet is very key here.
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  9. #9
    Registered User GreenIvy's Avatar
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    But if i eat more, won't I just gain weight and increase my body fat?

  10. #10
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    The ladies are right. Trying to recomposition your body is hard enough. It's next to impossible if you don't get serious about your diet and workout routine. There's no magic pill, just hard work.

  11. #11
    Registered User GreenIvy's Avatar
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    ok..i'll try out a program from the website here and give it a try? thanks everyone

  12. #12
    deracate chinese frower Mindi912's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by GreenIvy View Post
    But if i eat more, won't I just gain weight and increase my body fat?
    Nope you wont' I know it sounds crazy but think of it like this.

    Currently you are eating very little and your body thinks to itself it's going to starve - so it goes into starvation mode.

    Now starvation mode is a funny thing because on the outside you think hahaha the less I eat the more weight I should lose. Your body on the other hand is thinking damn I'm never going to get fed again so I will store every last bit of energy as fat and I'll reserve it for when I really need it.

    Now even though you are still eating your body is still thinking it's not going to get fed and so everything literally everything that goes into your body is getting stored up.

    Now if you eat more and more regularly your body realises and thinks to itself I don't have to worry about starving I can in fact afford to spend as much energy as I need to because I know I am going to fed very soon.

    You will soon see that once you start eating more regular you are going to hungry every 3 hours or so. Your body becomes like clock work and your metabolism speeds up simply because it can afford to 'waste' energy if you want to think of it like that.
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  13. #13
    on a 9-month bulk Tiffany_P's Avatar
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    starvation mode

    The idea of starvation mode is widely exaggerated on these forums.

    Starvation mode doesn't cause people to gain weight. It simply causes weight loss to slow down. If you are starving though, you WILL be losing weight.

    Starvation mode isn't caused by skipping meals. It's caused by severe calorie restriction over a period of time. Even while fasting, your metabolism doesn't slow down until the 3rd day. Eating more frequently does not increase your metabolism. Eating more calories will increase your metabolism, but not so much that it'll cause you to lose weight. That's nonsense.

  14. #14
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    Not eating enough calories slows down the metabolism. So, even though we are eating less, it's hard to lose weight because our bodies are fighting to keep the energy it has stored in body fat.

    Exercise and getting the proper amount of calories (clean foods) will boost the metabolism which helps to burn more calories, lose bodyfat and or weight loss.

    It's that simple...

  15. #15
    deracate chinese frower Mindi912's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tiffany_P View Post
    The idea of starvation mode is widely exaggerated on these forums.

    Starvation mode doesn't cause people to gain weight. It simply causes weight loss to slow down. If you are starving though, you WILL be losing weight.

    Starvation mode isn't caused by skipping meals. It's caused by severe calorie restriction over a period of time. Even while fasting, your metabolism doesn't slow down until the 3rd day. Eating more frequently does not increase your metabolism. Eating more calories will increase your metabolism, but not so much that it'll cause you to lose weight. That's nonsense.
    Where did I say any of this exactly?

    I didn't say it causes you gain weight I said it causes your body to store the food that's put into it hence the reason why you can't lose weight!

    I didn't say that it's caused by a restriction of meals either I said not eating frequently will cause your body to into starvation mode - what I didn't say was because you are more than lightly in a calorie deficit..

    Also where did I say she's lose weight I simply said that her body would not be trying to store the energy.

    You know what your not worth arguing with!
    Last edited by Mindi911; 07-29-2008 at 11:14 AM.
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  16. #16
    deracate chinese frower Mindi912's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by kimm4 View Post
    Not eating enough calories slows down the metabolism. So, even though we are eating less, it's hard to lose weight because our bodies are fighting to keep the energy it has stored in body fat.

    Exercise and getting the proper amount of calories (clean foods) will boost the metabolism which helps to burn more calories, lose bodyfat and or weight loss.

    It's that simple...
    exactly thanks Kim that's what I was trying to say.
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  17. #17
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    Originally Posted by Tiffany_P View Post
    The idea of starvation mode is widely exaggerated on these forums.

    Starvation mode doesn't cause people to gain weight. It simply causes weight loss to slow down. If you are starving though, you WILL be losing weight.

    Starvation mode isn't caused by skipping meals. It's caused by severe calorie restriction over a period of time. Even while fasting, your metabolism doesn't slow down until the 3rd day. Eating more frequently does not increase your metabolism. Eating more calories will increase your metabolism, but not so much that it'll cause you to lose weight. That's nonsense.
    It can cause weight gain. Your body adapts pretty rapidly. Stay on a 1200 a day diet and you'll lose, then plateau, then seem to gain. It causes weight gain with just slight increases in caloric intake. That's the body's response to hoard fat as it doesn't believe the famine is over.

    Eating more will correct the metabolism and once that occurs one will start losing weight at a higher caloric level. Back to the 1200 a day example, get the cals up to 1700 for a period of time, then drop to 1600, and weight loss occurs. The indeterminable question is how long will it take to correct the metabolism.

  18. #18
    on a 9-month bulk Tiffany_P's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by freebirdmac View Post
    It can cause weight gain. Your body adapts pretty rapidly. Stay on a 1200 a day diet and you'll lose, then plateau, then seem to gain.
    You won't start gaining until after you start eating more though, right? I guess I'm confused because a lot of people seem to say things like "you're not losing weight because you're not eating enough" which doesn't make sense to me.

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    Originally Posted by GreenIvy View Post
    I've been going to the gym for a while now, and in the past month drinking protein powder and everything. I don't do enough cardio, true, but I'm thin to begin with so i just want more muscle so i focus on weights.
    But I naturally hold what seems like all my body in my legs. I want those pretty knees that most girls have, mine have like fat on them and it looks bad, and the slim little ankles I'll never get because mine are just thick, and I HATE the cellulite i get on my hamstrings. It seems like I'd have to workout for years to see any results and my legs are still ugly. I hate wearing skirts and going to the beach because i want very skinny legs and thats not what I've got. Even though i'm 5 10 and 130 pounds, it looks so untoned and i'm sooo discouraged. And i saw this girl at the gym yesterday with muscles you could clearly see when she walks and that what i want. I just feel like it will take me so long and so much work to get there, it will never happen. I want to not be embarressed about what I see in the mirror. I don't care what people try to tell me to feel better, I don't like what I see in the mirror and its taking an emotional toll on me and thats bad.
    Well how about some motivation? When you say it will take you so long to do why don't you take a look at http://bodyforlife.com/success/goals/fatloss.asp and see the transformations. It's a 3 month program. I've had great results from the same program. You'd be surprised what you can do in that amount of time. It was incredible motivation for me.

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  20. #20
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    Originally Posted by Tiffany_P View Post
    You won't start gaining until after you start eating more though, right? I guess I'm confused because a lot of people seem to say things like "you're not losing weight because you're not eating enough" which doesn't make sense to me.
    Warning I'm about to mix a bunch of metaphors:

    Your body is an efficient engine that will run off what ever fuel you give it. Whether you fill it up or give it half a tank it will run and when there is no fuel left it?ll start eating itself (in the form of muscle). If you suddenly go on a low calorie diet say below 100 calories. You lose weight for a while because you are losing muscle along with some fat. The problem is your body, the awesome engine that it is, will eventually figure you out and adjust its idle (metabolism) in order to continue to function. But remember, you?ve already lost a load of muscle. So whatever you were losing on when you had some muscle is no longer low enough so your weight starts creeping up. In order to maintain weight loss on a low calorie diet you either have to lower your calories even more?or burn more calories, something that?s hard to do on a low calorie diet anyway. Sorry if I confused you more.
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    Originally Posted by Tiffany_P View Post
    You won't start gaining until after you start eating more though, right? I guess I'm confused because a lot of people seem to say things like "you're not losing weight because you're not eating enough" which doesn't make sense to me.
    If you are under eating based on your BMR and activity level then increase the cals, you may temporarily gain a couple of pounds. Your body will grab the food and try to store it. Keep the cals up and it decides the famine is over and revs the metabolism back up. If your higher cal level is at a deficit based on your activity level, then weight loss resumes. How long you have to be at the higher cals before weight loss starts up again depends on how damaged your metabolism is. But you won't gain loads of fat. A lot of what you gain may just be water from the additional carbs and also muscle pump. If it's severely damaged you just may find yourself at a long lasting plateau with slow fat loss.

    If one is trying to lose body fat and is eating too low, you're really setting yourself for muscle loss. Then you end up skinny-fat and losing body fat becomes an exercise in futility. No matter how much body fat you lose you just don't look right due to not enough muscle.

    Anytime you go below 1500 calories huge red flags should go up. Unless you are in contest prep. Most women will lose at 1600 and above with a reasonable exercise program. Add a bunch of cardio and that number will go up. People seem to have a hard time realizing that all of this exercise raises the metabolism and you have to eat a bit more. Instead many drop the cals and add even more cardio not realizing that their cal level, as high as it might seem, has thrown them into starvation mode. In more extreme cases where someone is doing an hour of cardio every day, plus lifting 5 days a week, and eating 1800 calories they find no weight loss, wonder why, and drop the cals. Then wonder why that didn't work. It's because even at 1800 they are at too large of a deficit. And bingo, starvation mode.

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    Here is a great article from another board:

    http://www.figureathlete.com/article..._lose_more_fat

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    Originally Posted by CutGirl View Post
    Warning I'm about to mix a bunch of metaphors:

    Your body is an efficient engine that will run off what ever fuel you give it. Whether you fill it up or give it half a tank it will run and when there is no fuel left it?ll start eating itself (in the form of muscle). If you suddenly go on a low calorie diet say below 100 calories. You lose weight for a while because you are losing muscle along with some fat. The problem is your body, the awesome engine that it is, will eventually figure you out and adjust its idle (metabolism) in order to continue to function. But remember, you?ve already lost a load of muscle. So whatever you were losing on when you had some muscle is no longer low enough so your weight starts creeping up. In order to maintain weight loss on a low calorie diet you either have to lower your calories even more?or burn more calories, something that?s hard to do on a low calorie diet anyway. Sorry if I confused you more.
    I do "get it." I've heard the argument many, many times. I just don't really buy into it. Maybe it's because I've never had a problem "trying to get enough calories." Personally, I've never had the willpower to starve themselves for long enough to go into starvation mode, because it would be really painful. Also, if one was to eat extremely low calories for an extended time, they may hit starvation mode, but they would still continue to lose weight as they starved, albeit at a much slower rate than when they first started. The men on that famous starvation experiment continued to lose weight during the entire experiment. They lost weight at a much slower rate, but they never gained weight because their calories never increased. Your metabolism can't shut down completely. It can only slow down.

    I completely agree that keeping calories extremely low is not the best solution when it comes to long term results. However, eating more will never lead to immediate weight loss. If I'm not losing weight on 1800 calories, then I'm not going to lose weight on 2000 calories unless my activity level changes.

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    To the original poster, you need a good, solid weight training program. Things like kickbacks and adductor/abductor work are isolation exercises which are not going to do a single thing to your overall appearance. You need the heavy basics like deadlifts, squats, bench presses etc.

    One good program that I really liked and helped me see results when I was still new to bodybuilding was MAX-OT (google it for the program) which focuses on the basics. Even Body for Life might be a good idea for you as it will help you look at both your nutrition and training.
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    Originally Posted by GreenIvy View Post
    I've been going to the gym for a while now, and in the past month drinking protein powder and everything. I don't do enough cardio, true, but I'm thin to begin with so i just want more muscle so i focus on weights.
    But I naturally hold what seems like all my body in my legs. I want those pretty knees that most girls have, mine have like fat on them and it looks bad, and the slim little ankles I'll never get because mine are just thick, and I HATE the cellulite i get on my hamstrings. It seems like I'd have to workout for years to see any results and my legs are still ugly. I hate wearing skirts and going to the beach because i want very skinny legs and thats not what I've got. Even though i'm 5 10 and 130 pounds, it looks so untoned and i'm sooo discouraged. And i saw this girl at the gym yesterday with muscles you could clearly see when she walks and that what i want. I just feel like it will take me so long and so much work to get there, it will never happen. I want to not be embarressed about what I see in the mirror. I don't care what people try to tell me to feel better, I don't like what I see in the mirror and its taking an emotional toll on me and thats bad.
    all i have to say is that you came to the right place these ladies will support you and help you so much its not even funny they are an awesome bunch

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    Thanks guys...I'm gonna pick a program today and stick with it for a while and let you know how I'm doing (probably the Max-OT that was suggested). Its really good to have somewhere to go to ask questions about this stuff.
    Thanks a bunch.

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    Originally Posted by Tiffany_P View Post
    I do "get it." I've heard the argument many, many times. I just don't really buy into it. Maybe it's because I've never had a problem "trying to get enough calories." Personally, I've never had the willpower to starve themselves for long enough to go into starvation mode, because it would be really painful. Also, if one was to eat extremely low calories for an extended time, they may hit starvation mode, but they would still continue to lose weight as they starved, albeit at a much slower rate than when they first started. The men on that famous starvation experiment continued to lose weight during the entire experiment. They lost weight at a much slower rate, but they never gained weight because their calories never increased. Your metabolism can't shut down completely. It can only slow down.

    I completely agree that keeping calories extremely low is not the best solution when it comes to long term results. However, eating more will never lead to immediate weight loss. If I'm not losing weight on 1800 calories, then I'm not going to lose weight on 2000 calories unless my activity level changes.
    nice comments here , I could not agree more - wandered over on your link.
    Why do people not think logically on this issue??
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    Originally Posted by GreenIvy View Post
    But if i eat more, won't I just gain weight and increase my body fat?
    At 5'10" and 130 lbs, you are already at the low end of what is considered a healthy weight for someone of your height. That's a generality, but it doesn't really look like you should be focusing on losing more weight.

    With all the comments you made, I believe you are actually asking how to gain muscle, which won't happen at a calorie deficit. You have to eat to support the more calorie expensive body tissue you are trying to create. I would expect some weight fluctuation and over time you may find yourself at a lean 130 lbs, but you also may find that you're happier weighing more than that when a greater percentage of your bodyweight is comprised of muscle.

    I had to get down to the low end of what was healthy for someone of my height before I realized I had to do things that seemed a bit backward to acheive my goals. I think that raising your calories and lifting heavy will give you the results you desire if you are patient. You aren't going to become lean overnight, though.
    Last edited by Amanda76; 07-31-2008 at 02:18 PM.

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