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Thread: ALA vs. r-ALA

  1. #1
    13S3A BlueFenix13S's Avatar
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    ALA vs. r-ALA

    What is the difference between the two? I've searched and pretty much come up with nothing.

    Which is better for the nutrient repartitioning effect? I'm using Anabolic Pump right now, but I am looking for a cheaper alternative but I can't figure out if ALA or r-ALA would be better. Thanks.
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    Join AENation Trans_Isomer's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Fidelitas626 View Post
    What is the difference between the two? I've searched and pretty much come up with nothing.

    Which is better for the nutrient repartitioning effect? I'm using Anabolic Pump right now, but I am looking for a cheaper alternative but I can't figure out if ALA or r-ALA would be better. Thanks.
    Racemic ALA means it has both the (R) and (S) isomers. They are mirror images of one another, but are not the same thing. So, when you buy ALA, you get a mixture of both S-ALA and R-ALA.

    The beneficial properties of ALA, are derived from the R-ALA isomer. So, I would encourage buying R-ALA over racemic ALA.

    I believe R-ALA to be more supported by the literature, for both being a healthy antioxidant as well as a insulin mimetic over Anabolic Pump. I would go with that over Anabolic Pump product.
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  3. #3
    nevigsawkufelgnisaton in10city's Avatar
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    ALA is typically a 50 : 50 combination of R-alpha-lipoic acid and S-alpha-lipoic acid. An R-ALA form (K, Na) would likely be better than racemic ALA. You probably won't get the same effects though.

    This basically sums it up...

    http://www.geronova.com/products/in_.../lipoic_acids/

    R-Lipoic Acid - Naturally occurring Lipoic Acid, the type the body makes and requires, contains the R form. This gives R-Lipoic Acid significantly more potency and efficacy, because the body "recognizes" R-Lipoic Acid and "knows" how to properly metabolize it (most key enzymes are structured to hold only the R-form).

    S-Lipoic Acid is a by-product from chemical synthesis of racemic alpha Lipoic Acid and may inhibit the most essential properties of the R form, including interactions with proteins, enzymes and genes
    Last edited by in10city; 07-23-2008 at 05:30 PM.
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  4. #4
    onigami!@#!$@ mer-der-ah's Avatar
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    what about kr-ala? it's even better than r-ala and requires less to get the desired effect.
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  5. #5
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    So it would be better to get an r-ALA product rather than a pure ALA product (for example, AST's R-ALA instead of PrimaForce's Pure ALA)?
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    Originally Posted by mer-der-ah View Post
    what about kr-ala? it's even better than r-ala and requires less to get the desired effect.
    Why is it better?

    Originally Posted by Fidelitas626 View Post
    So it would be better to get an r-ALA product rather than a pure ALA product (for example, AST's R-ALA instead of PrimaForce's Pure ALA)?
    Or Primaforce's R-ALA product over AST's. Your choice. Yes a R-ALA is better.
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  7. #7
    PT, DPT, PMA-CPT riseboi's Avatar
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    You might want to look into this thread:

    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...&highlight=ALA
    Physical Therapist

    My thoughts are just that; thoughts. Take anything I say with a grain of salt.
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  8. #8
    chasn w8t's like its pu$y Jamps's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Trans_Isomer View Post
    Why is it better?
    bump
    PimPin Iron ain't easy, but i do it though...1 plate at a time. So watch how i Get'er done in my workout journal: http://tinyurl.com/

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  9. #9
    onigami!@#!$@ mer-der-ah's Avatar
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    pure, unstabilized RLA has an extremely low GI absorption and bioavailability. unstablized RLA utizilized in most commercially available RLA products has an extremely poor disintegration/dissolution profile and tend to polymerize.

    K-RALA is convereted to its more potent form R-dihydrolipoic acid, after reacting with and neutralizing an oxidant. R-dihydrolipoic acid is the reduced form of RLA, and is the only form that functions directly as an antioxidant. free RLA is rapidly taken up by cells and reduced to R-DHLA intracellularly. Although only R-DHLA functions directly as an antioxidant, RLA may have indirect antioxidant effects. a significant factor in aging is the decay of the mitochondria and as we age, the efficiency of the mitochondria diminishes, as well as their quantity per cell. K-RALA functions as a critical cofactor in several important enzymes related to energy metabolism. K-RALA is part of a potent antioxidant couple (with R-DHLA) that detoxifies the free radicals released during the energy-producing process. K-RALA has a significant effect on other cellular antioxidants such as vitamins C and E, as well as CoQ10 and glutathione.

    K-RALA lowers the oxidative stress on the body. this stress is due to the tendency of oxidants to attack the body's molecular components. a high level of free radicals causes high oxidative stress. K-RALA has the ability to enter both lipid and water environments, unlike other antioxidants that are not capable of this dual function. K-RALA can protect the entire cell; the fatty cellular environments such as membranes, as well as the water-soluble cellular components that comprise the major part of the cell. K-RALA functions as a coenzyme by enhancing the utilization and disposal of glucose.
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  10. #10
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    NA-RALA is currently the best form of stable R-Lipoic acid available.

    http://www.geronova.com/products/in_...cid/k-rala.php
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    Thumbs down

    Originally Posted by mer-der-ah View Post
    pure, unstabilized RLA has an extremely low GI absorption and bioavailability. unstablized RLA utizilized in most commercially available RLA products has an extremely poor disintegration/dissolution profile and tend to polymerize.

    K-RALA is convereted to its more potent form R-dihydrolipoic acid, after reacting with and neutralizing an oxidant. R-dihydrolipoic acid is the reduced form of RLA, and is the only form that functions directly as an antioxidant. free RLA is rapidly taken up by cells and reduced to R-DHLA intracellularly. Although only R-DHLA functions directly as an antioxidant, RLA may have indirect antioxidant effects. a significant factor in aging is the decay of the mitochondria and as we age, the efficiency of the mitochondria diminishes, as well as their quantity per cell. K-RALA functions as a critical cofactor in several important enzymes related to energy metabolism. K-RALA is part of a potent antioxidant couple (with R-DHLA) that detoxifies the free radicals released during the energy-producing process. K-RALA has a significant effect on other cellular antioxidants such as vitamins C and E, as well as CoQ10 and glutathione.

    K-RALA lowers the oxidative stress on the body. this stress is due to the tendency of oxidants to attack the body's molecular components. a high level of free radicals causes high oxidative stress. K-RALA has the ability to enter both lipid and water environments, unlike other antioxidants that are not capable of this dual function. K-RALA can protect the entire cell; the fatty cellular environments such as membranes, as well as the water-soluble cellular components that comprise the major part of the cell. K-RALA functions as a coenzyme by enhancing the utilization and disposal of glucose.

    Nice copy and paste job. You sound so smart.

    http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/pfac/krala.html
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    [1] "RLA is barely distinguishable from baseline"

    [2] "RLA is not suitable for use in nutraceutical or pharmaceutical products."


    Originally Posted by NO HYPE View Post
    It looks as if anyone who is supplementing R-ALA.... is unaware of the truth.

    So either way, we are getting scammed????


    Results

    Baseline levels of RLA (Limit of Detection ~50-250 ng/mL) could be detected by liberation from plasma proteins with mobile phase using a modification of the method of Chen et al. (46) Although previous studies indicate rac-LA does not accumulate in blood or tissues, (17) in the present study baseline RLA was detected only in subjects who are regular users of a mixture of RLA and R-DHLA, even subsequent to a three-day washout period at levels of 0.05-0.25 mcg/mL. Analysis of the plasma concentration-time curves in a preliminary study with two subjects revealed that 600 mg pure RLA yields low Cmax and bioavailability (as measured by AUC) values, significantly lower than an equivalent weight of rac-LA. (43) The preliminary study provided the first published PK values for NaRLA. The Cmax and AUC values for NaRLA in the male subject were 25.86 and 3.3 times higher, respectively, than RLA. In the female subject, NaRLA produced Cmax and AUC values 17.9 and 2.67 times higher, respectively, than pure RLA. (43) RLA (100 mg; commonly found in nutritional supplements) is barely distinguishable from baseline, presumably due to poor absorption (data not shown). As expected, use of RLA as the pre-dissolved sodium salt resulted in significant increases in Cmax and AUC in all 12 subjects (Figure 2; Table 2). The average dose was 8.25 mg/kg, generating a mean Cmax of 16.03 mcg/mL (range: 10.6-33.8 mcg/mL), median Tmax of 15 minutes (range: 10-20 minutes), and mean AUC of 441.59 mcg min/mL (7.36 mcg hr/mL). The plasma concentration time profile had negligible effect on plasma glucose levels measured at each time point. Subject 3 consumed three 600-mg doses of RLA (as NaRLA) (Figure 3), resulting in a Cmax of 21.9 mcg/mL, AUC of 1,049 mcg min/mL (17.48 mcg x hr/mL), and extended the Tmax out to 45 minutes. An unexpected finding of this study was that, at plasma concentrations as high as 30 mcg/mL (~150 [micro]M) (Cmax subject 6), negligible free RLA was detected.


    Discussion

    Although the clinical significance of baseline RLA (0.05-0.25 mcg/mL) is not fully characterized, previous trials have correlated low baseline RLA with a variety of disease states. (7,10,49-52) It has been suggested that the presence of RLA in plasma may function to maintain the plasma redox status, which shifts to a more oxidized state with age and in numerous diseases. (53,54) The current study and previous findings from this laboratory conclude that pure RLA is not suitable for use in nutraceutical or pharmaceutical products. Rather, it should be treated as raw material for further processing into stable, bioavailable dosage forms. PK data reveals pure RLA is significantly less bioavailable than RLA found as a 50-percent component of rac-LA; and RLA in a salt form is considerably more bioavailable than an equivalent dose of racLA (RLA + SLA). This indicates SLA may function as a competitive inhibitor in the absorption of RLA.

    Different forms of RLA produce dramatically different PK values. Recently, RLA was compared to NaRLA in humans using a simple crossover design. (43) This study compared Cmax and AUC values of a pre-dissolved aqueous solution containing 600 mg RLA (as NaRLA) to those of 600 mg RLA in the same subjects. In a single male (subject 1), NaRLA produced Cmax of 14.1 mcg/mL; whereas, RLA resulted in a Cmax of 0.7 mcg/mL (increase of 25.86x). The AUC in the same subject was 5.18 mcg hr/mL for NaRLA versus 1.56 mcg hr/mL for RLA (increase of 3.3x). In a single female (subject 4), Cmax was 18.1 mcg/mL for NaRLA versus 1.01 mcg/mL for RLA (increase of 17.9x) and the AUC was 5.71 mcg hr/mL for NaRLA compared to 2.14 mcg hr/mL for RLA (increase of 2.67x).

    The data shows Cmax and relative bioavailability as measured by AUC for the aqueous solution of three doses of 600 mg RLA (as NaRLA) taken at 15-minute intervals is similar to those reported for a 20-minute I.V. infusion of 300 mg rac-LA. (55) Cmax and AUC values were significantly increased over the one-time dose. Cmax values reached 21.9 mcg/mL versus 12.9 mcg/mL and AUC values increased from 376.2 mcg min/mL (6.27 mcg hr/mL) to 1,049 mcg min/mL (17.48 mcg min/mL).

    Based on the mean values from eight human PK studies utilizing 600 mg rac-LA, the current authors suggest the threshold of activation of the therapeutic effects of LA is equal to Cmax of 4-5 mcg/mL (~20-25 [micro]M) and AUC equal to 2.85 mcg hr/mL. (17,45,46,55-59) More consistent therapeutic results may be achieved at plasma concentrations of 10-20 mcg/mL (~50-100 [micro]M) of the natural enantiomer, RLA. (17,60) The upper limit of the human therapeutic concentration range is ~50 mcg/mL (~250 [micro]M). (41)

    A basic principle of pharmacology states that free drug (not bound to plasma proteins) is more biologically active than plasma protein-bound drug and mostly responsible for the therapeutic action. (61-63) Most PK studies and assays for LA have measured the total LA content in serum or plasma rather than differentiating the concentrations of free and bound LA. Many different techniques with varying degrees of efficiency have been utilized to determine the total LA concentrations. In vitro, rac-LA spiked into human plasma is not measurable in "free" form until plasma protein binding is saturated at ~4-5 [micro]M (0.825-1.030 mcg/mL). (64) In rats, it was reported only 20 percent (~0.8 mcg/mL) of the total plasma RLA (~4 mcg/mL) was free (using the Centrisart ultrafiltration device). The level of free/unbound RLA was concentration independent and temperature dependent. The "free" value corresponded to the amounts of RLA found in skeletal muscle by micro-dialysis and was extrapolated to account for plasma protein binding in humans. (17) Since the therapeutic efficacy of a compound is associated with the "free" levels and levels of "free" drug concentration differ from species to species (and even wide inter-individual differences are known), the decision was made to test the levels of "free" RLA in each subject's plasma.

    This is the first study to demonstrate negligible amounts of "free" RLA, even at Cmax. This indicates that a re-assessment of a fundamental principle of pharmacology (i.e., the therapeutically active form of a drug or nutrient is correlated to the amount of "free" versus unbound drug) relative to the mechanisms of transport and action of LA is necessary.

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