A shout out to supplement companies regarding "Proprietary Blends"

[Bliptrip]

A big thumbs up to MAN Sports and Allmax for fully listing ingredient amounts and not resorting to the proprietary blend facade. There's something to be said for knowing if a blend has ingredients dosed effectively. Am I missing any other supplement companies that are doing this?

I know the subject has been beaten to death, but I would still like to see more companies step up to the plate and give full disclosure on their products. What is there really to protect via using the proprietary blend? Are cheesy counterfeit supplements really that much of a threat? Products get copied regardless; I'd rather buy from the supplement companies telling me exactly what is going into my body.

[MBSowards]

1st

[_J-BONE_]

A big thumbs up to MAN Sports and Allmax for fully listing ingredient amounts and not resorting to the proprietary blend facade. There's something to be said for knowing if a blend has ingredients dosed effectively. Am I missing any other supplement companies that are doing this?

I know the subject has been beaten to death, but I would still like to see more companies step up to the plate and give full disclosure on their products. What is there really to protect via using the proprietary blend? Are cheesy counterfeit supplements really that much of a threat? Products get copied regardless; I'd rather buy from the supplement companies telling me exactly what is going into my body.

i can understand both sides to this one..

[An Inconvenient Bro]

A big thumbs up to MAN Sports and Allmax for fully listing ingredient amounts and not resorting to the proprietary blend facade. There's something to be said for knowing if a blend has ingredients dosed effectively. Am I missing any other supplement companies that are doing this?

I know the subject has been beaten to death, but I would still like to see more companies step up to the plate and give full disclosure on their products. What is there really to protect via using the proprietary blend? Are cheesy counterfeit supplements really that much of a threat? Products get copied regardless; I'd rather buy from the supplement companies telling me exactly what is going into my body.

the problem is when 99.9% of the consumer base doesn't care or even know any better many companies see little reason to give disclosure

[Bliptrip]

I'd like to see a MAN Sports or Allmax rep jump in and let us know if full disclosure on the ingredient label has negatively effected sales due to copycat products.

[MBSowards]

I'd like to see a MAN Sports or Allmax rep jump in and let us know if full disclosure on the ingredient label has negatively effected sales due to copycat products.

How exactly would you be able to tell someone something like that?

[An Inconvenient Bro]

I'd like to see a MAN Sports or Allmax rep jump in and let us know if full disclosure on the ingredient label has negatively effected sales due to copycat products.

of course it hasn't. prop blends serve two purposes and only two purposes, neither of which are to prevent knock offs.

[dam225]

A big thumbs up to MAN Sports and Allmax for fully listing ingredient amounts and not resorting to the proprietary blend facade. There's something to be said for knowing if a blend has ingredients dosed effectively. Am I missing any other supplement companies that are doing this?

I know the subject has been beaten to death, but I would still like to see more companies step up to the plate and give full disclosure on their products. What is there really to protect via using the proprietary blend? Are cheesy counterfeit supplements really that much of a threat? Products get copied regardless; I'd rather buy from the supplement companies telling me exactly what is going into my body.

Core Nutritionals!

http://www.corenutritionals.com/about.html

[cxm]

of course it hasn't. prop blends serve two purposes and only two purposes, neither of which are to prevent knock offs.

did you ever try my prop blend on that carne asada recipe I sent you?

[An Inconvenient Bro]

did you ever try my prop blend on that carne asada recipe I sent you?

indeed



spicy!

[cxm]

indeed



spicy!

I gathered you liked it....I hope.

[nni]

A big thumbs up to MAN Sports and Allmax for fully listing ingredient amounts and not resorting to the proprietary blend facade. There's something to be said for knowing if a blend has ingredients dosed effectively. Am I missing any other supplement companies that are doing this?

I know the subject has been beaten to death, but I would still like to see more companies step up to the plate and give full disclosure on their products. What is there really to protect via using the proprietary blend? Are cheesy counterfeit supplements really that much of a threat? Products get copied regardless; I'd rather buy from the supplement companies telling me exactly what is going into my body.

the problem is when 99.9% of the consumer base doesn't care or even know any better many companies see little reason to give disclosure

exactly. there are positive and negatives to prop blends (we did a nice article on it in one of the issues of intelligent design mag). the negative is that a prop blends gives a company a mask to use. a less than honest company can underdose ingredients or shift formulas and deceive the consumer. on the positive it does give a company some protection over intellectual property. yes a company can test it and reverse engineer it, but at least they have to do something other than read a label and call a supplier.

[Bliptrip]

of course it hasn't. prop blends serve two purposes and only two purposes, neither of which are to prevent knock offs.

What are those two purposes?

[nni]

What are those two purposes?

to hide underdosed ingredients, and to shift the formula at will. there is a third purpose whether he wants to admit it or not.

[Bliptrip]

+1 for Core Nutritionals. Any others?

[dsade]

We haven't, and won't, be using prop blends.

It is vital to know what and how much you are ingesting.

[CognitiveNutrition]

We haven't, and won't, be using prop blends.

It is vital to know what and how much you are ingesting.

Good show old man. I agree.

[AntiGlobalist]

Not knowing what goes into my camera, or a computer chip, or some television... is okay.

Not knowing what exactly that i'm putting into my body? Unacceptable.

[Peter LeDrew]

Not knowing what goes into my camera, or a computer chip, or some television... is okay.

Not knowing what exactly that i'm putting into my body? Unacceptable.

good point! Support non-prop. blends and that will be the trend. Simple, but so hard to happen.

[DGreekStallion]

Fusion Bodybuilding also does not do the propietary horse****.

[Peter LeDrew]

+1 for Core Nutritionals. Any others?

As many know, I am a huge proponent of non-prop. blends and try to support many companies and products that follow that rule... I also get a lot of crap for speaking out on such.

Athletic Edge Nutrition seem to follow a close to non-prop. blend with their products, esp. the IntraStack of IntrAbolic and IntraXCell which list the doses of the seller ingredients...ie. beta-alanine, leucine, whey hydro, etc... it is esp. important to know that the doses you are consuming reach the levels shown in the clinical trials to be effective... Why a company using effective doses would not want to proudly show their consumers their products dosing remains a mystery to me... or a mistake as I know I would often pass over a product that does not list dose for one that would.

I think prop. blends insult the consumer in many ways. Some ingredients work better for others at different doses. I like to know the dose I am getting when I know what dose works best for me and one that is based on the science.

Do I trust that all companies know the science and what an effective clinical dose is? Heck no! Many do not and just go on what sells at the moment... Looking at many products that sell well, I know not to fall for the claim that a company knows what is best for me. Often ingredients are only added to have them in there so the company can state that it is...yeah we have beta-alanine in our product it says so on the bottle..see!!, but little does the consumer know it is the 12th ingredient of a 15,000mg prop. blend dosed at 500mg per serving... enough to raise carnosine levels 5% if you are lucky?

I am not saying I never use or recommend prop. blends, but I would often choose a similar non-prop. one over one that uses prop. blend. And like everything, some prop. blends are better than others...broken down much more and easier to see that effective doses are likely used.

[NastyNally]

I'm not a fan of proprietary blends either. You don't know how much of what you're getting, which can be a dangerous combination if you're taking other supplements.

[Peter LeDrew]

I'm not a fan of proprietary blends either. You don't know how much of what you're getting, which can be a dangerous combination if you're taking other supplements.

Exactly, another perfectly good reason... there are many.

[NastyNally]

Exactly, another perfectly good reason... there are many.

Yeah, I'm not going to name any companies, but some just love to fill their products with unnecessary ingredients. Then, they tell you to stack their products when both products contain an insane amount of proprietary blends. Once you stack them you get sick because the combination is too much yohimbine, for example. Try to guess who I'm talking about lol...starts with M and ends with T (MT).

[jonnyflores]

I too am not a fan of prop blends, but in the supplement industry do we ever really know what we are getting? I'm not sitting here conjuring up conspiracy theories cause I use as many supplements as the next guy, but I take every label with a grain of salt......prop or not.

[NastyNally]

I too am not a fan of prop blends, but in the supplement industry do we ever really know what we are getting? I'm not sitting here conjuring up conspiracy theories cause I use as many supplements as the next guy, but I take every label with a grain of salt......prop or not.

I agreed, but I trust respected reputable companies on here who have reps (who are former normal bb.com posters like us) answering questions about their products. For example, Controlled Labs, Optimum, Universal are some that come to mind.

Also, with websites or places (supplement police) that test certain products it's getting harder for supplement companies to pull a fast one without getting hit with a major lawsuit.

[Gym God]

Fusion Bodybuilding also does not do the propietary horse****.

Thank you sir!

www.fusionbodybuilding.com

[deserusan]

Core Nutritionals!

http://www.corenutritionals.com/about.html

I found it odd while using your product I didn't get any parathesia despite being very sensitive to beta alanine. Any explanation? Since I know there are gram doses in your product I found that REALLY odd. Thanks in advance.

[deserusan]

. What is there really to protect via using the proprietary blend?

SizeON - Took three years to knock off
Novedex XT - Took two years to knock off
PlasmaJet - Took about eight months to knock off

Do see a pattern here? It would be nice to fully disclose everything but unfortunately our slow patent process doesn't allow for good protection under the current system. Even with patent protection people will still knock you off by just circumventing your claims.

No offense to the people that don't use prop blends, but no one really wants to knock them off. Yeah I said it. Do you see any large company not using prop blends? No. The reason being, we are on the radar of everyone else. If we weren't it would be nice to stand up here and claim how honorable we are by not using them. It's just how it is. Sure, some want to hide underdosed ingredients, shift ratios based on raw prices, etc. However, some of us actually like to protect our formulas. There is no sense in giving a competitor a blue print to your product if the law affords you protection.

Unfortunately, this is not an honorable industry as whole so you do what you can to protect your hard work to make it more difficult for competitors to copy you. It's bound to happen anyway, but the hope is that you can slow the process a bit. It's hard when companies try to buy your materials from suppliers in the same ratios you do, lab test your products to find the exact amounts, copy your ad materials, etc, etc, etc.

[put5onyo]

I know the subject has been beaten to death

Yep

/thread