Why does strength not equal size?

[Definitelynotme]

This is something I've been wondering for a while: why does strength not equal size?

There are people at my gym who weigh perhaps 60 pounds less than I do, and manage to lift the same/more weight than me. With good form. This thread is not asking "how do I get stronger", nor am I competing with anyone's lifts. My question is looking for an answer as to why guys who are quite small are able to lift very heavy weight.

Thanks!

[pkirk330]

It has to do with the microscopic breakdown of the muscle. The more myosin heads you have in a muscle the stronger it is (i believe thats the term). So some people my not be as big but have more dense muscle.

Im not a small guy by any means but some of my lifts are a lot more than people would expect me to be able to do. Whenever I get a spot on bench press the people look at me like "Ohhh yea ok" then afterward they always have a shocked look on their face.

[W8isGR8]

neural drive, muscle attachment points, limb lengths....

[arom27]

Ye this is one thing that pisses me off personally. I wanna be strong as **** but doing strength training (1-3 reps) gets you no where size wise.

[Kiknskreem]

I wanna be strong as **** but doing strength training (1-3 reps) gets you no where size wise.

Add a few hundred pounds to your core lifts and eat enough to add bodyweight.... and see if you've gone nowhere size wise.

Not saying low rep strength training is optimal by any means, but to say training in lower reps doesn't lead to size gains is a total fallacy. If you are getting stronger and eating enough to drive bodyweight gains... there ya go.

[rmani]

depends on the muscle fiber types and what proportions, as well a muscle density and ligament strength. it frustrates me as well i have some freakishly strong friends. also don't be fooled i see a lot of guys using awful form and putting up enormous weight.

[RU4A69]

Skeletal structure.

[GoJu]

2 things:

1) not enough reps or volume
2) not eating enough

if you do these 2 things right and putting weight on your lifts on a consistent basis you WILL get bigger

[IronAbrams]

(Physiologically speaking)

Strength is closely tied to the nervous system, not just the cross-sectional area of the muscle.

[Masknight]

i was under the impression that greater size equals greater strength? so is it just pure genetics and maybe things like limb length that affects how much you can life?

[MawkieMawk]

Because Size doesn't always equal Muscle...

http://blogs.news.com.au/images/uploads/fat_thumb.jpg

[AnnaMatronic]

Because Size doesn't always equal Muscle...

http://blogs.news.com.au/images/uploads/fat_thumb.jpg

And yeah, size =/= strength.

I have pretty skinny arms but I have decent tricep strength.

My one buddy who sometimes works out with me is shorter and a bigger but we do the same weights for the most part.

[SyderBomb]

Ye this is one thing that pisses me off personally. I wanna be strong as **** but doing strength training (1-3 reps) gets you no where size wise.

I know what you mean Ive been doing more power lifting and my friend that i use to workout with told me the other day i just look like im getting skinner. I messed with my head for a few days until I got my dead lifts up from 360lbs to 405lbs in 5 weeks. Im starting to like power lifting more than body building. My new workout partner is all powerlifter and he always says he rather be the part then look the part..lol..

[PH3NOM]

Ye this is one thing that pisses me off personally. I wanna be strong as **** but doing strength training (1-3 reps) gets you no where size wise.

why do u wanna be big and strong????

Having the optimal weight/strength ratio is way more desired.

Being agile, quick and fast yet still strong as an ox is way better than being a huge ****ing brick with no movement and strong.

[TJ2000]

Its sad though true that size doesn't equal strength all the time.
I've seen 140lbers using 60s for dumbbell shoulder press (sitting not standing) mean while some dude looked at least 200lbs mostly muscle mass doing the same seated move using only 40s, but this guy was feeling it more cause he focused on the move. The squeeze and the pump I guess cause he had some decent delts on em.

But this isn't always true. I've seen some big dudes (not just strong men)
lifting a lot of weight. But I don't let it get to me.
If the guy next to me is benching 300 while I'm only doing 200 I could care less.

[Bioteknik]

ha.. I hope to someday be one of those guys ~60 lb lighter putting up some good weight. I don't want to get HUGE I want to be lean and strong.

[FWCMuZiK]

less body fat?

[TallKyle13]

Personally I think a lot of it had to do with the amount of time you've been lifting weights also. The longer you've been at it the stronger your going to be. But size doesn't always come with strength because not everyone who lifts eats enough to make gains. My opinion.

But honestly how many people do you see lifting significant amounts of weight who don't have size? Most of the time the dudes who bench 315 aren't 130 lbs

[AHTTG]

Strength = Size

The more work you put in, the more truth you'll find in that. It doesn't help that we have a bunch of noobs putting in their 2 cents on every topic.

[DiamondDelts]

And it begins............................................ ..........again.

[robplaysgeetar]

And it begins............................................ ..........again.

Rofl, I would go into some explanation about the different types of hypertrophy, volume, intensity, loads, and neural capabilities, but I feel it would just be lost, again.

[DiamondDelts]

Rofl, I would go into some explanation about the different types of hypertrophy, volume, intensity, loads, and neural capabilities, but I feel it would just be lost, again.

It's been getting lost here since 2003.

[ElayneTrakand]

So if you are hella strong without gaining size what happens when you start bulking? Do you gain size very quickly because your lifts are so heavy?

[AHTTG]

Rofl, I would go into some explanation about the different types of hypertrophy, volume, intensity, loads, and neural capabilities, but I feel it would just be lost, again.

Flamebait! I trust you to do the right thing DD. Ban him.

[robplaysgeetar]

It's been getting lost here since 2003.

Wait, I didn't realize you were a mod now, congratulations.

[Dominik]

This is something I've been wondering for a while: why does strength not equal size?

There are people at my gym who weigh perhaps 60 pounds less than I do, and manage to lift the same/more weight than me. With good form. This thread is not asking "how do I get stronger", nor am I competing with anyone's lifts. My question is looking for an answer as to why guys who are quite small are able to lift very heavy weight.

I've yet to see someone who got big naturally by not lifting relatively heavy weights. That doesn't necessarily mean they'll be challenging records in powerlifting, but for reps they'll be moving a respectable amount of weight for their size.

I posted this last month on the size = strength correlation.

Cliffs: sufficient calories, protein, training volume, rest, sleep, and form that effectively targets the right muscles, will result in strength gains materializing in size gains.

On the flipside a whole range of genetic factors + training style + calorie restrictions can result in extremely strong lifters for their size or who might not even look like they lift weights. But don't look to them as the rule.

[robplaysgeetar]

I've yet to see someone who got big naturally by not lifting relatively heavy weights. That doesn't necessarily mean they'll be challenging records in powerlifting, but for reps they'll be moving a respectable amount of weight for their size.

I posted this last month on the size = strength correlation.

Cliffs: sufficient calories, protein, training volume, rest, sleep, and form that effectively targets the right muscles, will result in strength gains materializing in size gains.

On the flipside a whole range of genetic factors + training style + calorie restrictions can result in extremely strong lifters for their size or who might not even look like they lift weights. But don't look to them as the rule.

I think the only real problem that people are figuring in to gaining size is the volume equation since most people view nearly all strength programs as a rippetoe's/5x5 format. Most people I see in my gym who lift heavy with low reps who have a respectable amount of size on them usually use an 8x4 or 8x5 scheme (which would kill me, but they have been lifting forever I guess).

Right now I am a strong advocate for my method of gaining strength and getting bigger; heavy weight high reps.

[Beast Genetics]

Add a few hundred pounds to your core lifts and eat enough to add bodyweight.... and see if you've gone nowhere size wise.

Not saying low rep strength training is optimal by any means, but to say training in lower reps doesn't lead to size gains is a total fallacy. If you are getting stronger and eating enough to drive bodyweight gains... there ya go.

DITTO

[Dominik]

I think the only real problem that people are figuring in to gaining size is the volume equation since most people view nearly all strength programs as a rippetoe's/5x5 format. Most people I see in my gym who lift heavy with low reps who have a respectable amount of size on them usually use an 8x4 or 8x5 scheme (which would kill me, but they have been lifting forever I guess).

Right now I am a strong advocate for my method of gaining strength and getting bigger; heavy weight high reps.

At the end of the day heavy weights + low volume might not be enough but then exclusively lifting light weights + high volume is rarely the answer either. I can tell you this much though, if I was going to put my money on a strong guy or a weak guy getting big once they sort out their training and diet, it'd be an easy choice.

These are generalizations, but what I've found in almost 6 years of training in commercial gyms is this:

Aside from the guys who were big when their balls dropped and it's either mainly fat making them big or they haven't been training long, the biggest guys in the gym are usually the strongest on the lifts and rep ranges they train in.

And while steroids can make a lifter with the optimal genetics and training style incredibly big and strong, most of the guys who are big, lean, but weak for their size, are on juice. There might be a handful of genetic freaks who got big off light weights without gear, but I've never met any.

[AHTTG]

I think the only real problem that people are figuring in to gaining size is the volume equation since most people view nearly all strength programs as a rippetoe's/5x5 format. Most people I see in my gym who lift heavy with low reps who have a respectable amount of size on them usually use an 8x4 or 8x5 scheme (which would kill me, but they have been lifting forever I guess).

Right now I am a strong advocate for my method of gaining strength and getting bigger; heavy weight high reps.

That's their problem. There's all kinds of crazy mislead **** out there. If people think that training for PRs means 5 work sets a workout between reps 3-5, great. Doesn't make what we're saying any less true.

There's a guy in this thread saying that strength does not equal size. His argument is "I have pretty skinny arms but I have decent tricep strength." His signature is "I bench 155lbs for reps." Draw your own conclusions.