bulk or cut first?

[turtlesauce]

excuse me for being new to this

so i'm trying to get that summer body on and i want to get some size first, but i dont want to sacrifice definition.

im debating if i should continue this bulking phase for another month or two, then just try to get cut from there, or should i get cut first, then bulk up.

in doing this, any recommendations on diet or workout plans?

i started working out almost a year ago, and lost a significant amount of weight, but now i feel that im too scrawny, but my some of my belly is still there. i want to be able to get more muscle mass, and i understand that means eating a lot more, so in doing this, would i gain more bodyfat and worsen my belly? [and especially because im taking muscle milk vs. my regular on whey]

my main goals for the summer are:
-six pack
-bigger arms
-bigger and defined shoulders

to accomplish this, my main question is: bulk then cut, or cut then bulk?

thanks for any help or advise. i apologize for my ignorance. =D

[JAC4146]

post a pic so we can see (no homo)

[abefroman35]

what are you at right now? if you dont have much body fat on you right now and you feel you can stand to have fat for another month or two then bulk if not then start cutting - i would just start bulking clean and just make sure you are eating enough protein i.e. 1.5+g per lbs.

[B...]

i suppose you should put on more muscle and then do the cardio with it. Keep that heavy diet.

[turtlesauce]

nohomo.



...look at that belly. :/

5'6"
145lb.

thanks again

[ThiZzNation925]

my main goals for the summer are:
-six pack
-bigger arms
-bigger and defined shoulders

A six pack is done by having a low body fat percentage. It looks like your pretty cut though, so I would definitely incorporate cardio into your workout.

This concept goes for the whole body. Definition=low body fat percentage. As far as getting "bigger" goes, you can simply increase the reps to 10-12 for an increase in size.

http://www.freedomfly.net/Articles/T...training29.htm

[turtlesauce]

so in order to acheive my goals faster and effeciently, should i just get that size now?
&if i should gain, how many calories should i consume? i workout probably 5times a week, and dedicate at least 2 days strictly on cardio. other days are mixed routines.

[ThiZzNation925]

In this situation, I would have most of your training done in the 10-12 range, but still do some in the 6-8 to facilitate strength gains, because minimal strength gains are made in 10-12.

As far as your diet, keep the calories between 2000-2500; and get cardio in there to burn that belly!

You could cut right now and lose body fat, but I guarantee your strength and size gains will be severely impaired.

[turtlesauce]

so thats 2 for bulking and 1 for cutting.

any other words of advice?

+thanks for all the previous help.

[Fleshka]

just cut. bulks do nothing. i just bulked to 218 and tell you the truth i wish i didn't. when you are cut, you can see your actual progress not guessing how much you are progressing with a layer of fat on ****. everyone here gonna say to bulk, but look at the people giving you advice.

[turtlesauce]

just cut. bulks do nothing. i just bulked to 218 and tell you the truth i wish i didn't. when you are cut, you can see your actual progress not guessing how much you are progressing with a layer of fat on ****. everyone here gonna say to bulk, but look at the people giving you advice.

i agree with seeing the progress, but i kinda of want size. it seems kinda easy to look cut, and not have much size to it. im kinda looking for more definition, but i want the mass there too. my arms are dinky. but my shoulders and abs could use the tone.

thanks for the advice. ill take into consideration.

[LoverBoyX]

I say u bulk, I am 5"7' and i wt 188 lbs. For a month now i am trying to cut down and get lean muscles. I lift 6days a week and cardio daily.
Got myself to 173 lbs which is a very gud thing...hehehe


Start bulking but i think u should do cardio to get those tammy 6 packed...hehehe

[likwidmunki]

I think you can do both to a certain degree. I aren't huge and i agree with the above post. I'm trying to get cut just so ican see how far I've come and it's easier (for me at least, its all personal preference!) to stay motivated when im defined, rather than big. You look fairly lean already so do steady cardio for about 30-45 minutes. are you taking any supplements or considering specific supplements?

[turtlesauce]

I think you can do both to a certain degree. I aren't huge and i agree with the above post. I'm trying to get cut just so ican see how far I've come and it's easier (for me at least, its all personal preference!) to stay motivated when im defined, rather than big. You look fairly lean already so do steady cardio for about 30-45 minutes. are you taking any supplements or considering specific supplements?

uhm, well right now because im trying to get some mass, i've been using muscle milk as my protein vs. my usual on whey. im also taking gnc mega mens sport, kirkland signature fish oil :/, and no explode. =D

does creatine help much if you're trying to cut, or does it just assist in size?

and i do do a lot of cardio. i end with 30 minutes every workout, and on my designated cardio days, i do anywhere from 45-1 1/2 intense cardio. i know that the pack comes with low bodyfat, but that would mean that i'd have to eat generously to get there, but the thing is, if i want to get bigger, ill need all the eating i can get. thats why im deciding if i should bulk first. right now, im doing that idea where its somewhat both. im not sure if this will work... but i continue a heavy diet on most days, especially on lifting training days, and the next day follows with an intense cardio workout, and i eat somewhat carefully, but still well.

if this would help, this is a sample of my daily meals on a training day
breakfast- oatmeal [with whey], or an omlette
snack - beef jerkey, or a granola bar
lunch - sandwich, apple, salad
snack - protein shake, or fruit [usually a bit before workout]
dinner - grilled chicken breasts, brocolli, brown rice
pre bedtime - protein shake

thanks for all the help so far guys!

[Mwilli01]

Well, you really need to decide what YOU want to do, bulk or cut. Personally, I have found it is very difficult to maintain muscle mass while on a cut. I have never lost a ridiculous amount of muscle, but cutting made me feel less motivated and less energized while working out. I wasn't eating enough to continue hardcore training and it just made me feel bleh.

Cardio is great, you look like you enjoy it too telling by how much you do. I can't stand doing more than 45 minutes of it to be honest. Too much cardio can be detrimental to your size gains though. Your muscles need the calories you consume to grow, and if you're burning them through too much cardio, then your muscles won't be able to grow as much. Just keep that in mind.

Creatine is more of an energy enhancer when it comes to lifting. It also increases flow (blood and water) into your muscles. It's fine for either phase, cutting or bulking, but is definitely important in bulking.

The best thing I would advise if you want to bulk up with little fat gain is to try to stay as clean as possible. Grilled chicken, fish, high quality carbs, etc, all that is going to keep you from putting on too much fat. For your lunch, what kind of sandwich are you eating? I ask because a lot of deli meats aren't good for you. Turkey and chicken deli is by far the best choice, try to stay away from the processed bologna, pepperoni, all that stuff. Roast beef isn't too bad, but is higher in fat content. And for your omelette, make sure you are going with 1 whole egg and the rest egg whites, something to that effect. Don't eat too many whole eggs if you are trying to stay clean.

[turtlesauce]

Well, you really need to decide what YOU want to do, bulk or cut. Personally, I have found it is very difficult to maintain muscle mass while on a cut. I have never lost a ridiculous amount of muscle, but cutting made me feel less motivated and less energized while working out. I wasn't eating enough to continue hardcore training and it just made me feel bleh.

Cardio is great, you look like you enjoy it too telling by how much you do. I can't stand doing more than 45 minutes of it to be honest. Too much cardio can be detrimental to your size gains though. Your muscles need the calories you consume to grow, and if you're burning them through too much cardio, then your muscles won't be able to grow as much. Just keep that in mind.

Creatine is more of an energy enhancer when it comes to lifting. It also increases flow (blood and water) into your muscles. It's fine for either phase, cutting or bulking, but is definitely important in bulking.

The best thing I would advise if you want to bulk up with little fat gain is to try to stay as clean as possible. Grilled chicken, fish, high quality carbs, etc, all that is going to keep you from putting on too much fat. For your lunch, what kind of sandwich are you eating? I ask because a lot of deli meats aren't good for you. Turkey and chicken deli is by far the best choice, try to stay away from the processed bologna, pepperoni, all that stuff. Roast beef isn't too bad, but is higher in fat content. And for your omelette, make sure you are going with 1 whole egg and the rest egg whites, something to that effect. Don't eat too many whole eggs if you are trying to stay clean.

yeah my sandwiches usually contain loads of deli meat, a slice of white cheese, and any vege i can get my hands on. and yeah, my omlettes are without most of the yolk.

basically, to summarize what i want, would it be faster to bulk, then cut, or cut then bulk in order to acheive bigger arms and a six pack?

thanks, that was a big help. i should limit my cardio a bit if im trying to gain.

[bluedot]

If you want a summer body you're screwed because it takes time to gain muscle, it takes time to lose fat, and it looks like you're not someone who can do both at the same time. You simply don't have enough time to do both, so you're going to have to decide. You might be best served by eating either at or just slightly above maintenance calories and hoping for whatever recomposition you can get because you don't have enough time to see a meaningful change in your body.

[turtlesauce]

If you want a summer body you're screwed because it takes time to gain muscle, it takes time to lose fat, and it looks like you're not someone who can do both at the same time. You simply don't have enough time to do both, so you're going to have to decide. You might be best served by eating either at or just slightly above maintenance calories and hoping for whatever recomposition you can get because you don't have enough time to see a meaningful change in your body.

yikes. i guess you're right. but for a while i've been bulking, and those pictures are a bit out of date. i guess im going to jump into a cutting phase earlier than i planned to though to get semi-decent results, and worry about all the size later.

[likwidmunki]

i think if you ate clean calories on a bulking diet, you'd still look lean. if you had a skinny guy and a big guy both at 6% bodyfat, for example, the bigger guy would look leaner cos that fat has more muscle to cover. you're fairly lean as it is so i dont think bulking (again, if clean) is such a bad idea. some diets work with jus overall bulk but since you still wanna look lean, try and eat as clean as you can

[turtlesauce]

thanks, ill keep that in mind when i eat a whole bunch. haha. can i get some advice on a good clean diet with a good hefty amount of calories for me to bulk up?

[turtlesauce]

bump