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  1. #1
    Registered User kiwidave's Avatar
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    Old, fat, injury prone, skinny guy needs starting up advice please?

    Hi. I've been reading this forum for a few months now and learning a lot so thanks everyone for creating such a cool forum. Now I understand some basics I'm hoping to get some help to plan my next 6 months approach to working out. First some background:

    I'm 46 years old and always done lots of sports but nothing strength oriented. Tennis, squash, basketball, windsurfing, snowboarding, motorcycle racing, etc. and always plenty of running, cycling, swimming for aerobic fitness and enjoyment. I'm 6'0 and slim but have never looked really lean - never had visible abs for example even when running 60 miles a week training for marathons, or doing 150 miles a week on the bike. Have done a bit of weight training off and on over the years but only for general fitness and never with any decent information or significant strength gains.

    The last 10-15 years have been an endless struggle with minor injuries - pulled muscles, tendinitis, strains, etc. For almost 2 years now I've been struggling with recurring hamstring tendinitis at the knee which has prevented me from doing regular cycling/running and helped me gain fat.

    So after the holidays I decided to start weight training with the goal of reversing the fat gains and getting generally stronger/healthier. Armed with 10 minutes of internet research I went hard and heavy (for me) and sure enough injured my shoulder (tendons again!) after about 3 weeks. OK - another month of rest and anti-inflammatories.

    Two weeks ago I started again but this time much more cautiously and with the aim to reverse the fat gains and very slowly get my body accustomed to weight training with no more injuries caused by over-enthusiasm. So here are my questions (finally - sorry for the long post).

    Age: 46:
    Height: 6'0
    Weight: 178lb
    Body: fat skinny-guy (chest 40", hips 34", waist 36", bicep 7"... --> calculated body fat around 22%)
    Lifestyle: 5 days a week behind a computer followed by busy physical weekend working on the new house/garden.

    Goal - burn off the tummy fat and add a bit of strength/muscle.

    Question 1. Any advice for how to manage the training load to slowly improve while avoiding further injuries? I'm currently doing 3 days on with 1 day off but with very light weights (feels like maybe 50-70% of possible max but I'm not going to try a 1 rep max and test this theory !).
    Day 1: deadlift, assisted chin-ups, pulldowns, seated rows, bent rows, curls + 30 mins low intensity cardio
    Day 2: chest press, pec dec, seated overhead press, assisted dips, tricep pushdowns, situps + 30 mins low intensity cardio
    Day 3: squats, calf raises, leg curls, leg press, leg extensions + 30 mins low intensity cardio
    Day 4: rest
    All exercises are 4x10 with low weights - emphasis on good form, going slow and not injuring anything. I am sweating and can feel the muscles working but reach the 10th rep quite comfortably and could probably do 3x15-20reps at the weights I'm using. I'm aiming to slowly increase this with aim of hitting failure at 3x10 in about 6 weeks from now with no further injuries. After that I can look at next steps.

    Question 2: You guys have made it pretty clear how important diet is. I'm not a big eater, and certainly not yet ready to live off brown rice and chicken breasts (huge respect to those who do). But I am trying to get rid of the excess carbs, sugars and processed foods that I normally eat. I know about the 6 meals a day and protein shakes approach but don't know if I should be doing this yet while my workout load is so light? I know my protein intake is pretty low but again am unsure when to increase it given my weight training effort is so light right now?
    Typical day currently would look like this:
    Breakfast: bowl of cereal (bran flakes or muesli etc) with low fat milk, maybe a banana or strawberries, and cup of tea.
    Lunch: Some salad, bread, salami or tuna, yoghurt, cup of tea and a couple of chocolates or a cookie.
    Dinner: meat or fish, pasta or rice or potato, some veges or salad. Dessert maybe twice a week.
    During the day about 3 expressos with small sugar plus about 50oz water. No snacks.

    So, sorry for being so long but I'd really like to hear any and all advice for a case like mine. Especially from anyone coming from a similar starting point of plenty of sports but no strength training and a body that is feeling its age. Thanks everyone.
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  2. #2
    Banned Prince.'s Avatar
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    wow, you really wrote an essay there bro.

    keep in the higher rep range, say 10-15 or 20, depending on the extent of your restrictions. discontinue any exercise that causes you discomfort etc.

    except for the cookies and deserts your diet is more devoid of carbs than mine. maybe just cut out the sweet stuff. definitely up your protein intake.
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  3. #3
    Registered User kiwidave's Avatar
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    thanks, I'm trying to get serious on the carbs reduction as for years I've been doing tons of cardio oriented sports and eating plenty of carbs without thinking about it.

    The advice on sticking with high reps is probably a wise one. Maybe I'll try something like adding 2 reps per workout until I get from 4x10 to 4x20 without injury and then look at adding weight slowly to get back to 4x10. I'm not significantly injured/restricted right now but have spent far too many months over the past few years recovering from injuries so I want to be really cautious until I have some sort of base to work from. At least with weight training it is a very controlled environment so I just need to curb my natural enthusiasm :-)
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  4. #4
    Registered User britonarius's Avatar
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    Welcome - and dump the cookies/ chocolate. get a protein shake in there - esp. with the weight training even though it is light. I understand the cautiousness and the softly softly aproach but being able to comfortaby achieve the 20's indicates that it is not heavy enough. Try increasing the last set of each in weight and see how that goes.
    I used to suffer badly from tendonitis but a doctor friend [ herbal ] put me on biotin and Vitamin E and since then - no problems.
    The training schedule looks ok and good luck
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  5. #5
    Registered User kiwidave's Avatar
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    Britonarius, thanks for the biotin tip. I'll look into it. Nice to hear from someone who has seen the back tendinitis as it seems pretty common for it to drag on for ages.

    I'm already taking a multivitamin but thats the nearest to supplements I've ever gotten. I've been losing about a pound per week for the last month so I'll add a daily protein shake and see if the waistline measurement changes. I'm not bothered about my weight, just my fat level. I'm working on eliminating the sweet stuff - have to convince my perenially slim wife to stop putting this stuff around where I can see it :-)

    I know I need to move the weights up and trust me I'm having to hold myself back from doing so too quickly. I've always been pretty gung-ho about sports and what my body will take but the older I get the worse this seems to work out :-(

    So I'll move from 4x10 to 4x15 to 4x20 over the next few weeks and then add weights at 4x20 (as you've suggested) until I start struggling in the last set. At that point I'll start slowly adding weight each seek until I am back down to around 3x10-12. I'm aiming to reach this point no faster than 6-8 weeks and in doing so hopefully will have established some sort of base to work from.

    Anyone else in their 40's/50's have experience/opinion of how fast you can push the muscle strength gains when starting out while still allowing the joints/ligaments/tendons to keep up?

    Cheers, Dave.
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  6. #6
    Registered User rocketman44's Avatar
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    "So I'll move from 4x10 to 4x15 to 4x20 over the next few weeks and then add weights at 4x20 (as you've suggested) until I start struggling in the last set. At that point I'll start slowly adding weight each seek until I am back down to around 3x10-12. I'm aiming to reach this point no faster than 6-8 weeks and in doing so hopefully will have established some sort of base to work from."

    Your plan seems pretty good to me.

    I'm around the same age and have had injury issues. I've found that, for me anyway, there's no need to add weight too soon. I've done that only to aggravate injuries.

    Remember that you can employ strict form and use different methods. Using methods like rest/pause and drop sets can help you do a little something different to the muscles, which keeps them guessing, as the saying goes.
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  7. #7
    Registered User kiwidave's Avatar
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    Cheers for that RocketMan.
    I took a peek at your bodyblog and plan to go back and read it properly tonight. Looks like I could learn a bit from your experience with injury frustrations. Nice to know I'm not the only one in this boat.
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  8. #8
    Registered Flex Offender ColdFlex's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by kiwidave View Post
    ... Any advice for how to manage the training load to slowly improve while avoiding further injuries? ...
    Try taking some kind of Glucosamine/Chondroitin. It's good for joints. For me, I have to take it for 2-4 weeks before I start feeling any benefit from it. Then maybe later on step up to some Animal Flex. I have some AF on the way to see if it is worth the extra money to me. It's a little more expensive, but has great reviews.
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  9. #9
    Registered User blopid's Avatar
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    Just want to mention one thing... I had terrible knee pain for years. It would be a struggle for me to go up and down the stairs... I started doing serious weight training about two years ago, and when I started doing squats, slowly at first and taking it very easy, the pain started to go away... I figure that I had weak tendons and ligaments and got them really strong after doing squats for a while... I mention this because it seems that any issue I have had with joint pain has slowly faded as I progressed in my workouts... Always keep it safe and maintain good form. I also found that "Hydraplenish" really worked for me for maintaining joint health... I agree that you should get rid of the sweets and start eating clean. Working out is only 50%, the rest is a really good diet... Hope this helped... Later...


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  10. #10
    Registered User kiwidave's Avatar
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    1pak, thanks for the tip.
    Had read about gluscomine/chondrotin but balked at the price (I'm in France not USA). Just did a search on Animal Flex expecting sticker shock and saw a place with it on sale so I'll order a pack and try it for 6 weeks.

    Blopid, funny you should mention this because I'm sure that since starting to do light squats my problem knee is feeling a bit better. Thought it was just wishful thinking/conicidence but your experience gives me new hope. Tried to find Hydraplenish in some french search sites but didn't see it anywhere so I'll try the Animal Flex and see how that works out.
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  11. #11
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    You're taking the right approach for now. With a history of injuries, easing into weight training is the way for you to go. The string of injuries is caused by a week's inactivity, followed by trying to make it all up on Saturday; some call it "Weekend Warrior Syndrome"! Britonarius's advice is solid, as is other advice in this thread. As for nutrition, you don't have to change everything all at once; just start weaning yourself off junk for now, add some protein, and an extra small meal or two, and get accustomed to these changes. Down the road a ways, you can think about chicken/rice/broccoli, and eating 6-7 times a day! By then, after you've trained for a few months, and made gains, your appetite will kick-in, and you'll start to think of yourself as a bodybuilder. Good luck.
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  12. #12
    Registered User kiwidave's Avatar
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    Smile

    Great - thanks everyone for taking the time to reply. I'll take this road and see where it leads.
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