How bad is sugar for gains?

[Dr. Horse]

However, there are 3 consistent blood metabolic indicators of all centenarians which are relatively consistent: low sugar, low triglycerides, and low insulin. All 3 are relatively low for age. Among these 3 variables, insulin is the common denominator. The level of insulin sensitivity of the cell is one of the most important markers of lifespan.

Confounding abounds.

[dominicanito]

i dont like to have fruit during my cut except for grapefruit with some splenda on top.



stick to carbs like:

vegetables, oats, wild rice.

thanks 4 the input guys but vaughn i heard grapefruit has or increases estrogen so b careful with that

[NathanTurner]

I really don't think a grapefruit every now and then will turn you into a raging hormonal woman. The same goes for flax seed oil. Fruit smoothies, quiche, and long walks on the beach will, however.

Besides, unless you're getting into competition shape at insanely low body fat levels, fruit will not hurt you on a diet so long as you include the nutritional content toward your daily allowances. A serving a day or so would probably be good for you while on a diet, as it tends to help boost the metabolism and thyroid hormones.

[Hesh]

Interesting post, care to include some links?

It's from http://www.healingdaily.com/

reputable?

[followme]

Sugars are normally and healthy nutrients in food...

Refined sugar is not. There are a whole host of studies on the negative effects of consuming too much refined sugar.

It's easy to do, too. I once showed how Frosted Flakes cereal has more sugar per serving than Chips Ahoy! chocolate chip cookies, and they share the same main two ingredients (refined flour, refined sugar).

As a general rule of thumb, avoid refined sugars. The two primary enemies are white sugar and corn syrup.

[Dr. Horse]

Sugars are normally and healthy nutrients in food...

Refined sugar is not.

What is the difference between "normal healthy" sugar and refined sugar?

[Kamja]

Is there a way to quantify the amount of sugar one should/can safely consume? Also, can someone clarify the difference between and sources of "good" sugars and refined sugars?

Thank you.

[chenrko420]

Ice cream, bro, ice cream. Great way to add calories and it tastes great. Plus, if your worried about the fat content or whatever, opt for the low fat version.

[thedestro]

What is the difference between "normal healthy" sugar and refined sugar?

Probably quantity.

[followme]

What is the difference between "normal healthy" sugar and refined sugar?

"Normal healthy" sugar, as you have said it, is a term that refers to naturally occurring sugars, such as fructose. There are sugars in all sorts of things, not just things that taste sweet to us.

These sugars are perfectly fine. It's when we use processes to extract concentrated amounts of these sugars into a pure form that we run into problems. It's as much a balance issue as it is an issue of quantity, too.

Mr. Horse, we're all familiar with your pseudo-credentials here .

[followme]

Is there a way to quantify the amount of sugar one should/can safely consume? Also, can someone clarify the difference between and sources of "good" sugars and refined sugars?

Thank you.

Yes, it's easy to do.

If it's not refined, it's "good" (anything can be bad in excess quantities, however). Fruits, vegetables, milk, etc.

If it's refined, it's "bad" (best to avoid it). This includes white sugar and corn syrup. Some will argue, "Where do you think corn syrup comes from? It's naturally, ultimately." To which I always answer, "Everything is 'ultimately' natural. You can drink battery acid and claim it's natural."

What we're looking for here is what's best, not what suffices. No, eating sugar won't kill you. No, it's not instant disease. But many studies link excessive consumption of refined sugars to adult-onset diabetes and obesity.

[hooked4life]

^^^ this guy thinks evolution is a global conspiracy. i wouldn't worry about the science horse.

[thedestro]

"Normal healthy" sugar, as you have said it, is a term that refers to naturally occurring sugars, such as fructose. There are sugars in all sorts of things, not just things that taste sweet to us.

Yeah... no...

Edit: That said, since hooked4life seems to think there is no "science" supporting this guy, I feel obliged to point out that I doubt anyone familiar with the literature would disagree with his final statement: "What we're looking for here is what's best, not what suffices. No, eating sugar won't kill you. No, it's not instant disease. But many studies link excessive consumption of refined sugars to adult-onset diabetes and obesity."

[hooked4life]

Yeah... no...

Edit: That said, since hooked4life seems to think there is no "science" supporting this guy, I feel obliged to point out that I doubt anyone familiar with the literature would disagree with his final statement: "What we're looking for here is what's best, not what suffices. No, eating sugar won't kill you. No, it's not instant disease. But many studies link excessive consumption of refined sugars to adult-onset diabetes and obesity."

I just mean the RP section beat itself to death over this guy, i'm not slamming him (or trying) by saying this, but it's not going to work.

if he wants to make a food dogma out of this, nothing you reply directly to him will work. others will know better, hopefully.

[followme]

^^^ this guy thinks evolution is a global conspiracy. i wouldn't worry about the science horse.

If you're referring to me, which your arrows are doing so, I believe no such thing.

Don't spout off idiocy.

[followme]

double post erased

[followme]

I just mean the RP section beat itself to death over this guy, i'm not slamming him (or trying) by saying this, but it's not going to work.

if he wants to make a food dogma out of this, nothing you reply directly to him will work. others will know better, hopefully.

You're thinking of someone else pal. Get your story straight.

[Dr. Horse]

"Normal healthy" sugar, as you have said it, is a term that refers to naturally occurring sugars, such as fructose. There are sugars in all sorts of things, not just things that taste sweet to us.

How is naturally occuring fructose/sucrose/glucose different than that which exists in a "refined" sugar product? Of course it may be easier to consume larger amounts after refinement, but is the sugar fundamentally different?

Mr. Horse, we're all familiar with your pseudo-credentials here .

What the hell are you talking about? What are my "pseudo-credentials", and how do they pertain to this discussion?

[followme]

How is naturally occuring fructose/sucrose/glucose different than that which exists in a "refined" sugar product? Of course it may be easier to consume larger amounts after refinement, but is the sugar fundamentally different?

You can Google, Mr. Horse. There's plenty of studies showing the effects of consuming refined sugars.

What the hell are you talking about? What are my "pseudo-credentials", and how do they pertain to this discussion?

We know you like to play expert on these forums. Part of that feeds into the anti-broscience obsession that people have, throwing caution and common sense to the wind as they bow down and worship the almighty "If it fits in your macros..."

[Marcus8880]

Level 10 type of bad.

[Krebs-Cycle]

I can't get enough calories in a day to make good gains. I just don't have the appetite. So I just started using a commercial weight gainer to get an extra 700-800 calories in my diet for the day. But these things are loaded with sugar. How bad is the sugar? Is it just unhealthy or does it affect muscle growth?

Ever heard of evolution? If sugar was clearly bad for us, then having it taste sweet would be a stupid idea from a natural selection point of view wouldn't it? I'll let you ponder that for a second.

[xXBoStErXx]

[QUOTE=Mr. Horse;319237951]How is naturally occuring fructose/sucrose/glucose different than that which exists in a "refined" sugar product? Of course it may be easier to consume larger amounts after refinement, but is the sugar fundamentally different?

QUOTE]


Refined sugar is very different than naturally occurring sugar. It lacks the natural minerals which are present in its natural state ( sugar beet/cane ) without these minerals the body is unable to properly metabolize the carbohydrate which results in a "toxic metabolite" such as.. pyruvic acid.

accumulates in the brain, red blood cell etc. interfering with the respiration of cells. Also it produces an acidic environment in the body which isn't optimal for adding lean mass.

Obviously you won't keel over and die from eating some refined sugars, but to say they are the same as natural sugar is a lie.

[Dr. Horse]

You can Google, Mr. Horse. There's plenty of studies showing the effects of consuming refined sugars.

That's not what I asked at all. How is the sugar different?

We know you like to play expert on these forums.

I "play" expert? Perhaps you are projecting? Become some of us here are actually educated and are not just talking our of our respective asses.

Part of that feeds into the anti-broscience obsession that people have, throwing caution and common sense to the wind as they bow down and worship the almighty "If it fits in your macros..."

I have NEVER ever said "if it fits in your macros..."

Refined sugar is very different than naturally occurring sugar. It lacks the natural minerals which are present in its natural state ( sugar beet/cane ) without these minerals the body is unable to properly metabolize the carbohydrate which results in a "toxic metabolite" such as.. pyruvic acid.

accumulates in the brain, red blood cell etc. interfering with the respiration of cells. Also it produces an acidic environment in the body which isn't optimal for adding lean mass.

Obviously you won't keel over and die from eating some refined sugars, but to say they are the same as natural sugar is a lie.

Wow, somehow I never learned this stuff! Do you care to show me some evidence of all this?

[Holyspokes]

What's the difference between table sugar and sugar in fruit? Not much if anything. Sucrose is sucrose. Glucose is glucose. and Fructose is fructose. It's what comes along with the sugar in fruits that makes the difference.

[Colossal Spoons]

Something I've always wondered: at what point in the day do you want to consume sugar? Pre/post workout, etc.

[Simmo0508]

Something I've always wondered: at what point in the day do you want to consume sugar? Pre/post workout, etc.

When your body actually needs it. Most people tend to use it after training moreso than any other time.


By the way, good posts followme. I'm gonna use a bit of that in some of my personal notes for clients Thanks. You use easy to understand language that i think's a lot better to absorb for a lot of people.

[californiajeff]

Be careful with excess sugar and carbohydrate consumption. It has been shown to significantly speed up the ageing and degeneration process. Calorific/Carbohydrate restriction is optimum for health. It may be useful applying, to some degree, these principles to your diet.

"Centenarians, people who have lived over 100 years, don't have much in common. Many are smokers, for example. They come from all over the world without a favoring any geographic location in particular.

However, there are 3 consistent blood metabolic indicators of all centenarians which are relatively consistent: low sugar, low triglycerides, and low insulin. All 3 are relatively low for age. Among these 3 variables, insulin is the common denominator. The level of insulin sensitivity of the cell is one of the most important markers of lifespan.

Controlling your insulin levels is one of the most powerful anti-aging strategies you can possibly implement. Sugar and grains cause your body to produce insulin and high insulin levels are the single largest physical cause of accelerated aging. If you want to slow down aging and be healthy then you need to change your grains for greens. "

Good post.

[VulcanFlame]

Why load yourself up with more carbs and protein when you can simply add essential fats?
- Natural Peanut butter (just avoindg sugar and trans fat)
- Olive oil
- Fish oil
.
.
.
- If you cant get the calories, eat read meat instead of chicken
- Drink milk

It is VERY easy to get 800+ calories adding some fat to your meals =).

[GermanBarbarian]

That's not what I asked at all. How is the sugar different?

(I assume refined sugar vs. natural sugar) It doesn't contain the micro-nutrients that allow for proper utilization of the sugar (google chromium and insulin)

I "play" expert? Perhaps you are projecting? Become some of us here are actually educated and are not just talking our of our respective asses.

He does have some points bro.


I have NEVER ever said "if it fits in your macros..."

I believe you just said recently (not exactly "if it fits in your macros", but basically the same thing). "No such thing as empty calories when you're trying to gain weight."

Wow, somehow I never learned this stuff! Do you care to show me some evidence of all this?

Responses in between your rebuttals bro.

[Dr. Horse]

Responses in between bro.

Wha?