Why are there so many atheists these days... (srs)(warning dear diary)

[UltimateBrah]

Religious people don't generally live happier lives because they believe in a hell. Hell causes people to stress out. Also, when god fails to protect them or their loved ones can create hatred in their hearts. Kind of a vague statement for you to make.

your generalizing. some people find peace in God after tragedy.

[ausurfer]

The world and our bodies are far too complex to have happened randomly.

The world? As in Earth? If so, I find this statement rather ridiculous. The Earth is simply the result of circumstellar ejecta from a supernovae explosion billions of years ago. Over time it has very SLOWLY evolved into what it is today.. Think about how much technology has evolved in the last hundred years .. Now 100 years compared to 1,000,000,000 years is significantly different. Yes, technological advancement is quite different from biological/structural advancement .. but on a timeline of BILLIONS of years, I don't think the complexies apparent today are too farfetch to have been the result of evolution.

It's pretty ridiculous to believe that the matter of the universe came from nothing.

1. As opposed to being created by a wizard?
2. There are other scientific theories about how the universe came to be.
3. I'd rather admit I have no clue of how the universe came to be rather than blindy believe in god for the mere reasoning of having an 'answer'.

inb4whocreatedGod

Why does the justification of the universe being created warrent an answer yet this doesn't?

I used to doubt the God stuff myself, but I've seen Him work in so many aspects of my life. I've seen so much evidence of His existence in our world and in each unique person He created.

Examples?

This **** just doesn't happen randomly.

See previous reply.

You're not a unique, complex, intelligent human being because a load of matter randomly evolved.

Every galaxy out there is complex and unique and is clearly run by its own rules, not gods.

Also, what kind of hopeless life is it to believe there's nothing after this? It's like what's the ****ing point if this is all there is? Why do you even live if you're just going to cease to exist one day? I'd much rather believe in a loving, merciful God and an afterlife than to live a hopeless life and risk spending eternity getting butt****ed by Satan and Hitler because I was too "intelligent" to believe in God. That's not why I'm a Christian, but sometimes I wonder why people are willing to take that risk if they really understood how ****ed they are.

I do not believe in an afterlife yet I am not running around screaming and pulling my hair out. Everything comes to an end. I play soccer on the weekends with the knowledge that it will come to an end. However, I enjoy it whilst it lasts.

If you were to live forever, how much different would your life really be? What would you change in your day to day? Your pleasure from different aspects of life would be the same, if not less as you have already experienced it countless times before.

What if you chose the wrong god? Why don't you worship all gods if you are really that worried about getting messy with satan?

[KDotLamar]

The world and our bodies are far too complex to have happened randomly.

The world? As in Earth? If so, I find this statement rather ridiculous. The Earth is simply the result of circumstellar ejecta from a supernovae explosion billions of years ago. Over time it has very SLOWLY evolved into what it is today.. Think about how much technology has evolved in the last hundred years .. Now 100 years compared to 1,000,000,000 years is significantly different. Yes, technological advancement is quite different from biological/structural advancement .. but on a timeline of BILLIONS of years, I don't think the complexies apparent today are too farfetch to have been the result of evolution.

WHY did they evolve? What gave the cells/particles the intelligence to know what to evolve into? What designed them? Where did they come from? Why did some cells/particles evolve into penguins, others into humans, others into horses, stars, etc. Why is there so much beauty in the world? It just happened randomly? The beauty and creativity of this world leave no doubt in my mind that it came from a creative, artistic God.

It's pretty ridiculous to believe that the matter of the universe came from nothing.


1. As opposed to being created by a wizard?
2. There are other scientific theories about how the universe came to be.
3. I'd rather admit I have no clue of how the universe came to be rather than blindy believe in god for the mere reasoning of having an 'answer'.

It's not blindly believing. Many scientists believe in some form of intelligent design.

inb4whocreatedGod

Why does the justification of the universe being created warrent an answer yet this doesn't?

There is no answer to this question. God is too complex for us to understand. Period.

I used to doubt the God stuff myself, but I've seen Him work in so many aspects of my life. I've seen so much evidence of His existence in our world and in each unique person He created.

again, just look at the beauty and order of this world. the uniqueness of each individual. the very fact that we have the intelligence to sit here and argue about this. that didn't happen randomly from some space particles. that was a design by a creative God.

You're not a unique, complex, intelligent human being because a load of matter randomly evolved.

Every galaxy out there is complex and unique and is clearly run by its own rules, not gods.

Who established these rules? Particles that were blown out into space randomly decided to come together into an orderly and coherent galaxy? Again, what told them to do this? What created the rules of the universe?

Also, what kind of hopeless life is it to believe there's nothing after this? It's like what's the ****ing point if this is all there is? Why do you even live if you're just going to cease to exist one day? I'd much rather believe in a loving, merciful God and an afterlife than to live a hopeless life and risk spending eternity getting butt****ed by Satan and Hitler because I was too "intelligent" to believe in God. That's not why I'm a Christian, but sometimes I wonder why people are willing to take that risk if they really understood how ****ed they are.

I do not believe in an afterlife yet I am not running around screaming and pulling my hair out. Everything comes to an end. I play soccer on the weekends with the knowledge that it will come to an end. However, I enjoy it whilst it lasts.

If you were to live forever, how much different would your life really be? What would you change in your day to day? Your pleasure from different aspects of life would be the same, if not less as you have already experienced it countless times before.

What if you chose the wrong god? Why don't you worship all gods if you are really that worried about getting messy with satan?

If I live forever, it won't be on this world. It will be in a perfect place where I can worship God and not have to experience pain or suffering. All I know is that God has revealed to me that He is the one true God and that cannot be explained scientifically, only in an anecdotal fashion.

It's cool if you believe what you believe. I'm just asking you to consider some of these things.

[OllieSA]

Didn't read the thread past page 1.

A better question would be: Why are there still so many theists these days?

A primitive idea to explain the unexplained has lasted so long and we still bring up our kids to believe it as the core of their little worldview.

[joblank]

WHY did they evolve? What gave the cells/particles the intelligence to know what to evolve into? What designed them? Where did they come from? Why did some cells/particles evolve into penguins, others into humans, others into horses, stars, etc. Why is there so much beauty in the world? It just happened randomly? The beauty and creativity of this world leave no doubt in my mind that it came from a creative, artistic God.

so many questions, and most of them can be answered by science we already know.

ok I'll bite, why did "god" create us? Why did god create planets that seemingly have no other purpose than to orbit around a star? For his own amusement, or what?

[Scofield]

"I think I would say that the universe has a purpose, it's not somehow just there by chance ... some people, I think, take the view that the universe is just there and it runs along–it's a bit like it just sort of computes, and we happen somehow by accident to find ourselves in this thing. But I don't think that's a very fruitful or helpful way of looking at the universe, I think that there is something much deeper about it."

[Scofield]

WHY did they evolve? What gave the cells/particles the intelligence to know what to evolve into? What designed them? Where did they come from? Why did some cells/particles evolve into penguins, others into humans, others into horses, stars, etc. Why is there so much beauty in the world? It just happened randomly? The beauty and creativity of this world leave no doubt in my mind that it came from a creative, artistic God.



It's not blindly believing. Many scientists believe in some form of intelligent design.



There is no answer to this question. God is too complex for us to understand. Period.



again, just look at the beauty and order of this world. the uniqueness of each individual. the very fact that we have the intelligence to sit here and argue about this. that didn't happen randomly from some space particles. that was a design by a creative God.



Who established these rules? Particles that were blown out into space randomly decided to come together into an orderly and coherent galaxy? Again, what told them to do this? What created the rules of the universe?



If I live forever, it won't be on this world. It will be in a perfect place where I can worship God and not have to experience pain or suffering. All I know is that God has revealed to me that He is the one true God and that cannot be explained scientifically, only in an anecdotal fashion.

It's cool if you believe what you believe. I'm just asking you to consider some of these things.

must be trolling with some of these answers....

yep

join date nov 2011

[WinterWoIf]

WHY did they evolve? What gave the cells/particles the intelligence to know what to evolve into? What designed them? Where did they come from? Why did some cells/particles evolve into penguins, others into humans, others into horses, stars, etc. Why is there so much beauty in the world? It just happened randomly? The beauty and creativity of this world leave no doubt in my mind that it came from a creative, artistic God.



It's not blindly believing. Many scientists believe in some form of intelligent design.



There is no answer to this question. God is too complex for us to understand. Period.



again, just look at the beauty and order of this world. the uniqueness of each individual. the very fact that we have the intelligence to sit here and argue about this. that didn't happen randomly from some space particles. that was a design by a creative God.



Who established these rules? Particles that were blown out into space randomly decided to come together into an orderly and coherent galaxy? Again, what told them to do this? What created the rules of the universe?



If I live forever, it won't be on this world. It will be in a perfect place where I can worship God and not have to experience pain or suffering. All I know is that God has revealed to me that He is the one true God and that cannot be explained scientifically, only in an anecdotal fashion.

It's cool if you believe what you believe. I'm just asking you to consider some of these things.

Do you not see the hilarious irony of you saying "God is too complex for us to understand" and then saying other things can't possibly exist because of their complexity? That's nothing more than a vague Sunday School copout. You are introducing a vastly more complex being as the only possible answer behind something complex, that alone makes your argument completely illogical. The answer to your question is simple: no matter how small the chance of the Universe being aligned in such a way that intelligent life could exist, the only way we could ask this question is if we existed. If the 99.9999999% chance that we didn't exist was reality, you wouldn't be here asking it. Pretty simple, and adding God to the equation is just completely unnecessary.

Also LMAO at "coherent and orderly galaxy". The universe is the complete opposite with all those supernovas, supermassive blackholes, blackholes, how galaxies collide together, trillions of planets made of diamond and ice and fire and gas. Yeah bro what an orderly and coherent galaxy. One planet in an unbelievably large Universe being able to support life (and this one is 70% salt water which humans have no use for) does not make that Universe remotely orderly. As for your "that didn't just randomly happen from space particles", yeah, it does actually, there is a scientific reasoning behind that statement far more than the idea some mysterious, unknowable God made it just because he wanted people to worship him. You are acting like the statement that we are star dust is somehow a ridiculous notion. Arguments from incredulity just make you look stupid and that's basically all you said.

As for our anecdotal evidence of the true God having revealed himself to you, millions of people in India believed Sathya Sai Baba (who died very recently) was a reincarnation of a holy healer and thousands claimed to have witnessed him perform similar miracles to Jesus. Over half a million people attended his funeral.

And by the way, saying 'many scientists' believe in some form of intelligent design is incredibly misleading. Maybe some do, but very few people in relevant fields about the universe and the development of life do so, and mostly because of a religious upbringing.

"I think I would say that the universe has a purpose, it's not somehow just there by chance ... some people, I think, take the view that the universe is just there and it runs along–it's a bit like it just sort of computes, and we happen somehow by accident to find ourselves in this thing. But I don't think that's a very fruitful or helpful way of looking at the universe, I think that there is something much deeper about it."

Do you not realize you are quoting an atheist? Or are you just quoting it because you like it?

The world and our bodies are far too complex to have happened randomly. It's pretty ridiculous to believe that the matter of the universe came from nothing.

inb4whocreatedGod

I used to doubt the God stuff myself, but I've seen Him work in so many aspects of my life. I've seen so much evidence of His existence in our world and in each unique person He created. This **** just doesn't happen randomly. You're not a unique, complex, intelligent human being because a load of matter randomly evolved. Also, what kind of hopeless life is it to believe there's nothing after this? It's like what's the ****ing point if this is all there is? Why do you even live if you're just going to cease to exist one day? I'd much rather believe in a loving, merciful God and an afterlife than to live a hopeless life and risk spending eternity getting butt****ed by Satan and Hitler because I was too "intelligent" to believe in God. That's not why I'm a Christian, but sometimes I wonder why people are willing to take that risk if they really understood how ****ed they are.

Wow, what a cowardly view toward life. Sometimes I wish there is a God, so people who only find meaning in empty promises, fear, and ignorance can be judged for the sad lives they live. Herp derp what if I don't die in battle and end up not being able to go to Valhalla?

[BrotatoChip]

I love how in all these threads the religious zealots always end up questioning science itself. "HURRR, I mean science was wrong about things in the past, so it's probably wrong about everything that we think we know now right? Fuking scientists always changing their minds about stuff. I mean first Earth was flat, now it's round, tomorrow it'll probably be a rectangular prism."

But that's not even the best part. The best is when they start speaking FOR the entire scientific community, "science has no explanation for _______. Most scientists believe _____."

I changed my mind, the best part is when someone points out that "_____ is just a theory"


just a theory
































just a theory

[weltweitefurcht]

What I recently pondered was that we are all made of the same atoms, minerals, etc. The wall, the rock, you, your brain..

I find it amazing that some of those atoms, can become self-aware when working together.

Let me explain further.

Your brain is composed of so many things, amino acids, fatty acids, b-vitamins, magnesium/minerals, on and on.
They work together to make your brain.. think and be..

You look through a microscope, at some materials.. magnesium or an amino acid for instance, and that visual/information travels through your eyes.. to a brain composed of perhaps the same stuff your looking at..

and your vessel of various atoms (brain) can understand and comprehend that it is, what it is.. and that it is similar to your atoms and materials.


ANother way to put it is, if you took some dust, and held it in your palm. And thought.. can this dust look at another pile of dust and understand that they are the same? Can it understand what it is made out of? Can it understand what the other pile of dust is made out of..

can it understand that it understands?

Things are just so complex.. I do not rule out anything, and anyone who makes giant claims whether an athiest or a religious person are ignorant.

[Scofield]

Do you not realize you are quoting an atheist? Or are you just quoting it because you like it?

Athiests seem to be overly represented as Nihilists on the internet for some reason and tend to sell the two belief systems as a package deal.

[Chook Legs]

Atheism isn't a claim of ultimate knowledge. It's just a rejection of claims of the existence of an invisible wizard in the sky.

Brb applying other peoples definitions of what god is, so it is easier for me to reject him/her/it.

Well, I have news for you. I am God, because without me here to acknowledge your presence through a post, you do not exist.

[WinterWoIf]

Athiests seem to be overly represented as Nihilists on the internet for some reason and tend to sell the two belief systems as a package deal.

As in existential nihilists? Yeah, that makes no sense since if you believe there is only one life you want to live as well as possible. Religious people should be more concerned with all those people oppressed by their religion into not living the way they want. And instead of 'praying' for changes I try to actually do ****, like donate what I can to charity/volunteer at shelters/etc.

[feelymcfeel]

I look forward to the glorious day when I will ride at Odin's side, as he sits atop Sleipnir leading the Aesir into battle against the Jotnar. Until Ragnarok, the breaking of Bifrost and the burning of Yggdrasil, I'll wait in Valhalla and feast and battle in glory with my Viking brethren.

FOR ODIN!

[Nocturnal310]

i think it could be due to utilitarian theory which the religion very harshly conflicts with.

utilitarian is goal based...while religion is ruled based....all religions are concerned with sticking to the rules, practices, rituals as a purpose of life whether they have any utility or not.


religious beliefs work on the principle that 'do this and you will be happy and a good person or you will experience misery'

but religious practices as we know dont help us achieve the state of happiness .....going to church or mosque to pray doesnt really solve anything but give you a fake sense of content.

.its more like a non-credible promise'...and people are realising that religious instructions are not as credible as they r claimed to be due to information age which allows humans to share inner thoughts without fear of consequences.



atheism on the other hand gives u freedom from fear and lets you personally pursue a state of content and happiness.




atheism in true essence is a freedom from any societal chains and in human nature..we will always try to strive for freedom.

[1337h4x]

Op, i also do not understand how people can be so 100 percent about whether or not there is a god.

its called ignorance




not that i believe in god... but in this world nothing is 100% not even death

[CoolStoryBrotha]

I just rule out god until there is proof. All the experiments in the OP I can do and I can see and I can quantify. There is no proof of any god so why should I give any credence to that story.

It's convenient that one of the conditions of almost every religion ever made is that you just have to believe it blindly.

[SportbikerKid]

Strong Christian checking in. Come at me broz

[V10Kyle]

Because the idea that when your brain, or anyone else's brain for that matter, has trouble comprehending something that you automatically assume there must be some higher power to explain it. Humans are extremely curious by nature and want to explain things; this is what scientists do by furthering their research and knowledge base; it's what the population at large does to explain what they can't understand.

[lucious]

Christians you are so horribly wrong







Atheists are wasting their time arguing with them





The answer is in DMT. If youre religious, take some DMT and you will realise you were wasting your time./

[NIguy]

areyoufkingkiddingme.jpg

If you make a claim, you are expected to back it up with evidence. If you can't, then you are a jackass and there is no reason to listen to you. If you claim there is a god, you should be able to give me something better than "I feel it, so therefore it is real!"

There is a major problem with these arguments that you seem to be ignoring or ignorant of. When it is broken down to the fundamentals of 'what is a theist?' and 'what is an atheist?' the real difference is not evidence based but idealogical. When the ultimate evidence for both parties is the very nature of existence the only real difference can be ideology.

When the question is put to a theist or atheist, 'how did the universe come about and what evidence is there for your view?' the simplistic and most basic interpretation of each view is equally as plausible as the other and NEITHER of them are testable.

A theist will tell you that their best guess is that something was involved in all of this, they find it hard to accept that from nothing came everything without a cause. Can they provide evidence of that 'something?' No - how can you test something that you have no means of testing. The very nature of a God is one that isn't quantifiable by humans who can only test the four dimensions within they live.

An atheist by contrast believes that the universe doesn't need a 'something' and what prompted its expansion was nothing. When asked the same question they suggest that the universe simply 'was' in the same way theists suggest God simply 'is,' and that the origin was a consequence of random events. Can they provide evidence of how something can come out of nothing, or the absence of a causative agent that normally precedes all events? No, how would you test such a thing?

Neither position is more rational than the other fundamentally, both positions can be rationalised, both positions have the glaring problems and neither need declare ultimate knowledge. An atheist might sarcastically suggest that there is no 'wizard in the sky' (your 1st post ITT) and lambaste a theist for not providing any evidence of one but atheists don't seem to get that creating something from nothing without a cause isn't logical either. Theists might rightly ask an analogous question, 'provide evidence for a process without cause, or define how something can come from nothing?' How is that question fundamentally different from the one levelled at theists? The two ideologies are simply the antistasis of the other both limited in exactly the same way just at a different end point.

It is very handy to put yourself under the atheist banner, because belief in nothing being responsible for eveything is considered by many as having no need to provide evidence for such a belief, a completely false notion.

The fact that you continue to harp on in the manner you are tells me you didn't even get my message in the OP. Namely: how can atheists be so sure of their 'ideology' when new data on the fundamentals of the universe (quantum physics, cosmology), interpretation of events (neuroscience) and the processing of information (psychology) are constantly challenging the very nature of reality as we perceive it. The arguments are moving forward, and fast, get with the fuking program.

Christians you are so horribly wrong

Atheists are wasting their time arguing with them

The answer is in DMT. If youre religious, take some DMT and you will realise you were wasting your time./

DMT is very interesting but there are a lot of people who take it and who come out of their first trip and believe in something. What's your ideology? I think that will determine what you believe in coming out the other side.

[Adimi24]

All of the advancements in physics just prove to me that there is no God, not the other way around

[lucious]

All of the advancements in physics just prove to me that there is no God, not the other way around

Sounds like you need some DMT.

[CoolDehLa]

OP=

I don't know, therefor God

[OllieSA]

An atheist by contrast believes that the universe came out of nothing

Don't be an idiot. Atheism says nothing of origins.

[UltimateBrah]

As in existential nihilists? Yeah, that makes no sense since if you believe there is only one life you want to live as well as possible. Religious people should be more concerned with all those people oppressed by their religion into not living the way they want. And instead of 'praying' for changes I try to actually do ****, like donate what I can to charity/volunteer at shelters/etc.

most churches ive been to have something called an offering...

[UltimateBrah]

OP=

I don't know, therefor God

no
OP= idk, so how can u confirm no God?

[UltimateBrah]

for those of you(like OP) that are curious about science AND religion should check out "Everything is Spiritual" with Rob Bell. I dont know how much of what he's saying is actually true, and im sure some people could point out whats wrong, but he makes a very compelling argument.

edit: i think its on youtube

[wulpurgis]

i can't believe how ****ing stupid people are, they read a little bit of controversial or watered down science and think that reality is an illusion / lie. good god.....

[Margzz]

The way this thread has gone is a perfect illustration of one of the greatest flaws of humanity. We decide what side of the fence we are on by making our own logical deductions through our personal belief and our experience of the world around us, and then we shut up shop and remain intensely steadfast on defending our original position regardless of any logical inconsistencies we may run into that challenges said position.

The OP didn't even mention religion, yet somehow it has one again stemmed into a atheist vs. religion debate of sorts. Most mainstream religions, and the most common one discussed in this thread being Christianity, are dependent on God's existence, however the existence of a creator of sorts is not dependent on say what is written in the bible being true.

The OP's point was that with each passing day we learn more information about the universe that shakes and breaks down our conceived laws of the universe. His extension of that point was if our supposed "laws of the universe" can be proven false, then how can we be so sure there that some sort of divine being does not exist?

The point is, we can't. So it is a logical fallacy to refer to a Creator's existence in absolutes, because we ultimately have no proof to confirm or deny his existence.