Intermittent Fasting for Strength Training and Fat Loss

[IrishPilot]

...
It can be done, and I did this all last summer (eating earlier in the day and working out at 6 a.m.) broke my fast at 7 a.m. until around 2 p.m., then would fast until the next morning

Could you share your experience? How did it work for you, did you enjoy it, etc.? Or possibly direct me to where you may have already talked about it?

Thanks bud!

[ChinoZ32]

Just a quick update:

I've started to implement IF into my CKD regimen on Wednesdays (rest) only and currently into my 14th hour. So far so good, not hungry despite the fact that I'm on a ketogenic diet and yesterday's intake was 500cal below my maintenance. Did my rest day LISS this morning without any problems. In fact I don't even feel hungry despite my last meal being 14hrs ago and just thinking of it now, I'm actually pretty switched on.

Again, with my lifestyle, I'll still have to pack food the night before to take to work. But it can't be avoided for me despite what diet/regimen I decide on.

I wouldn't mind it if any IF'ers (particulary leangains protocol) could post their before/after stats, goals, and how they approach IF in terms of total cals on training/non-training days and macro break down.

I am thinking of jumping into IF (leangains) after my last attempt to get down to 7% bf using SKD and see how it goes in terms of 'lean gains'. I will stick to CKD for a while, even though I'm gaining some bf I'm gradually getting PB's which tends to show I'm gaining some muscle and I'm actually enjoying the 'anabolic' effect after a weekend refeed/carbup.

[The Solution]

Could you share your experience? How did it work for you, did you enjoy it, etc.? Or possibly direct me to where you may have already talked about it?

Thanks bud!

I did it because 1) i live a crazy life and work 2 jobs in the summer, I am on my feet all day working in the food industry, so i practically ate a huge PWO meal after my workout and before going to work, and then when I had a break at work I would get something off the menu and eat that, and fast the rest of the day.

Anything will work any diet will work, any meal frequency will work, I just did this because it suited MY schedule. I had no time to pack meals nor do i enjoy small meals.

I wouldn't mind it if any IF'ers (particulary leangains protocol) could post their before/after stats, goals, and how they approach IF in terms of total cals on training/non-training days and macro break down.

Read my article on March 25th on Martin's Site.

The amount of kcals on on/off days is too dependent on the individual, NOBODY is the same, it will vary depending on goal as well. The only way to figure out what works for YOU Is through trial and error. Giving others their calories doesnt mean anything. If we all used the same calories and we all ate like arnold did would we all be jacked? No, doesnt work like that. You do keto stuff literally none of martin's clients do Keto, Very little if any even venture there.

Some people such as myself can gain on 500-600g of carbs, some cannot, too much of a variable to give distinct macros.

[ChinoZ32]

Read my article on March 25th on Martin's Site.

The amount of kcals on on/off days is too dependent on the individual, NOBODY is the same, it will vary depending on goal as well. The only way to figure out what works for YOU Is through trial and error. Giving others their calories doesnt mean anything. If we all used the same calories and we all ate like arnold did would we all be jacked? No, doesnt work like that. You do keto stuff literally none of martin's clients do Keto, Very little if any even venture there.

Some people such as myself can gain on 500-600g of carbs, some cannot, too much of a variable to give distinct macros.

Gotcha. I wasn't in anyway trying to get others to do my homework for me so to speak, I just want to gauge the results of IF is all. Also, I think Martin does have one client on keto due to personal condition. I shouldn't have mentioned keto anyway, it's besides the point and in fact, I'm looking for a life long change I can follow, and one that does not avoid any food groups. And yes, I've ready that article but you are right, it'd be best to experiment. I might try and start off with maintenance cals on training days and about 500cal deficit on rest days.

Edit:

The Solution: Well done btw, I thought you looked familiar. You were in the Animal Pak Vs Leangains post, and looking at your pics now, you look awesome. GW!

[Trillios]

Little update from me. I owe one huge thing to IF: being able to binge on my allowed macro/caloric intake! I don't want to say the fasting/eating windows have contributed to my recent bodyfat loss (slow progression and minimal loss) because I still believe IF to be a style of dieting more than anything else. The cravings for anything have gone away and the fiber binge keeps me ridiculously full.

[joyce261]

does it get easier, and if so, WHEN? i've been doing IF for about 3 weeks (excluding weekends) and some days i feel like it's easy, other days i feel like crap. i feel kind of miserable right now, like i would really like to eat. but i think maybe i am just moody and bored, and therefore THINK i need food, but i don't. i'm almost certain that if i were to eat food right now, it wouldn't make me feel any better. but on the other hand, it seems like such an internal struggle...i wonder why i am torturing myself, maybe i should just eat. ARGHHH i feel like a complete headcase right now!

[Trillios]

A typical day for me looks like this:

-pre workout meal 20% of total macros
-postworkout meal 80% left (food eaten right after another)
-drink 1.5 gallons of water until i fall asleep or during my nightshift at work

I notice i start to get KIND OF hungry within 12 hours of fasting but not enough to make me go crazy. I'm currently taking in 2200 cals and most carbs come from fiber (mixed veggies + 2-3 cups oats). Make sure you're getting enough. Hope this helps.

[liammccarthy]

A typical day for me looks like this:

-pre workout meal 20% of total macros
-postworkout meal 80% left (food eaten right after another)
-drink 1.5 gallons of water until i fall asleep or during my nightshift at work

I notice i start to get KIND OF hungry within 12 hours of fasting but not enough to make me go crazy. I'm currently taking in 2200 cals and most carbs come from fiber (mixed veggies + 2-3 cups oats). Make sure you're getting enough. Hope this helps.

Similar to me right now except I'll have 5 egg whites and a whole egg right at the end of the 8 hour window to help curb the hunger for the next morning.

[determined4000]

I notice i start to get KIND OF hungry within 12 hours of fasting but not enough to make me go crazy. I'm currently taking in 2200 cals and most carbs come from fiber (mixed veggies + 2-3 cups oats). Make sure you're getting enough. Hope this helps.

Increase fat and fiber intake of last meal
Are you eating a casein protein source?
All will help keep you satiated through the fasting

[magicmatt]

anyone notice they get nasty headaches after the first meal? mine is usually around 4pm and i get a headache around 5/530. its not unbearable but i just dont know why. i almost think after not eating for 16 hours my body is going into ketosis and the food knocks it out of ketosis. could this be why?

[determined4000]

anyone notice they get nasty headaches after the first meal? mine is usually around 4pm and i get a headache around 5/530. its not unbearable but i just dont know why. i almost think after not eating for 16 hours my body is going into ketosis and the food knocks it out of ketosis. could this be why?

YOu dont go in and out of ketosis in this manner
Ketosis comes from days and days of carb restriction not a 16hour period of no food
Could be dehydration, could be what you are eating, could be you haven't adapted yet.

[magicmatt]

YOu dont go in and out of ketosis in this manner
Ketosis comes from days and days of carb restriction not a 16hour period of no food
Could be dehydration, could be what you are eating, could be you haven't adapted yet.

i dont think its dehydration and the foods i eat havent changed. and i used to go into ketosis after a very short time of no carbs based on those strips that you piss on. so who knows.

[blacksmith77]

has anyone actually done a test on body composition with eating the same amount of calories on IF vs a standard diet with the same goal and therefore workouts?

[sportyaccordy]

has anyone actually done a test on body composition with eating the same amount of calories on IF vs a standard diet with the same goal and therefore workouts?

This is what I really want to know....

Not to knock on the method, but if the driver of fat loss is the calorie deficit, and IF only helps certain people's meal planning and hunger management....????

[magicmatt]

anyone notice they get nasty headaches after the first meal? mine is usually around 4pm and i get a headache around 5/530. its not unbearable but i just dont know why. i almost think after not eating for 16 hours my body is going into ketosis and the food knocks it out of ketosis. could this be why?

ate at 4, its now 530. here comes the headache like clockwork. ****in weird

[The Solution]

has anyone actually done a test on body composition with eating the same amount of calories on IF vs a standard diet with the same goal and therefore workouts?

Sure.

Me last year at 170 before starting IF:





Me this year at 176 utilizing IF:








I reckon I am happy with how I am now and since I have been using IF

[ErickStevens]

6 weeks on IF, 9.5 lbs difference. Still have 6 weeks to go on my cut, I'll be transitioning into maintenance afterwards using IF. This is the easiest cut I've ever done and I've been getting compliments constantly. The conversations are great....

"So what do you eat?"
"You know, the usual. Egg whites, chicken, broccoli, oatmeal, cereal, candy, ice cream, sushi..."
"Wut."

[determined4000]

6 weeks on IF, 9.5 lbs difference."

I reckon I am happy with how I am now and since I have been using IF

Awesome progress pics Shows you can effectively improve body comp bulking or cutting with IF. How did each of you change workouts, calorie levels, and macros. I am assuming Eric went down in calories for the cut (what about workouts?) and I think Bob said he transitioned to more rest days (?) and pretty sure you said lifts have shot up.

[Fututre117]

do you have to workout at the sametime all the time to utilize IF?

[The Solution]

Awesome progress pics Shows you can effectively improve body comp bulking or cutting with IF. How did each of you change workouts, calorie levels, and macros. I am assuming Eric went down in calories for the cut (what about workouts?) and I think Bob said he transitioned to more rest days (?) and pretty sure you said lifts have shot up.

Same calories, less time in gym and less time on cardio. Went from training 5x a week (Power-Hypertrophy Split via Layne Norton to Upper/Lower -- Lyle McDonalds Generic Bulking Routine).

Again for the 903497230 time. Macros dont mean ANYTHING, everyone is different and should utilize the macros that SUIT them. I prefer higher carbs and less fat because I work well like that. I utilized a carb cycle approach on IF because it worked, just look at the difference. Even Martin agreed that I should keep this style of eating because of how my body cannot handle huge loads of carbs on a day to day basis. So my low days (carb cycle) were around 150g of carbs and fats that were around 150g. Protein was high.

High carb days carbs would sky over 600+g (1-2x a week 2 towards the beginning then 1 when more towards recomp) and medium day carbs were around 300-350g (1-2x a week 2 towards recomp 1 towards full bulk)

do you have to workout at the sametime all the time to utilize IF?

No I workout at different times almost everyday. Sometimes 11 a.m., sometimes 1 p.m., sometimes 3 p.m., sometimes 8 p.m.

[ChinoZ32]

I think that Martin also noted the importance of meal timing which is why I think IF works great. Massive meals immediately post workout and allowing cal intake to go above maintenance. As 'The Solution' says, macros will vary depending on individual but calories count. I also tested myself on IF (one day only to test self will) and was very successful, but only on a rest day. Two meals, and despite being cal deficit the day before and on the day (1k below actually) I felt fine. In conclusion, IF is a very very manageable method.

[LeroysAces]

Great job 'The Solution'! You do a great job providing info, too.

Well guys and gals, today is the final day of my cut! I weighed 162.4 today, which is crazy, since my prior low weight was 165.0. Pics tomorrow morning and I will post them here (assuming I have enough posts, lol.).

Bulking to come next!

[ErickStevens]

I am assuming Eric went down in calories for the cut (what about workouts?) and I think Bob said he transitioned to more rest days (?) and pretty sure you said lifts have shot up.

Without giving too much away, Martin's initial consultation had me eating slightly below maintenance on training days with an even larger deficit on rest days. Training days were high carb/high protein/low fat while rest days were high protein/moderate carb/low fat. Training was 3x per week, low volume, high intensity with focus on progression.

I modified the approach by adding in more activity (LISS cardio, BJJ), switching my rest days to PSMF days, and dropping my protein on training days to 1g per lb of body weight. I still train using a 3 day split, as I found this is just right in terms of recovering sufficiently. I've gotten' stronger in a number of lifts as well.

[ANIMALISTIKZ]

Same calories, less time in gym and less time on cardio. Went from training 5x a week (Power-Hypertrophy Split via Layne Norton to Upper/Lower -- Lyle McDonalds Generic Bulking Routine).

Again for the 903497230 time. Macros dont mean ANYTHING, everyone is different and should utilize the macros that SUIT them. I prefer higher carbs and less fat because I work well like that. I utilized a carb cycle approach on IF because it worked, just look at the difference. Even Martin agreed that I should keep this style of eating because of how my body cannot handle huge loads of carbs on a day to day basis. So my low days (carb cycle) were around 150g of carbs and fats that were around 150g. Protein was high.

High carb days carbs would sky over 600+g (1-2x a week 2 towards the beginning then 1 when more towards recomp) and medium day carbs were around 300-350g (1-2x a week 2 towards recomp 1 towards full bulk)



No I workout at different times almost everyday. Sometimes 11 a.m., sometimes 1 p.m., sometimes 3 p.m., sometimes 8 p.m.

so do you just workout whenever, then after that feeding window wait atleast 16 hours for the next work out?

[The Solution]

so do you just workout whenever, then after that feeding window wait atleast 16 hours for the next work out?

No, workout whenever, then just workout the next day whenever, my feeding window is usually like 4-5 hours max. I just like eating large meals in a short span to keep me full.

Worked out at like 2 p.m. today, and will workout like 10 a.m. tomorrow. just Adjust my feeding window and plan ahead.

[liammccarthy]

Hey all, just wanted a couple of opinions on my current cutting diet...

How do you guys think this is for a cut using IF:

Ht - 5'11
Wt - 102 kg
BF - 14%
BMR - 2500kCal (low for my weight but I've experimented a LOT with calories and this is my best estimate for myself as I have an IT job and other than lifting / cardio I am stuck at a PC all day)

Training Days - 2000kCal, 220g Protein, 150g Carbs, 50g Fat
Non-Training Days - 1500kCal, 180g Protein, 100g Carbs, 60g Fat
Refeed Day (Also a training day) - 4500kCal, 250g Protein, 500g Carbs, 160g Fat

Probably only have one refeeed day per week until I get under 10% BF, then will increase refeeds to 2x per week. Thoughts?

[ErickStevens]

Not enough calories/carbs on training days IMO. Also, wayyyy to much fat on your refeed day. Fat intake should be no more than < 50g.

[determined4000]

Agreed. A 500 calorie deficit on a training day (and a 1000 on non) sounds like muscle loss to me.
Too high on refeed.

[liammccarthy]

Less than 50g Fat? Even at the lowest end of the spectrum, and using only lean mass as an indicator I should be having at 58g of Fat per day...

What's the reasoning for such low fat?

[Nutir]

I'm thinking about going back to IF (did a bout about two years ago while I had a really flexible schedule)..

Just wondering how I would arrange it, given the following schedule for the next few weeks (next quarter is gonna be easier to fix):

9-950 class
1030-1130 gym
1-4 class

Right now I eat at 8am, noon, and around 6pm -- which is a little over the 8hour eating window, the only thing I see is:

8am small breakfast (10% kcals)
12 pwo meal (60% kcals)
4pm smaller high fat/fiber meal (30% kcals)

What do you guys think? Last time I did IF I had a smaller eating window (6hours) and did just fine during the fasting phase (just one no-cals energy drink and water)



Also, what's the current take about refeeds/cheats? Still once a week eat the whole day whatever you want?