Lifting while standing on the balance ball?

[BaldwinBoy]

I see a lot of trainers in my pricey gym having their clients do dumbbell exercises while balancing on the rubber ball or half ball.

I appreciate the value of developing balance (hey, I saw Karate Kid 3x), but it seems to me you can't get much out of the dumbbells if you're mostly balancing. Sometimes I think trainers do this just to appear knowledge in exotica.

[AICfan69]

Originally Posted by BaldwinBoy

I see a lot of trainers in my pricey gym having their clients do dumbbell exercises while balancing on the rubber ball or half ball.

I appreciate the value of developing balance (hey, I saw Karate Kid 3x), but it seems to me you can't get much out of the dumbbells if you're mostly balancing. Sometimes I think trainers do this just to appear knowledge in exotica.

The act of balancing your body makes the exercise more difficult, thus means more energy used. Most of their clients aren't planning on entering a bodybuilding contest anytime soon. They pay their trainers to put them through a tough a workout. I see no problem with incorporating aerobic or bosu balls into their program.

[BaldwinBoy]

And no, the crowd at that gym is NOT competing anytime soon. thx

Originally Posted by AICfan69

The act of balancing your body makes the exercise more difficult, thus means more energy used. Most of their clients aren't planning on entering a bodybuilding contest anytime soon. They pay their trainers to put them through a tough a workout. I see no problem with incorporating aerobic or bosu balls into their program.

[Jack_Lupino]

have you ever tried it?

i think that's the only way to really find out...

my personal favorite uses for the bosu ball were 1 legged lateral/frontal db raises and this other thing where i would stand in a tree pose and have my buddy shin kick me in the obliques.

[Austin109]

personally i like jumping jacks on them.

[-Lucifer]

I know a Cricketer, who used to do DB shoulder presses and other exercises on the Bosu ball. Must be important for Cricket or he wouldn't do them.

Never seen PTs at my gym making their clients do that, though. The most I've seen is, people doing crunches on the Bosu ball.

Originally Posted by Austin109

personally i like jumping jacks on them.

You should try hang cleans on them, like I do. You'll be swole as hell!

[GuyJin]

Damn, and all I do are one-legged squats with a barbell on my back and someone punching me in the face while I close my eyes and think about Kim Kardashian. (Yes, joke....duh!).

I honestly can't see the advantages of some exercises people use on these balance balls. Yes, for some chest exercises they may offer a better stretch but you have to use less weight, a trade-off I don't want to make. Same deal with "core" work--if you do heavy leg and back work i.e. squats, lunges, deads, cleans PLUS working your abs with crunches and whatnot, then that's all the core work IMHO you really need.

[jdelarod]

Do overhead squats for your core and dont get close to a bosu ball ever.

[Jack_Lupino]

just to clear things up a little...

having been a PT who used Bosu and other such stability products, please allow me to explain the purpose as it was explained to me by our gym's corporate personal trainer trainer.

the average schmoe walking into a gym for the first time or who hasn't worked out since HS or college will most likely be suffering from a condition where there core does not activate as quickly as it is meant to. (i can't remember the exact numbers but we're talking hundreds of miliseconds) it has a lot to do with the CNS, not just the muscles of the torso...

if your brain doesn't send the message through your spine that prepares it for stress on the extremities this is when injury can and will occur.

thus, the aim of starting clients out with such exercises serves the dual purpose of making them stronger from the inside out as well as helping to cover the trainer and gym's arses.

[Tommy W.]

These things are great for conditioning and co ordination.
They limit the amount of weight you're able to use so for hypertrophy they're not optimum

[chenko]

Originally Posted by -Lucifer

I know a Cricketer, who used to do DB shoulder presses and other exercises on the Bosu ball. Must be important for Cricket or he wouldn't do them.

Never seen PTs at my gym making their clients do that, though. The most I've seen is, people doing crunches on the Bosu ball.

You should try hang cleans on them, like I do. You'll be swole as hell!

wth at your avatar?

Good mornings?

[Diablomeister]

i like to do cock pushups on them, feels good.

[madaozeki]

Originally Posted by Jack_Lupino

just to clear things up a little...

having been a PT who used Bosu and other such stability products, please allow me to explain the purpose as it was explained to me by our gym's corporate personal trainer trainer.

the average schmoe walking into a gym for the first time or who hasn't worked out since HS or college will most likely be suffering from a condition where there core does not activate as quickly as it is meant to. (i can't remember the exact numbers but we're talking hundreds of miliseconds) it has a lot to do with the CNS, not just the muscles of the torso...

if your brain doesn't send the message through your spine that prepares it for stress on the extremities this is when injury can and will occur.

thus, the aim of starting clients out with such exercises serves the dual purpose of making them stronger from the inside out as well as helping to cover the trainer and gym's arses.

Sounds well-meaning enough, but there's absolutely zero hard science to support anything you've said, unfortunately. Using a stability or bosu ball under a load, especially for a NEW trainee, is probably one of the stupidest trends in the fitness industry ever conceived.

Personal trainers and gym owners basically follow the fold and latch on to any new and cool-seeming things to make them seem like they're up on the most current trends. Sadly, almost nothing "new" proves to be any more effective than the old standards, and in this case, introducing the element of instability serves no concrete purpose for a loaded movement. All it does is increase the chance of injury, with NO ADDED BENEFIT TO THE LIFTER THAT CAN'T ALREADY BE OBTAINED BY SAFER MEANS.

That last part is important. The stability or bosu ball may or may not be effective at what it's intended to do, but the fact that FAR safer alternatives exist to achieve the same purported goal makes them criminal, in my mind. Any trainer worth his/her salt should really evaluate the pros/cons of a tool before employing it blindly, IMO.

[jdelarod]

I second that. Every time you hear a PT invoke "CNS" you realize they cant back up their claims except through mystical bull****.

[Dr Clay]

Exercising while standing on a ball or a half ball is great if you are preparing to audition for Cirque du Soleil.

Okay sure, if you are rehabbing an ankle, knee, hip, or pelvic injury or muscular imbalance, then exercising on an unstable surface is often a great option.

Here are my (brief) thoughts on some of the claims or points made about training on unstable surface (i.e. Bosu ball):

1) it's functional training -- functional for what? Baseball, soccer, football, hockey, lacrosse, badminton, tennis, table tennis, and so on... all of these sports are played on a level surface, not only a semicircular ball!

2) CNS activation -- moving heavier weight and moving it more quickly is THE fundamental way to increase CNS activation with weight training. Standing on an unstable surface causes more activation in stabilizing muscles like the peroneus brevis, glute medius, etc. But that does not mean that it increases motor unit recruitment of the primary muscle being worked! Again, that's where more resistance (a.k.a. tension) and a faster rep speed come into play.

3) you burn more calories -- guess what... you can also burn more calories by utilizing more weight, and this will have a MUCH more profound effect on the target muscle.

Let me clarify that I am not at all against training on a Bosu ball or any other unstable surface. But I am against doing it just because it's cool or unique, when the client/trainee would actually get much better results by training on the ground... which is about 99.5% of the time.

Okay, I'm done with my rant :-)

Best,

[-Lucifer]

Originally Posted by chenko

wth at your avatar?
Good mornings?

Yes - Olympic style.

I used too much knee bend, but that was my first time.

[chenko]

Originally Posted by -Lucifer

Yes - Olympic style.

I used too much knee bend, but that was my first time.

Thank ****** for that...I feared the worst

Still looks decidely unhealthy though

[-Lucifer]

You have to do them with perfect form, or you will get hurt. Fortunately, I was able to keep my back arched, at all times.

[GuyJin]

Devil-guy,

Good mornings are the shiznit for the lower back and hams (in part) but one false move and you're f--ked--I've seen it happen and ain't pretty. Yes on the arch and a big FTW "YES" on moving up the weights SLOWLY. I love GM's but I'm always careful.

(What, and you thought I was going to make a joke? For shame...) (smile)

[AntM1564]

I try to keep to myself and zone everyone out at the gym, but there is this one guy I see once in awhile who insists on doing squats on this damn balance balls. Part of me wants to go push him off so he learns a lesson. The other part of me just wants to ask him why. The max I've seen him squat like that was 115, but it still isn't worth the risk IMO.

[optimus1]

I see those stupid balls all the time, many different gyms use them nowadays. Never once, not ever, have I seen someone in good shape on them. Maybe a few skinny chicks that haven't eaten in about a week, but I don't really consider them in good shape either. The bosu ball is purely a tactic by the trainer to give client the impression that they NEED the trainer for these far out ideas, that simple weight lifting and running are not enough. Sales tactic, no more no less. I like kicking the balls to the other side of the gym where no one is gonna use em.

[mc-]

Originally Posted by madaozeki

Sounds well-meaning enough, but there's absolutely zero hard science to support anything you've said, unfortunately. Using a stability or bosu ball under a load, especially for a NEW trainee, is probably one of the stupidest trends in the fitness industry ever conceived.

Personal trainers and gym owners basically follow the fold and latch on to any new and cool-seeming things to make them seem like they're up on the most current trends. Sadly, almost nothing "new" proves to be any more effective than the old standards, and in this case, introducing the element of instability serves no concrete purpose for a loaded movement. All it does is increase the chance of injury, with NO ADDED BENEFIT TO THE LIFTER THAT CAN'T ALREADY BE OBTAINED BY SAFER MEANS.

That last part is important. The stability or bosu ball may or may not be effective at what it's intended to do, but the fact that FAR safer alternatives exist to achieve the same purported goal makes them criminal, in my mind. Any trainer worth his/her salt should really evaluate the pros/cons of a tool before employing it blindly, IMO.

yup.

and just to add a little more evidence.

we've worked with someone who'd done a LOT of bosu work thinking this was great for balance etc.

his movement when off the ball - just walking - was really fraught - especially his upper body was very stiff. did the bosu help induce this? dunno, but his off bosu balance (stand on one leg, close your eyes, turn head quickly) was rather poor.

Another basic test we've used are muscle tests pre and post balance ball stuff. I've yet to test someone where they're stronger after doing stability surface work. And again, transfer to balance is not great.

Also work by c.staley's group shows that after doing say bench presses with dumbbells on a ball after about a week i think, the additional stabilizer activation is no longer present. no surprise: muscles have adapted.

A couple of great sources: stuart mcgills ulitmate back fitness has some words about the role of balls and say replacements for desk chairs and eric cressey has been doing some interesting work in this space and athletic performance (link) .

and here's an abstract from his study:

J Strength Cond Res. 2007 May;21(2):561-7.
The effects of ten weeks of lower-body unstable surface training on markers of athletic performance.

Cressey EM, West CA, Tiberio DP, Kraemer WJ, Maresh CM.

Human Performance Laboratory, Department of Kinesiology, University of Connecticut, Storrs, Connecticut 06269, USA. ericcressey@hotmail.com

Initially reserved for rehabilitation programs, unstable surface training (UST) has recently grown in popularity in strength and conditioning and general exercise scenarios. Nonetheless, no studies to date have examined the effects of UST on performance in healthy, trained individuals. The purpose of this study was to determine the effects of 10 weeks of lower-body UST on performance in elite athletes. Nineteen healthy, trained members (ages 18-23 years) of a National Collegiate Athletic Association Division I collegiate men's soccer team participated. The experimental (US) group (n = 10) supplemented their normal conditioning program with lower-body exercises on inflatable rubber discs; the control (ST) group (n = 9) performed the same exercises on stable surfaces. Bounce drop jump (BDJ) and countermovement jump (CMJ) heights, 40- and 10-yard sprint times, and T-test (agility) times were assessed before and after the intervention. The ST group improved significantly on predicted power output on both the BDJ (3.2%) and CMJ (2.4%); no significant changes were noted in the US group. Both groups improved significantly on the 40- (US = -1.8%, ST = -3.9%) and 10-yard sprint times (US = -4.0%, ST = -7.6%). The ST group improved significantly more than the US group in 40-yard sprint time; a trend toward greater improvement in the ST group was apparent on the 10-yard sprint time. Both groups improved significantly (US = 2.9%, ST = -4.4%) on T-test performance; no statistically significant changes were apparent between the groups. These results indicate that UST using inflatable rubber discs attenuates performance improvements in healthy, trained athletes. Such implements have proved valuable in rehabilitation, but caution should be exercised when applying UST to athletic performance and general exercise scenarios.

Hope that helps

mc

[Valjean]

My ex bb trainer is always filled with broscience, but says "Why are you lying on a ball when you are trying to work your chest? You can do core later"

[mc-]

by the way, i think balance training is great, but rarely needs to be done on an unstable surface.

if you go down to "test stronger" in this article there's a wee discussion about types of balance (vestibular) tests and sequences for balance improvement.

mc

[-Lucifer]

Originally Posted by GuyJin

Devil-guy,
Good mornings are the shiznit for the lower back and hams (in part) but one false move and you're f--ked--I've seen it happen and ain't pretty. Yes on the arch and a big FTW "YES" on moving up the weights SLOWLY. I love GM's but I'm always careful.

Yup, good mornings are the shit. I'm very careful with them, though. I do not want another lumbar injury.

Originally Posted by GuyJin

(What, and you thought I was going to make a joke?

Yes.

[Jack_Lupino]

well since the title of the thread has to do with lifting while on ball i suppose that explains most of the replies.

me personally, never really used it for any non-body weight exercises on a regular basis.

yes your body will adapt to the ball but it will also adapt to flat ground, i see no harm in mixing things up.

and to the Cirque du Soleil comment, not everyone's goals are just mass or tone...

i feel that bosu and other such products have a place, maybe not for most people but for those who are training for something along the lines of Parkour/Free running, Sasuke (Ninja Warrior) or any obstacle course type activity i believe they are beneficial.

[AICfan69]

Originally Posted by Dr Clay

3) you burn more calories -- guess what... you can also burn more calories by utilizing more weight, and this will have a MUCH more profound effect on the target muscle.

You can burn more calories doing a lot of things. This is simply one method that works. I can understand why it wouldn't be very beneficial to someone like you who's a competitive bodybuilder, but it can be a very useful tool for someone who's an average person looking to challenge their self.

A lot of you are being far too critical of a legitimate tool used to better one's self. No one is claiming it's a magical method that will make you an "unmovable" force that will have superior balance. It's a tool used to help strengthen your body core muscles. And it also adds new depth to your regimen, it's a new challenge that people find effective.

I realize the majority here have bodybuilding goals, and the balance ball or bosu ball may not have a place in your routine and understandably so. All I'm s***esting is not everyone who uses this method is an 'idiot' who blindly follows the current trend in fitness and exercise.

My .02

[theapexxxx]

Originally Posted by Dr Clay

Exercising while standing on a ball or a half ball is great if you are preparing to audition for Cirque du Soleil.

Okay sure, if you are rehabbing an ankle, knee, hip, or pelvic injury or muscular imbalance, then exercising on an unstable surface is often a great option.

Here are my (brief) thoughts on some of the claims or points made about training on unstable surface (i.e. Bosu ball):

1) it's functional training -- functional for what? Baseball, soccer, football, hockey, lacrosse, badminton, tennis, table tennis, and so on... all of these sports are played on a level surface, not only a semicircular ball!

2) CNS activation -- moving heavier weight and moving it more quickly is THE fundamental way to increase CNS activation with weight training. Standing on an unstable surface causes more activation in stabilizing muscles like the peroneus brevis, glute medius, etc. But that does not mean that it increases motor unit recruitment of the primary muscle being worked! Again, that's where more resistance (a.k.a. tension) and a faster rep speed come into play.

3) you burn more calories -- guess what... you can also burn more calories by utilizing more weight, and this will have a MUCH more profound effect on the target muscle.

Let me clarify that I am not at all against training on a Bosu ball or any other unstable surface. But I am against doing it just because it's cool or unique, when the client/trainee would actually get much better results by training on the ground... which is about 99.5% of the time.

Okay, I'm done with my rant :-)

Best,

Quoted.....so maybe more people will read this and STFU.
Bosu balls are merely a fad.

Kind of like how low-fat diets were all the craze.......until what, they were deemed dangerous.....huh?
Then came the Atkins diet...........we must be right now.......nope.
Greater chances of cardiovascular disease.....bummer.

Fads come and go. People who realise it early on will be better off.

[Masta_of_Riddum]

Originally Posted by BaldwinBoy

I see a lot of trainers in my pricey gym having their clients do dumbbell exercises while balancing on the rubber ball or half ball.

I appreciate the value of developing balance (hey, I saw Karate Kid 3x), but it seems to me you can't get much out of the dumbbells if you're mostly balancing. Sometimes I think trainers do this just to appear knowledge in exotica.

ur right! u wanna know wut traditional weight room exercises stimulate ur core musculature the most? Heavy squats and deadlifts! If you wannna get lean go on a diet! Stop this circus training. Most athletes will plateau on an ab routine after six week for the rest of their lives. U wanna do something that will stimulate ur abs? Walk with a super yoke on ur back and youll understand the meaning of real core training!

[sargefit]

As a PT the only time I use an unstable surface is for rehab. Most gym users cannot even do the basic movements like squats etc on a stable surface properly let alone an unstable surface. Even if they could I would increase weights used etc before even dreaming of an unstable surface.