Q & A With Clayton South: August 2004!

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[trusolman]

forgive me if i sound harsh, but looking at your photos, i'm not at all impressed with your physique which makes me doubt the credibility of the advice you give. i remember you started a series earlier this year, "12 weeks to a lean Physique." what went wrong? why haven't you succeeded? as a trainer, you are your own best or worst advertising and quite honestly you are providing some poor advertising. in some past articles you've dubbed yourself an "expert", what are your credentials anyway?

[Clayton South]

Originally Posted by trusolman

forgive me if i sound harsh, but looking at your photos, i'm not at all impressed with your physique which makes me doubt the credibility of the advice you give. i remember you started a series earlier this year, "12 weeks to a lean Physique." what went wrong? why haven't you succeeded? as a trainer, you are your own best or worst advertising and quite honestly you are providing some poor advertising. in some past articles you've dubbed yourself an "expert", what are your credentials anyway?

Trusolman:

I propose that your view of the human body is highly warped by unrealistic and chemically enhanced images in the bodybuilding magazines.

As for my results on the program, I reduced my bodyfat by 15lbs, and trimmed 7 inches off of my waist in 12 weeks with minimal loss of muscle tissue. Those are great results, and I succeeded.

As for my credentials, I hold a law degree, I am a former personal trainer, and I work full-time in the bodybuilding industry for several [six] big-name supplement companies. For one of these companies I am the CRO - Chief Research Officer, and I am also responsible for a good majority of marketing strategy.

I have considerable business experience and am frequently called upon to assist companies in product research and development, as well as issues regarding company efficiency and managment science. Not only that, but I am working on my Masters degree thesis in Cognitive Neuroscience [Biological Psychology]. I currently have over 120 bodybuilding publications to my credit.

I don't require your approval or admiration. Frankly, I'd rather you kept it to yourself. I would prefer, instead, that you understand the science that is the basis of what I write. If being judgemental and close minded is more important to you than sound advice backed by proven science, go ahead and short change yourself. It really is of no concern to me.

I suggest that, for future posts, it is in your interest to first know who you are talking to, or about, before making statements that result in you looking foolish.

-Clayton South

trusolman is not necessarily your enemy. What if he were your friend?

[Clayton South]

Originally Posted by lucubrationband

trusolman is not necessarily your enemy. What if he were your friend?

Which is it?

[trusolman]

Originally Posted by Clayton South

Trusolman:

I propose that your view of the human body is highly warped by unrealistic and chemically enhanced images in the bodybuilding magazines.

As for my results on the program, I reduced my bodyfat by 15lbs, and trimmed 7 inches off of my waist in 12 weeks with minimal loss of muscle tissue. Those are great results, and I succeeded.

As for my credentials, I hold a law degree, I am a former personal trainer, and I work full-time in the bodybuilding industry for several [six] big-name supplement companies. For one of these companies I am the CRO - Chief Research Officer, and I am also responsible for a good majority of marketing strategy.

I have considerable business experience and am frequently called upon to assist companies in product research and development, as well as issues regarding company efficiency and managment science. Not only that, but I am working on my Masters degree thesis in Cognitive Neuroscience [Biological Psychology]. I currently have over 120 bodybuilding publications to my credit.

I don't require your approval or admiration. Frankly, I'd rather you kept it to yourself. I would prefer, instead, that you understand the science that is the basis of what I write. If being judgemental and close minded is more important to you than sound advice backed by proven science, go ahead and short change yourself. It really is of no concern to me.

I suggest that, for future posts, it is in your interest to first know who you are talking to, or about, before making statements that result in you looking foolish.

-Clayton South

i don't see how my statements or questions make me look foolish or close-minded. in truth, a fool is someone who falls for anything or believes anything. if i just believed what you propose without questioning your credentials or basis, wouldn't THAT make me a fool? and clayton, it is my open mind that compels me to question all things.

i think it's more foolish to ramble on about "sound advice backed by proven science" when in your own case i don't think you got what your "science" was supposed to give you. you stated in the 1st installment of "12 weeks to a lean physique" that your goal was to be 212.04 lbs. @ 7% bodyfat, not to lose 15 lbs of fat and 7 inches of your waist. would you propose that your view of yourself at the time was "warped by unrealistic and chemically enhanced images in the bodybuilding magazines?" futhermore, i assume you used the "proven science" you speak of to develop your plan. did you along the course of your journey decide that your goal was unattainable despite the scientific evidence you used to plan your outcomes?

clayton, i am not your enemy. you are your only enemy. when you put yourself out there for public view you should be prepared to hear some things you don't like. you're gonna be judged whether you like it or not. honestly though, i was dissappointed with your response. i can respect your credentials, but i expected that by the way you talk in previous publications, you are a deep thinker/philosopher who is open to all things, but apparently you are open only to what tickles your ear. fair enough. but my questions came out of an honest desire to learn. i've struggled with bodyfat my whole life, and i'm not looking for a magic bullet, or unrealistic results; just real results. i want advice from people who have struggled like me and succeeded. i want to hear from someone who has done better than i have with the same tools, not from someone who has read a book.

despite that fact that your are not open to my questions or concerns, i am open to yours. i have read many of your articles and have considered everything i've read because i too am on a journey. i am my own laboratory and am willing to experiment on myself. the only thing i don't have a lot of is spare time, so i am forced to limit myself to only those things that have worked for other people. i know that what works for others will not necessarily work for me and vice-versa, so i try to narrow things down even further to only trying what has worked for other people who struggle as i have. by your pictures and words, i assumed you fell into that category.

i would encourage your to take a moment to re-read your 1st installment of "12-weeks," then re-read my questions/comments and see if you can't at least understand where i am coming from. i sincerely hope you achieve your goals. i was dissappointed for you when you got sick halfway through and then when it seemed like you just put it on the back burner. i was waiting for you to reach the end and was left hangin. you quit talking about what you were doing/how you were progressing and instead shifted your focus to retaliating against anyone who critiqued or judged you. that was probably your biggest failure on that journey.

i think you can make it clayton. just quit wasting energy on trying to retaliate against what is clearly an interested reader and instead use the energy to stoke the fire of passion within yourself to achieve what you set out for. maybe even post a reply to readers admitting that you fell short, but are back on the path or even just taking time out, or even that you decided you didn't want to pursue the goal any longer. that at least would be real.

[Clayton South]

Thank you for your reply to my posting.

Your second posting makes it clear to me that your first was not malicious. It is easy to misunderstand someones motives, especially when you can't talk to them face-to-face.

As you know, many people who post on the message boards do so only so that they can unfairly criticize others. King Kamali and I are in agreement that this is both annoying and stupid. As an aside, and on a personal note, it makes me angry when I work hard both in the gym and as a full-time writer and I find people who would criticize and yet these same people never produce a single article of any quality. I spend hours on a single article, making it the best that I can, for the readers - because they deserve it - and someone can post a gramatically incorrect posting - taking 20 seconds of their time - that is rude, defamitory and degrading? Its not right, and its an injustice. My though is: If a problem is found, innovate and make it better. Sadly, they seldom do this.

Your balanced explination in the second post was appreciated, and, in light of it, I can see how my posting, based on the misunderstanding explained above, appears unreasonable.

I agree that one should always question. Having a scientific mind neccessitates inteligent inquiry. You are correct in stating that I did not achieve the results I set out to achieve - i.e. the ideal results. I, however, feel strongly that I succeeded. Success comes in degrees, and I did reduce my bodyfat considerably and improve my health. Getting sick was a major setback to me (thank you for your consideration in this regard!), and although I did not mention it in the article, there was a family death during this time as well - my 15 year old younger brother. These events, however, are not excuses, because I did not settle. I had setbacks, but I continued to fight for the results that were still possible until the deadline. To me, settling means giving up for whatever reason and taking what you got until the point at which you threw in the hat. I continued to work, and the results i mention were what I achieved in light of, or perhaps in spite of, the events i outlined.

You suggest that my body image was warped by unrealistic images in the magazines. This is true to a degree. Working full-time in this industry, reading all of the magazines and knowing the athletes in them tends to do that, perhaps moreso for us than for the average person. Once you hang out with Ronnie Coleman, Craig Titus, Lee Labrada or others, your reference for evaluating others and your own body will change.

I also made some mistakes with my nutrition during the course of the program as well. This happens even for the professional athletes. I have since done considearable research, and I understand where mistakes occured, and how they can be avoided / corrected in the future. Its a strange thing - as a former trainer I could get athletes into incredible shape through the application of science, yet sometimes with my own training I am less conscientious.

You mention your lifelong struggle - we share this in common. Three years ago I used to play football, and became incredibly heavy - to the tune of 270lbs. I was also powerlifting at this time. At this bodyweight I began experiencing abnormal aches and pains, and my bodyfat levels were high. I now weigh a leaner 215lbs and feel much better and healthier. Though it was not easy, and though i must continue to watch carefully what I eat and how I train, the bodyfat has not returned since.

Thank you for your second posting - it would have been a shame for a misunderstanding of this kind to exist.

-Clayton South

[trusolman]

sounds like you have had some success. i would like to hear a bit about how you are maintaining and what if any are your plans to take it to the next level. you say you've had success training a lot of people. are there any people you've helped get to single digit bodyfat for the first time in their lives? if so, how?

Originally Posted by Clayton South

Thank you for your reply to my posting.

Your second posting makes it clear to me that your first was not malicious. It is easy to misunderstand someones motives, especially when you can't talk to them face-to-face.

As you know, many people who post on the message boards do so only so that they can unfairly criticize others. King Kamali and I are in agreement that this is both annoying and stupid. As an aside, and on a personal note, it makes me angry when I work hard both in the gym and as a full-time writer and I find people who would criticize and yet these same people never produce a single article of any quality. I spend hours on a single article, making it the best that I can, for the readers - because they deserve it - and someone can post a gramatically incorrect posting - taking 20 seconds of their time - that is rude, defamitory and degrading? Its not right, and its an injustice. My though is: If a problem is found, innovate and make it better. Sadly, they seldom do this.

Your balanced explination in the second post was appreciated, and, in light of it, I can see how my posting, based on the misunderstanding explained above, appears unreasonable.

I agree that one should always question. Having a scientific mind neccessitates inteligent inquiry. You are correct in stating that I did not achieve the results I set out to achieve - i.e. the ideal results. I, however, feel strongly that I succeeded. Success comes in degrees, and I did reduce my bodyfat considerably and improve my health. Getting sick was a major setback to me (thank you for your consideration in this regard!), and although I did not mention it in the article, there was a family death during this time as well - my 15 year old younger brother. These events, however, are not excuses, because I did not settle. I had setbacks, but I continued to fight for the results that were still possible until the deadline. To me, settling means giving up for whatever reason and taking what you got until the point at which you threw in the hat. I continued to work, and the results i mention were what I achieved in light of, or perhaps in spite of, the events i outlined.

You suggest that my body image was warped by unrealistic images in the magazines. This is true to a degree. Working full-time in this industry, reading all of the magazines and knowing the athletes in them tends to do that, perhaps moreso for us than for the average person. Once you hang out with Ronnie Coleman, Craig Titus, Lee Labrada or others, your reference for evaluating others and your own body will change.

I also made some mistakes with my nutrition during the course of the program as well. This happens even for the professional athletes. I have since done considearable research, and I understand where mistakes occured, and how they can be avoided / corrected in the future. Its a strange thing - as a former trainer I could get athletes into incredible shape through the application of science, yet sometimes with my own training I am less conscientious.

You mention your lifelong struggle - we share this in common. Three years ago I used to play football, and became incredibly heavy - to the tune of 270lbs. I was also powerlifting at this time. At this bodyweight I began experiencing abnormal aches and pains, and my bodyfat levels were high. I now weigh a leaner 215lbs and feel much better and healthier. Though it was not easy, and though i must continue to watch carefully what I eat and how I train, the bodyfat has not returned since.

Thank you for your second posting - it would have been a shame for a misunderstanding of this kind to exist.

-Clayton South