Max OT or HST?

Turbonod · 12-27-2003, 06:54 PM

For all that have used them, what did you have better results on for bulking? I have only used Max-ot with moderately good results, but lately have been thinking about HST.

lemme know

Smeagol · 12-27-2003, 07:06 PM

I have tried max ot and hst. HST, I gained 10lbs in 6 weeks. I tried max-ot but quit in 2 weeks. I was more of a n00b lifter then and didn't do any good compounds so thats why. Both are GOOD programmes. You'll have to try both to see which works better for YOU.

THe WeapoN · 12-27-2003, 09:02 PM

max ot was a good pogram am about to start hst soon

thugluv · 12-27-2003, 10:14 PM

Do both, it will 'shock' your muscles in new growth since they are different programs

Turbonod · 12-28-2003, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by thugluv
Do both, it will 'shock' your muscles in new growth since they are different programs

Have you actually used both?

I dont want to waste time on HST if it just another wacked out idea. Seems like those first weeks of 15reps and even 10 wont do anything but contradict my bulking routine. I know there is science but i am very skeptical. Some one give me some real world feed back.

TachyonStallion · 12-28-2003, 09:40 AM

I am doing max-ot to mostly to build strength right now. I'm sort of a beginner and haven't really built a solid technique/strength base to really benefit from HST (in my opinion). To me, HST says 'start growing again', but I really wasn't growing a lot in the first place, haha! I imagine I will try HST sometime next year.

Wheelies · 12-28-2003, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Turbonod
Have you actually used both?

I dont want to waste time on HST if it just another wacked out idea. Seems like those first weeks of 15reps and even 10 wont do anything but contradict my bulking routine. I know there is science but i am very skeptical. Some one give me some real world feed back.

I use Max OT and I think its a very effective program. I was thinking about giving HST a try, but just like you were saying, I think the whole 15 reps thing is a waste of time, some of the philosiphies I dont really like.

Smeagol · 12-28-2003, 12:13 PM

Last cycle I gained 3.5 pounds on the 15's....

Wheelies · 12-28-2003, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Smeagol
Last cycle I gained 3.5 pounds on the 15's....

Did you gain strength as well?

Smeagol · 12-28-2003, 12:24 PM

um, IMO, hst isn't the best programme for strength. At the start I was squatting 45lbs for 15 and at the end I was doing 160lbs for 5, which was my established five rep max.

I maxed out again for five reps and I only got 175lbs.

Brick · 12-28-2003, 02:18 PM

If your gonna try HST and don't like the suggested 15, 10, & 5 rep scheme try a 10, 8, 5 routine or something, you don't have to stick exactly to what is suggested for HST.

xenonguy · 12-28-2003, 03:07 PM

15 reps is too much coz if you do 15 reps,you will create fatiuge and overtraining which is counterproductive to muscle building.
I am using max-ot,my strength skyrocket.
I think HST is waste of time,there is nothing like shocking muscle,don't believe that bul... bodybuilding gurus.
Feel the burn,go for the burn,more is better,no pain no gain
they are just of time,belive the science you won't REGRET

Kane Fan · 12-28-2003, 03:13 PM

the two programs are set up so differently that they should not be compared to each other

max ot is designed (as far as I know) to be used steadily
HST (again as far as I know) is designed as an x week program (12 weeks I think?) and then go to something else
so why not do both
do max 0t, then do HST as a 12 week breakup (after the 9-14 day deconditioning period) and that should work out pretty well
just be careful with how often you throw in HST spurts

Turbonod · 12-28-2003, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kane Fan

just be careful with how often you throw in HST spurts

What do you mean by that? Max-Ot is set up as a 12 week program also. Is HST supposed to be cycled after 12 weeks and not used for "X" amount of time?

The program is extremely vague. Its hard to believe all the talk about it. WHERE IS THE PROOF!? I could try it for myself but I dont want to waste time if the general feedback is negative. I have not seen one positve response that isnt a noob bodybuilder gaining his nautral weight and relating them to HST.

I guess I wont know til im done my Maxot routine. BTW for anyone who is interested... last year all of my peaks were during maxot, in other words the strongest and biggest I ever was. But due to injury im only now getting back into it.

Lost_my_whey · 12-28-2003, 06:55 PM

I'm just another noob now, but I'll vouch for HST for natural guys. It worked great for me. I just started training again after a 1 1/2 year layoff due to injuries. Two knee surgeries later and I'm ready to put my weight back on. I was 5'10", 212#, 17 3/4 bicepts, 32" waist and lean enough to see my abs. I am now 170 with a gut and can sadly bench more than I can squat. I will be using HST to get back into shape. I'll let yall know how it goes.

scrawny-nomore · 12-28-2003, 10:22 PM

Have you guys ever heard of DFHT??? It resembles HST but without the 15,10,5 scheme..........I will try to get you guy a link for it if you want..........good luck all

scrawny-nomore · 12-28-2003, 10:26 PM

Here is the link to DFHT:

http://www.asylum-strength.com/Dual_...y_Training.doc

Turbonod · 12-29-2003, 09:53 AM

Keep us posted

Kane Fan · 12-29-2003, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Turbonod
What do you mean by that? Max-Ot is set up as a 12 week program also. Is HST supposed to be cycled after 12 weeks and not used for "X" amount of time?

The program is extremely vague. Its hard to believe all the talk about it. WHERE IS THE PROOF!? I could try it for myself but I dont want to waste time if the general feedback is negative. I have not seen one positve response that isnt a noob bodybuilder gaining his nautral weight and relating them to HST.

I guess I wont know til im done my Maxot routine. BTW for anyone who is interested... last year all of my peaks were during maxot, in other words the strongest and biggest I ever was. But due to injury im only now getting back into it.

sorry I thought Maxot was designed to be used steadily

Younglifter14 · 12-29-2003, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Turbonod
Its hard to believe all the talk about it. WHERE IS THE PROOF!? I could try it for myself but I dont want to waste time if the general feedback is negative. I have not seen one positve response that isnt a noob bodybuilder gaining his nautral weight and relating them to HST.

lmao. Right here:

http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/...t=ST;f=14;t=21

If you want other proof, feel free to check out the hst forums some more or ask bryan for some studies. It feels good seeing a study rather then jeff willet telling me I must use ast-ss's products in order to get maximum results in max-ot.

xenonguy · 12-30-2003, 02:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Younglifter14
lmao. Right here:

http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/...t=ST;f=14;t=21

If you want other proof, feel free to check out the hst forums some more or ask bryan for some studies. It feels good seeing a study rather then jeff willet telling me I must use ast-ss's products in order to get maximum results in max-ot.

Come on,give max-ot a try,you would definitely feel the difference,but the most important thing is post workout nutrition,drink some carbonhydrate based drink and protein powder you would definitely grow,i assure you

midian · 12-30-2003, 05:07 AM

imo HST above max-ot

a HST or DFHT is exacly what i would suggest to any bodybuilder

Wheelies · 12-30-2003, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Younglifter14
lmao. Right here:

http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/...t=ST;f=14;t=21

If you want other proof, feel free to check out the hst forums some more or ask bryan for some studies. It feels good seeing a study rather then jeff willet telling me I must use ast-ss's products in order to get maximum results in max-ot.

I like how people jump on the band wagon with the whole "AST just tries to sell you stuff every time". I have exchanged numerous emails with Jeff Willet and never once did he say, "oh, your deadlift is stuck, try some AST V2 Whey protien"

And its kinda weird that the first thing I saw on the HST site were advertisements for protien.

If you want studies, Paul Cribb list many studies done by sports journals and other independent studies that show the effectiveness of Max OT style training.

Turbonod · 12-30-2003, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Younglifter14
lmao. Right here:

http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/...t=ST;f=14;t=21

If you want other proof, feel free to check out the hst forums some more or ask bryan for some studies. It feels good seeing a study rather then jeff willet telling me I must use ast-ss's products in order to get maximum results in max-ot.

Again as I said before I am a very skeptical person when it comes to off the wall ideas (atleast IMO). I personally tried MAXOT last year b/c the BB.com community had many rave reviews about it. I wouldnt take the word or even think about looking at the forums on ASTs' site for feedback on MAXOT, think about it.
Why would i do the same for HST? It may be funny to you, but take a look at this thread, the best response i have gotten was "HST is better than Maxot." This topic is getting beat nobody can show me or even tell me some results they have gotten from HST.

For the people that said they were using it, keep a log and keep us posted on the results. If it really is all that its cracked up to be, Ill be using it in a heartbeat.

Brick · 12-30-2003, 10:56 AM

Threads like this should be banned, they just end up turning into a, " This one is better than that one and I want proof", type of thread.

If your the type of person that solely waits for a miracle routine that everyone else backs up before you'll try it then you shouldn't even be in the gym.

Oh I have tried other routines and HST has worked best for me.

And you wouldn't need proof if you would give them both a try and find out which one is right for you.

Was I rambling, lol

Younglifter14 · 12-30-2003, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Turbonod
Again as I said before I am a very skeptical person when it comes to off the wall ideas (atleast IMO). I personally tried MAXOT last year b/c the BB.com community had many rave reviews about it. I wouldnt take the word or even think about looking at the forums on ASTs' site for feedback on MAXOT, think about it.

Thats probably becuase they don't even have a forum

. The people on the HST boards are mostly from other bb boards. Quiet a few from here as well.

Quote:

Why would i do the same for HST?

It's a program that has been founded on science and is something interesting to check out.

Quote:

It may be funny to you, but take a look at this thread, the best response i have gotten was "HST is better than Maxot."

what would you like? studies, journals, etc?

Quote:

This topic is getting beat nobody can show me or even tell me some results they have gotten from HST.

I just sent you a whole 11 page thread about it .

and i mean comon really, give 8 weeks of your max-ot praised life and try HST. I'll make sure skip doesn't find out

.

Younglifter14 · 12-30-2003, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Wheelies
I like how people jump on the band wagon with the whole "AST just tries to sell you stuff every time". I have exchanged numerous emails with Jeff Willet and never once did he say, "oh, your deadlift is stuck, try some AST V2 Whey protien"

And its kinda weird that the first thing I saw on the HST site were advertisements for protien.

If you want studies, Paul Cribb list many studies done by sports journals and other independent studies that show the effectiveness of Max OT style training.

I was very careful not to say that in order for max-ot to work you needed the supps but rather in order to get maximum results. I remember reading the 12 week course 2 whole things were devoted to the supplements. and I never said anything you mentioned in your post either

.

Coool, if you can, can i see them?

Younglifter14 · 12-30-2003, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by xenonguy
Come on,give max-ot a try,you would definitely feel the difference,but the most important thing is post workout nutrition,drink some carbonhydrate based drink and protein powder you would definitely grow,i assure you

I never said you wouldn't.

beatphats · 12-30-2003, 11:24 AM

I still think Super Nintendo is better than the Sega Genesis....oops wrong board

HST is perfect for noobs or off season sports training, even though for some reason, HST.com says it's not for sports training. Never tried Max-OT, so I won't comment.

Younglifter14 · 12-30-2003, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by beatphats
I still think Super Nintendo is better than the Sega Genesis....oops wrong board

HST is perfect for noobs or off season sports training, even though for some reason, HST.com says it's not for sports training.

lol

.

HST is mainly for mass though which is why it isn't reccomended to sports atheletes who want say endurance, speed-strength, etc.