Why is there still such a stigma attached to mental health?

[Pump that iron!]

Damn, I don't get it. I have some ideas though...

I know in the East, and I am by no means saying this is representative of the east as a whole but generally speaking, in some eastern cultures having to seek psychological help is frowned and looked down upon. Why? I don't know but I imagine it is this mentality of "you're weak if you need outside help or a crutch to get through life."

I would imagine social attitudes are better in the west but still, some people see mental health as a weakness -- this seriously pisses me off. Schizophrenia, OCD, ADD, etc etc...these and other mental health issues are not paid the attention they are due and considering that depression will be a leading health issue in the ocming years, I say, we gotsta change our outlook.

If the outlook was different, I might have gotten help with my OCD (I was diagnosed this year) years ealier. This is just me, whatever.

Anyways:

1. Why the hell is mental health still frowned down upon in the west? Why is there a stigma?

2. Why is there a lack of funding towards mental health?

Thats good place to start. Discuss please.

[xer0xed]

Probably since often times it's used as an excuse to diminish individual responsibility. Not always, though.

[thirsty4chicken]

Also, as soon as you walk into a shrink's office, you're labeled as a person who has mental problems. Why are mental problems bad? Well, it's better to be sane than insane...

Crazy people don't tend to do well in life. I think that's the source of the 'stigma' right there.

[TricepsNGirls]

What are your symptoms? There's really no need to diagnose OCD unless it seriously disrupts your life/work.

Western psychology is too trigger-happy. People are almost proud of their "mental disorders". You can pretty much diagnose anyone who decides to walk into a psychologist's office with a plethora of mental illnesses. If it's something controllable or temporary, fix it yourself. Sometimes, poor and maladaptive behavior is one's own fault (eg. a matter of choice and self-control).

[Pump that iron!]

Originally Posted by TricepsNGirls

What are your symptoms? There's really no need to diagnose OCD unless it seriously disrupts your life/work.

Western psychology is too trigger-happy. People are almost proud of their "mental disorders". You can pretty much diagnose anyone who decides to walk into a psychologist's office with a plethora of mental illnesses. If it's something controllable or temporary, fix it yourself. Sometimes, poor and maladaptive behavior is one's own fault (eg. a matter of choice and self-control).

That is classic Eastern atittude towards mental illness. I should know, I AM Chinese and I grew up in this kind of environment with that kind of mentality.

[thirsty4chicken]

Originally Posted by TricepsNGirls

What are your symptoms? There's really no need to diagnose OCD unless it seriously disrupts your life/work.

Western psychology is too trigger-happy. People are almost proud of their "mental disorders". You can pretty much diagnose anyone who decides to walk into a psychologist's office with a plethora of mental illnesses. If it's something controllable or temporary, fix it yourself. Sometimes, poor and maladaptive behavior is one's own fault (eg. a matter of choice and self-control).

Originally Posted by Pump that iron!

That is classic Eastern atittude towards mental illness. I should know, I AM Chinese and I grew up in this kind of environment with that kind of mentality.

ROFL

[TricepsNGirls]

Originally Posted by thirsty4chicken

ROFL

heh

Originally Posted by Pump that iron!

That is classic Eastern atittude towards mental illness. I should know, I AM Chinese and I grew up in this kind of environment with that kind of mentality.

The classic mentality is - "Pump that iron!, omigod what the hell! You psycho or what? You disgrace family! Now everyone know you psycho!" - a lot less reasonable.

[US_Ranger]

Originally Posted by TricepsNGirls

What are your symptoms? There's really no need to diagnose OCD unless it seriously disrupts your life/work.

Western psychology is too trigger-happy. People are almost proud of their "mental disorders". You can pretty much diagnose anyone who decides to walk into a psychologist's office with a plethora of mental illnesses. If it's something controllable or temporary, fix it yourself. Sometimes, poor and maladaptive behavior is one's own fault (eg. a matter of choice and self-control).

QFT

I know a few psychologists that have spent 8 years in school getting their PHD and now work in counseling. They're almost gleeful at the chance of prescribing Ritalin to everyone. They love diagnosing, I think it gives meaning to their lives.

[Luca2]

For those who have the time/are interested, as a good book on the topic I would suggest "Madness and Civilization: A History of Insanity in the Age of Reason" by the late philosopher Michel Foucault. It's not an easy read by any means, but still a compelling one. It deals with how the idea of "madness" (in Western society mind you) gradually became associated with "labeling" people, stigma and exclusion.

[ArchAngel'73]

Originally Posted by US_Ranger

QFT

I know a few psychologists that have spent 8 years in school getting their PHD and now work in counseling. They're almost gleeful at the chance of prescribing Ritalin to everyone. They love diagnosing, I think it gives meaning to their lives.

No offence man but psychologists cannot prescribe ANY medication, only M.D's and psychiatrists. Age old debate between the two professions-"skills vs pills".

Eastern and Western treatment for mental illness has always originated from the notion that mental illness is a SPIRITUAL illness. From the witch hunts in Salem to the notion of Karma in buddhist teachings.
It has not been until recently that science has shown us some very real organic and biological explanations for mental illness.
Furthermore, diagnosing is usually the ONLY way to get your treatment paid for by an insurance company. The worse the diagnosis, the better chance the company will approve payment. That is to the benefit of the individual in many cases.
Diagnosing is also an effective inter-professional communication tool. It allows for easier classification of symptoms into a comprehensible treatment approach. More often than not, a diagnosis refers to the classifcation of presenting symptoms and doesn't mean the indiv. has the full blown disorder, just symptoms of it.

[xer0xed]

Originally Posted by US_Ranger

QFT

I know a few psychologists that have spent 8 years in school getting their PHD and now work in counseling. They're almost gleeful at the chance of prescribing Ritalin to everyone. They love diagnosing, I think it gives meaning to their lives.

Good way to cure ADD: have the kid run laps around the nearest building until they're exhausted.

[MantisShrimp]

Originally Posted by TricepsNGirls

What are your symptoms? There's really no need to diagnose OCD unless it seriously disrupts your life/work.

Western psychology is too trigger-happy. People are almost proud of their "mental disorders". You can pretty much diagnose anyone who decides to walk into a psychologist's office with a plethora of mental illnesses. If it's something controllable or temporary, fix it yourself. Sometimes, poor and maladaptive behavior is one's own fault (eg. a matter of choice and self-control).

x2

[clovely]

Originally Posted by xer0xed

Probably since often times it's used as an excuse to diminish individual responsibility. Not always, though.

Originally Posted by TricepsNGirls

What are your symptoms? There's really no need to diagnose OCD unless it seriously disrupts your life/work.

Western psychology is too trigger-happy. People are almost proud of their "mental disorders". You can pretty much diagnose anyone who decides to walk into a psychologist's office with a plethora of mental illnesses. If it's something controllable or temporary, fix it yourself. Sometimes, poor and maladaptive behavior is one's own fault (eg. a matter of choice and self-control).

Points well taken. There's some truth to that. It's too fashionable in our society to talk about your latest diagnosis. There are extreme mental issues that need to be dealt with by professionals. But if you look at the almost epidemic rates of these "disorders" you realize we can't fix stupid.

Too much of psychology and psychiatry is guesswork, if you ask me. And too many people (not all but way too many) make it their excuse for laziness or stupidity and too many want an easy fix to life's problems.

Originally Posted by xer0xed

Good way to cure ADD: have the kid run laps around the nearest building until they're exhausted.

LOL!

[Thy_Kingdom]

How effective is psychiatry? Seems like they're more messed up than their patients from what you guys are saying.

I agree with much of Triceps post that an overmedicated nation makes it seem cool to have some mental disorder.

[Pump that iron!]

So there is this association with mental illness as an excuse for laziness, stupidity, etc etc.

Well, I can't speak for others but only for myself. I grew up in a family that praises hard work, yeah I grew up lower class but I did manage to make it into university through hard work...I am one of those that grades don't necessarily come easy, I gotta work for 'em.

By no means do I use my OCD as a crutch, even when offered extra time for exams cause my OCD can be considered a disability, I turned it down...Hell, I do better than the majority of folks in my classes with OCD so for me, extra exam time is almost unfair.

[clovely]

Originally Posted by Pump that iron!

So there is this association with mental illness as an excuse for laziness, stupidity, etc etc.

Well, I can't speak for others but only for myself. I grew up in a family that praises hard work, yeah I grew up lower class but I did manage to make it into university through hard work...I am one of those that grades don't necessarily come easy, I gotta work for 'em.

By no means do I use my OCD as a crutch, even when offered extra time for exams cause my OCD can be considered a disability, I turned it down...Hell, I do better than the majority of folks in my classes with OCD so for me, extra exam time is almost unfair.

Did you say you're not from/in the US? I might be confusing posts. But you might not be seeing the same things we're talking about either.

[Pump that iron!]

Originally Posted by clovely

Did you say you're not from/in the US? I might be confusing posts. But you might not be seeing the same things we're talking about either.

I live in Canada, but I am Chinese and grew up in a typical, traditional Chinese family.

[Pump that iron!]

What are your symptoms? There's really no need to diagnose OCD unless it seriously disrupts your life/work.

Oh it does, trust me. Do you have extensive knowledge of OCD or something? You seem to speak matter of factly about everything when you are only 19.

Western psychology is too trigger-happy.

Oh, you have experience in the psychological and psychiatric communities?

People are almost proud of their "mental disorders".

Gee, I don't know if the typical obsessive-compulsive sufferer is exactly proud of ruminating or peforming compulsions for their entire day.

You can pretty much diagnose anyone who decides to walk into a psychologist's office with a plethora of mental illnesses.

Oh yeah, is this what your psych prof told you or something lol? Again, sources? Otherwise, I think you are talking out of your ass or at least parotting someone else.

If it's something controllable or temporary, fix it yourself. Sometimes, poor and maladaptive behavior is one's own fault (eg. a matter of choice and self-control).

Sometimes it is but I nor anyone else should pass judgment as much as we do.

[The Experiment]

Why is there a stigma? Too many people try using as an excuse.

My sister thinks she is bipolar. In reality, she doesn't have it. She just wants an excuse to flip out at people for telling her to get off of Myspace.com or so she can flip out at us if we tell her to go to work when she wants to call in sick. Doesn't sound too bipolar does it?

I didn't want to air out the family laundry here but my sister is an example of why there is a stigma.

Mental illness is real, there's no doubt about that, but I'm willing to bet you money that most mental illness patients are just making it up. People have various defense mechanisms for why things are the way they are for them. Some people have the mechanism that they suck and should get better through hard work. Others want people to feel sorry for them. For the latter, there's always a psychiatrist willing to start funneling pills down your throat.

Also, on a personal note, I used to be deadly certain I had Asperger's. Turns out, I was just a lazy assh0le.

[US_Ranger]

Originally Posted by Fiend_73

No offence man but psychologists cannot prescribe ANY medication, only M.D's and psychiatrists. Age old debate between the two professions-"skills vs pills".

Eastern and Western treatment for mental illness has always originated from the notion that mental illness is a SPIRITUAL illness. From the witch hunts in Salem to the notion of Karma in buddhist teachings.
It has not been until recently that science has shown us some very real organic and biological explanations for mental illness.
Furthermore, diagnosing is usually the ONLY way to get your treatment paid for by an insurance company. The worse the diagnosis, the better chance the company will approve payment. That is to the benefit of the individual in many cases.
Diagnosing is also an effective inter-professional communication tool. It allows for easier classification of symptoms into a comprehensible treatment approach. More often than not, a diagnosis refers to the classifcation of presenting symptoms and doesn't mean the indiv. has the full blown disorder, just symptoms of it.

I agree about who can and can't prescribe. I used poor wording. On the other hand, public school teachers have been prescribing drugs for years. It's a lot easier than trying to deal with an active kid. If you don't believe me, do some research and see how much sway a teacher can have when it comes to drugs and kids.

[US_Ranger]

Originally Posted by xer0xed

Good way to cure ADD: have the kid run laps around the nearest building until they're exhausted.

Best answer.

My dad, after he retired from public administration, still does substitute teaching for 4th and 5th graders to stay busy. He had a couple boys who were causing problems (supposed ADD) so he had them race each other for 2 laps around the track. Afterwards there were no more disruptions in class and the kids were tired and happy.


Btw, the administration threatened to fire him if he did this ever again so now the kids are back to acting up and my dad can't do anything. Why? I don't know........

[ArchAngel'73]

Originally Posted by US_Ranger

I agree about who can and can't prescribe. I used poor wording. On the other hand, public school teachers have been prescribing drugs for years. It's a lot easier than trying to deal with an active kid. If you don't believe me, do some research and see how much sway a teacher can have when it comes to drugs and kids.

I've seen first hand teachers influence presciption meds on students. Freakin' shame.
I like your dad's approach, but the beeding hearts see it as a from of corporal punishment. That too is a shame.

[potatoe]

Originally Posted by US_Ranger

Best answer.

My dad, after he retired from public administration, still does substitute teaching for 4th and 5th graders to stay busy. He had a couple boys who were causing problems (supposed ADD) so he had them race each other for 2 laps around the track. Afterwards there were no more disruptions in class and the kids were tired and happy.


Btw, the administration threatened to fire him if he did this ever again so now the kids are back to acting up and my dad can't do anything. Why? I don't know........

ADD really stands for: Adults Don't Discipline.

Thats really what it boils down to. No one bothers to "correct" them.

[potatoe]

Originally Posted by Fiend_73

I've seen first hand teachers influence presciption meds on students. Freakin' shame.
I like your dad's approach, but the beeding hearts see it as a from of corporal punishment. That too is a shame.

LOL. Running. Not like that is really punishment anyway, if anything he just gave them an opprotunity to burn off energy. Not like he spanked them or something. Which he'd be well in his right to if they had not banned it. (Yes spanked as child).

[Pump that iron!]

Originally Posted by potatoe

ADD really stands for: Adults Don't Discipline.

Thats really what it boils down to. No one bothers to "correct" them.

Wow, that is hands down the dumbest **** I've read on this forum.

Sorry, just being honest and straight up.

It is too bad that the public associates the ones who use mental illness as a crutch with the ones who truly do have problems. Sad, sad, and sad. Well, I thought VA massacre was going to put mental health on the map but the hyper-masculine attitudes of mental health still exist. Not suprising tho, throughout history men will always condemn others for supposed signs of "weakness."

[US_Ranger]

Originally Posted by Pump that iron!

Wow, that is hands down the dumbest **** I've read on this forum.

Sorry, just being honest and straight up.

It is too bad that the public associates the ones who use mental illness as a crutch with the ones who truly do have problems. Sad, sad, and sad. Well, I thought VA massacre was going to put mental health on the map but the hyper-masculine attitudes of mental health still exist. Not suprising tho, throughout history men will always condemn others for supposed signs of "weakness."

He over-generalized but what he says makes a lot of sense. Watch the documentary "Raising Cain" or just go out and pick up the book. It's a NYT best seller if that means anything. It's a damn good brain busting amount of information and it goes to show that most instances of supposed ADD can be fixed without drugs and without any sort of mental health professional even being needed. Our culture (drug companies making millions) promotes the use of anti-depressents as opposed to exercise for kids. Our parents are made to believe that there is no harm from the use of drugs and our supposed bull**** role models openly take them as well. If parents woke the **** up and raised their kids instead of tried to be friends with them, a lot of these problems would go away and kids would be healthier and happier.

[potatoe]

Originally Posted by Pump that iron!

Wow, that is hands down the dumbest **** I've read on this forum.

Sorry, just being honest and straight up.

It is too bad that the public associates the ones who use mental illness as a crutch with the ones who truly do have problems. Sad, sad, and sad. Well, I thought VA massacre was going to put mental health on the map but the hyper-masculine attitudes of mental health still exist. Not suprising tho, throughout history men will always condemn others for supposed signs of "weakness."

Are you kidding me? I see it all the time. I see it all the time at school. Kids doing stupid stuff, being disruptive, and all around clowns in a couple classes, then act like little angels when it comes to dealing with teachers such as my wrestling coach, or ones thatjust get rid of you if you wanna act like a 5 year old.

But for the teachers that repeatedly say, "you better knock it off, or...(insert stupid threat here that the teacher has no intention of going through here) their classes are hell for them, and anyone else that hates to put up with crap.

I see it at home to. Before my parents split I was spanked as a kid all through growing up as a kid. My sister who was about 7-8 ish when my parents split completely different. She's an outright disrepectful spaz when it comes to dealing with my mom, and even my dad now that he's "soften up". She pulls stuff that when I was her age and younger, I couldn't even dream of trying. And its all because she knows she will not have any consequences for what she does, same with the kids I was describing in the previous paragraph.

The reason ridilin is so over prescribed is because docs make money, and the parents don't have to actively have to get involved with their children. And teachers have nice dozey drugged up QUIET kids. Its a win win for everyone, except the kids. And its not about the here and now, its about teaching them lessons and how to make good moral judgments in the future when they grow up.

[Pump that iron!]

Originally Posted by potatoe

Are you kidding me? I see it all the time. I see it all the time at school. Kids doing stupid stuff, being disruptive, and all around clowns in a couple classes, then act like little angels when it comes to dealing with teachers such as my wrestling coach, or ones thatjust get rid of you if you wanna act like a 5 year old.

But for the teachers that repeatedly say, "you better knock it off, or...(insert stupid threat here that the teacher has no intention of going through here) their classes are hell for them, and anyone else that hates to put up with crap.

I see it at home to. Before my parents split I was spanked as a kid all through growing up as a kid. My sister who was about 7-8 ish when my parents split completely different. She's an outright disrepectful spaz when it comes to dealing with my mom, and even my dad now that he's "soften up". She pulls stuff that when I was her age and younger, I couldn't even dream of trying. And its all because she knows she will not have any consequences for what she does, same with the kids I was describing in the previous paragraph.

The reason ridilin is so over prescribed is because docs make money, and the parents don't have to actively have to get involved with their children. And teachers have nice dozey drugged up QUIET kids. Its a win win for everyone, except the kids. And its not about the here and now, its about teaching them lessons and how to make good moral judgments in the future when they grow up.

Oh ADD exists though. Is it misdiagnosed? Sure it is. So are physical conditions along with mental ones.

That's your own experiences and you're free to preach 'em but I hate when people make blanket statements. That is a slap in the face to people who actually have the disorder who don't need you to trivialize it.

Y'know what is part of the problem? Straight up -- white, middle-upperclass suburban families. Honestly, if they grew up in traditional asian family like mine, they'd think twice about spewing their garbage.

That is irrelevant to my point but nonetheless, it is the case. The best of parents can't 100% help a child that truly has a mental disorder. My heart goes out to those parents 'cause it ain't pretty.

It would be great if parents could "correct" things like Schizophrenia, OCD, manic depression...but that isn't the reality.