After 3 months of lifting, now on a cut - What can I expect? (Yup - NOOB)

[Dan K]

Hey guys - Still pretty new to this whole thing (3 months on Thursday), and so far I think I've been doing ok (not good, but ok...)

When I started out back in February, my E-Z bar bicep curls were at 35.2lbs for 3 sets of 10, and last week were up to 66lbs for 4 sets of 10 - Thats doing my arm workout once a week, so it could have been better I guess.

Anyway, a few years ago I damaged both my shoulders, and the right one seems to flair up here & there -As it did last week. So rather than risking further injury, I decided to give myself a week off from last Tuesday (arm day was on monday). Unfortunately, I found myself reverting back to old habbits a few times (a chinese takeaway, some chocolate a couple of times, skipping protein shakes & such, and a night out drinking on Sunday). It wasnt every day, but it might as well have been.

Well, yesterday was my first bad workout - I had trouble matching the previous weeks 66lbs for 4/10 on the e-z bar curl, only just matched the 31.9lbs for 10,9,9,9 on dumbell curls, and I was a rep or 2 down on my 4 sets of seated dumbell curls, with my left arm reaching complete failure on the 3rd rep of set 4. As such I couldnt do the 4 sets of hammer curls I usually do. I had to reduce the weight I use for my tricep exercises by 1.1lbs to match the number of sets/reps I was doing last monday.... Really, really dissapointed with this.

Now I having started a cut a week before my week of shame, I expected my lifting gains to be fewer, I didn't expect them to actually decrease by such an ammount (I'm also on the recommended 4 week break from creatine by the way).

So my first question is, what are the pysiological reasons for my pretty heavy drop in performance over one week - Which is the usual rest period for my arms anyway. Would the week bad diet, lack of other lifting sessions and alcohol the night before contribute that much towards it? What about psychological involvement?

And my second question is, being that I've now started my cut again (I'm 6ft 3, about 20% bf at approx 226.8lbs) can I expect to see decreases in performance like this in the future? My caloric intake should be around 2574 or so - Which I *believe* is the correct caloric deficit range to lose as little muscle as possible whilst still losing fat.

If anything, last weeks relapse has made my resolve stronger, and in the end I will look better - But, and I know this is going to sound stupid, but decreasing performance after 3 months of hard work and achievment is a hit to the ego ;o)

Any thoughts?

Cheers guys
-Dan

[ScottC]

Originally Posted by Dan K

So my first question is, what are the pysiological reasons for my pretty heavy drop in performance over one week - Which is the usual rest period for my arms anyway. Would the week bad diet, lack of other lifting sessions and alcohol the night before contribute that much towards it? What about psychological involvement?

And my second question is, being that I've now started my cut again (I'm 6ft 3, about 20% bf at approx 226.8lbs) can I expect to see decreases in performance like this in the future? My caloric intake should be around 2574 or so - Which I *believe* is the correct caloric deficit range to lose as little muscle as possible whilst still losing fat.

If anything, last weeks relapse has made my resolve stronger, and in the end I will look better - But, and I know this is going to sound stupid, but decreasing performance after 3 months of hard work and achievment is a hit to the ego ;o)

Any thoughts?

I would speak with your doctor about your shoulder issues. Let him/her know they are acting up. You probably didn't give them enough rest...and shoulders, as I assume you know, are slow healers. You should not push them by starting out with the same weight you last were using when they started to act up.

As for your diet, well, if you are assuming your diet plan is good with the right amount of calories....why don't you post up your diet plan, complete with calories per meal, and let us have a look & critique?

[Dan K]

Heya. I'm in contact with the doctors about my shoulder - My front delts hold out ok, and I have no trouble at all in the rear section. The problem mostly involves lateral movement - I only work out the lateral head once a week - and the most I lift is 4 sets of 10 @ 11lbs - And even at that very light weight I find it quite tough (Very embarrasing lol) I think the problem was that I don't own a squat rack as of yet (I know...), and as such am having to press the weight above my head before and after each exercise - The weight is still very light though - only 88lbs. But my shoulder was a little off that day from sleeping on it in a weird position, and flaired up after the workout - Pretty much ok now though - I'll knock off a few lbs before this evenings shoulder routine.

In regards to my diet, I have some issues with wheat, a nut allergy, and problems with some high GI foods & vegetables, so I'm pretty limited to my diet - I've tried my best, and I know it's probably not ideal, but it's based on the following (please bear in mind that the caloric levels are close estimates, and the protein powder is based on the flavoured whey from the whey consortium and mixed with only water)

Meal 1, Protein shake, 1 egg fried in tablespoon olive oil - calories = 529.5

Meal 2, 25gms rice ( basmati & brown mix), half a tin of tuna fried in 1 tblspn olive oil - calories = 295.5

Meal 3, 25gms rice ( basmati & brown mix), half a tin of tuna fried in 1 tblspn olive oil - calories = 295.5

Meal 4, Protein shake, 25gms rice - calories = 421

Meal 5, Protein shake, 50 gms rice - calories = 508.5

Meal 6, Protein shake, half a tin of tuna fried in olive oil - calories = 541

Which should work out at 2591, so a little higher than my original estimate.
I also take multivitamins and minerals. I also know I should be having more fruit, but I find it hard to fit it in without bumping up my caloric intake too high...

[NeedToBeBig]

Man, that p shake should be some chicken or tuna those last 3 meals...

your calories look ok though, a little low for your weight in my opinion, but i think youll be ok.

alot of rice huh? you could mix it up with some oats if ya want, just a suggestion...

[Dan K]

Forgot to mention - I dont eat meat, hence the number of protien drinks

I dont know if anyone misread, but I was actually concerned with my bicep/tricep performance, not my shoulders (as I havn't worked these out since tuesday before last) and was enquiring as to whether there was any reason either physiological or psychological as to why my performance dropped by that amount in my usual rest period. Am I likely to see further drops as I continue my cut?

[ScottC]

Originally Posted by Dan K

Forgot to mention - I dont eat meat, hence the number of protien drinks

I dont know if anyone misread, but I was actually concerned with my bicep/tricep performance, not my shoulders (as I havn't worked these out since tuesday before last) and was enquiring as to whether there was any reason either physiological or psychological as to why my performance dropped by that amount in my usual rest period. Am I likely to see further drops as I continue my cut?

The arm is the arm. You have to use some shoulder to do arm exercises. This is part of your issue with weight drop, imo.

The only way I would see drops in weight during a cut was if my diet plan stinks and I wasn't getting the calories I need. Since that is not the case, I continue to make small gains in strength during my cut.

[Clear Intention]

Don't worry about drops just yet. We all have bad workouts from time to time. Sometimes I feel super-weak -- and yet everying is the same (good sleep, good diet, etc). Then the next day I'm just fine, so I can only shrug my shoulders and not worry about it.

I would be concerned about it if it continued. And if it does continue, then yeah look at your sleep, diet, alcohol consumption, etc. And of course as has been said, your shoulder figures into a lot of your lifting too, from bench presses to arm exercises.

As for diet -- even if you don't eat meat (except fish?), my opinion is that you need to eat more "real" food (as has been said, replace those shakes). Put in other sources of protein in there, such as milk, cottage cheese, low-fat cheese, etc. If you eat fish, then mix it up with some other fish (besides just tuna all the time).

[Dan K]

Lol, the offending shoulder is opposite to the arm which reached failure early - Usually my stronger arm The plot thickens...

Thanks for all the info guys! Most appreciated! I'll try not to worry about it too much for the moment - I'll knock a kilo or 2 off my shoulder exercises (in about an hour) and see how I get on.

In regards to diet, I'm trying to get the recommended 1-1.5gms of protein per lb of bodyfat, but as I'm pretty heavy, it's tough to do that whilst still keeping within the recommended balance of macro's without the shakes (seeing as each shake has about 66gms of protein and a can of tuna has 44gms) - I'll look into what I can do