I admit I throw my kettlebells and wouldn't a barbell the weight is to spread out and it'd probably tip me over. Seriously, I wouldn't throw dumbbells or a barbell and catch them cause they aren't made to take that kind of abuse. When I toss around my kettlebell I'm out side so if I miss the catch it lands on the ground no damage except a little dirt. I'm sure no one started out throwing kbs right away or started off throwing the heavier ones. I think towards functional strength the kettlebells win. As far as the safety issue people get hurt doing regular weight training also. If you don't take it easy and learn proper form you're asking for it no matter what you use.
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genius by birth-slacker by choice
No Tim, I wouldn't do what you suggested with a barbell. I wouldn't do a toss of any kind with even my pink kettlebell right now either. I said its an advanced move.
Personally, I think some of the stuff I've seen people do with kettlebells is just down right amazing. These are oldschool strongman tools and they are just pretty cool and effective. As far as I'm concerned, just because something can be used in an advanced manner that I may never get to, doesn't rule it out for my training. If it takes something to a different level, then even better. Its the same reason I like rings and a freebar over the smith....they're harder. Someone who never picks up a kettlebell can have plenty of functional strength, but those who can do amazing things can more than likely translate those skills into something functional as well. Even your juggler......well I bet his balance and focus skills would help me in some manner in some facet of my life. No, I don't need them and I'm not saying I'm going to go get a juggling kit.....I just don't want to say I'm not going to learn something because I may not use it anywhere in my life.
People told me not to go to back to school when I was 26 for the same reason, and while I don't really "use" my degree for my profession......I'm still pretty proud of obtaining it and I think it made me a better more rounded person.
I also already said that yes, I would say a newb should get some db's first. You're on a budget and so are some others.....but that's not the subject I don't think. Because if it is....I say get some spinlocks and lets not confuse the issue because if you're here the issue should be at the very least general fitness regardless of your budget.....many ideas and options there.
I just like the kettlebells and their history, I think they are different than my db's, and I wouldn't want anybody to not at least give them a glance if they were interested.
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member No. 4
"Who is John Galt?"
My Workout Journal: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=117889891
I admit I throw my kettlebells and wouldn't a barbell the weight is to spread out and it'd probably tip me over. Seriously, I wouldn't throw dumbbells or a barbell and catch them cause they aren't made to take that kind of abuse. When I toss around my kettlebell I'm out side so if I miss the catch it lands on the ground no damage except a little dirt. I'm sure no one started out throwing kbs right away or started off throwing the heavier ones. I think towards functional strength the kettlebells win. As far as the safety issue people get hurt doing regular weight training also. If you don't take it easy and learn proper form you're asking for it no matter what you use.
Actually if your barbell is i good one it is just as made to take that abuse as a kettlebell, watch what the Olympians do to them sometime.
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member No. 11
Bodybuilding is for Life
When McDonalds opened what they considered a full meal, for an adult, is now sold, with a toy that does not pose a choking hazard to children under three!!!
If it was from a reputable source I would have gave it a read. It's probably an internet geek that has no experience lifting kettlebells. I skimmed through the table and "thick handle causes blisters" caught my eye. Definitely, an office amateur that is afraid of getting blisters. Grow some balls!
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member No.2
If it was from a reputable source I would have gave it a read. It's probably an internet geek that has no experience lifting kettlebells. I skimmed through the table and "thick handle causes blisters" caught my eye. Definitely, an office amateur that is afraid of getting blisters. Grow some balls!
well, i read it. that chart he made just sucks- everyone has different goals, and not everyone who buys dbs wants adjustables.
like i said, i've used both and would rather have kettlebells.
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"If there must be trouble let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." -thomas paine
5/3/1 training log:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=113516991
I'm not anti-kettlebell training. What I am is anti-stupid siht training. I just tend to see people using kettlebells in a manner that is far more advanced than their strength and skill level would allow for far more often than I do any other training tool. Stupid siht.
Nor am I aginst Old school devices or methods, most of my training has been proven for more than half a century, and for petes sake I incorporate indian club exercises. But again there is more to old school training than Kettlebells so...
I'm not even against jugglers. I juggle, and I've done it with some pretty stupid ****, including knives and bowling balls. But I don't try to kid myslef into thinking that its either save or anything but a stunt to do so.
I guess in this thread I am really reacting to a couple of things. One is the kettlebell fad, then there is the Crossfit Koolaid, and finally the myth that is functional training. I might be spending to much time in the Workout programs section but these three things come up pretty often accomanied by so much stupid siht that it makes you want to beat your head with a, well ..............kettlebell.
Here's just one example that came up recently:
its not even the bad form or the to much weight, its the encouragement from the "trainer" for the same.
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member No. 11
Bodybuilding is for Life
When McDonalds opened what they considered a full meal, for an adult, is now sold, with a toy that does not pose a choking hazard to children under three!!!
I'm not anti-kettlebell training. What I am is anti-stupid siht training. I just tend to see people using kettlebells in a manner that is far more advanced than their strength and skill level would allow for far more often than I do any other training tool. Stupid siht.
Nor am I aginst Old school devices or methods, most of my training has been proven for more than half a century, and for petes sake I incorporate indian club exercises. But again there is more to old school training than Kettlebells so...
I'm not even against jugglers. I juggle, and I've done it with some pretty stupid ****, including knives and bowling balls. But I don't try to kid myslef into thinking that its either save or anything but a stunt to do so.
I guess in this thread I am really reacting to a couple of things. One is the kettlebell fad, then there is the Crossfit Koolaid, and finally the myth that is functional training. I might be spending to much time in the Workout programs section but these three things come up pretty often accomanied by so much stupid siht that it makes you want to beat your head with a well kettlebell.
Ok, now this post I can deal with.......who got on your computer? I'm glad you got rid of them .
Simple questions/thoughts for discussion though:
I think the kettlebell's are on a fad swing right now......but only because we live in a pop-culture society and they've been re-discovered. They've been around for centuries. I don't know much about crossfit, but from what I've garnered.....I don't understand the hate..........seems like the concepts are fine if that's what you're into. Finally, functional strength myth? I think I know what you're saying here but not sure. Is training just training? Or are there some things that help us do stuff in our day to day more than some others?
I like movement and I like learning new things. If those new things help me get stronger and healthier, then I'll give it a shot. Heck, the acquisition of equipment has made me read, learn new excercises, and basically made this whole thing more of a hobby for me. That has helped me keep up the motivation and drive. My gym might be a little excessive (might?), but I like having the various tools and know that I can change things up all the time. Not because some book says I should or to "trick" my body, but to keep things fresh and different in my head and to keep staying active.
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member No. 4
"Who is John Galt?"
My Workout Journal: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=117889891
I like movement and I like learning new things. If those new things help me get stronger and healthier, then I'll give it a shot. Heck, the acquisition of equipment has made me read, learn new excercises, and basically made this whole thing more of a hobby for me. That has helped me keep up the motivation and drive. My gym might be a little excessive (might?), but I like having the various tools and know that I can change things up all the time. Not because some book says I should or to "trick" my body, but to keep things fresh and different in my head and to keep staying active.
^^^THIS^^^.......Keep the workouts interesting....I use kettlebells for my cardio routine. Do two handed swings followed by turkish get ups and my heart rate was a steady 140-160 for a 20-30 minute workout......cardio without the dishonor is what Pavel calls the KB.....
Kettlebells, the training tool of the Russian army
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member No. 11
Bodybuilding is for Life
When McDonalds opened what they considered a full meal, for an adult, is now sold, with a toy that does not pose a choking hazard to children under three!!!
Not kettlebell hate, just hate the way they are marketed.
ah, ok. the thing i'm not getting about the links you posted is that they are comparing kettlebells to adjustable dbs in a few places. of course you can't add a little weight to a solid kettlebell. besides platemates- you can't add it to a hex db, either. and i wouldn't trust a platemate to say put on a db if i was swinging it or doing cleans/snatches with it.
another is they both talk about how hard it is to grip kettlebells- i am relatively small- 5'6 and i have small hands. i've not had problems with holding onto a kettlebell.
yes, they are a bit more expensive than dbs, but unless i missed a huge marketing scheme, i haven't seen them advertised much. i will admit that i don't pay much attention, though, so that is possible.
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"If there must be trouble let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." -thomas paine
5/3/1 training log:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=113516991
Not kettlebell hate, just hate the way they are marketed.
I read the second article. Fairly good points and I maybe learned something about their origins and use. I say maybe because the books I've read said the opposite and they weren't "bad" sources, so who do you believe? Why lie or misconstrue the whole Russian thing? Oh well, I'll just take it all with a grain of salt, eh?
I understand the marketing hate, I've said a bunch I don't like the marketing of the bowflex. The rockstar status of the kettlebell isn't going to last forever. Although, I agree with Animal that I haven't felt bombarded with Kettlebell advertisements.
The article didn't sing the praises of the kettlebell, that's for sure. But they're still a tool and still add something to a training program. Injuries are a hazard, but they are with anything. Learn the exercises and learn good form and injuries will be reduced. Just like dbs and barbells.
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member No. 4
"Who is John Galt?"
My Workout Journal: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=117889891
As far as cost is concerned most people would begin with a single kettlebell which will serve their training needs for some time. Compare this to cheap set of dumbells which most people will out grow fairly quickly.
I began with a 16kg KB (~35lb) and have just started using a 28kg KB (~62lb). However, my 16 kg is still useful for warm ups, and practicing new moves.
As far as cost is concerned most people would begin with a single kettlebell which will serve their training needs for some time. Compare this to cheap set of dumbells which most people will out grow fairly quickly.
I began with a 16kg KB (~35lb) and have just started using a 28kg KB (~62lb). However, my 16 kg is still useful for warm ups, and practicing new moves.
well, i stand corrected (if i had punch kettlebells, at least). i started with a 12, 16, and 20. now i have more- but i haven't progressed too high yet. the reason i have bigger 'bells than i use right now? good deal on used.
i was basically disputing the articles posted- comparing a fixed weight kettlebell with an adjustable dumbbell just wasn't right. know what i mean?
i have had that site bookmarked, though i don't make it in there as often as i should. thanks for posting!
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"If there must be trouble let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." -thomas paine
5/3/1 training log:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=113516991
well, i stand corrected (if i had punch kettlebells, at least). i started with a 12, 16, and 20. now i have more- but i haven't progressed too high yet. the reason i have bigger 'bells than i use right now? good deal on used.
Most of my kettlebells have a small rubber pad fixed onto the bottom. Whilst they aren't Punch Gym KB's I can still remove the bolt holding the rubber pad on and afix a KB Buddy.
I've had my 28kg KB sitting in the corner waiting for my progress for about a year.
Now that I've started using the 28kg I've order a 32kg to take it's place and keep me motivated. I find it easier if I can see my goal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by animalfan
i was basically disputing the articles posted- comparing a fixed weight kettlebell with an adjustable dumbbell just wasn't right. know what i mean?
I know exactly what you mean. A lot of the supposed "information" posted in those articles is highly subjective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by animalfan
i have had that site bookmarked, though i don't make it in there as often as i should. thanks for posting!
If you want a good cardio / kettlebell ass kicking, you should try some of his (DiLuglio's) DVDs. I can do Providence and almost keep up with Newport. The Firepower DVD, however, is only for action Super Heros
If you want a good cardio / kettlebell ass kicking, you should try some of his (DiLuglio's) DVDs. I can do Providence and almost keep up with Newport. The Firepower DVD, however, is only for action Super Heros
^ This. Hey animal, you should have the Newport dvd.
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member #14
"A man who wants something will find a way; a man who doesn't will find an excuse"-S. Dolley Jr.
This article sets up a bunch of straw-man arguments that no reputable person actually makes, and then proceeds to knock them down. When was the last time you actually heard someone say that "kettlebells are magic" or "kettlebells will work for everyone"? Classic logical fallacy: if you have no answer for someone's real argument, make up another argument that's easier to refute.
The author also makes some blatantly false statements, such as "resistance is resistance." Anyone who has trained seriously for any length of time knows this is false. Just as lifting a 100-lb. sandbag requires a different technique and produces different results than lifting a 100-lb. dumbbell, so too with kettlebells. KBs aren't necessarily better--they're certainly not for everyone--but they are indisputably different and produce different results. As for the claim that KBs work only or primarily the shoulders, wrists, elbows, and lower back, that's simply a lie. ANYONE who has used them knows they do more than that.
I could go on. For example, the discussion of injury and correct form applies to any kind of weight training (try doing deadlifts with incorrect form), no one cares if KBs are "Russian," and proper KB training does not "hyperextend body parts." Suffice it to say that the author couldn't put a logical argument together if his life depended on it.
This article sets up a bunch of straw-man arguments that no reputable person actually makes (Kettlebells will work for everyone, KBs are magic, etc.) and then proceeds to knock them down. Classic logical fallacy: if you have no answer for someone's actual argument, make up another argument that's easier to refute.
The author also makes some blatantly false statements, such as "resistance is resistance." Anyone who has trained seriously for any length of time knows this is false. Just as lifting a 100-lb. sandbag requires a different technique and produces different results than lifting a 100-lb. dumbbell, so too with kettlebells. KBs aren't necessarily better--they're certainly not for everyone--but they are indisputably different and produce different results. As for the claim that KBs work only or primarily the shoulders, wrists, elbows, and lower back, that's simply a lie. ANYONE who has used them knows they do more than that.
I could go on. For example, the discussion of injury and correct form applies to any kind of weight training (try doing deadlifts with incorrect form), no one cares if KBs are "Russian," and proper KB training does not "hyperextend body parts." But suffice it to say that the author couldn't put a logical argument together if his life depended on it.
I just got done with it and came away with some of the same thoughts. He didn't knock kettlebells as much as the overhyped aura that surrounds them.
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[]---[] Equipment Crew Member #14
"A man who wants something will find a way; a man who doesn't will find an excuse"-S. Dolley Jr.
You can develop rhabdomyolysis from sitting on the couch for too long, so it's a spurious argument against any fitness initiative.
I agree, but making it into a cartoon character and laughing about it when they have been sued for causing rhabdomyolysis in a customer is in extremely poor taste.
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Hey, here's a crazy idea. How about eating a reasonable amount of quality food you actually enjoy, every day--- forever?
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