Pre-Contest Carbing up!!!

[Walt_22_07]

What's going on everybody? I have a bodybuilding competition November 7th (this Saturday) and I was wondering what are your thoughts on carbing up for the show? Btw for the past few weeks I have been operating on no carbs...

[Barn01]

Originally Posted by Walt_22_07

What's going on everybody? I have a bodybuilding competition November 7th (this Saturday) and I was wondering what are your thoughts on carbing up for the show? Btw for the past few weeks I have been operating on no carbs...

No carbs for a few weeks?? Hmmm you really should have had a couple good carb days in there to experiment. I like the dirty carb (crap load) method but everyone has there own thoughts on this. Different people and trainers will basically all tell you something else so basically that's why it's best to experiment a little in the weeks before and see for yourself what yeilds the best results. Timing and quantity are key when messing with a peak week carb load. Leave it to late and you won't look full, don't eat enough and you won't look full.

If I were you I would start carbing Fri morning or around noon and eat all the way up until a couple hours before you're on stage. It takes time to fill out, definatly not something you're going to pull out of a hat the morning of. If you start feeling any bloat coming on just stop eating for an hour or two then start up again.

[Walt_22_07]

Well I guess I should have said that differently. I've taken in no carbs other than having a high carb meal once a week, but I eliminated that from my diet last week. That "crap load" or dirty carb load is what I did last yr and worked out for me really well, also 2 of my trainers I've seen n the past recommend I do this as well. Thanks for the help bro!

[Vietgoboi]

Originally Posted by ChrisAceto

i usually have a bb cut the carbs in hald for two days then say half again for a day...that will deplete you

So the BB eating 150 grams a day would go to half or 75 for 2 days then on the third half of that or 37 grams for a day

Sodium I usually cut it 3-5 days out depending ont he condition of the person

Here the advice I receive from Chris Aceto.

GL w/ your show.

[AustrianOakJr]

Cutting sodium out is the best way to go in completely flat.

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by Barn01

If I were you I would start carbing Fri morning or around noon and eat all the way up until a couple hours before you're on stage. It takes time to fill out, definatly not something you're going to pull out of a hat the morning of. If you start feeling any bloat coming on just stop eating for an hour or two then start up again.

Actually, if I were him I would simply pay attention to my high carb days in what I was already doing and see how I look at certain times both after carb meals AND after the high carb day is finished. Try to keep as many variables as constant as you can (food selection for one) and pay attention to the timing of the different looks. For him, the timing could be different than you...so simply saying "I would start Friday morning..." and actually putting a specific time on someone you have never worked with and know nothing about is pretty bad advice.

For someone trying to do this as much on their own as they can and looking for some great guidelines to follow for peak week, here are a few:

Keep as many variables as you can constant so that you have a better understanding of what is actually doing what. That means food choice, water amount, salt amounts (sodium/potassium) etc. DO the best you can with keeping them constant and then pay attnetion to your carb load every high carb day you have. Pay attnetion to the timing of the different looks you get starting from right after you are done eating up until about 2 hours out. Notice if/when you look soft, vascular, full, dry, bloated, etc. All of this will give you information on how you do your final carb up into a show. This is what top trainers do. They are constantly getting feedback from their clients from their refeeds. Then each refeed, you can start to play with the amounts to see what amount does what. Refeeds to raise leptin are different from those that are for filling out. Learn your body's boundaries.

As with the other variables like water, salts, and all of the rest - the best advice I can give for someone working on their own is to not do anything drastic. If you taper water,don't do it drastically. If you mess with sodium and postassium, don't so it drastically.

Physiology can get extremely complex - so the best thing you can do is not get to wrapped up into all the things we can't control and just focus on a few that we can.

Best of luck!

Sporto

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by AustrianOakJr

Cutting sodium out is the best way to go in completely flat.

How many times have you heard this backstage at a bodybuilding show in the pump up room"

"Man, no matter what I do, I can't seem to hold a pump!"

These are the competitors that completely cut out sodium.

Sporto

[Barn01]

Originally Posted by Sporto1633

For him, the timing could be different than you...so simply saying "I would start Friday morning..." and actually putting a specific time on someone you have never worked with and know nothing about is pretty bad advice.

Sporto

Spoken by someone that hasn't read the original post I think you should take that back. His comp is on Sat .... he doesn't have time to do experiments anymore. So here's a kid reaching for ideas because he didn't set a plan in place early enough. I could have said nothing or do as he requested and provide the best advice I can with what I've been given to work with. Besides I clearly stated that if I was him that's what I would do .... I never told him to do it, and even if I did nobody is forcing him to.

(Oh I had more to say but decide best to leave that out)

[Exa123]

Originally Posted by Sporto1633

"Man, no matter what I do, I can't seem to hold a pump!"

These are the competitors that completely cut out sodium.

Sporto

Been there, done that.......never doing that again!!!

[Walt_22_07]

Originally Posted by Sporto1633

Actually, if I were him I would simply pay attention to my high carb days in what I was already doing and see how I look at certain times both after carb meals AND after the high carb day is finished. Try to keep as many variables as constant as you can (food selection for one) and pay attention to the timing of the different looks. For him, the timing could be different than you...so simply saying "I would start Friday morning..." and actually putting a specific time on someone you have never worked with and know nothing about is pretty bad advice.

For someone trying to do this as much on their own as they can and looking for some great guidelines to follow for peak week, here are a few:

Keep as many variables as you can constant so that you have a better understanding of what is actually doing what. That means food choice, water amount, salt amounts (sodium/potassium) etc. DO the best you can with keeping them constant and then pay attnetion to your carb load every high carb day you have. Pay attnetion to the timing of the different looks you get starting from right after you are done eating up until about 2 hours out. Notice if/when you look soft, vascular, full, dry, bloated, etc. All of this will give you information on how you do your final carb up into a show. This is what top trainers do. They are constantly getting feedback from their clients from their refeeds. Then each refeed, you can start to play with the amounts to see what amount does what. Refeeds to raise leptin are different from those that are for filling out. Learn your body's boundaries.

As with the other variables like water, salts, and all of the rest - the best advice I can give for someone working on their own is to not do anything drastic. If you taper water,don't do it drastically. If you mess with sodium and postassium, don't so it drastically.

Physiology can get extremely complex - so the best thing you can do is not get to wrapped up into all the things we can't control and just focus on a few that we can.

Best of luck!

Sporto

Thanks man that was very helpful! I appreciate it!

[Walt_22_07]

I appreciate everyones help, I really do! 4 more days till showtime and can't wait!

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by Barn01

Spoken by someone that hasn't read the original post I think you should take that back. His comp is on Sat .... he doesn't have time to do experiments anymore. So here's a kid reaching for ideas because he didn't set a plan in place early enough. I could have said nothing or do as he requested and provide the best advice I can with what I've been given to work with. Besides I clearly stated that if I was him that's what I would do .... I never told him to do it, and even if I did nobody is forcing him to.

(Oh I had more to say but decide best to leave that out)

Yeah, trust me, I have plenty more to say about almost every post you write, but I hold back as well. But, thanks for sharing your thoughts in parenthesis.

And I read the original post, my advice still stands...BUT, let me better write what my entire point was for YOU personally so that you can comprehend it (even though the original poster was smart enough to grasp it and thanked me):

To the original poster:

Try to remember as best as you can how your body responded to your high carb days. Think about what you looked like at different times that you may have noticed a more softer look, a more vascular look, food sources...just whatever you can remember. Plan your carb load around that. Try to keep as many things as you can constant, and what changes you do make, don't do anything drastic. If you decide to cut water, taper it slightly. If you decide to mess with sodium at all, taper it slightly...again, nothing drastic. With 4 days left, you have time to do a little earlier carb load with some really high amounts, which gives you some leeway on the timing if you eat too much (you could use Friday as a diet day if you do to tighten back up), or if you had found that you looked really good towards the end of your high carb days, then you can try to time the amount and go backwards from prejudging (your actual stage time, not start time) and do it that way. Just spread out your carbs as best you can and try not to eat large meals all at once.

There, I added more this time around just for you and even bolded it for ya. I hope you can actually get the point of the message this time.

Sporto

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by Walt_22_07

I appreciate everyones help, I really do! 4 more days till showtime and can't wait!

One more thing! If you plan on competing in the future, pay real close attention to how you look throughout the week and throughout the contest day. Use that information along with the protocol you chose to go with and compare them - if you have questions about what might have caused what look at different parts of the week/day afterwards, come back and we will try to help with the understanding of it so you can be that much better next time!

Good luck!

Sporto

[Walt_22_07]

Sounds Great Sporto 1633! Appreciate it! I'll keep everything you said in mind! Thanks again!

[Barn01]

Originally Posted by Sporto1633

Yeah, trust me, I have plenty more to say about almost every post you write, but I hold back as well. But, thanks for sharing your thoughts in parenthesis.

And I read the original post, my advice still stands...BUT, let me better write what my entire point was for YOU personally so that you can comprehend it (even though the original poster was smart enough to grasp it and thanked me):

Sporto

Oh I think you said enough in your multiple page PM. You continue you bash me ... for passing out "bad" advice. I really think you should give it a rest. You just NOW tell him to start eating carbs but you too have no idea how much and of what kind he's going to eat and how much water he's going to consume in the coming days? A front load or back load can both work and many competitors and trainers use both methods so please stop pretending your god and your way is the only way!

The original poster thanked us both smarty. Might I add that he's already tried what I suggested with success and I'm not the only one suggesting it.

That "crap load" or dirty carb load is what I did last yr and worked out for me really well, also 2 of my trainers I've seen n the past recommend I do this as well. Thanks for the help bro!

Seriously I've stated to you so many times now that I don't get why you have this attitude towards me. Lots of people here post thoughts and opinions .... it's a public forum! If someone is interested in knowing more of the "science" behind an idea they can research it and see if there's any truth to it or ask me personally. At least putting the idea out there gives someone direction to investigate.

I've really tried to be nice and respectful when dealing with you but you keep pushing me and it's getting annoying!

I'm starting to think your just jealous because my side seratus pose looks better than yours

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by Barn01

Oh I think you said enough in your multiple page PM.

The multiple page PM was out of courtesy to simply point out that your advice is either very poor, or very poorly given. You never explain why you advise to do any of the things you suggest on here, and probably very simply because you have no clue. All I was doing was trying to be nice and offer a suggestion on changing your approach on how you give your information. That's all. You were rude back to me, so from that point on, when you post your piss poor advice, I will continue to point it out. Either you back up what you advise to do with reasons why (which I know you won't because you don't know), or I will continue to point out the flaws in your posts.

Originally Posted by Barn01

You continue you bash me ... for passing out "bad" advice. I really think you should give it a rest.

Actually, I think the lurkers and the curious who peruse these forums deserve to know the truth and science behind why to do certain things so that they can gain a better understanding of the entire picture. They can't get that with any of your posts.

Originally Posted by Barn01

You just NOW tell him to start eating carbs but you too have no idea how much and of what kind he's going to eat and how much water he's going to consume in the coming days?

Your reading comprehension is just as piss poor as most of the advice you give. You should try re-reading what the point of my post was - I tried twice to spell it out to you, but beyond that, I believe there really is no hope for you at all.

Originally Posted by Barn01

A front load or back load can both work and many competitors and trainers use both methods so please stop pretending your god and your way is the only way!

Well, first off, I don't have just one way...so there is no "my way is the only way". There are SEVERAL ways...but you obviously have no clue how to incorporate the different variables together to get the optimal result for any of those several ways - which is most assuredly why you never post why or explain yourself better than senseless posts like, "I don't know Oak, I tapered my water and look at me!" LOL

Originally Posted by Barn01

The original poster thanked us both smarty. Might I add that he's already tried what I suggested with success and I'm not the only one suggesting it.

My bad...you must be referring to the generic post where he thanked everyone who posted in the thread. I was actually referring to the extra post he made where he took the time to quote my post in order to specifically thank me for a detailed explanation - something no one ever gets with your posts. But hey, whatever makes you feel better about yourself.

Originally Posted by Barn01

Seriously I've stated to you so many times now that I don't get why you have this attitude towards me.

Actually, you have never stated anywhere that I have ever seen that you don't know why I have an attitude towards you. Why would that be? Um, because I never did That's why I was trying to be nice and send a PM to offer a suggestion. In all actuality, now I just find you entertaining. And I don't treat you any different than I treat anyone else on here who posts the way you do.

Originally Posted by Barn01

Lots of people here post thoughts and opinions .... it's a public forum! If someone is interested in knowing more of the "science" behind an idea they can research it and see if there's any truth to it or ask me personally. At least putting the idea out there gives someone direction to investigate.

See, that's my point. You are no different than every other 'bro' in the gym who hands out poor advice that has no clue how any of this works. And I hope they do ask you personally, so they can see what they are dealing with. Yes, lots of people post thoughts and opinions...and those of us who actually know the science behind things and know how all the details and variables work together like to post those things when it is necessary. I'm not picking on you or have an attitude towards you, but it just so happens that most of your posts either aren't correct, or they *could* be correct if you actually explained the other things that have to be involved in order to make it work.

Originally Posted by Barn01

I've really tried to be nice and respectful when dealing with you but you keep pushing me and it's getting annoying!

Actually, you have yet to be nice or respectful. Your PM back to me, although it made me laugh, was anything but - which is perfectly fine. I actualy had a feeling you were that type of person. I'm not pushing you at all, TRUST ME. But you keep posting crap, and I will keep pointing it out

Originally Posted by Barn01

I'm starting to think your just jealous because my side seratus pose looks better than yours

Quite possibly the funniest thing you've said to date You do realize that your obliques are nowhere near the size of mine, right? And you aren't as lean as me, right? And the d*uche-bag look you have on your face while you are posing completely makes it look even more ridiculous, right? Oh, and what book cover is your side serratus on? LOL! Believe me, I would love to challenge you to a mutual show, but you are years behind me and I am simply not waiting for you. I mean, it's funny that you win a small show that hardly anyone shows up in shape for (you just happen to be the winner by lack of options) and all of sudden you are posting everywhere on here as if you know what you are talking about - like you understand this sport after doing well at one small show LOL. Trust me Barney...there is absolutely nothing anywhere remotely near jealousy on my end - just pity and amusement. So please, don't stop posting...you have been quite the entertainment lately!

And the double digit number of PMs I got from the people that read my posts in response to yours all agree as well So keep up the fantastic work!

Sporto

[Barn01]

Originally Posted by Sporto1633

The multiple page PM was out of courtesy to simply point out that your advice is either very poor, or very poorly given. You never explain why you advise to do any of the things you suggest on here, and probably very simply because you have no clue.

Please stop assuming you know anything about me.

All I was doing was trying to be nice and offer a suggestion on changing your approach on how you give your information. That's all. You were rude back to me, so from that point on, when you post your piss poor advice, I will continue to point it out.

No you were trying to get me to do what you want because you think that any other way of posting isn't satisfactory. I was NOT rude back to you and I even ended my PM with a compliment towards you .... would you like me to cut and paste it to refresh your memory?

Either you back up what you advise to do with reasons why (which I know you won't because you don't know), or I will continue to point out the flaws in your posts.

Please stop assuming you know what I know. You know what assuming does right?
You do what you have to do, I'm not breaking any forum rules.

Your reading comprehension is just as piss poor as most of the advice you give. You should try re-reading what the point of my post was - I tried twice to spell it out to you, but beyond that, I believe there really is no hope for you at all.

Ummm well here was your advice even though he only had a few days until the show and stated that he's been eating no carbs in the OP.

Keep as many variables as you can constant so that you have a better understanding of what is actually doing what. That means food choice, water amount, salt amounts (sodium/potassium) etc. DO the best you can with keeping them constant and then pay attnetion to your carb load every high carb day you have. Pay attnetion to the timing of the different looks you get starting from right after you are done eating up until about 2 hours out. Notice if/when you look soft, vascular, full, dry, bloated, etc. All of this will give you information on how you do your final carb up into a show.

So how is he supposed to do this monitoring high carb days when he doesn't have time left to do them and never stated in the OP that he even did them in the past?

Well, first off, I don't have just one way...so there is no "my way is the only way". There are SEVERAL ways...but you obviously have no clue how to incorporate the different variables together to get the optimal result for any of those several ways - which is most assuredly why you never post why or explain yourself better than senseless posts like, "I don't know Oak, I tapered my water and look at me!" LOL

I never said you had one way ... please reread. You just like to disagree with anyone that doesn't have the same thought process as you, it has nothing to do with you having only one way.

My bad...you must be referring to the generic post where he thanked everyone who posted in the thread. I was actually referring to the extra post he made where he took the time to quote my post in order to specifically thank me for a detailed explanation - something no one ever gets with your posts. But hey, whatever makes you feel better about yourself.

Wow are you that hung up on a thank you? I even posted the quote and you still push it!

Actually, you have never stated anywhere that I have ever seen that you don't know why I have an attitude towards you. Why would that be? Um, because I never did That's why I was trying to be nice and send a PM to offer a suggestion. In all actuality, now I just find you entertaining. And I don't treat you any different than I treat anyone else on here who posts the way you do.

My bad that was part of the PM that I deleted and didn't bother sending you because I really didn't feel it was worth going there. I see that you have no problem going there though.

I'm not picking on you or have an attitude towards you,

Haha wow ummm ok, if you say so.

Actually, you have yet to be nice or respectful. Your PM back to me, although it made me laugh, was anything but - which is perfectly fine. I actualy had a feeling you were that type of person. I'm not pushing you at all, TRUST ME. But you keep posting crap, and I will keep pointing it out

I wasn't disrespectful at all, infact I actually complimented you .... remember?

I am not out to pick up clients, (I don't even work in a fittness industry) I've never taken a dollar from anyone when it comes to training or diet advice. If someone comes to me and asks then I tell them my thoughts and that's that. Afterall they came asking and I don't mind sharing what I think. I feel that's how we all learn and grow. Besides that's what the forums are for aren't they? I respect your experiance and I'm sure many appreciate your advice. I actually would like to say thank you ... I took your advice on how to apply dream tan with a hard slap and it works great ... I just added a little pam for the prejudge and muscle sheen for the night show ... I'm all about experimenting. (both looked great btw)

So please, don't stop posting...you have been quite the entertainment lately!

Looks like we're both entertained by each other.

[Grinners]

Originally Posted by Walt_22_07

Sounds Great Sporto 1633! Appreciate it! I'll keep everything you said in mind! Thanks again!

Abs look unbelieveably powerful! Any advice (routine?)

Good luck!

[Agostage]

Although it's entertaining to read, you both are better than this bickering; agree to disagree and go lift something heavy.

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by Barn01

Please stop assuming you know anything about me.

What I know of you has been strictly due to your posts so far on this forum...so if you are a different person than you portray, you should maybe change your approach.

Originally Posted by Barn01

No you were trying to get me to do what you want because you think that any other way of posting isn't satisfactory. I was NOT rude back to you and I even ended my PM with a compliment towards you .... would you like me to cut and paste it to refresh your memory?

I was referring to the context of what you wrote back. I wasn't trying to get you to do anything, I was offering a suggestion on your approach so that you don't end up getting corrected and made an example of every time you offer up bad or incomplete advice. You chose to snub me and act like you know it all and continue with your approach, so like I said back to you, I'll just reply to you publicly.

Originally Posted by Barn01

Please stop assuming you know what I know. You know what assuming does right?
You do what you have to do, I'm not breaking any forum rules.

I don't have to assume buddy, your posts make it painfully obvious

Originally Posted by Barn01

Ummm well here was your advice even though he only had a few days until the show and stated that he's been eating no carbs in the OP.

Wow, your reading comprehension is beyond piss poor. You did happen to see his next response as to having a high carb day once a week as well, right? I'll give you a hint: it's immediately after your first post. Take a second look...

Originally Posted by Barn01

So how is he supposed to do this monitoring high carb days when he doesn't have time left to do them and never stated in the OP that he even did them in the past?

Actually, if you could read, he stated that he did. It was only a week ago that he had eliminated them. So, he has had plenty of time to see how his body reacted. And incorporating them during peak week would be simple...I have a handful of people every month start to freak out before a show and bring me in strictly for peak week. If you understand the science and the fundamentals, it's an easy adjustment no matter waht approach they use.

Originally Posted by Barn01

I never said you had one way ... please reread. You just like to disagree with anyone that doesn't have the same thought process as you, it has nothing to do with you having only one way.

I know what you said...that apparently I think my way is the only way - which incinuates that I have one way and it is always right. I don't need to reread anything, you need some serious reading comprehension skills.

And I don't like to disagree with everyone, I simply call a spade a spade. In fact, when correct information is posted, the majority of my posts are chiming in and confirming the truth based on available research, anecdotal data, etc. So, except for your bad advice, I spend more time agreeing and confirming good advice on here from veterans of the sport who know their stuff.

Originally Posted by Barn01

Wow are you that hung up on a thank you? I even posted the quote and you still push it!

Nope! Could care less...just felt like pointing it out to you for obvious reasons.

Originally Posted by Barn01

My bad that was part of the PM that I deleted and didn't bother sending you because I really didn't feel it was worth going there. I see that you have no problem going there though.

Could care less. Your opinion of me is meaningless. I'm just doing my best to educate the lurkers not to follow poor advice. That's all.

Originally Posted by Barn01

Looks like we're both entertained by each other.

Oh trust me, you have entertained plenty more people than just me...especially with that side serratus delusion LOL

Originally Posted by Agostage

Although it's entertaining to read, you both are better than this bickering; agree to disagree and go lift something heavy.

You are right...sometimes I just get bored of the same questions both in here and in the numerous pms. Usually every few months though a newbie likes to come in and blow his load in here with a ton of fragments from cookie cutter advice and it gives me something to do

When you are jumping on stage again? You've got to be getting the itch, right?

Sporto

[Agostage]

Originally Posted by Sporto1633

When you are jumping on stage again? You've got to be getting the itch, right?

Sporto

Oh you know it! Plan is to compete in 2010. I had taken 2008 off with the plan of an '09 run; but the career required me to take a 14 hour licensing exam that necessitated 4 months of studying. I decided that studying and dieting would not be a good idea. But the exam was last week, I can focus again and it's full speed ahead. Thanks for asking SPORTOOOOOO!

[Rodzilla]

wow, how did his question turn into this.

who wants to compare bench numbers?!

[Barn01]

Originally Posted by Rodzilla

wow, how did his question turn into this.

I have no idea ... people can think whatever they want from it all. All I did was respond to a guys post. I thought that's how a form worked.

People shouldn't be afraid to express thoughts, ideas, experiances. Sporto you have your way of expressing yourself ... I get that and I'm sure everyone else does too.

I refuse to respond to this any further, you've become unreasonable and it's not worth my time because it doesn't get me anywhere but down to your level.

[Sporto1633]

Originally Posted by Agostage

Oh you know it! Plan is to compete in 2010. I had taken 2008 off with the plan of an '09 run; but the career required me to take a 14 hour licensing exam that necessitated 4 months of studying. I decided that studying and dieting would not be a good idea. But the exam was last week, I can focus again and it's full speed ahead. Thanks for asking SPORTOOOOOO!

Nice! I've been getting the itch myself, and like you, had to take care of some things first. 2010 is gonna be a good year!

Originally Posted by Rodzilla

wow, how did his question turn into this.

who wants to compare bench numbers?!

Simple - poor advice was being corrected yet again, and someone isn't mature enough to handle it Well, that and a hilarious side serratus comment lol

Originally Posted by Barn01

I have no idea ... people can think whatever they want from it all. All I did was respond to a guys post. I thought that's how a form worked.

That's precisely how a forum works. And if you are man enough to post advice like you know what you are talking about, you should be prepared to back up the things you say and claim. I have yet to see you do either when any of your advice is questioned - which shows precisely how much you know about what you post.

Originally Posted by Barn01

People shouldn't be afraid to express thoughts, ideas, experiances. Sporto you have your way of expressing yourself ... I get that and I'm sure everyone else does too.

No they shouldn't. And if it is a mere thought, or idea for discussion, then that is one thing. But stating claims in the manner you do like they are fact when they are backed up with absolutely nothing is something completely different. Again, it was your approach that I was originally trying to make a suggestion for, but whatever LOL

Originally Posted by Barn01

I refuse to respond to this any further, you've become unreasonable and it's not worth my time because it doesn't get me anywhere but down to your level.

Well, you are right about one thing - we most certainly are not on the same level...but the whole "down" to my level, implying that you are above me, gave me a good laugh (kind of like your side serratus joke) - so thanks for that

Sporto