To Curl or not To Curl... That is.. The Question

[Pantload]

As long as i've been working out i've never really been that big on bicep curling, or really any arm exercise for that matter. The most i do for an "arm" exercise is Skull Crushers (you can see my full routine below). I've never been that guy at the gym curling in front of the mirror for 30 minutes, let alone dedicating a whole day to "arms". I'm not aiming to insult anyone be any means, i just don't know if i should or shouldn't. I figured that all the compound lift i do would in turn work my arms, without the need to work them on their own seperate day, or even add a arm "split" into my routine; i.e. chest and tirs, or back and bis. Is there really a need to curl when i'm doing compund lifts? Just want some opinions on if curling maybe over-rated...

[tagun]

If you're going to bench/squat/DL/MP/CGBP and do heavy weighted dips/pullups/chins etc. then obviously you'll have to have strong hands. But that doesn't, by all means, mean (especially if you're a bodybuilder - striving for mass over strength/endurance) that you'll have bulging biceps or triceps.

IF you're training bodybuilding style (and you aren't novice/training for strength) then you'll definitely need SOME accessory biceps/triceps work.

Will you get big biceps by curling 24/7? No. But adding some sets of curls, pressdowns and other isolation work, that isn't fundamentally mass/strength building like those heavy compounds, is definitely necessary for arm mass.

[Pantload]

Originally Posted by tagun

If you're going to bench/squat/DL/MP/CGBP and do heavy weighted dips/pullups/chins etc. then obviously you'll have to have strong hands. But that doesn't, by all means, mean (especially if you're a bodybuilder - striving for mass over strength/endurance) that you'll have bulging biceps or triceps.

IF you're training bodybuilding style (and you aren't novice/training for strength) then you'll definitely need SOME accessory biceps/triceps work.

Will you get big biceps by curling 24/7? No. But adding some sets of curls, pressdowns and other isolation work, that isn't fundamentally mass/strength building like those heavy compounds, is definitely necessary for arm mass.

Well right now my routine is set up like so with a few added things here and there:
monday-chest
tuesday-back
wednesday-rest
thursday-legs
fri-free weight chest combo
sat-rest
sunday-shoulders/traps

The big 3 are done on Monday,tuesday and thursday. The other days are sort of accessory muscles i guess you could say. I've just always been kinda anti-curling. But maybe i'm not making the strength gains i could be making if i added more isolated arm exercises.. meaning that if i had stronger biceps and triceps maybe 2 out of the big 3 would go up with the increased arm strength... which usually size follows strength...

What i'm getting at is do i need to add arm exercises in? would it really help me burn that many more calories? add that much size? release that much more testosterone? and if so what's a few good exercises that'll leave my arms to weak to wipe the sweat off my face when i'm done?


Oh and repped for a good reply, might not be much but it's something

[SteveM70]

Originally Posted by tagun

If you're going to bench/squat/DL/MP/CGBP and do heavy weighted dips/pullups/chins etc. then obviously you'll have to have strong hands. But that doesn't, by all means, mean (especially if you're a bodybuilder - striving for mass over strength/endurance) that you'll have bulging biceps or triceps.

IF you're training bodybuilding style (and you aren't novice/training for strength) then you'll definitely need SOME accessory biceps/triceps work.

Will you get big biceps by curling 24/7? No. But adding some sets of curls, pressdowns and other isolation work, that isn't fundamentally mass/strength building like those heavy compounds, is definitely necessary for arm mass.

Man, where were you the last 100 times this question was asked? I do believe you have nailed the answer!

[_Dominik_]

Originally Posted by Pantload

As long as i've been working out i've never really been that big on bicep curling, or really any arm exercise for that matter. The most i do for an "arm" exercise is Skull Crushers (you can see my full routine below). I've never been that guy at the gym curling in front of the mirror for 30 minutes, let alone dedicating a whole day to "arms". I'm not aiming to insult anyone be any means, i just don't know if i should or shouldn't. I figured that all the compound lift i do would in turn work my arms, without the need to work them on their own seperate day, or even add a arm "split" into my routine; i.e. chest and tirs, or back and bis. Is there really a need to curl when i'm doing compund lifts? Just want some opinions on if curling maybe over-rated...

Gyms are full of guys who only do curls and bench, but the reality is curls are the best exercise for specifically targeting the biceps so if you wanted to maximize growth there, you'd include curls in your routine.

[tagun]

Originally Posted by Pantload

Well right now my routine is set up like so with a few added things here and there:
monday-chest
tuesday-back
wednesday-rest
thursday-legs
fri-free weight chest combo
sat-rest
sunday-shoulders/traps

The big 3 are done on Monday,tuesday and thursday. The other days are sort of accessory muscles i guess you could say. I've just always been kinda anti-curling. But maybe i'm not making the strength gains i could be making if i added more isolated arm exercises.. meaning that if i had stronger biceps and triceps maybe 2 out of the big 3 would go up with the increased arm strength... which usually size follows strength...

What i'm getting at is do i need to add arm exercises in? would it really help me burn that many more calories? add that much size? release that much more testosterone? and if so what's a few good exercises that'll leave my arms to weak to wipe the sweat off my face when i'm done?


Oh and repped for a good reply, might not be much but it's something

Originally Posted by SteveM70

Man, where were you the last 100 times this question was asked? I do believe you have nailed the answer!

Thanks for the positive responses. And repped back for not being the usual curl/bench (with horrendous form might I add) whore!

Now as for the questions. No, a few sets of dumbbell curls will definitely not release much testosterone. But you have to know that even squats and deadlifts aren't exactly a shot of AAS. What I'm getting at is, don't be afraid of some isolation work even though it won't make you panting for air and sweat a liter for water out of you. If you want to have larger biceps and triceps squats and deadlifts alone won't cut it.

Do a few sets of dumbbell curls, hammer curls, chinups (close grip), close grip BP, skullcrushers, weighted bench or triceps dips (not leaning forward as you would for chest), rope pressdowns and maybe some overhead extensions. See? You've got more great exercises than you need. Try 'em out and mix them up. Go for what feels right, pumps your muscles and feels like you're working what you're targeting. Don't overdo it. Especially if you're just starting out, keep the majority of exercises to heavy compounds for strength and overall mass.

[Pantload]

Originally posted by tagun
Now as for the questions. No, a few sets of dumbbell curls will definitely not release much testosterone. But you have to know that even squats and deadlifts aren't exactly a shot of AAS. What I'm getting at is, don't be afraid of some isolation work even though it won't make you panting for air and sweat a liter for water out of you. If you want to have larger biceps and triceps squats and deadlifts alone won't cut it.

Do a few sets of dumbbell curls, hammer curls, chinups (close grip), close grip BP, skullcrushers, weighted bench or triceps dips (not leaning forward as you would for chest), rope pressdowns and maybe some overhead extensions. See? You've got more great exercises than you need. Try 'em out and mix them up. Go for what feels right, pumps your muscles and feels like you're working what you're targeting. Don't overdo it. Especially if you're just starting out, keep the majority of exercises to heavy compounds for strength and overall mass.

Sweet. Once again thanks for the great response. I've been doing my own routine for a few months now. Tweaked it a couple times and i think i'm about to tweak it some more.

When i do dips should i just stay perpendicular? I knew dips could be a tri/chest workout depending on which way you lean

and what is a rope pressdown? and overhead extensions? i'm assuming cable oriented exercises?

[tagun]

No problem, glad to have helped.

Dips: everything you need to know -> http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...t=dips+triceps (but yeah, don't lean forward, keep your hand as close to your body as you can and really focus on triceps. If that doesn't work, do bench dips)
Rope pressdowns: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pakPe5-Wyr0
Overhead extension: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcI2PWeqyXI

[Pantload]

Thanks again man. Very useful info

Edit: Lol i've done both those exercises just didn't know the actual name for them. thanks again though

[manofmany]

I think alot of people who advise you not to curl are just as egotistical as those who only do curls (and bench)

[Pantload]

Hmm... I guess just after seeing person after person curl uslessly in front of the mirror for un-natural periods of time and get no where... it kind of set me askew from thinking i "need" to do any bicep/tricep isolation work. Which i guess i don't need too but it'll probably help out way more for long term goals..

I used to be one of those guys who didn't bench all the time but benched at least every other day, then i learned the importance of overall body fitness.. and how having a strong back helps with your upper body lifts as well.

[johnderriLLL]

if u do skull crushers why not do curls? you could superset them.

[Pantload]

Originally Posted by johnderriLLL

if u do skull crushers why not do curls? you could superset them.

What do you mean?

[wrecking_ball]

I am just adding this for some humor - when I first touched weights at 15 I thought bench press worked the biceps. I have no idea how I came to that conclusion but there you go.

Besides that whether to curl or not I say depends on you. Not everyone may need a direct biceps assault but some people may need to hit the muscle directly to get their desired effect. Be your own judge!

[crupiea]

I dont curl and i do nothing but compound lifts.

I am not that concerned about my arm development like having big looking biceps, other then them being tools to help me with compound lifts. I work more triceps because that helps with benching. That sort of thing.

Some people are really into it and more power to them.

Im just not one of them. I have my plate full with squats, deads, cleans and jerks, bench, military press, rack pulls, etc.

I want the work to directly relate and improve the main lifts.

[djansen]

OP, you seem to be basing your decision not to curl on the fact that some people curl for hours in front of the mirrior without any idea what the heck they are doing. really, who gives a **** what they are doing? It seems like you have a good routine and you ARE doing the compound moves already. Are you not happy with your arm size? if not why not try some direct arm work? if you find it takes away from your compound lifts then stop. It really bothers me when its all compound lifts or nothing, is there a rule that says you cant do both compound and isolation in the same workout?

[Pantload]

Originally Posted by djansen

OP, you seem to be basing your decision not to curl on the fact that some people curl for hours in front of the mirrior without any idea what the heck they are doing. really, who gives a **** what they are doing? It seems like you have a good routine and you ARE doing the compound moves already. Are you not happy with your arm size? if not why not try some direct arm work? if you find it takes away from your compound lifts then stop. It really bothers me when its all compound lifts or nothing, is there a rule that says you cant do both compound and isolation in the same workout?

I actually just added a few isolation exercises to my workout and i'm going to see what results i get from them.

What i was asking is basically, does curling do anything? Maybe it's just some waste of time or does it actually help? or can i get the same benifts from my compund lifts?

I can now say, yes curling helps to an extent. Yes compound lifts help. But i'm going to combine some isolation in and see what happens.

[Mad_Dog_Divine]

Originally Posted by Pantload

Hmm... I guess just after seeing person after person curl uslessly in front of the mirror for un-natural periods of time and get no where... it kind of set me askew from thinking i "need" to do any bicep/tricep isolation work. Which i guess i don't need too but it'll probably help out way more for long term goals..

I used to be one of those guys who didn't bench all the time but benched at least every other day, then i learned the importance of overall body fitness.. and how having a strong back helps with your upper body lifts as well.

The problem is that watching idiots curling for an hour and getting nowhere makes you think that there is something fundamentally wrong with curling. There isn't. As long as do them with good form, constant tension and keep aiming for some sort of progression over time.

[xbd83x]

Originally Posted by Pantload

As long as i've been working out i've never really been that big on bicep curling, or really any arm exercise for that matter. The most i do for an "arm" exercise is Skull Crushers (you can see my full routine below). I've never been that guy at the gym curling in front of the mirror for 30 minutes, let alone dedicating a whole day to "arms". I'm not aiming to insult anyone be any means, i just don't know if i should or shouldn't. I figured that all the compound lift i do would in turn work my arms, without the need to work them on their own seperate day, or even add a arm "split" into my routine; i.e. chest and tirs, or back and bis. Is there really a need to curl when i'm doing compund lifts? Just want some opinions on if curling maybe over-rated...

It depends on how your genetics are and if you need the extra work or not. I would recommend at least a little curling. You said you're doing a lot of compund movements as it is...you may see some nice arm progress all of a sudden if you added some isolation curls and hammer curls somewhere in the mix and it wouldn't be overkill on the groups you've been hitting with compound movements. Not sure if you do any forearm work, but personally I saw a lot of benefit for the forearm through hammer curls as well as the biceps.

[BC02]

If your arms are progressing without them then skip them. If not throw in a few sets. Personally i hate doing them

[Pantload]

Originally Posted by Mad_Dog_Divine

The problem is that watching idiots curling for an hour and getting nowhere makes you think that there is something fundamentally wrong with curling. There isn't. As long as do them with good form, constant tension and keep aiming for some sort of progression over time.

This is probably true. That and all the curl bashing that goes on in this website kinda makes me biast against curling. But I now have it in my routine, if you're interested it's in my sig

Originally Posted by xbd83x

It depends on how your genetics are and if you need the extra work or not. I would recommend at least a little curling. You said you're doing a lot of compund movements as it is...you may see some nice arm progress all of a sudden if you added some isolation curls and hammer curls somewhere in the mix and it wouldn't be overkill on the groups you've been hitting with compound movements. Not sure if you do any forearm work, but personally I saw a lot of benefit for the forearm through hammer curls as well as the biceps.

I'm pretty happy with my arms, they are nothing extrordinary but for not curling they seem pretty damn defined. BUT as i said above, i am going to try it out. The only "forearm" work i do really is just from deadlifting.. which is more of a grip thing. What kind of progress did you see while doing the hammer curls? just beefier forearms or easy to grab ahold of heavy ass weight and throw it around with a solid grip?

Originally Posted by BC02

If your arms are progressing without them then skip them. If not throw in a few sets. Personally i hate doing them

Yeah the few times i did a few sets of curls i didn't really like them, but i threw in some preacher curls and reverse grip preacher curls into my routine... gunna see how that works for me over the next few weeks

[Cheesin]

Originally Posted by Pantload

I actually just added a few isolation exercises to my workout and i'm going to see what results i get from them.

What i was asking is basically, does curling do anything? Maybe it's just some waste of time or does it actually help? or can i get the same benifts from my compund lifts?

I can now say, yes curling helps to an extent. Yes compound lifts help. But i'm going to combine some isolation in and see what happens.

Why would anyone who wanted bigger biceps not do bicep curls? No one is telling you to do them excessively.

When I first started I did nothing but bench and bicep curls for a long ass time. No attention was paid to diet or anything like that. No pulldowns, no pull ups, but my arms are currently 17 in, at a weight of 180, 13 or 14% bf.

Compounds, from what I gather from looking at EMGs and my own results ARE useful and efficient. You hit multiple bodyparts at once, but do not hit each bodypart as effectively as from isolations.

Edit: this is more the case when it comes to smaller bodyparts though. For example, when doing pullups, your arms are taxed but you cannot put full effort in your biceps due to most being directed to your lats. When doing bicep curls, the biceps are stressed more directly, and all of the focus/effort is into that muscle group.

Now personally, I am not sure how effective single joint movements are for larger bodyparts, because I never really did them for an extended period of time.