Machida or Shogun, who won? - Page 5

Lord_Lemon · 10-26-2009, 04:30 AM

I'm a huge Machida nutthugger and gave Shogun all five rounds. I was not sold on Machida's flurry at the end of rnd 3.

It's Shogun's fault for not trying to cement his win though. His corner should have been telling him he's winning but it's still too close for comfort and he needs to make something memorable happen.

Metalbender00 · 10-26-2009, 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajstylesisgod

this by far
round 1 4 5 to shogun
2 was even
3 was machidas

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord_Lemon

I'm a huge Machida nutthugger and gave Shogun all five rounds. I was not sold on Machida's flurry at the end of rnd 3.

It's Shogun's fault for not trying to cement his win though. His corner should have been telling him he's winning but it's still too close for comfort and he needs to make something memorable happen.

if anything i might give him round 3.. but that's it.. shogun clearly controlled the fight. And not to blame them but his corner shouldn't have directed him the way they did..

sword_ · 10-26-2009, 07:02 AM

I wanted Machida to win but Shogun was a better figher. He landed more hits than Machida, and that's including head shots.

Mpower. · 10-26-2009, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardGainer82

Like I said in another thread, lots of UFC judges have a boxing background and therefore score head shots more heavily than leg kicks. Machida was popping Shogun in the face on a lot of those leg kicks, but no one here seems to have even noticed.

Actually Shogun landed more head shots as well

http://compustrike.com/stats_files/u...acHida-Rua.HTM

HardGainer82 · 10-26-2009, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mpower.

Actually Shogun landed more head shots as well

http://compustrike.com/stats_files/u...acHida-Rua.HTM

In the total fight. You have to break it down by rounds. I believe Shogun landed the vast majority of his headshots in round five.

*edit* Maybe I missed it, but does that link even count the head shots?

ssnipazz · 10-27-2009, 01:18 AM

Here's a compilation of all the notable people / websites / blogs and their thoughts on the fight:

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f2/all...links-1072966/

AWhislyle · 10-27-2009, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardGainer82

In the total fight. You have to break it down by rounds. I believe Shogun landed the vast majority of his headshots in round five.

*edit* Maybe I missed it, but does that link even count the head shots?

According to Fight metric on head strikes:
Rd. 1 Rua 2-1
Rd. 2 Machida 2-1
Rd. 3 Machida 9-6
Rd. 4 Tie 1-1
Rd. 5 Rua 7-1
http://www.fightmetric.com/fights/Machida-Shogun.html

ssj4veggeto1008 · 10-27-2009, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord_Lemon

I'm a huge Machida nutthugger and gave Shogun all five rounds. I was not sold on Machida's flurry at the end of rnd 3.

It's Shogun's fault for not trying to cement his win though. His corner should have been telling him he's winning but it's still too close for comfort and he needs to make something memorable happen.

how did you get green? lol

Lord_Lemon · 10-27-2009, 02:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssj4veggeto1008

how did you get green? lol

Because I never should have been red brah. Some dode took one of my quotes with a tasteless, albit funny picture in it and spammed it in every thread in the misc till I got mod negged. Took awhile to get back to the greenz but it was made possible through my intelligent and thought provoking posts.

HardGainer82 · 10-27-2009, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWhislyle

According to Fight metric on head strikes:
Rd. 1 Rua 2-1
Rd. 2 Machida 2-1
Rd. 3 Machida 9-6
Rd. 4 Tie 1-1
Rd. 5 Rua 7-1
http://www.fightmetric.com/fights/Machida-Shogun.html

Wow, what an assraping by Shogun lol

The fact that things are this close is why it annoys me that people are calling this a robbery.

christienjulian · 10-28-2009, 02:34 PM

The main-event of UFC 104 saw Lyoto Machida defend his Light heavyweight title by winning a unanimous decision over Shogun Rua but not without controversy as many spectators felt the scorecards reflected poorly upon the fight. Long time MMA judge and referee, Cecil Peoples provided us with his reasoning behind his issued score of 48-47 in favour of the champion, Lyoto Machida.

"First of all what you need to understand is that from where the judges are sitting, we get to see things that the fans at home may miss. Mauricio Rua was being aggressive but it wasn't effective aggressiveness which is what we as the judges look for when scoring a fight. The way I saw it, Lyoto was landing the more cleaner and damaging strikes throughout the fight - if you take a look at the judging criteria clean strikes are valued more-so than the quantity of strikes landed. Although Rua threw a lot of low kicks they were not as damaging as Lyotos diverse attack in the earlier rounds which is why I scored the first three rounds for Machida. You have to keep in mind we always the favour the fighter who is trying to finish the fight, and leg kicks certainly don't do that."

"When both fighters are engaged in a striking match what I always look for is the fighter who is being judicious, picking his spots, being accurate and landing the cleaner strikes which ultimately is what Lyoto did more effectively than Rua. Lyoto made Shogun come after him, he determined where the fight took place which in my opinion constitutes as effective Octagon control. I recognize the fact that Rua did have a few takedown attempts during the course of the fight however Lyoto defended them all successfully which counts as effective grappling in his favour, where as ununsuccessful takedown attempts are not scored at all. Therefore going by that criteria, I believe Lyoto won the fight clearly. I'm just glad the other judges on the panel saw it the same way and I'm sure the fans who understand the technicalities of the sport agree with the decision too."
So basically he's saying that Rampage should have the belt since leg kicks don't count !

hfce354 · 10-28-2009, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by christienjulian

The main-event of UFC 104 saw Lyoto Machida defend his Light heavyweight title by winning a unanimous decision over Shogun Rua but not without controversy as many spectators felt the scorecards reflected poorly upon the fight. Long time MMA judge and referee, Cecil Peoples provided us with his reasoning behind his issued score of 48-47 in favour of the champion, Lyoto Machida.

"First of all what you need to understand is that from where the judges are sitting, we get to see things that the fans at home may miss. Mauricio Rua was being aggressive but it wasn't effective aggressiveness which is what we as the judges look for when scoring a fight. The way I saw it, Lyoto was landing the more cleaner and damaging strikes throughout the fight - if you take a look at the judging criteria clean strikes are valued more-so than the quantity of strikes landed. Although Rua threw a lot of low kicks they were not as damaging as Lyotos diverse attack in the earlier rounds which is why I scored the first three rounds for Machida. You have to keep in mind we always the favour the fighter who is trying to finish the fight, and leg kicks certainly don't do that."

"When both fighters are engaged in a striking match what I always look for is the fighter who is being judicious, picking his spots, being accurate and landing the cleaner strikes which ultimately is what Lyoto did more effectively than Rua. Lyoto made Shogun come after him, he determined where the fight took place which in my opinion constitutes as effective Octagon control. I recognize the fact that Rua did have a few takedown attempts during the course of the fight however Lyoto defended them all successfully which counts as effective grappling in his favour, where as ununsuccessful takedown attempts are not scored at all. Therefore going by that criteria, I believe Lyoto won the fight clearly. I'm just glad the other judges on the panel saw it the same way and I'm sure the fans who understand the technicalities of the sport agree with the decision too."
So basically he's saying that Rampage should have the belt since leg kicks don't count !

Shogun landed leg kicks but didnt follow up with combinations. I think that may be what CP was trying to say. I hope so because a leg kick can certainly end a fight if it is preceded by or followed up by additional strikes. A leg kick is like a body shot in boxing. it has a cumulative effect but the idea of bodyshots is to free up the head and finish the fight. Shogun just didnt do that. So we get a controversial decision when he probably should have won.

hfce354 · 10-28-2009, 04:29 PM

Following his controversial unanimous decision over Mauricio ?Shogun? Rua at UFC 104, UFC light heavyweight champion Lyoto Machida discussed the fight via phone with Sherdog.com?s Marcelo Alonso.

?I thought it was a very even and tough fight,? Machida said. ?I had the opportunity to see the fight again and I thought I won four rounds and Shogun took the last one. Some people say he won the fourth and fifth round, but for sure I won at least the first three rounds. The American commentators were pretty much biased. If you see the fight without audio, you will probably see a different fight.

?Shogun was a great opponent and had a nice strategy. He deserves all my respect as a fighter, but I was superior. I had three or four chances to finish the fight, and he never put me in danger. I didn?t get (dazed) at any moment of the fight, but I put him in danger three or four times. He kicked my legs a couple of times, but he wouldn?t knock me out with that.?

AWhislyle · 10-28-2009, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hfce354

Following his controversial unanimous decision over Mauricio ?Shogun? Rua at UFC 104, UFC light heavyweight champion Lyoto Machida discussed the fight via phone with Sherdog.com?s Marcelo Alonso.

?I thought it was a very even and tough fight,? Machida said. ?I had the opportunity to see the fight again and I thought I won four rounds and Shogun took the last one. Some people say he won the fourth and fifth round, but for sure I won at least the first three rounds. The American commentators were pretty much biased. If you see the fight without audio, you will probably see a different fight.

?Shogun was a great opponent and had a nice strategy. He deserves all my respect as a fighter, but I was superior. I had three or four chances to finish the fight, and he never put me in danger. I didn?t get (dazed) at any moment of the fight, but I put him in danger three or four times. He kicked my legs a couple of times, but he wouldn?t knock me out with that.?

Wow either Machida is delusional or lying through his teeth, nice.

HardGainer82 · 10-28-2009, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWhislyle

Wow either Machida is delusional or lying through his teeth, nice.

A fight can look a lot different from the inside...but I don't think anyone could possibly give him all five.

stealth_swimmer · 10-28-2009, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardGainer82

Wow, what an assraping by Shogun lol

The fact that things are this close is why it annoys me that people are calling this a robbery.

It wasn't close at all. Shogun was doing more damage. Machida would get hit and then jump back..then get hit some more...then land some shots, but the shots he was taking were VISIBLY slowing him down and doing damage. The stuff he did to Shogun didn't seem like a big deal to Shogun.

HardGainer82 · 10-28-2009, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stealth_swimmer

It wasn't close at all. Shogun was doing more damage. Machida would get hit and then jump back..then get hit some more...then land some shots, but the shots he was taking were VISIBLY slowing him down and doing damage. The stuff he did to Shogun didn't seem like a big deal to Shogun.

It was close. I'm not having this argument again.